Jump to content

Raids will fail at this point (My opinion)


Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

Please read before you comment :)

I genuinely think Less Spawns and a better enemy A.I could make the game 10 times more fun and interesting to play, I don't know why the devs think overwhelming players with hordes of enemies that literally act the same way is a good Idea.

bcs lets be honest here, Warframe is not a top down ARPG, it is nothing like Path of exile or Diablo franchise, those games have built in mechanics that makes them worth playing, builds in ARPGs makes sense and more about your play style than about the numbers, while every time I get into a mission in warframe I wish there was something else to do rather than just mindlessly shoot and use melee to kill everything as quickly as possible, even using warframe abilities feels the same sometimes.

with DE now releasing a new warframe in every update, DE will always struggle to make good content bcs of the way this game was made 8 years ago, gaming back then was very influenced by Games like CoD and Left4Dead, For them to make things such as 8 player Raids possible tweaks to the way we interact with enemies is necessary, Otherwise... Raids will end up being glorified Extermination missions like state of Deimos Isolation vaults, Even bosses are nothing more than bigger enemies with more HP.

 and we see the same trend being replicated in Railjack which is supposed to represent the future of the game maybe ? We Need interesting ways to use our arsenal and weapons rather than Adding more Weapons to the Arsenal, otherwise what's the difference between one loadout and another if all you do is Exterminate, every mission type is literally Extermination with minor differences, We need threats to force us to use different strategies.

the only place I see this being utilized in with Eidolon, They literally force you to use Operators, I still don't understand why the hate on some of the best content DE added to the game, sometimes I start to think its not DE's fault the game is a big Giant extermination mission, sometimes I think its ours, we're too used to mindlessly shooting and slashing enemies in the same game logic that hasn't changed since release of the game..... And I'm telling you, Raids will Fail miserably, New war will probably end up being a 30 min long quest, and Duviri will probably end up being a content Island with tons of grind... but to when ?? I was just watching some streamer playing Returnal, a game that got released out of nowhere, Its literally what warframe should've been in 2021, No matter the visual cluster DE trying to make, no matter the Graphical enhancement they add to warframe, This game plays and feel more like a 2008 game... 

again, I Love this game... but playing it sometimes feel more like a Chore..

Apologies for the Rant.

Edit : So I went did some Youtube search on what "Law Of Retribution Trails" are, And oh god, I'm glad this isn't in the game anymore, If DE plans on bringing back raids to Warframe, it better not be like this : 

 This is very complex to play as a team, I would like to see Raids coming back to the game but not like this, I think More fights like the Orbs and Eidolons should be fine with some good rewards attached to it, Maybe Make arcanes more like The Gem system from PoE, this will give us a reason to play raids.

My conclusion :

I don't think warframe needs the "Waw factor" anymore, In fact it needs to be constantly updated with more Reworks to existing outdated systems, and more quality of Life features, DE doesn't have to re-invent the wheel every time they want to add content, Raids could simply be more Bosses like Tridolons with 8 players, I also think the game would be better if enemies are more interesting and force you to use your arsenal, and not some Random Grind Hard Squad cheese build.

Thank you for discussing my post guys, Until next update !

Edited by MouadSaqui
Paragraphs
  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Please put some paragraphs in your post to make it easier to read.

 

Didn't read your post yet, but I think new raids will have a hard time getting a decent playerbase in the days of many solo players that also never want to fail any mission.

 

Edit:

I think the power creep just sells well, back in the day when emptying your entire Brakk into a heavy gunner to kill it was considered an amazing weapon, DE had to add something even better to get people to farm/buy it. Now years later we have a laser pointer that takes out a group of those same heavy gunners in a seccond.

 

There's no coming back from it now, but as long as DE can think of something decent to do with all the power, the game will still be fun.

Disruption gives you a ton of easy targets, but the mode is really about spotting a specific enemy fast and getting rid of it quickly, if you just stand around and kill, the demolyst will not leave you much time to kill it.

Some of the priority corpus railjack targets require you to get from point A to B really fast, that way DE is still asking you to learn the movement system, which is the best part of this game.

Missions that have additional loot hidden around are great to learn about hidden rooms and figure out how to navigate through them quickly while also breaking every single container there is.

 

But the other modes I can think of are pretty much all about throwing all of your strongest power and guns constantly at the enemies until that green waypoint tells you to leave.

