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Verdict on Void Storms? Dead content.


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3 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

If Normal Railjack missions give the same rewards then why bother doing void storms?

If Void Fissures give the same rewards as normal missions why bother doing Void Fissures?

Relics. The Relics you're opening is the answer to both of these questions.

2 hours ago, DrivaMain said:

FTFY. Once everyone got their Sevagoth and Epitaph most players will just go back doing capture fissures because it's more efficient.  We all want Void Storms to succeed, but this is not the way to go. as I said, in a grinding game, efficiency matters. Most players are not gonna waste their time farming item with method X while method Y is superior in terms of reward output.

Most players play Warframe for the new shiny. Fun is an afterthought.

If you're playing solely for efficiency in opening relics sure but you're not going to get everything else I listed in a normal fissure mission. Even if it's less efficient than doing some capture fissures followed by an Index run being able to knock out both farms simultaneously and then some is still reason enough for players to consider them.

And, believe it or not, most players do play for fun first. But for those who find efficiency more fun or just find the grind itself unfun then they can fast track it through regular capture fissures. While for everyone else there is now a viable alternative to multiple farms that they can choose to run. And this variety is how you avoid burnout which you inevitably rush yourself towards by solely playing for efficiency.

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5 hours ago, trst said:

Except they also reward 30-150k credits, a 50% chance at either a free radiant relic or 25-100 traces, and all the secondary objective rewards in Corpus missions. Y'know all the same secondary rewards Railjack already gives.

They're far from dead content for anyone that wants an alternative prime/credit farm. And anyone in the boat of not needing any of the secondary rewards/resources are suffering from having already "finished" the game rather than storms being unrewarding.

Trouble is its more effective to do normal RJ missions for that other stuff you mention with less hassle from the Void Storm, then just go run regular missions on your WF for relic cracking. As it stands it's both faster and more fun to do 1 regular RJ mission + 1 Capture WF mission than it is to do 1 Void Storm RJ mission.

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3 minutes ago, trst said:

If you're playing solely for efficiency in opening relics sure but you're not going to get everything else I listed in a normal fissure mission. Even if it's less efficient than doing some capture fissures followed by an Index run being able to knock out both farms simultaneously and then some is still reason enough for players to consider them.

Credits aren’t good enough for players to consider. They’ll just quickly pile up the longer you play.

 

4 minutes ago, trst said:

And, believe it or not, most players do play for fun first.

Yes and there is also the “Where’s my shiny” crowd. They are big and vocal.

 

6 minutes ago, trst said:

But for those who find efficiency more fun or just find the grind itself unfun then they can fast track it through regular capture fissures. While for everyone else there is now a viable alternative to multiple farms that they can choose to run. And this variety is how you avoid burnout which you inevitably rush yourself towards by solely playing for efficiency.

Not getting the items you want in a reasonable time frame can also cause burnout and frustrations. On average, a Veil Skirmish Void Storm mission takes around 10 minutes to complete and they reward 150k credits on completion. While in that 10 minutes assuming no loading times a player can do :

  • 2 Capture Fissures, 4 minute spent assuming not using speed run tactics.
  • 1 High Risk Index or Profit Taker that will take around 5-6 minutes.

Compare these rewards 

Veil Proxima Void Storm :

  • 1 prime part.
  • 150k credits.

“The Old Way” :

  • 2 prime parts.
  • 250k credits.

That’s almost Double the amount. It’s objectively clear that a mission that demands more work should not be worse than a mission that almost requires ZERO effort to do. At the very least they should be similar. You can’t have variety when there is one option that is superior. 

 

 

 

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In their current state - yes.
They need to rework them massively to even compete with normal missions.
Like many people suggested at least give the opportunity to open multiple relics at the same time - no it won't be a waste, it will be a big time saver. For example I have a gazillion lith relics that I can't open in my lifetime even if I tried.

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Yes, continue, bois. We must show that efficiency is the only way.

That is why I never run Defense, Survival, Disruption, Interception, Sabotage, Excavation, Assassinations. They are so damn inneficient when we have a mission that can last less than 30s like Capture. 

