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No! No more RNG within RNG within RNG within an unexplained surprise "mechanic"


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3 hours ago, Zorbiter said:

I am well aware, but when you then butt#*!% players with someone who suddenly steals half of what you're grinding for, only to find out that was a major mistake. What then?

 

If you're even a small bit the Space Ninja you ought be, you roll with that "mistake", figure out how to kill it (which you clearly know), and do so.  You then LEARN from your "mistake" and CHOOSE not to kill/create another Lich.

Pretty simple, really :/ 

You also get all your loot back when you kill it, plus a nifty weapon and potential ephemera.  

You can either make excuses or you can make progress.  Pick one.

1 hour ago, (PSN)DoctorWho_90250 said:

You're right. Unfortunately, DE has blinker vision when it comes to taking criticisms and advice so they'll listen to people who tell them Warframe is fantastic. Also, without the grind, there's not much to Warframe as the game's meant to be played over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again etc. etc. in order to get the thing you want.

So don't play :/   It isn't like you paid for the game and thus are forced to "keep at it" for some sunk-cost fallacy's sake.  

You literally owe them nothing, and you can uninstall whensoever you feel the need to do so.

DE takes criticisms... but there's a difference between "hearing criticisms", and letting the chaotic playerbase back-seat dev, which would be an unmitigated disaster. 

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41 minutes ago, (PSN)JustJoshinEnt said:

So don't play :/   It isn't like you paid for the game and thus are forced to "keep at it" for some sunk-cost fallacy's sake.  

You literally owe them nothing, and you can uninstall whensoever you feel the need to do so.

What about people who pay and support DE all along? Should they expect 9/10 missions to be buggy/softlocked/glitched as a good content drop? Doesn't DE owe them a single bug free update? 

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Forget the rng, this game is way too easy to be satisfying. When I played through the tutorial and had to defend my ship from the grineer I just stood on top of my ship with my sword out and auto deflected everything. When the timer was up I just casually walked through all of them while spamming e. When I had to fight Vor I just did the same thing, facetanking everything while hacking away at vor until the obligatory invulnerability mechanic came up so I could hide behind some boxes. This feels less like a game and more like a quicktime movie. 

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46 minutes ago, (PSN)JustJoshinEnt said:

So don't play :/   It isn't like you paid for the game and thus are forced to "keep at it" for some sunk-cost fallacy's sake.  


You literally owe them nothing, and you can uninstall whensoever you feel the need to do so.

DE takes criticisms... but there's a difference between "hearing criticisms", and letting the chaotic playerbase back-seat dev, which would be an unmitigated disaster. 

For one, I understand not doing something/not engaging a product that makes you unhappy. I get that. At the same time, such advice should not be used as some pathetic attempt to shut down criticism. And no, DE doesn't take criticism. DE ignores it and goes on their merry little path with sycophants cheering them on while those who provide actual, good advice and criticism are drowned out or ignored.

OP is completely 100% correct in his original post. DE had chances to make things better, heck there was so much they could have down with the new player experience but they just remade the opening quest and called it a day. So lazy and pathetic.

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6 hours ago, Zorbiter said:

The annoyance is too great.

qft

I got all the weapons last year and never got the patience to level the element to it's max, even if it's way easier than it was the first iteration of the liches(then the rng was even more absurd)

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7 hours ago, Zorbiter said:

The Kuva Lich mechanic needs to be an opt in/out.

You are, at no point or in any way forced to do Kuva Liches. They are never an objective or requirement of mission completion and can safely be ignored.

Provided you can shelve the bloodlust momentarily when you encounter a Kuva'd Grineer.

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I wonder if someone keeps shooting everyone with a memory loss ray gun when an update drops, because everyone acts like they've never encountered bad RNG before, even when they've been playing for years like me. at this point I'm more concerned when things aren't hidden behind layers of RNG, because as much as it can suck when you keep rolling snake eyes, other systems have problems too. 

tell you what, how about a railjack token system? every 100 missions you complete that's enough tokens for a Sevagoth part guaranteed! sound fair? :)

 

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9 hours ago, Zorbiter said:


The Kuva Lich mechanic needs to be an opt in/out. 

It is , creation of kuva lich is entirely based on your actions alone and interaction with it is completely optional .

