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Why Rivens Suck, and an easy way to fix that


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32 minutes ago, Aldain said:

No Riven on Earth is going to make an Aklato enjoyable to use, and I have one that nearly gives +400% damage and 300% multishot.

Aklato is a MR3 weapon that's meant to be replaced as you progress through the game. I don't think it should be able to compete with higher MR weapons even with riven. What would be the point of progressing through the game if all you ever needed was starter weapons? 

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Just now, Berzerkules said:

Aklato is a MR3 weapon that's meant to be replaced as you progress through the game. I don't think it should be able to compete with higher MR weapons even with riven. What would be the point of progressing through the game if all you ever needed was starter weapons? 

My point is that people constantly harp on how Rivens are supposed to help weaker weapons, but almost never do because Riven mods only give percentage based boosts to stats, which means only base stats matter.

That's my major point of contention with Riven mods, and that they've been used as an excuse for not properly balancing or adjusting weapon stats for years.

Oh and about the whole MR3 thing, Melee weapons as a whole pretty much ignore the MR thing entirely thanks to mods like Blood Rush/Condition Overload/Weeping Wounds and outdamage many Primaries and Secondaries of drastically higher MR, yet ranged weapons currently are discarded and disregarded in droves, MR hasn't meant anything to weapons for a long time thanks to that.

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, Aldain said:

My point is that people constantly harp on how Rivens are supposed to help weaker weapons, but almost never do because Riven mods only give percentage based boosts to stats, which means only base stats matter.

That's my major point of contention with Riven mods, and that they've been used as an excuse for not properly balancing or adjusting weapon stats for years.

Oh and about the whole MR3 thing, Melee weapons as a whole pretty much ignore the MR thing entirely thanks to mods like Blood Rush/Condition Overload/Weeping Wounds and outdamage many Primaries and Secondaries of drastically higher MR, yet ranged weapons currently are discarded and disregarded in droves, MR hasn't meant anything to weapons for a long time thanks to that.

If rivens gave bonuses to base unmodded stats trash weapons could become viable but already good weapons would be entirely too strong. Imagine a Reaper Prime riven with +30% to to base unmodded crit chance and 2x cd multiplier, your Reaper would now have base 65% cc with a 4.5x cd multiplier. It would do nothing to close the gap between weak and strong weapons, it would probably make it even worse. 

I'm not trying to defend the riven system as a means to balance the disparity between weapons, it fails in it's intended purpose. I'm just saying that not all weapons can or should be a viable option throughout the game. These type of games are going to give you access to trash weapons early in the game so that when we rank up and gain access to more weapons we feel stronger, there is a sense of accomplishment. Our time and effort has been rewarded and we want to continue to progress to through the game, gaining access to better weapons to face the tougher foes that await us. There is a natural progression to these sort of games, expecting a single mod to bypass that is an unrealistic expectation and it would be unhealthy for the game if you could. There would be no need or to progress if there was no des

Melee vs ranged is a conversation for an entirely different topic but, there are a few lower MR ranged weapons like the Kohm (MR5) and Hek (MR 4) that can carry you through the star chart and beyond. The exceptions don't make the rule though, many low level ranged weapons will never be useful, many high MR ones are trash as well.  

Edited by Berzerkules
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I'd recommend giving that Zhuge riven a go. It'll turn the Prime variant in to a monster - speaking from experience using a crit chance/fire rate/multishot one.

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Just now, Dualice said:

I'd recommend giving that Zhuge riven a go. It'll turn the Prime variant in to a monster - speaking from experience using a crit chance/fire rate/multishot one.

Zhuge Prime is actually a fun weapon. Once I learned it had a secondary explosion I realized I could use it to apply status for co. I was hunting a lich recently and was killing enemies before I had a chance to melee, no riven/damage mods and built for full utility status chance, multi shot and firerate. 

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Berzerkules said:

Zhuge Prime is actually a fun weapon. Once I learned it had a secondary explosion I realized I could use it to apply status for co. I was hunting a lich recently and was killing enemies before I had a chance to melee, no riven/damage mods and built for full utility status chance, multi shot and firerate. 

Indeed it's a much underrated weapon, though I can't complain too much as it's keeping the riven disposition high! 

On-topic, yeah the riven system in general is just layers of RNG. As others have mentioned, OP's proposal would mean folk would just be unveiling rivens for the same handful of weapons, further destroying their disposition and kind of defeating the purpose of having a riven in the first place.

And honestly with the potency of some of the newer kit coming out, as well as the sheer power of the current melee meta, most weapons don't even need rivens for the kind of content the average player is running. One can comfortably run solo Steel Path content with a Stahlta, Epitaph, and Nikana Prime (a general example from my experience) and no rivens.

Edited by Dualice
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