 

Getting back to "players hate to fail", which is also the reason many people don't like eidolons.

It kind of started with removing daily revives and instead making them useable for every mission, previously dying was pretty punishing and you avoided it as much as possible, but now the only penality is a meager amount of exp you won't even miss in most missions.

Now add more warframes getting 90% damage reduction powers and adaptation and suddenly level 1000 enemies gunning you down will have a hard time ever taking you down. Worst offender for people that never want to die is Inaros, adds nothing to make the team perform better, but also doesn't have to rely on energy or even inputs to stay alive once you stack heatlh and install Grace, bonus points if the Inaros player is using an infused ability to get even tankier instead of using something that does anything.

Another good example is the glassmaker boss fight, tons of complaints about dying in a single hit and hating the mission for being unfair, but it was actually a great test of skill of all your movement and evasion skills, which obviously many Inaros mains never bother to learn.

(Wanted to add something about people refusing to learn certain missions, but demanding to get carried for it, but that only really applies to eidolons or poorly explained missions, but couldn't word it without sounding mean/ just ranting)

 

DE is making lods of emone these days and these have a ton of internal stats to see which part of the playerbase is actually keeping the lights on, if the "never fail, only nuke" playerbase is the one that shovels money into the game, Warframe will further evolve to suit their needs. If content releasses that asks you for more skill or asks you do to different things releasses, but the people playing it don't send in nearly as much money, it won't get further content expansion or even be cut off the game entirely if bug fixing gets too difficult.

 

Ultimately you have to find your own niche of content you like, if you have done everything fun, come back later, if that doesn't help you will just have to move on, I've done so many times with other games myself.

Edited by 16Bitman
  • Like 14
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the main problem is Warframe doesn't know what sort of game it is or even wants to be. A major aspect of this is the player base pulling in two different directions. Broadly one side wanting quick, easy, overwhelming power while the other side want challenging, skill based content. I remember DE_Steve once saying something to the effct the game was always flipping between being Dynasty Warriors and Dark Souls. Ultimately I think the devs need to make a firm decision where they want the difficulty of the game to sit and work towards it. Large parts of the community won't like it but to be blunt they need to like it or lump it. Harsh as it is I belive this would be best for the quality of the game. Sadly I suspect the current status que of trying to pander to everyone will continue as this better for the longevity of the game.

  • Like 22
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, (PSN)Shelneroth said:

I remember DE_Steve once saying something to the effct the game was always flipping between being Dynasty Warriors and Dark Souls.

DE's direction regarding difficulty seems to be going the Dynasty Warriors route. Warframe is a horde shooter after all. Every time DE adds something remotely challenging they will always dumb it down later on because that's not what the majority wants. We've seen it countless time throughout the years, Fortuna and Railjack are good examples of that.

  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sometimes hordes aren't always a problem. When I am playing Sevagoth and I'm in a horde of enemies, I am basically immortal as long as I can keep hitting things. I actually find it harder to survive when I'm NOT surrounded by hordes, rather just a few very powerful enemies that are spaced out. (Kuva Liches and their Thralls are a good example of that.)

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Warframe is a looter. How would new players get loot if they're fighting less than already sparse enemies on the regular starchart?

The hordes of enemies shouldn't be overwhelming unless you're new or inexperienced as well, hence the already weak spawns on the regular starchart. 

This isn't a "raiding" type of game, but people keep asking for it so DE is gonna make an attempt to throw it in the spaghetti code because there's demand for it. All they can do is try to bug fix all they can and deal with the host migration complaints.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are not a lot of players that play Steel Path so I don't think raids would be a huge issue. Unless players are in meta mode, the enemies actually have time to form up and attack, wrecking players. I've watched this time and time again when I play with randos and it begs them to go to youtube for the meta spoilers and tips. 

Second, regardless of what DE brings out, many of the youtubers do an absolutely horrible, HORRIBLE job of covering the content. Bypassing slick and thoughtful preview play, these youtubers completely play the content while providing complete hand-holding guides. The experience is in learning what to do by experience, not by just watching someone else. This is what creates the "insta-vet" syndrome. That problem is out of DE's hands so it's basically players applying self-damage over time. 