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7 hours ago, -AncientWarrior- said:

Dear OP,

After reading your responses I get the feeling you're more interested in creating a reaction here than actually playing the game.. a lot of players have offered you valid and helpful advice that you've just tossed aside.  Based on your responses and just how little understanding of Warframe you really have, I think you'll most probably end up being a very casual player anyway, but good luck with your WF journey no matter how short it may be ... but no matter what, maybe just play the bits you enjoy and leave the rest alone  ..

Yes. Now that I've counted to ten, taken a deep breath, and had several cups of coffee, I still find the rng within rng within rng utterly obnoxious. You are absolutely correct in assuming I am a casual player. I play the game to have fun. My complaint is, that an unfun random game mechanic has been introduced, and at this point I am just tired. I get Requiem II and III relics and VERY rarely a I and IV. Meanwhile the game continues to punish me for being unlucky.
I am not seeking advice. I am stating my frustration with a very particular aspect of the game.

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9 hours ago, ebrl said:

I have my doubts if you understand what you're trying to say, so I wouldn't be really surprised if I got it wrong.

Fair enough. Some beer was involved at the time. I will review my frustrated responses. My initial complaint still stands, though.
Apologies en masse for any offense.

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11 hours ago, Zorbiter said:

Dear DE,
I love Warframe, but you are making it increasingly difficult. I don't know the decision making in your organization, but if the goal is more new players, you are on the wrong path. If you are catering to a select few elite players, that is the path you are on.
The Kuva Lich mechanic needs to be an opt in/out. I can only speak for myself as an almost exclusively solo player. I have absolutely no problem fighting the Duush Bahk, but the grind to maybe get a relic that maybe has the rune, has left me avoiding that part of the game altogether. I care nothing for the potential reward. The annoyance is too great.
Also... You have made a new player experience. No you have made a new player video. You actively refuse to guide new potential customers? That is baffling!
Dial the grind down a notch.
Sincerely,

Wait till you find out there used to be a weekly "get rid of my Lich" option. Which DE has removed from the game...

I myself have had a Lich for about half a year and I'm slowly gathering the mods over this period. It's not fun, so I play it rarely. This is why I haven't gotten rid of my Lich yet. When I do I'll be rich. She's taken over the Index so she owes me a lot of money.

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11 hours ago, DrivaMain said:

Oh wait till you see the RNG of Riven Mods. 

 

Have you tried farming Requiem Relics from Lich thralls? Farming relics in kuva siphon or flood is very inefficient.
 

I have. It didn't yield much more than further frustration. I want my loot back and the lich gone. That's all. I find the entire system, concerning Kuva Liches, extremely annoying mainly because of the russian doll design. I'd have much less of a problem with it if each relic contained ONLY 2 runes.

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7 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

Wait till you find out there used to be a weekly "get rid of my Lich" option. Which DE has removed from the game...

I myself have had a Lich for about half a year and I'm slowly gathering the mods over this period. It's not fun, so I play it rarely. This is why I haven't gotten rid of my Lich yet. When I do I'll be rich. She's taken over the Index so she owes me a lot of money.

Now I found out, and now I'm even more frustrated and bewildered. Thanks, I guess.

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9 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

Wait till you find out there used to be a weekly "get rid of my Lich" option. Which DE has removed from the game...

I don't recall ever seeing that.

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1 minute ago, RazerXPrime said:

I've never seen it myself, but someone in my clan said this used to be an option.

They may've been pulling your leg. I recall a lot of suggestion about it but never the implementation. 

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11 hours ago, DrivaMain said:

Try this method

  • Farm useless Prime Parts from relics.
  • Sell them for plat to other players.
  • Buy the mods from other players.

Requiem mods are dirt cheap these days. They are priced around 5 platinum

I suppose that's the way to go. I try to avoid trading.
I still think it's poor game design, to effectively force players to circumvent the game. I am, however, well aware that the platinum has to come from somewhere :-)

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6 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

I don't recall ever seeing that.

It used to be a thing briefly, but they removed it to focus on improving the overall lich experience. I'm also pretty sure they mentioned that this feature is now unnecessary because liches are opt-in. I couldn't find the source for the latter, however, so I might be making that up.

From https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1166021-empyrean-kuva-lich-changes-2710-27101/

*Clarification on ‘Abandoning Liches’: We have removed the prototype for this for now, because rather than not fixing the core loop and just letting a Lich be banished, we intend to focus on the core loop first. 

