Instead of Removing Cephalon Cy Research from Clans that researched it - Why not leave it as a legacy research?

[(PSN)Wolf_Folivora]

In the > Call of the Tempestarii: TennoGen: Hotfix 30.2.2 < one of the railjack changes was listed as > Removed Cephalon Cy Research from Clans and moved Blueprint to the in-game Market for Credits. < While having Cephalon Cy avalible in the Market is great for Clan-less Tenno, the investment for researching Cy prior to this update was considirable. For some Clans the cost of researching Cephalon Cy was even up to 500 Fieldron, 500 Detonite Injector, 500 Mutagen Mass, 400 Orokin Cells,... you get the idea. I believe it is fundamentally wrong to just delete this player investment from Clan Dojos. If a Clan decided to research the Cephalon when it was available - than they should be allowed to keep it in their Dojo as a legacy research. While for those who did not, or couldn't the Cephalon Cy Research can always remain available in the Market.
For Storm, Mountain, and Moon Clans the Cephalon Cy was a costly Research, a community effort. Let's not just press the delete button. DE Please respect the player Investment.

[TARINunit9]

15 minutes ago, (PSN)Wolf_von_Saturn said:

For some Clans the cost of researching Cephalon Cy was even up to 500 Fieldron, 500 Detonite Injector, 500 Mutagen Mass, 400 Orokin Cells,... you get the idea. I believe it is fundamentally wrong to just delete this player investment from Clan Dojos.

Any time DE changes research costs, the difference (in this case, 100%) refunded and credited to the clan's vault. If DE ever releases more research that requires more Fieldron for example, the clans will get to research it for free

[(PSN)Wolf_Folivora]

1 minute ago, TARINunit9 said:

Any time DE changes research costs, the difference (in this case, 100%) refunded and credited to the clan's vault. If DE ever releases more research that requires more Fieldron for example, the clans will get to research it for free

It is NOT about the resources. It is about the clan deciding to research this project to have it. And for a big Clan like Moon for example: it was also a community effort to complete the Cephalon Cy research.

[TARINunit9]

3 minutes ago, (PSN)Wolf_von_Saturn said:

It is NOT about the resources. It is about the clan deciding to research this project to have it. 

Yeah but what does that accomplish?

3 minutes ago, (PSN)Wolf_von_Saturn said:

 And for a big Clan like Moon for example: it was also a community effort to complete the Cephalon Cy research.

I mean maybe give the clans a trophy for it. But the research itself, I'd like to avoid the implications of "Ignis Wraith again, except 10 times stupider"

[KIREEK]

Legacy research is one of the main problems with clans, resulting in many issues, to name a few:

• Users may engage in RMT to purchase dojos with said research, while it's true it exists on normal clans, some users specifically seek clans with unobtainable research
• Recruiters mislead users on the actual state of research, what is not convinient isn't spoken, 100% research may or may not include certain researches so while 100% is common to hear, only when you look carefully you see what's missing, some even claim the research when it's another entirely different clan that has it. For example, having a weapon bp but it's given by 1 clan in the entire alliance, not the clan you joined.
• toxicity or elitism, clans will be set apart based on that research
• users will be unable, regardless how long they have been playing, to research that specific content, so joining clans is the only option, meaning there is less of an incentive to make your own clan or to help another newly introduced clan

While not really a reason, any clan that has 1 of these situations applied to them has an increased probability of having other issues, in rare instances point 1,2 and 3 may be present in a single clan.

Your resources are not gone, when a new research appears you may use previous effort (clan treasury) done by the clan to research things easily.

[Slayer-.]

I built the Dry Dock and Researched all the stuff for Railjack in my Ghost Clan of 10 players, I WANT A MEDAL.  

 

[0_The_F00l]

3 hours ago, Slayer-. said:

I built the Dry Dock and Researched all the stuff for Railjack in my Ghost Clan of 10 players, I WANT A MEDAL.  

 

Didn't you get the decoration ?

[Slayer-.]

3 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Didn't you get the decoration ?

My post was in jest. 

Yes the big ship decoration is there as well and I built that too. 

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

So... You want to flex that your clan did it?

[Aldain]

7 hours ago, Slayer-. said:

I built the Dry Dock and Researched all the stuff for Railjack in my Ghost Clan of 10 players, I WANT A MEDAL.  

 

I did it in a clan of one, can I have a parade? ;p

[Alpheus]

24 minutes ago, Aldain said:

I did it in a clan of one, can I have a parade? ;p

Solo Hema researchers, unite!

[Aldain]

2 minutes ago, Alpheus said:

Solo Hema researchers, unite!

Woah now, I ain't that kind of solo clan guy.

That ain't worth it.

[Voltage]

I really don't like legacy items in this game. It basically just represents your account age. You may as well just have a profile accolade with the date you created your account instead of keeping items in the game but locking them from acquisition. Warframe has many hints of completionism, but also many examples of punishing exceptions that you need to overlook as there are loads of items in the game that are retired, unobtainable, untradeable, transmuted, event cosmetics, etc.