Surrender humanity.

Be release from the flesh.

Be EFFICIENT.

Be the machine. 

Let all become DALEK!

EXTERMINATE! EXTERMINATE!

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5 hours ago, trst said:

If Void Fissures give the same rewards as normal missions why bother doing Void Fissures?

Relics. The Relics you're opening is the answer to both of these questions.

If you're playing solely for efficiency in opening relics sure but you're not going to get everything else I listed in a normal fissure mission. Even if it's less efficient than doing some capture fissures followed by an Index run being able to knock out both farms simultaneously and then some is still reason enough for players to consider them.

And, believe it or not, most players do play for fun first. But for those who find efficiency more fun or just find the grind itself unfun then they can fast track it through regular capture fissures. While for everyone else there is now a viable alternative to multiple farms that they can choose to run. And this variety is how you avoid burnout which you inevitably rush yourself towards by solely playing for efficiency.

You don’t get visual clutter, and you can open relics elsewhere much faster.

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Honestly if they made it so Railjack gave more affinity than ESO, I think it would go a long way to making Railjack popular. As it stands, if you want to power level a frame or weapon, you do Hydron or do ESO, which are both mindless S#&$-missions. Make Railjack reward it's longer time investment with superior affinity. Especially since certain roles don't need maxed warframes or weapons to perform. Leaning into that makes Railjack accessible and desirable to different levels of player, because the newbie who doesn't know much and is trying to level their excalibur isn't entirely useless if you make em a gunner for the railjack, while the guy formaing his Wukong Prime for the sixth time and has an eight forma kuva nukor can go on the away missions and shear through the enemies. Everyone can be useful, everyone gets a ton of affinity/focus, and everyone gets to feel like they are actually playing a game, and not just standing in a glowy golden room while Mirage wipes every enemy instantly with explosive pick-ups.

 

Then for Void Storms, have them crack multiple relics of different tiers. Choose three relics of three different tiers. People still have to run low level fissure missions in order to crack relics for various parts. Which is not challenging, engaging or interesting. So why not make it so you can crack a lith, an axi and a meso at the same time in a railjack mission against lvl 40 enemies?

 

It's weird because logic and game design dictate that more complex and involved tasks offer a better payout, but it's the total opposite in Warframe. The fastest way to level something is to bring Saryn/Volt/Mirage to ESO and go to sleep. The fastest way to crack relics is to speedrun capture. It's silly and backwards and harmful to the game. The content that is actually engaging, challenging, or interesting isn't worth doing after you get the one-time rewards.

 

And Affinity is actually a really really really important resource, since so much of the game is based around resetting and releveling frames and weapons. Including other ways to do that is a smart way to make other forms of content relevant.

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15 hours ago, (XBOX)An Raging Hobo said:

De wanted to kill RJ and make no one like it plain and simple 

I understand your frustration, but why would the developer itself want to sabotage their own game? It keeps paying their bills, and offers a creative outlet for the devs.

Sooo...

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On 2021-04-15 at 3:31 AM, Crashen said:

It's weird because logic and game design dictate that more complex and involved tasks offer a better payout, but it's the total opposite in Warframe. The fastest way to level something is to bring Saryn/Volt/Mirage to ESO and go to sleep. The fastest way to crack relics is to speedrun capture. It's silly and backwards and harmful to the game. The content that is actually engaging, challenging, or interesting isn't worth doing after you get the one-time rewards.

This

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So far the free radiant relics and extra traces will keep me doing them here and their while also farming carmine penta part to sell off.

My only complaint is they don't work with grineer skirmishes not enough enemies to get traces off of or there's no fissures in the objectives. Honestly if you get reactant off enemy fighters it be fine

Length doesn't affect me as if yoy have a good team railjack goes by fast and i don't mind missions tgat are longer than average of im doing different things in that mission, defense is mind numbing boredom but railjack I'm at least moving place place to get things done

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In my opinion ordinary void fissures need to disappear, and void storms should replace them to give some sort of 'skill' gap between experienced players. To mitigate all the time storms take maybe we could get an opportunity to open more than one relic at a time?