Third, the new void storm setup tells me a raid is almost ready to go! Powerful obstacles that increase over time that affects both the railjack and warframes. This also means that a boss can have more time to set up offenses and defenses while we have to be faster and more agile, greatly increasing parkour usage. Further, instant enemy spawns means enemies need less travel a path and, instead, can get right to the attack. Even better is in how a very heavily armed ship or Jordas type enemy could give the railjack a helluva raid fight, requiring high maneuvering, void storm avoidance and a more intense three stage sequence like: staged ship incapacitations --> massive fleet fight while the ship recovers --> repeat --> enter the ship for lich fight and defeat lich.

 

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I mean, pretty much. Game ain't balanced, so nothing works. Recently now more than ever DE's been struggling to create content that isn't some iteration of Exterminate or Mobile Defense. It's always either some sort of timer that you have to hurry up and wait for or a mindless click-a-thon of cardboard enemies. Even SP can't offer a challenge to anyone who half knows what they're doing. I still think the game could be balanced, at least much better than it is right now, with a few relatively simple changes and some willpower. Putting in the effort would improve a lot of things, but it feels like DE would rather just keep coasting as if nothing is wrong.

  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
Il y a 4 heures, (PSN)Shelneroth a dit :

I think the main problem is Warframe doesn't know what sort of game it is or even wants to be. A major aspect of this is the player base pulling in two different directions. Broadly one side wanting quick, easy, overwhelming power while the other side want challenging, skill based content. I remember DE_Steve once saying something to the effct the game was always flipping between being Dynasty Warriors and Dark Souls. Ultimately I think the devs need to make a firm decision where they want the difficulty of the game to sit and work towards it. Large parts of the community won't like it but to be blunt they need to like it or lump it. Harsh as it is I belive this would be best for the quality of the game. Sadly I suspect the current status que of trying to pander to everyone will continue as this better for the longevity of the game.

This. I'm on the "I want a challenge not to be bored" side of things and either way would be fine.

Challenging instanced content is far from impossible, Anthem and Destiny have done that properly and they have less resources at their disposal than DE these days so it's not a matter of "can we do it?" but "do we want to?". Instead of working on their 4th iteration of the plains of Eidolon which is getting really tedious and overdone by now with Duviri or whatever it's called, maybe they could surprise us and do something new for once.

As it is all we have is the steel path which is a bad joke because it's the same old crap we've had for 8 years with 100 extra levels and a few uninspired rewards tacked on - if the "reworked" Jackal is all their designers can come up with maybe they need new hires.

Edited by sixmille
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, DrivaMain said:

DE's direction regarding difficulty seems to be going the Dynasty Warriors route. Warframe is a horde shooter after all. Every time DE adds something remotely challenging they will always dumb it down later on because that's not what the majority wants. We've seen it countless time throughout the years, Fortuna and Railjack are good examples of that.

This.

Dynasty/ Samurai Warriors is a genre. They even give it a name recently: "crowd brawler"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Crowd-combat_fighting_games

To put it simply in layman's terms, warriors games are comfort games, games that makes you feel powerful, feel good about yourself, release stress, some might even go as far as calling them guilty pleasure games.

They are NOT games that supposed to challenge you, provide any form of complex entertainment, or increase your brain size whatsoever.

I'm just saying, if you don't want to have a hard time, don't play cuphead, nioh, or dark souls. If you don't want to get scared, don't play resident evil, fatal frame, or outlast. You see where I'm getting here, mate? Right now you're expecting something wrong at the wrong place. Do not play barbie dream house if you want to enjoy award winning story, go play god of war instead.

Edited by Soy77
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, DrivaMain said:

DE's direction regarding difficulty seems to be going the Dynasty Warriors route. Warframe is a horde shooter after all. Every time DE adds something remotely challenging they will always dumb it down later on because that's not what the majority wants. We've seen it countless time throughout the years, Fortuna and Railjack are good examples of that.

Also Nobody plays Dynasty Warrior in 2021 except some niche type of players, that game is dead

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Only read 1 line, already disgusted. Less spawns? Please, when playing solo or with less than 4 players there already are no enemies outside of steel path. And you want even less? No thanks.

Edit: also i love people flailing around "just use better ai 4Head", it starts to make my skin crawl. Because as of 9th May 2021, there still is NO good and uncheesable AI. Every game people claim having intelligent ai can be debunked by just visiting speedrun dot com (seriously, do it. You'd be surprised that your flawless other game isn't flawless at all) where every game 'claimed' to have done it right, looks even worse than warframes ai. 

