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With Sevagoth released, Equinox should get a rework


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Greetings Tenno,

After Sevagoth being released a good friend pointed this out and I think it's a discussion that should happen. Equinox a warframe also having two forms herself should receive a rework. 

The point being brought up is that out of 7 abilities...only 3 are worth the energy to cast  despite the fact she has two forms, like Sevagoth. So her builds are kinda limited due to this.

With Sevagoth having two moddable forms, why can't Equinox also receive this? Make her day and night forms both moddable and make all her abilities worth casting, because Sevagoths abilities all appear to be worth casting.

Thoughts? 

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1 minute ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Oh not not this again.

Another rework thread. 

*bangs head against wall in frustration* 

Hit your head all you want but it's going to happen eventually 🤷‍♂️ 

I say at least make it a really good rework 👍 having both forms moddable is a great place to start I'd say. 

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Just now, (XBOX)Cram Duahcim said:

Hit your head all you want but it's going to happen eventually 🤷‍♂️ 

I say at least make it a really good rework 👍 having both forms moddable is a great place to start I'd say. 

Is it though? 

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2 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

She doesn't need a rework she could benefit from having 2 builds for each form though

I am sure DE would be down with that two frame builds equals double the forma and that is sales 

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9 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Oh not not this again.

Another rework thread. 

*bangs head against wall in frustration* 

''Oh no, do I hear people trying to improve the game by suggesting changes to make the game more fun? This won't do, this won't do at all. The fun police is here!''

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5 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

She doesn't need a rework she could benefit from having 2 builds for each form though

That would still be a revisit/rework, I understand that it does increase the forma requirement but a few rounds of Hydron isn't that big of a deal. 

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1 minute ago, Wyrmius_Prime said:

''Oh no, do I hear people trying to improve the game by suggesting changes to make the game more fun? This won't do, this won't do at all. The fun police is here!''

"Let's keep wasting dev time and starting stupid arguments by pointlessly suggesting we take a hatchet to frames, every time a new frame comes out that has anything cool or a slightly similar theme or function!!!" 

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1 minute ago, Tesseract7777 said:

"Let's keep wasting dev time and starting stupid arguments by pointlessly suggesting we take a hatchet to frames, every time a new frame comes out that has anything cool or a slightly similar theme or function!!!" 

Someone dosent like change 🤣

And does it really take THAT much away from development time? I mean I am on console so I'm already used to waiting.

Having Pablo or a couple people working on reworks likely doesn't cut into the map design Team, or the motion capture team or the sound team or the design team....see where I'm going.

I think that's just an ongoing excuse being used to resist change because 1 to 3 people working on reworks shouldn't take away from the major work that goes into these updates. 

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Just now, (XBOX)Cram Duahcim said:

Someone dosent like change 🤣

And does it really take THAT much away from development time? I mean I am on console so I'm already used to waiting.

Having Pablo or a couple people working on reworks likely doesn't cut into the map design Team, or the motion capture team or the sound team or the design team....see where I'm going.

I think that's just an ongoing excuse being used to resist change because 1 to 3 people working on reworks shouldn't take away from the major work that goes into these updates. 

Actually that has nothing to do with it, I just don't like to see dev time wasted. No offense but you clearly aren't listening to my point. 

Reb has made posts before that indicate reworks actually do cannibalize a lot of dev time, it isn't just a handful of people, and those people involved are also high level people sometimes whose time is needed elsewhere. 

But we might have a different definition of rework. 

If you are talking a revisit kind of like Pablo did with Zephyr, no that doesn't eat up too much time. 

But historically when this community talks rework, they are talking about changes where at least one ability is entirely replaced (and that definitely takes up a lot of animation time and other resources). 

To me there is a big difference between revisit and rework. It's the difference between say, the most recent Zephyr changes (revisit) and the most recent Ember changes (rework). 

I don't mind change, but one of those two things takes a lot more dev time than the other, and with 45+ frames and going and going, it become harder and harder to put that kind of spotlight on any one frame. 

I used to support full reworks back in the day, but we are at the point of literally dozens of frames now, and I think that can quickly get out of hand. 

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Equinox could definitely benefit from this without needing extra dev work. Implementing the two moddable forms could be some technical work, but the rest of the abilities could adapt pretty well if they just had some simple number tuning and effect changes. We could also get the Equinox QoL changes alongside this, such as Energy Transfer (and a similar effect for Pacify/Provoke) being baseline, removal of decaying buff values on Metamorphosis, and changes to fashion to customize all three forms individually. 

