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SP spawn-rates on REGULAR missions


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Posted (edited)

So...

  1. I'm a solo player. And I don't need anyone else in my missions, I enjoy this game "as is", as a solo.
  2. I don't mind the extra difficulty of Steel Path. The extra levels/armor, the acolytes and extra spawns even when playing solo.
  3. I have multiple Steel Path viable warframe/weapon choices (fully moded, forma-ed, etc) so it does not pose a threat to me. Steel Essence>Kuva is an added bonus.
  4. So yes. I am having a whole lot of fun with Steel Path - all due to sheer amount of enemies to kill.

What bothers me however... Is when I'm "forced"(in quotes!) to play NON-Steel Path missions - such as sorties, void relics, invasions, etc. They are also important, you know? In regular missions, I'm often forced to actively seek out enemies myself half across the map. Because there is just seriously sooooooo little of them spawning in regular missions when playing as a solo.

While on many mission types it's irrelevant (say, spy missions or capture missions for void relics), on others it's actually impacting your performance - like SURVIVAL, for example. There is just simply not enough enemies spawning to keep up Life Support without using the big capsules. And I'm talking Khora/Nekros here who also have double loot chance for extra life support capsules from enemies. Not even them are enough if you're playing solo on regular mission spawns. Which... is NOT A PROBLEM on Steel Path. I recently did two hour-long runs of SP Survival against Greneer as Khora - didn't use a single big capsule. All the life support came from dying enemies + extra loot from the dome. And my build for Khora is all about mobility/survivability under fire(Rolling guard + Defy) and "bringing the dome to groups of spawned enemies" instead of standing in one place, semi-AFK. It's actually FUN to play and feels awesome - hop into the literal middle a group of spawned enemies(while immune thanks to Rolling guard OR Defy), drop a dome, whip-slap em all. Rinse-repeat. I had a lot of good emotions about those runs and would definitely do more/longer ones too for sure in the future.

But it's Steel Path. Why can't I do that in NON-steel path? Why can't I have the same amount of fun on, say, void relic survival instead? Because there's simply not enough enemy spawns in regular missions as a solo, that's why. I can't bring a dome to a group of enemies because there are NO groups of enemies. They spawn as 1-2, maybe 3 occasionally, in distant parts of the map and I have to actively seek em out, thus wasting life support too due to no killing. Or stand semi-afk and wait for them to eventually come to me. Hopefully. If they don't get stuck somewhere or something.

 

So the bottom line is. Can we have a switch - "FULL ENEMY SPAWN RATE when solo" or something like that? An option to turn on for those who want it and turn off for those who don't.

I want more enemies to kill. Isn't Warframe a "horde shooter"? With those spawns - not much of a horde, you know... Do I really have to go Steel Path for that?

 

P.s. I also hear people saying "But Steel Path is a gimmick, barely anyone plays it! SP Starchart is empty - people complete and forget" - while I feel like I'm no longer getting any fun from regular missions due to much lower enemy spawns... so if I'm not doing "important" stuff like Sorties/Void Relics/etc... I feel like I'm "forced" to play Steel Path to actually have fun. Not from challenge due to extra level/armor, but NUMBER OF ENEMIES, yeah?

Edited by _Kit_Kat_Cat_
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Posted (edited)

If you're bored doing non-SP missions, you could try not being so overpowered.

I've found that if I can kill enemies at a good rate (not instantly), and they can threaten me at a good rate (not instant death, but definitely there), Starchart mission fun sort of falls into place. And spawnrates are quite balanced around the "On the same level" approach 👍

🤔 And if the spawnrates for most of the game are balanced around being on the same level, I think the idea of Warframe as a horde shooter might need to be reconsidered.

I can get that people treat it as such (most people engage in the content in as risk-averse a way as possible, and then it seems like it's meant to be a horde shooter). But you might find it a different story if there's threat of failure involved

edit: Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you under the impression that the big Life Support capsules aren't supposed to be used?