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1 minute ago, Genitive said:

It used to be a thing briefly, but they removed it to focus on improving the overall lich experience. I'm also pretty sure they mentioned that this feature is now unnecessary because liches are opt-in. I couldn't find the source for the latter, however, so I might be making that up.

From https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1166021-empyrean-kuva-lich-changes-2710-27101/

*Clarification on ‘Abandoning Liches’: We have removed the prototype for this for now, because rather than not fixing the core loop and just letting a Lich be banished, we intend to focus on the core loop first. 

Ah thankyou, I must've missed that update. I mean apart from anything else it would kill the longevity of their content to have it so I can understand why they removed it even if they briefly entertained the idea.

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2 minutes ago, Genitive said:

It used to be a thing briefly, but they removed it to focus on improving the overall lich experience. I'm also pretty sure they mentioned that this feature is now unnecessary because liches are opt-in. I couldn't find the source for the latter, however, so I might be making that up.

From https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1166021-empyrean-kuva-lich-changes-2710-27101/

*Clarification on ‘Abandoning Liches’: We have removed the prototype for this for now, because rather than not fixing the core loop and just letting a Lich be banished, we intend to focus on the core loop first. 

Yea I found the same source just browsing right now.

The Liches are opt in, but they're not... because a player is used to kill everything in his mission so they will just take down the larveling not knowing what they just did. Since it's completely unclear what the results of your actions are to a new player. I mean you get the option for a Kuva Lich after the War Within. At that point in the game you're a total noob with maybe 3-4 frames and some weapons. How on earth does this make sense for these players?

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11 hours ago, -AncientWarrior- said:

You know I have read this about 4 times and I still dont actually know what you are try to get across..  you're unhappy about the grind or the Lichs or relics/requiems ?   You say lichs should have an opt/in/out.. they do already.. you say DE are making it increasingly difficult when infact they have made it far less difficult in the last 3 years.. DE cater to new players by making everything available to them very early on allowing them much better weapons and frames so they go into higher mission faster.. as for the videos for new players Utube has thousands of WF videos for all player levels for all missions.. sorry I know you're trying to make a point I just dont see what the point is.. 

 

And really based on the first statement I'd suggest, politely, that you shouldnt be the one trying to explain to your friend about WF .. :) 

I apologise profusely! Beer was involved, and my linguistic skills were severely diminished at the time. I suppose you had to be there...
My main complaint is the relic mechanic. The randomness involved in getting rid of the Lich. I wouldn't be this frustrated if the relics had ONLY 2 runes, and if a kuva mission had maybe 75% chance of dropping a relic. So far I've very rarely gotten a requiem I and IV. The lich is stealing half my loot. It is, in my opinion, a very, very obstructive game mechanic, and poor design. It is subtracting from the quality of the game. In my opinion.
To sum it up, the RNG philosophy, in game development, has gone too far. In my opinion.

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27 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

I've never seen it myself, but someone in my clan said this used to be an option.

It was NEVER a thing. It was discussed in Streams but when they decided to show the weapon the Lich will have and increased the chances for an Epherema, it was discarded.

They are blowing smoke out of their ass.

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6 minutes ago, Zorbiter said:

I apologise profusely! Beer was involved, and my linguistic skills were severely diminished at the time. I suppose you had to be there...
My main complaint is the relic mechanic. The randomness involved in getting rid of the Lich. I wouldn't be this frustrated if the relics had ONLY 2 runes, and if a kuva mission had maybe 75% chance of dropping a relic. So far I've very rarely gotten a requiem I and IV. The lich is stealing half my loot. It is, in my opinion, a very, very obstructive game mechanic, and poor design. It is subtracting from the quality of the game. In my opinion.
To sum it up, the RNG philosophy, in game development, has gone too far. In my opinion.

Man I get that you're frustrated but honestly, I think you're making it harder for yourself than it needs to be. If you've been playing for a while you obviously know how to make plat, even a small amount. The requiems will cost you about 5-10p each tops. Just sell a couple of sculptures, syndicate mods, prime parts etc and rid yourself of that frustration by buying them and then go hunt down and eradicate your lich and get your loot back. It'll only take a couple of hours and then you're free of it.

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