--

I think the only aspect of warframe that is failing is this weird part of the community that would like warframe to be something it never was, isn't, and never will be. And instead of playing the games that people actually want, and games that have what they need, they rather sit in the orbiter for hours typing their fingers off trying their best to not play other games.

Edited by (XBOX)TyeGoo
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, MouadSaqui said:

Also Nobody plays Dynasty Warrior in 2021 except some niche type of players, that game is dead

A lot of people used to play it back in the day, myself included during the glory days of PS2. It was a good power fantasy game.

Edited by DrivaMain
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, 16Bitman said:

DE is making lods of emone these days and these have a ton of internal stats to see which part of the playerbase is actually keeping the lights on, if the "never fail, only nuke" playerbase is the one that shovels money into the game, Warframe will further evolve to suit their needs. If content releasses that asks you for more skill or asks you do to different things releasses, but the people playing it don't send in nearly as much money, it won't get further content expansion or even be cut off the game entirely if bug fixing gets too difficult.

This is how game companies back themselves in a corner, if this was the right approach we wouldn't see games like genshin Impact making a billion dollar in 6 months, DE's short vision is crippling the game, Always catering to what the majority wants make the product appeal on a certain type of costumers and not others, Yeah sure DE can have a moment of glory every now and then with Ambitious updates, but Obviously some players will burnout, others will move on to play other games and the game will keep Recycling new players who still didn't figure out how to use Mods properly, those who go straight to the market and buy starter packs.... and if you think about it, there is a reason why new player experience sucks, even me who spent a lot of time playing it still can't figure out what "state sticks" are and how they work, This game has a solid foundation to Surpass any Looter shooter out there but sadly DE won't listen.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, (XBOX)TyeGoo said:

Edit: also i love people flailing around "just use better ai 4Head", it starts to make my skin crawl. Because as of 9th May 2021, there still is NO good and uncheesable AI. Every game people claim having intelligent ai can be debunked by just visiting speedrun dot com (seriously, do it. You'd be surprised that your flawless other game isn't flawless at all) where every game 'claimed' to have done it right, looks even worse than warframes ai. 

By AI people mean good interesting enemy move sets, and better behavior, nobody asked for a super intelligent ai, the problem is when mobile games starts having more interesting enemies than Warframe enemies here we have a problem, bcs anyone can download Unity 3D and donwload some AI script from github and make better AI for a mobile game than How grineers act in this game

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Il y a 1 heure, MouadSaqui a dit :

By AI people mean good interesting enemy move sets, and better behavior, nobody asked for a super intelligent ai, the problem is when mobile games starts having more interesting enemies than Warframe enemies here we have a problem, bcs anyone can download Unity 3D and donwload some AI script from github and make better AI for a mobile game than How grineers act in this game

Speaking of that, yeah, some mobile games have richer and deeper content than Warframe when you think of it.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

the only place I see this being utilized in with Eidolon, They literally force you to use Operators, I still don't understand why the hate on some of the best content DE added to the game, sometimes I start to think its not DE's fault the game is a big Giant extermination mission, sometimes I think its ours, we're too used to mindlessly shooting and slashing enemies in the same game logic that hasn't changed since release of the game..... And I'm telling you, Raids will Fail miserably, New war will probably end up being a 30 min long quest, and Duviri will probably end up being a content Island with tons of grind... but to when ?? I was just watching some streamer playing Returnal, a game that got released out of nowhere, Its literally what warframe should've been in 2021, No matter the visual cluster DE trying to make, no matter the Graphical enhancement they add to warframe, This game plays and feel more like a 2008 game...

Because there's so much DE can do with the game, but they don't and they won't. Whether it is because they actively don't want to, or they aren't skilled enough as a dev team to do so, or their code for Warframe is such a mess that they dare not mess with it...who knows. Just, there's a great many things DE could do with the game. Unfortunately, it won't happen.