Oh and definitely scale back particle effects, whoever at DE thinks particles=good graphics needs to look at other ways of improving the games look, because right now everyone's eyes are melting.

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Honestly I don't think I'd do Void Storm Relic cracking very much, partly because of the higher-on-average durability/damage of Railjack enemies.

Just slows everything down, I'd much rather go crack relics in a normal mission instead.

Perhaps I'd go for Void Storms if enemy fighter craft dropped the reactant instead, Skirmishes would be fairly quick comparatively then.

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On 2021-04-14 at 10:21 PM, -AncientWarrior- said:

Yeah  and you have to ask yourself why anyone would do this .. it just doesnt make any sense from a gaming or business point of view.. spend years developing a product and just wreck it from the start and make it worse as you go.. its just so confusing.

Same reason why ground missions and space battles can't happen at the same time: the game engine or net code is in dire need of an update.

In the last devstream, they talked about how they couldn't do certain things due to the coding and engine so they had to compromise.

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I think if they somehow could adapt a survival aspect of relic cracking like a trigger where once you hit 3 or so reactant it opens a relic then you repeat the trigger in a single void storm mission can open 3 relics at once might help. 

Like maybe make it so reactant drops  a lot more often so you pretty much can just worry about the mission and over the course of the mission you get 9 reactant where 3 of them would open a relic and it happens 3 times in a single void mission might help with the technical aspect of opening multiple relics in one mission.

The survival aspect would be the survival screen popping up once you hit 3 reactant and the current relic opens to select a new relic.

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2021/4/15 PM1点38分 , trst 说:

And, believe it or not, most players do play for fun first

If RJ is that much fun and popular DE wont need to rework it twice and pull reward form Fissures in the first place right?

"given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game" 

It alway is Devs job to design thier game to aline reward and fun. not the player.

Edited by BRZZAFK
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Gameplay wise, it's just Railjack with fissures. Both the good and bad parts.

So mostly what matters here is the rewards. Simply put, way, way too slow for cracking relics. The only way this would be worth it over normal fissures is if getting radiant relics or bonus traces was guaranteed. Ergo, if the relic cracking is significantly slower, the relic resources should be better significantly better.

One thing that nobody is talking about is that Railjack tends to overall be bad for Affinity, and this carries over to the fissures- Even moreso as corpus defense railjack objectives are suspiciously absent from fissures.

Other rewards suffer most of the same problems that railjack on a whole does. I. E. if you're cracking fissures on say, Helene, you're probably passively getting Orokin Cells, whereas in Railjack you're getting a lot of stuff that builds upgrades that are only useful in Railjack. This is really less a complaint about rewards here specifically, but a reminder that even with all the updates, Railjack still suffers from having bad integration with the rest of the game's progression.

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Since the content is different and people still like the different playstyle, why deem it ”dead content“? 
 

The problem you people have is that the rewards aren’t provided as fast as in normal relics. Wtf? If your looking for efficiency, don’t play the game at all. Get in bed at 7pm so you wake up earlier to get stuff done. Efficiency is useful in real life. But holy moly, the moment efficiency becomes the thing that decides what’s  good or bad content, people should reconsider playing at all.... 

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4 hours ago, Corvid said:

FYI the Moffat-era Cybermen are all Mondasian, as I recall.

If you say so... in New Who Cybermans and Daleks doesn't seem to be very.... it doesn't varies too much. I don't pay too much attention after N-th appearance of the "enemies of Dr".

ps. Thanks

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It's a change of pace to do rj with friends to crack relics, but then again we are also going for sevagoth and his boomstick.

Long term having the ability to open multiple relics at once and making the storms more engaging will help, as well as the addition of queenpins if done right.

If all you wanted was to crack relics you should be doing ground missions. But if you wanted credits, traces and relic cracking rj is definitely the way top go.

Spice! Add more spice.

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