Edited by (NSW)Greybones
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10 hours ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

If you're bored doing non-SP missions, you could try not being so overpowered.

hahaha-no.gif

Imagine saying things like that in a game about constant power-creep, lots of modding options, warframe+weapon combo synergies and so on, so forth.

10 hours ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

edit: Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you under the impression that the big Life Support capsules aren't supposed to be used?

After doing multiple long SP survival runs, I am under the impression that it is possible to not use the big capsules and sustain life support only on the small ones. Just as long there is more than enough enemies to kill. In Steel Path with Khora it's not an issue. My life support rarely went below 70-80%, most of the time spending at 90-100% - all because of how many enemies there are and how consistently I was getting those small capsules from them.

Outside of Steel Path as a solo... It's not the case. Not enough enemies.

Sure, I know it's possible to do a survival mission without killing anyone. Just use ivara and stand next to the big capsule, using it only at super low life support. But... That's not how I wanna play an endless mission with an endless supply of enemies to kill. Non-SP missions don't have enough enemies to kill for solo player. That's my only issue here.

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34 minutes ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

hahaha-no.gif

Imagine saying things like that in a game about constant power-creep, lots of modding options, warframe+weapon combo synergies and so on, so forth.

🤷‍♀️ Yet here I am, saying it. That constant power-creep is a player's choice at the end of the day, and non-power-creep and modding options/warframe+weapon combos aren't strictly incompatible: that's just your personal take on the options available to us.

What's more, I'm also actively engaging in non-power-creep, and really enjoying it too. Instead of doing missions and falling asleep because I selected "Super super super super Easy" from the difficulty selection screen. I'd hate to be bored in a game, ya know?

34 minutes ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

After doing multiple long SP survival runs, I am under the impression that it is possible to not use the big capsules and sustain life support only on the small ones. Just as long there is more than enough enemies to kill. In Steel Path with Khora it's not an issue. My life support rarely went below 70-80%, most of the time spending at 90-100% - all because of how many enemies there are and how consistently I was getting those small capsules from them.

Outside of Steel Path as a solo... It's not the case. Not enough enemies.

Sure, I know it's possible to do a survival mission without killing anyone. Just use ivara and stand next to the big capsule, using it only at super low life support. But... That's not how I wanna play an endless mission with an endless supply of enemies to kill. Non-SP missions don't have enough enemies to kill for solo player. That's my only issue here.

Right.... You've got this weird tone of "I expect it to work this way"

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Ok, so... Can you please phrase your point a bit more "on topic"?


As in... Are you AGAINST having such a switch of allowing full amount of spawns for solo players in regular missions?

Again, a switch, ON/OFF, an option. ON for those who want full spawns and OFF for those who don't want full spawns and rather play on lower spawns, like there is now. Similar to that Solo/Invite Only/Friends Only/Public switch at the top left OR that Normal/Steel Path switch on the right side. Same idea.

 

If your point is not connected to that question, but telling me that I'm "playing wrong" or something... Then you're already going "off-topic" here.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

Ok, so... Can you please phrase your point a bit more "on topic"?


As in... Are you AGAINST having such a switch of allowing full amount of spawns for solo players in regular missions?

Again, a switch, ON/OFF, an option. ON for those who want full spawns and OFF for those who don't want full spawns and rather play on lower spawns, like there is now. Similar to that Solo/Invite Only/Friends Only/Public switch at the top left OR that Normal/Steel Path switch on the right side. Same idea.

 

If your point is not connected to that question, but telling me that I'm "playing wrong" or something... Then you're already going "off-topic" here.

If they add a toggle to turn on increased spawns, what will you do?

Will you turn it on and then leave it? Live and breathe increased spawns?

And then when it comes to describing Warframe, what will you tell others? You’re already under this impression that Warframe is a horde shooter, I expect that you’ll point at the increased spawns and be like “Yup, that’s what this game is”. Nevermind that the reason (and I could be wrong about this) you’re under this impression in the first place is because you and most others you’ve come across choose to play in as risk-averse way as possible to keep the grind going fast, so that it seems like a Dynasty Warriors horde shooter because there’s no threat of defeat.