Also, Warframe is literally a grindfest. Others above have discussed the debate between quick missions and challenging missions. I'm in neither camp. I need a reason to care. A reason to keep playing. A reason to bother. I need a story. DE can't provide that reason. It took me a while to realize that. DE's story missions are just vague stuff meant to look and appear grand and deep, but it's just shallow. You referenced Returnal. I will reference Final Fantasy 14, a game that shouldn't be popular, a game that shouldn't have succeeded considering the state it was released in. At the same time, after playing through the free trial and getting through the main story and expansion, oh boy is it a fantastic story with fantastic characters that make you care about them. It's like they know how to make players care about a character, even one they barely met. Compare that to DE and, despite having the elements for a great story present, it is something they either won't capitalize on or are incapable of doing so for whatever reason. Returnal was made with a story in mind and to have the story be relevant even after players die. Warframe is a game that is meant to be a grind so players can grind for the grind where they grind, grind, grind, grind and grind in order to grind, and grind and grind so they can better grind and grind and grind. Eventually players will stop playing Returnal because they got what they wanted out of it, and others will stop once they've gotten 100%. Others will replay at their own leisure, be it for the game, the story or both. Others will play the DLC once they've finished the story, others will finish when they've gotten 100% and others will stop once they've done both. Warframe has no end as it's meant to be a grind where players grind so they can grind in order to better grind for the grind. The game does not have depth. There's no core reason to do anything.

 

7 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

I genuinely think Less Spawns and a better enemy A.I could make the game 10 times more fun and interesting to play, I don't know why the devs think overwhelming players with hordes of enemies that literally act the same way is a good Idea.

with DE now releasing a new warframe in every update, DE will always struggle to make good content bcs of the way this game was made 8 years ago, gaming back then was very influenced by Games like CoD and Left4Dead, For them to make things such as 8 player Raids possible tweaks to the way we interact with enemies is necessary, Otherwise... Raids will end up being glorified Extermination missions like state of Deimos Isolation vaults, Even bosses are nothing more than bigger enemies with more HP.

 and we see the same trend being replicated in Railjack which is supposed to represent the future of the game maybe ? We Need interesting ways to use our arsenal and weapons rather than Adding more Weapons to the Arsenal, otherwise what's the difference between one loadout and another if all you do is Exterminate, every mission type is literally Extermination with minor differences, We need threats to force us to use different strategies.

Making new Warframes with every update brings DE money. Players spend money, or trade and sell to get enough plat, and buy those new frames, weapons and accessories outright rather than grind for them (yes, I know some stuff can't be obtained via grinding [re: Tennogen]). No judgment there. It just means DE is stuck with making new things with every update to keep money coming in, regardless of what it does to the game.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Raids will always fail in these types of games, or they'll require massive overhauls/additions to the core mechanics to support it. Aslong as a game doesnt have a trinity setup raids will mostly be regular content that just completely miss the essence of what made raids popular in raiding games since MMORPGs were "invented". WF isnt the first non-trinity game that has tried it and failed misserably, and it doesnt matter how many tries they attempt it will still end up failing. WF has in essence tried two different types of raids, since both conflicts and trials were "raid" content.

The only non-trinity game out there that has successfully implemented raids as an afterthought is Guild Wars 2. But it didnt just slap on the raids, it already had open world encounters that let them dip their toes in the raid pond. However, when they decided to introduce raids, they also made massive changes to the classes, and gave them the options to build both as tanks, dps and healer/support. Things that may not work in 99.99% of the rest of the game, but it works in the raids in order to make them feel like actual raid-game raids in the veins of EQ, WoW, DaoC and so on.

And to touch on the A.I thing. Improving the A.I of WF will do nothing, other things need to change first to even make an A.I improvement remotely useful or noticable. When we move at the speed of light between enemy and enemy, and have access to an arsenal that lets you slot 3 tactical nukes along with a skill kit that could take out planets it doesnt matter how smart your enemy is. This game isnt Outriders for instance, where a sniper might actually have a chance to fill his role, in WF a sniper trying to shoot you from a smart position will be dead the moment you press a button of your choice. The sniper will also have a very low chance ever hitting you, or even get a shot off before you are on his position cleaving him in two. I wouldnt notice a different between the A.I we have now or the Musk A.I that servered as a competative component in a MOBA test. I'd fart in its general direction either way and likely kill it and all its friends with that fart, because that is Warframe. Sadly most people are against changing that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

I genuinely think Less Spawns and a better enemy A.I could make the game 10 times more fun and interesting to play, I don't know why the devs think overwhelming players with hordes of enemies that literally act the same way is a good Idea.

Saryn , Equinox , Mirage , Mesa , Gara , Nova , Protea , Vauban , Volt can nuke or trivialize enemies with out needed to see them and even behind walls .

