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What elements do you like and hate about Europa's tileset?


Zahnny

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I remember a year ago there was someone on the forums who was doing community strawpolls and from those, it was found that Europa's tileset was the most disliked tileset currently in the game, but I can't remember if it had people describe why they disliked it, so I want to get peoples opinions in this thread and how a potential Rework could work. Who knows, someone from DE might even see it and take it into consideration.

On a similar note, what are your opinions on the minor Corpus Ice Mine tileset in Railjack? I've noticed many seem to enjoy it and although it's limited, would you be interested in Europa's tileset being more like that? Or should it still remain something different?

 

When I ask for opinions, it can be literally anything even if it seems like nitpicks.

Perhaps you don't like the Theme of the planet itself or dislike wintery maps? Perhaps you feel that the tileset is simply outdated, both visually and gameplay wise. Not fitting Warframe's gameplay style and needs a facelift?

Basically anything major or minor. Cosmetic critique is just as valid as gameplay critique.

 

Feel free to list as many or as little things but here's some of my opinions.

Pro: I actually like the perfectly circular carved ice tunnels taking you between tiles, similar to the Grineer tram systems in Asteroid tilesets. While I don't want them to be cluttered they could do with not being completely empty however.

Con: Out of bound teleports are too restrictive. There's a lot of area on Europa's surface tiles but it is mostly inaccessible or the out of bound teleports are too low considering Warframes can typically jump above them in a single bullet jump without buffing parkour velocity. Europa in general could do with more open space and being less claustrophobic.

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Con: This map is still a nightmare of collisions. Looks like every corner in this map can stop your movement if you even get close enough.

Pro: this is a world of possibility. With larger maps, better lightning, it can get awesome.

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29 minutes ago, renleech said:

Con: This map is still a nightmare of collisions. Looks like every corner in this map can stop your movement if you even get close enough.

Eris also have literally this same problem, I hope both tilesets gets reworked in the future

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Things I like about it: nothing.

Things I hate about it: just about everything.

Top two things I hate are the absurd number of little pokey bits that stick out everywhere to try and catch you, and the fact that far too often they have these big confusing rooms with like 10 different paths, but no intermediate waypoints.  "The door is here.  Hope you memorized which of the numerous different, but identical looking paths is the one to get to it!"

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The reason the Corpus Ice Planet tileset is so unpopular is because its tiles are horrible to parkour in. Either the areas are large stretches of plain, tiny corridors one can only walk through, or they're full of jagged level geometry that would invite parkour if they didn't make players snag constantly onto one thing or another. Many icy areas look completely washed-out, and the Corpus bits are either haphazard wreckage or tiny observation posts, which makes for a boring tileset overall.

The reason the Corpus Ice Mine works better, in my opinion, is because it takes the cool theme of navigating an icy landscape (pun not intended), yet actually makes it interesting to traverse. There are some icy corridors, but those corridors have things going on, and most of the rooms feature different bits of machinery and other structures to parkour around. The ice is generally darker and better-defined, which makes the area as a whole prettier and more interesting to explore. If the Ice Mine were to replace the Ice Planet tileset (with perhaps some surface tiles added), I'd be very happy.

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pros:

- skybox and surrounding frozen wastes looks cool

- the concept of crashed corpus ship meets underground ice caves

- actual environmental conditions: if there's no heat generators nearby on the surface, you start freezing to death. problem is that destroying them doesn't seem to hurt the Corpus.

cons:

- tight corridors are no fun, don't get me wrong, I love close combat, but there's close, and then there's close enough to feel your victims last breath on your face... not trying to be edgy, just stating how it is when 5 Crewmen decide to try shooting you in a space the size of a portaloo.

- some of the verticality is a bit skewed: I don't mind dealing with multiple floors, but the Waypoint system doesn't like it lol.

- Ice caves are a little too barren, the ones on Corpus Icedrivers look pretty good. also, why don't the Corpus have Solaris on Europa? not like they're strangers to hard labor and cold weather after all. 

and my biggest gripe of all:

- NO ICE PIRATES! WHY NOT?? the description for the Quanta Aufeis Skin CLEARLY states that Ice Pirates raiding caravans is a thing on Europa; why have we not encountered them yet!?: I imagine they'd look awesome ,their armour being like a post-apocalypse/space viking take on a Corpus Crewman Suit! not kidding, if I were asked to draw a concept for a new NPC in Warframe, it'd be an Ice Pirate Captain. total cliché rogue-cowboy type of course, like a discount Mandalorian... too bad I can't draw! XD

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It isn't the tileset per se but the level design that just accentuates the super frustrating collision checks on solid objects, with the narrow paths and abundance of obstacles. I'm all for realism but there is also such a thing as too much realism. I am a space ninja for crying out loud. Why the heck is a small protruding ledge blocking my flight when there is clearly enough space to squeeze past? Or that small little rock halting my roll-dodge like it's a freaking boulder?

I get it, I really do. Clipping isn't cool by today's standards. But sweet Jesus, I would prefer more than a little clipping over these infuriating road blocks.

 

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hot take: all of the stuff people complain about in particular Tilesets related to getting stuck on stuff or Navigation - it actually applies to all of the Tilesets, they're just too pleb to notice it in other places since they can fall asleep on the Bullet Jump key combo and still get to Extraction eventually.

there's unnecessary stuff to get stuck on absolutely everywhere in the game.