Speaking of others, you won’t be the only one to have this switch, nor the only one to permanently have it on. So as multiple players toggle it, post youtube videos of it and talk about how Warframe is a horde shooter, the idea of what Warframe is (whether it’s accurate or not) will shift even further than it has already; “the toggle isn’t an option, it’s validation for this way of thinking” people will say. And you can imagine how it’d influence the direction of Warframe, whether DE (as they balance the community’s desires with their own vision) would want it to go in that direction or not.

That said, maybe they will add a toggle, who knows. I can’t speak on their behalf on what their vision actually is, but I can point out that a toggle like increased spawnrates is more nuanced than simply being a personal choice.

And also I’m against it; I prefer the more tactical small-group fights, and if a toggle is going to catalyse a direction towards “More Spawns!”, I do not want to see that.

edit: And after all that’s said, I just want to clarify something you referenced; if you’re having fun, I wouldn’t say you’re playing wrong. The game’s a toolbox, so use the tools.

If you’re not having fun, I feel it’s worth exploring why

Edited by (NSW)Greybones
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Posted (edited)

And I feel you're going waaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy too far off-topic here.

  1. Steel Path already has full-squad enemy spawns even for solo players. So there is no issues with it being in the game. It's already IN THE GAME. But only on SP.
  2. I am having fun in Steel Path. The extra difficulty AND threat of possible defeat is there. But I am primarily enjoying the amount of enemies to kill.
  3. I am NOT having fun in regular missions however. Because there are simply not enough enemies when played solo. It's not about difficulty.

What I'm asking for is to actually make the rest of the content - non-SP - to be as equally fun. By having AN OPTION for solo players to have the same full-squad enemy spawns in regular, non-SP missions. That's it. That's all there is to it. While you're pushing this thread off the rails, again and again.

Edited by _Kit_Kat_Cat_
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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

And I feel you're going waaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyy too far off-topic here.

  1. Steel Path already has full-squad enemy spawns even for solo players. So there is no issues with it being in the game. It's already IN THE GAME. But only on SP.
  2. I am having fun in Steel Path. The extra difficulty AND threat of possible defeat is there. But I am primarily enjoying the amount of enemies to kill.
  3. I am NOT having fun in regular missions however. Because there are simply not enough enemies when played solo. It's not about difficulty.

What I'm asking for is to actually make the rest of the content - non-SP - to be as equally fun. By having AN OPTION for solo players to have the same full-squad enemy spawns in regular, non-SP missions. That's it. That's all there is to it. While you're pushing this thread off the rails, again and again.

🤨

Then here’s something about as on-topic as I can think; I don’t support your desire for a switch for solo players to turn normal missions into Steel Path spawnrates.

Not that I already said that, or was talking about why I don’t support it.

edit: What adheres to the idea of on-topic for you? I admit that the second post may have been a little off the rails, but the third post was completely about The Option To Increase Spawnrates. You’re highlighting that there’s not enough enemies to kill, what are you expecting to be said about that?

Edited by (NSW)Greybones
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8 hours ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

🤨

Then here’s something about as on-topic as I can think; I don’t support your desire for a switch for solo players to turn normal missions into Steel Path spawnrates.

Not that I already said that, or was talking about why I don’t support it.

edit: What adheres to the idea of on-topic for you? I admit that the second post may have been a little off the rails, but the third post was completely about The Option To Increase Spawnrates. You’re highlighting that there’s not enough enemies to kill, what are you expecting to be said about that?

Warframe literally is a horde shooter, not sure what you're saying?

You seem to think us needing to nerf ourselves to get a challenge makes the game fun, no, it doesn't. If there was properly scaling content we could go into for a challenge, while still retaining the casual level play and easy missions, then this would be a massive boost to the game as a whole. You can have both casual content and properly scaling content that presents an actual challenge, you shouldn't need to intentionally equip half of the mods you are able to if you want to feel challenged, that is horrible design.

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6 minutes ago, scam said:

Warframe literally is a horde shooter, not sure what you're saying?