To quote DE Pablo "you can have the best AI in the world , it wont matter if players can endlessly CC and kill anything in 50 meters range"

 

  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I mean good gameplay is good gameplay.

It's too oversimplified and unspecific, to say "pvp can't work" or whatever. Plus, we know if the loot is there, people will grind anything.

Raids could have any number of features... or bugs, you can't really just say "raids" and make any conclusions. Good gameplay, with proper loot, well-adjusted difficulty etc etc etc. it's a long list of items, really. And it's fragile, taking only a few blunders to completely ruin features or game modes.

"Generalizing is always wrong", lol...

What I will say about gameplay, in general, is they stagnated and threw in the towel quite some time ago. So what does it really matter, what you name the game mode. Quality is quality by any other name.

Generic copy-pasted content and pumping out frames, is exactly what they said they didn't want to do. They set out to be innovative and experimental, so in so far as that, I feel it's fair to say the game has failed.

On top of that, they become their own problem, when they focus on gating loot behind content, making the content last only as long as it took to grind it. Where people echo that frame of mind, turning cheap scape uncle scrooge and resentful.

When you look at something like kuva liches, you immediately notice the 13 different ways they added artificial grinds, to waste as much time as possible.

It's a little harder to spot, where the intent of fun went.

It's coasting, complacency. They aren't accountable for the quality of the content, when people are willing to grind anything, given the right loot. So they spend most of the pitch meetings, coming up with ways to install new grinds.

Any renaming of game modes is going to have the same problems, so I feel the debate is better off, discussing all the actual, individual problems, in detail.

Then you can name it whatever you want later.

 

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah yes, the magical better AI.

haha press 4 to nuke over and over again

Seriously, no matter how good and interesting the AI is, it won't matter because they will be alive for 1-2 seconds before being dematerialized by a walking warcrime.

When you are flying at Mach 2 and can get up to 40 meters altitude with a press of two buttons and kill everything in sight in 5 seconds, good AI cannot thrive.

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

I genuinely think Less Spawns and a better enemy A.I could make the game 10 times more fun and interesting to play,

I'm the opposite way: nuke-spam aside, Combat is one of the thigns warframe gets right, and there's never enough enemeis in most Solo missions.

8 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

Even bosses are nothing more than bigger enemies with more HP.

the same can be said of a lot of bosses in a lot of other games. one can't deny that it's much easier to take an existing enemy unit and beef them up than it is to create an all-new dedicated boss from the ground up.

8 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

 We need threats to force us to use different strategies.

different strategies like what exactly? the only way you're gonna stop somehtign that's shooting at you is by shooting it back, or running in and stabbing it. you want to do a puzzle instead? Nihil's fight was more platform oriented and required players to master doing a specific series of actions - dodge glass bombs, pick up bombs and throw them back, dodge and bullet jump to avoid sword swings and move between platforms - and it wasn't receieved all that well.

as for raids.. I wouldn't bother worrying about them; just because DE says they plan on bringing them back, doesn't mean we'll see them any time soon.  it'll probably be at least another year or two before we even hear about them again.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Surbusken said:

It's coasting, complacency. They aren't accountable for the quality of the content, when people are willing to grind anything, given the right loot. So they spend most of the pitch meetings, coming up with ways to install new grinds.

Yet the grinds in WF are very short compared to most other western looters out there. It took me a shorter time grinding out all the Kuva weapons I wanted to max than it took me grinding out a full "steed" loadout for my D3 Crusader, which I in the end gave up on. It also took a shorter time to get those kuva weapons to max than the time it has taken me to get even a single High Roller or Boreal pants in Outriders, two things I've still not seen as drops.

I dont think DE's problem is the grinds, it is that they make really nice looking content that just doesnt support our power. Another issues is that they dont fully work systems into eachother, if they did we'd have Steel Path versions of everything, supporting out power slightly better. I mean, I dont think it is wrong to release nice looking content when you love the world and setting of your IP, it would however be nice with more content that also supports the progress we've made. It does however seem that atmosphere and ambiance is the higher priority, while regular "difficulty" makes up the combat content.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, MouadSaqui said:

Please read before you comment :)

I genuinely think Less Spawns and a better enemy A.I could make the game 10 times more fun and interesting to play, I don't know why the devs think overwhelming players with hordes of enemies that literally act the same way is a good Idea.

Nope. Sorry, not going to read an essay on why enemy density is too high. 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...