 

 

anyways i think Corpus Ice Planet is a pretty cool looking Tileset. it mixes a, well, Ice Planet, with some crashed wrecks of Ships from the Wars conintuously going on above the Surface of the Planet. 
just like Orokin Moon, different Environments meeting and blending together looks really awesome. you get multiple types of details simultaneously and that's a great recipe for success.

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I suspect (looking at most of the answers here, very correctly) that most people dislike this tileset because it requires a tiny little bit of active brain matter to navigate through.

We have one of the most agile moveset in the history of gaming, but if there is anything but smooth walls that people can slam across without a thought in the world, then it somehow becomes bad design. God forbid we have to keep our eyes open and actually navigate right ? As opposed as pointing in the vague direction and slide along every wall in the map, barely looking nor thinking to what we do.

Imo it's not the prettiest tileset, I can give you that anyday, but so hard to navigate that it becomes a serious problem for so many people ? Please... "I get stuck on things"... how 'bout you stop running into things ? It's ridiculous.

Same ridiculous complaints were made for kuva fortress and eris, by people incapable of maneuvering if it's not a straight, wide open corridor with 0 obstacle and very few exit points.

 

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2 hours ago, taiiat said:

 it actually applies to all of the Tilesets, they're just too pleb to notice it in other places since they can fall asleep on the Bullet Jump key combo and still get to Extraction eventually.

1 hour ago, Fallen77 said:

I suspect (looking at most of the answers here, very correctly) that most people dislike this tileset because it requires a tiny little bit of active brain matter to navigate through.

I don't think it's the fact that there is obstructions we have to navigate, but more the fact that the terrain has different collision geometry to what is actually visible. It's unfair to blame players for the level design being unfriendly. You wouldn't blame a person who struggles telling apart shades of red and green for mistaking a red or green door because that's completely outside of factors that they can control. Likewise, games are typically a visual medium, and if the level geometry is lying to us, it's not really our fault. It's hard to expect everyone to memorise every little collision defect in a tileset.

Things poking out having larger collision than would make sense, throwing off player movement and making the enviroment less trustworthy. I absolutely agree it doesn't just apply to Europa, it's just the biggest offender due to the secondary feature of Europa (first being ice) that it's a corpus ship graveyard with debris scattered farely commonly around the place.

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il y a une heure, Zahnny a dit :

I don't think it's the fact that there is obstructions we have to navigate, but more the fact that the terrain has different collision geometry to what is actually visible. It's unfair to blame players for the level design being unfriendly. You wouldn't blame a person who struggles telling apart shades of red and green for mistaking a red or green door because that's completely outside of factors that they can control. Likewise, games are typically a visual medium, and if the level geometry is lying to us, it's not really our fault. It's hard to expect everyone to memorise every little collision defect in a tileset.

Things poking out having larger collision than would make sense, throwing off player movement and making the enviroment less trustworthy. I absolutely agree it doesn't just apply to Europa, it's just the biggest offender due to the secondary feature of Europa (first being ice) that it's a corpus ship graveyard with debris scattered farely commonly around the place.

Meh, I don't see those suposedly larger than shown hitbox.

Maybe one or two debris through the entire tileset are a couple inches off, but nothing that really warrants such a reaction from what I've experienced over the years.

What I do see a lot of is players slopilly bullet jumping straight into debris, jaming themselves into the structure, then spamming bullet jump forward to no avail, trying to go bellow something that they visually have no business going through.

Hitboxes are not perfect by any means, but the huge majority of issues I see people having could be avoided by playing better, being more accurate with their jumps, not scraping every wall.

I guess hitboxes could be a bit less sticky, be a bit more leniant with letting players through, but that might lead to a lot of going out of bounds, so I'll take our more sticky surfaces anyday.

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3 hours ago, Zahnny said:

the terrain has different collision geometry to what is actually visible.

unnecessary Clipping Planes, maybe... a bit?
every Tileset has some of this though. and Infested Ship has far more of it if you ask me.

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5 minutes ago, (XBOX)Obi Wan Dandobi said:

I quite like the Europa tileset, it certainly isn't the worse, not even close (take a bow Eris, Uranus, Kuva fortress). The aesthetic is cool and closed to open back to closed feel of the map makes it pretty interesting.

Out of curiosity, what do you hate about Uranus? It's my favourite grineer tileset so I'm just curious.

I love the asthetic but hate the Sharkwing sections.

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2 hours ago, Zahnny said:

 

6 hours ago, Zahnny said:

I absolutely agree it doesn't just apply to Europa, it's just the biggest offender due to the secondary feature of Europa (first being ice) that it's a corpus ship graveyard with debris scattered farely commonly around the place.

 

 

3 hours ago, taiiat said:

and Infested Ship has far more of it if you ask me.

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Zahnny said:

Out of curiosity, what do you hate about Uranus? It's my favourite grineer tileset so I'm just curious.
I love the asthetic but hate the Sharkwing sections.

everyone hates the sharkwing sections ofcourse so i'm sure that's on everyones' list.
i mostly hate them for how awful the transition in/out is, taking upwards of 5 Seconds is actively frustrating. 

accidental Sharkwing is another great way to be instantly infuriated. not only because it cancels any Abilities but because you have to spend like 8 Seconds waiting to fully fall in so you can trigger the jump out Animation and.... man that's just so bad.

Grineer Sealab is also kinda annoying for those Elevator Shafts. they're thematic i guess..... simulating going to the 'Sea' floor.... but man, you basically start every Mission going down 3+ Elevator Shafts. any other Tiles with enormous Vertical changes are also annoying in a similar respect. Parkour can cope with it, but scaling huge sheer cliffs just isn't very interesting Parkour wise, so.

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