It's much healthier for DE to just remove old research from the game instead of locking it for newer clans and keeping it for old clans. There is no reason why Solar Rail research needs to even be shown/kept/exist for old clans. The mode is dead, and so should the research. That same principle can be applied here.

[Tesseract7777]

9 minutes ago, Voltage said:

I really don't like legacy items in this game. It basically just represents your account age. You may as well just have a profile accolade with the date you created your account instead of keeping items in the game but locking them from acquisition. Warframe has many hints of completionism, but also many examples of punishing exceptions that you need to overlook as there are loads of items in the game that are retired, unobtainable, untradeable, transmuted, event cosmetics, etc.

It's much healthier for DE to just remove old research from the game instead of locking it for newer clans and keeping it for old clans. There is no reason why Solar Rail research needs to even be shown/kept/exist for old clans. The mode is dead, and so should the research. That same principle can be applied here.

And those items also give unnecessary FOMO anxiety to collectors, who will be tempted to RMT or something of the like just to get their hands on an old dojo that they can say "has the legacy stuff", even though its really just a collectors item at best. Or spend hundreds and hundreds of platinum on useless arcane helmets that are not even close to the power of real arcanes so they can say they have it in their inventory even though there is no way to display it. 

[.durandle.]

22 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

I mean maybe give the clans a trophy for it. But the research itself, I'd like to avoid the implications of "Ignis Wraith again, except 10 times stupider"

clans did get a trophy for it
or maybe it was just for having the drydock build but they did give out the railjack trophy to clans that had sufficient investment into railjack prior to the changes

11 hours ago, Tesseract7777 said:

And those items also give unnecessary FOMO anxiety to collectors, who will be tempted to RMT or something of the like just to get their hands on an old dojo that they can say "has the legacy stuff", even though its really just a collectors item at best. Or spend hundreds and hundreds of platinum on useless arcane helmets that are not even close to the power of real arcanes so they can say they have it in their inventory even though there is no way to display it. 

DE has started making old arcane helmets obtainable via nightwave recently
only seen one so far but the ash scorpion arcane was available in i think it was week 1 or 2 of the intermission 3

and honestly there are a couple of those old arcane helmets that i would be more than willing to use the effects of
just not on the frames that those helmets are for
and also only if i could take said effect and just equip it in a legacy arcane slot or something 100% not enough to trade an actual arcane slot for and i would be 100% for that if they made all the old helms obtainable or just converted them to a new arcane class and that respective cosmetic helm if you didn't have that helm and made the new arcanes obtainable

[(PSN)kadeliza740]

5 hours ago, .durandle. said:

DE has started making old arcane helmets obtainable via nightwave recently
only seen one so far but the ash scorpion arcane was available in i think it was week 1 or 2 of the intermission 3

That was a mistake, as  DE Rebecca said...

Quote

As far as I know this is not intentional - we will rectify the offering / plan when the offices re-open Tuesday with full details on what happened here! In the data it's the 'Operator Wolf Hood' so we were trying to return that but something is not working here as you can see.

 

[.durandle.]

3 hours ago, (PSN)kadeliza740 said:

That was a mistake, as  DE Rebecca said...

 

they should just embrace it mistake or not
and just fill out the rest of them

and honestly **** anyone who cares that they spent exorbitant amounts of plat for items that are effectively novelty items from a by gone era

[Voltage]

On 2021-05-21 at 11:07 AM, .durandle. said:

and honestly **** anyone who cares that they spent exorbitant amounts of plat for items that are effectively novelty items from a by gone era

This is the sort of attitude that creates toxicity around Founders, Primed Chamber, Prime Access, and Riven Mods. Considering player investment when making decisions about these things is good for the game as a whole.

[.durandle.]

On 2021-05-23 at 1:11 AM, Voltage said:

This is the sort of attitude that creates toxicity around Founders, Primed Chamber, Prime Access, and Riven Mods. Considering player investment when making decisions about these things is good for the game as a whole.

not sure why you listed prime access in that
DE never said anything about vaulted primes never being obtainable again that i can recall

also while i am kinda sad that i don't have access to the 12k mastery points from founders exclusive items past that i don't really care much and that is the only thing that DE has intentionally released that they ever said would never be obtainable again

riven mods were released with the knowledge that their stats might be altered over time based on usage so really that is not DE's fault that people get a little salty when the riven they might have spent more than 10k plat on gets nerfed

honestly imo the less said about primed chamber the better
imo it is not worth the 3k ducats it currently costs it certainly was never worth the 10k+ plat prices i recall it being listed for on sites like warframe.market

and as they exist currently the old arcane helmets are borderline useless for the most part but a few of their effects could be quite usable on frames they are not available for
and currently i believe that are one of the few items excluding founders that has no plan at all to ever be obtainable in any way again
and from memory they were obtained via alerts like regular cosmetic helmets could be before the removal or regular alerts with the most recent solar map update prior to nightwave
they just got discontinued in favor of cosmetic only helmets so people could use the cosmetic helm that they wanted without having to worry about the potentially build ruining arcane effects