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1 hour ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

She doesn't need a rework she could benefit from having 2 builds for each form though

Best 'rework' idea I've seen on this forum so far.

Edited by Numerikuu
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2 hours ago, (XBOX)Cram Duahcim said:

Greetings Tenno,

After Sevagoth being released a good friend pointed this out and I think it's a discussion that should happen. Equinox a warframe also having two forms herself should receive a rework. 

The point being brought up is that out of 7 abilities...only 3 are worth the energy to cast  despite the fact she has two forms, like Sevagoth. So her builds are kinda limited due to this.

With Sevagoth having two moddable forms, why can't Equinox also receive this? Make her day and night forms both moddable and make all her abilities worth casting, because Sevagoths abilities all appear to be worth casting.

Thoughts? 

As an Equinox main, I totally would love to see her get reworked, for several reasons...

Her concept is being a "Duality" frame, based on "Taijitu", Yin and Yang. Despite being opposites, when used together, they bring out the best in each other. This theme itself holds a lot of potential for her gameplay design, where players could use both of her forms in tandem to combo their abilities off each other, to make them extremely effective, than she would when using her forms separately. An example being, Equinox's Night Form absorbing the enemies' aggression and in turn granting a bonus to her Day Form's abilities. Equinox, as she is currently, has no synergy or relationship between her two forms. In fact, as they are currently designed, they tend to work against each other, by design. So much so, most players choose one form other the other, and rarely do they use both, outside of "Duality" augment builds. 

When they they do use her, they simply use one ability, or two at most, within that one form. Which is bad for the fact that Equinox has the most abilities, in the game, when counting both her forms, and their abilities, together.

I'd like to see her reworked, where her unique mechanic of swapping her forms is given more of a focus, and with her abilities redesigned to work with it, and the abilities of her opposite forms.             

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14 hours ago, A-keras said:

As an Equinox main, I totally would love to see her get reworked, for several reasons...

Her concept is being a "Duality" frame, based on "Taijitu", Yin and Yang. Despite being opposites, when used together, they bring out the best in each other. This theme itself holds a lot of potential for her gameplay design, where players could use both of her forms in tandem to combo their abilities off each other, to make them extremely effective, than she would when using her forms separately. An example being, Equinox's Night Form absorbing the enemies' aggression and in turn granting a bonus to her Day Form's abilities. Equinox, as she is currently, has no synergy or relationship between her two forms. In fact, as they are currently designed, they tend to work against each other, by design. So much so, most players choose one form other the other, and rarely do they use both, outside of "Duality" augment builds. 

When they they do use her, they simply use one ability, or two at most, within that one form. Which is bad for the fact that Equinox has the most abilities, in the game, when counting both her forms, and their abilities, together.

I'd like to see her reworked, where her unique mechanic of swapping her forms is given more of a focus, and with her abilities redesigned to work with it, and the abilities of her opposite forms.             

This is exactly the conversation I had with a friend about it and how by the end the conclusion that Equinox is probably the #1 Warframe that needs a rework, she needs more synergy with as your either build for Day or Night. 

By building for both (Like Sevagoth with his forms) you have access to her entire kit. With a revisit to abilities and adding this function she's in a much better place. 

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Equinox is one of the most balanced and complete warframes ever made. Equinox is at the very last place when it comes to reworks/overhauls/whatever. And I'd love to know what abilities aren't worth using because I have 6 different builds, just off the top of my head that she can use with a completely different playstyle, there isn't a single other frame I can say this about. Not to mention how strong and versatile Equinox is.

The whole idea behind Equinox is there being 2 different forms. Basically like playing 2 different frames at the same time, not 1. And it does that perfectly. There is no problem with the way Equinox works because it was meant to work that way. The problem you have is you want this frame to change to something you want, that's personal and not objective at all. I can say the complete opposite of what you said, with the same reasoning and we'd be equally right since it's a personal opinion and that's subjective. Pointless.

Your suggestions are suggestions like any other but your reasoning is flawed and nonsense. It's like saying Paris Prime should be reworked to having explosive arrows because the Kuva Bramma/Lenz/Proboscis Cernos are explosive and you don't really use the Paris because its builds are "limited" and it's outdated. Or wanting all Drain abilities to work like Pacify & Provoke because Equinox has it and that's stronger and easier to play with.

You can use this reasoning for anything and everything. And it'd just escalate and stretch out to the point where everything in the game would be the same.

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Dude your logic makes zero sense, you do know that Chroma technically has a second form also right? They just made a new frame, stop moaning about reworks, Equinox is i a great spot so stop with the scapegoat tactics

15 hours ago, A-keras said:

When they they do use her, they simply use one ability, or two at most, within that one form. Which is bad for the fact that Equinox has the most abilities, in the game, when counting both her forms, and their abilities, together.

You may main her but you obviously don't know how to use her... her day form is great for nuking but night is great for survivablity, I use both in every mission... and all abilities also, her dmg increaser and her sleep cc are super useful plus her 3rd aura abilties are great

Edited by (XBOX)Apoll0 666
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14 minutes ago, ORDOJESUCHRISTO said:

Equinox is one of the most balanced and complete warframes ever made. Equinox is at the very last place when it comes to reworks/overhauls/whatever. And I'd love to know what abilities aren't worth using because I have 6 different builds, just off the top of my head that she can use with a completely different playstyle, there isn't a single other frame I can say this about. Not to mention how strong and versatile Equinox is.

The whole idea behind Equinox is there being 2 different forms. Basically like playing 2 different frames at the same time, not 1. And it does that perfectly. There is no problem with the way Equinox works because it was meant to work that way. The problem you have is you want this frame to change to something you want, that's personal and not objective at all. I can say the complete opposite of what you said, with the same reasoning and we'd be equally right since it's a personal opinion and that's subjective. Pointless.

Your suggestions are suggestions like any other but your reasoning is flawed and nonsense. It's like saying Paris Prime should be reworked to having explosive arrows because the Kuva Bramma/Lenz/Proboscis Cernos are explosive and you don't really use the Paris because its builds are "limited" and it's outdated. Or wanting all Drain abilities to work like Pacify & Provoke because Equinox has it and that's stronger and easier to play with.

You can use this reasoning for anything and everything. And it'd just escalate and stretch out to the point where everything in the game would be the same.

So how is having the ability to build for both forms flawed? Especially when your playing 2 different Warframes at the same time (As you've pointed out). 

And considering the fact Equinox Meta is simply build for Maim you really only build for it. You have 6 different builds? Congratulations but just because you do, dosent mean that the overwhelming majority of players build for the Meta of her kit. I've barely seen Night form being touched...if at all when your primary purpose is building damage and nuking the entire map. 

That's whats flawed about Equinox and the whole purpose of this conversation. She may be two different warframes....but you hardly see that other one. That's why she needs at least a revisit. (Its not like they've added similar mechanics from one warframe and gave it to another right, wait didn't Vauban get that when Ivara came out 🤔

And if you want an explosive Paris Prime....there's mods for that 🤷‍♂️

 

 

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imo equinox doenst need a rework "yet" as there are other frames that needs it NOW, like Hydroid[Frame only used for his 4º hability and farm on a corner] or (controvesial opinion) Inaros needs something as nearly everyone uses him because of his INSANE health pool and tank capabilty, but for nothing else, his abilities are not effective on the vas majority of the missions and even, if u have arcanes u dont need them anymore.

Equinox is viable on a lot of missions, she is fun to play, and she is effective

but inaros imo is just a health tank that does nothing else (a bit boring tbh), and hydroid is a tentacle farmer (eclipsed by khora)

If u dont think like me, its ok, this is just MY OPINION

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11 minutes ago, (XBOX)Apoll0 666 said:

Dude your logic makes zero sense, you do know that Chroma technically has a second form also right? They just made a new frame, stop moaning about reworks, Equinox is i a great spot so stop with the scapegoat tactics

You may main her but you obviously don't know how to use her... her day form is great for nuking but night is great for survivablity, I use both in every mission... and all abilities also, her dmg increaser and her sleep cc are super useful plus her 3rd aura abilties are great

And yet Chromas 4 is still not even worth casting, even after his revisit.

Even after his revisit there's still requests for a rework for that frame so if your trying to end this discussion for Equinox I'm willing to bet somewhere at DE, there's a "Warframe Rework List" and sooner or later  Equinox name will eventually be one they want to check off. (And even with Effigy, it dosent change his overall kit, it's not like he gets new abilities when it's on, unlike Equinox or Sevagoth)

If she's like playing two warframes at once I'd like to have the option to build for both (which I can do with Sevagoth) so how does that not making any sense? 

 

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3 minutes ago, (XBOX)Cram Duahcim said:

So how is having the ability to build for both forms flawed? Especially when your playing 2 different Warframes at the same time (As you've pointed out). 

And considering the fact Equinox Meta is simply build for Maim you really only build for it. You have 6 different builds? Congratulations but just because you do, dosent mean that the overwhelming majority of players build for the Meta of her kit. I've barely seen Night form being touched...if at all when your primary purpose is building damage and nuking the entire map. 

That's whats flawed about Equinox and the whole purpose of this conversation. She may be two different warframes....but you hardly see that other one. That's why she needs at least a revisit. (Its not like they've added similar mechanics from one warframe and gave it to another right, wait didn't Vauban get that when Ivara came out 🤔

And if you want an explosive Paris Prime....there's mods for that 🤷‍♂️

 

 

What's flawed about Equinox is most people only use 1 build? How is that the frame's fault? And can you speak for other builds? Can you say and prove the reason why they mostly use 1 build and then relate it as to why she needs a rework? Just because you and "most people" only know how to use 1 build, doesn't mean there aren't amazing builds for Equinox on her other abilities. You just proved my point. Hell, Maim is the one I use the least by far.

Most people only use broken weapons with Viral/Heat builds, does that mean those are the only weapons and that's the only build that matters/exists and that's good? No. Your lack of knowledge about the game only shows how your opinion means jack.

And if you read instead of blabbing out more crap, I said your reasoning is flawed. "Meta" means nothing. Your completely subjective/personal opninion, that isn't even informed, doesn't speak for the game or the community. Just like you still haven't given a single unbiased reason so far.

I can say most people prefer dogs to cats. I can say most people drive a Diesel engine. I can say I prefer both these things. How does this give any reason as to why they should be used? How does this justifty dogs over cats or Diesel over gasoline or gas or electric? It doesn't. You're just talking out of your ass.

Meanwhile you have stuff like Grendel but nah "the #1 Warframe that needs a rework" is Equinox. Play the game some more and then talk, please. Because when you say something as ignorant as this, you lose all credibility in one sentence.

I love how you're giving me attitude for debunking your bs. Grow up.

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45 minutes ago, ORDOJESUCHRISTO said:

What's flawed about Equinox is most people only use 1 build? How is that the frame's fault? And can you speak for other builds? Can you say and prove the reason why they mostly use 1 build and then relate it as to why she needs a rework? Just because you and "most people" only know how to use 1 build, doesn't mean there aren't amazing builds for Equinox on her other abilities. You just proved my point. Hell, Maim is the one I use the least by far.

Most people only use broken weapons with Viral/Heat builds, does that mean those are the only weapons and that's the only build that matters/exists and that's good? No. Your lack of knowledge about the game only shows how your opinion means jack.

And if you read instead of blabbing out more crap, I said your reasoning is flawed. "Meta" means nothing. Your completely subjective/personal opninion, that isn't even informed, doesn't speak for the game or the community. Just like you still haven't given a single unbiased reason so far.

I can say most people prefer dogs to cats. I can say most people drive a Diesel engine. I can say I prefer both these things. How does this give any reason as to why they should be used? How does this justifty dogs over cats or Diesel over gasoline or gas or electric? It doesn't. You're just talking out of your ass.

Meanwhile you have stuff like Grendel but nah "the #1 Warframe that needs a rework" is Equinox. Play the game some more and then talk, please. Because when you say something as ignorant as this, you lose all credibility in one sentence.

I love how you're giving me attitude for debunking your bs. Grow up.

Your highlighting the point I'm making right here with this statement, Equinox has that problem. Her Day form is far more popular than her Night form. So yeah I'd definitely say that's the Warframes problem, because most players don't touch the other half of her kit. 

That could be a lack of knowledge or it could be that you have one set of abilities that are seen to have more benefit compared to the other set being her Night Form and most builds isn't really considered overall.(My observations when observing Equinox players that I have encountered), 

Having the option to build for both could solve that problem. Plus by doing that, your not limited building for 1 form instead of 2. Everything would work better and alo bring more syngery, so I ask you again how is that a bad thing?

Plus after reviewing the forum where have I ever said I was speaking for the community? Everything I've said, have come from my observations and from a conversation I had with a friend.

I guess your not a fan of a little sarcasm, because I'm not the one with the bad attitude my friend. 

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5 minutes ago, (XBOX)Cram Duahcim said:

Her Day form is far more popular than her Night form. So yeah I'd definitely say that's the Warframes problem, because most players don't touch the other half of her kit.

That's on the players not Equinox, people tend to lean towards damage over support that's why you barely see night equinox. 

I have 2 builds one for night and one for day both subsumed metamorphosis cause maximizing one form hurts the other one for me. If they add Sevagoth mechanic to her then great but her abilitys definitely doesn't need reworks

Edited by (XBOX)C11H22O11
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