Is it designed to be a horde shooter? Or are people treating it as such, and then saying "This is what the game is meant to be"?

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, scam said:

You seem to think us needing to nerf ourselves to get a challenge makes the game fun, no, it doesn't. If there was properly scaling content we could go into for a challenge, while still retaining the casual level play and easy missions, then this would be a massive boost to the game as a whole. You can have both casual content and properly scaling content that presents an actual challenge, you shouldn't need to intentionally equip half of the mods you are able to if you want to feel challenged, that is horrible design.

At risk of being told off by the author again for going off-topic;

We've got 8 mod slots on weapons, plus an exilus.

Why is it so acceptable to equip a string of Big Number Mods, yet it's so unheard of to equip a string of, say, Exilus mods? Why is Serration, Multi-shot, and Crit superglued into those ever-so-interchangeable slots, when sometimes they don't even need to be, and there's all these other mods that can take their place?

This ties into my very first post in this topic. Here, let me quote it:

On 2021-06-02 at 11:12 AM, (NSW)Greybones said:

If you're bored doing non-SP missions, you could try not being so overpowered.

I've found that if I can kill enemies at a good rate (not instantly), and they can threaten me at a good rate (not instant death, but definitely there), Starchart mission fun sort of falls into place. And spawnrates are quite balanced around the "On the same level" approach 👍

🤔 And if the spawnrates for most of the game are balanced around being on the same level, I think the idea of Warframe as a horde shooter might need to be reconsidered.

I can get that people treat it as such (most people engage in the content in as risk-averse a way as possible, and then it seems like it's meant to be a horde shooter). But you might find it a different story if there's threat of failure involved

edit: Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you under the impression that the big Life Support capsules aren't supposed to be used?

Edited by (NSW)Greybones
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4 hours ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

Is it designed to be a horde shooter? Or are people treating it as such, and then saying "This is what the game is meant to be"?

It is designed to be a horde shooter, I have no idea how you have failed to grasp this.

I'm not arguing the game has issues, there should be more dedicated QoL mod slots and such on weapons, giving us an actual reason to slot them instead of just all DPS mods, but that doesn't mean it's not a horde shooter?

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Posted (edited)
37 minutes ago, scam said:

It is designed to be a horde shooter, I have no idea how you have failed to grasp this.

Maybe we're approaching from two different directions as to what a horde shooter is?

I'll go first; I'm thinking Dynasty Warriors type, where enemies become fancy-looking particles because of how many there are. Suck 'em all up into a big attack, and watch the satisfying fireworks of ragdoll bodies.

I see it happen in gameplay footage of Warframe, and I've engaged in it myself (it can be fun)

37 minutes ago, scam said:

I'm not arguing the game has issues, there should be more dedicated QoL mod slots and such on weapons, giving us an actual reason to slot them instead of just all DPS mods, but that doesn't mean it's not a horde shooter?

For most of the content, we don't need so many DPS mods, which frees us up to slap on mods that we might want. I'm not convinced we need more dedicated QoL slots 🤔

The higher-level you go, the less QoL mods you can equip because they need to start having DPS mods instead (I don't view this as a problem; it's like "Okay, time to get serious"). This is part of why I don't think I'll be engaging in Steel Path very much; it sounds like you need nothing but DPS and survival mods (I'll poke around, but I don't think I'll be treating it as my main gameplay).

Good thing the game doesn't strictly tie good rewards to the highest-level content

 

Edited by (NSW)Greybones
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I won't quote your posts there, Greybones, since it will just make mine look too bloated...

But I'm asking you specifically now. Am I understanding this right... You want me to stop using the tools that I'm given?

Aka not use mod setups, warframe+weapon combos, etc? Want me to just grab unmodded Mk-1-Braton, unmodded Mk-1-Bo , unmodded MK1-Furis and unmodded Mag? And then go and try do regular missions, to see that "enemy spawns are fine" or something? Is that what you're saying here when you say:

On 2021-06-02 at 4:12 AM, (NSW)Greybones said:

If you're bored doing non-SP missions, you could try not being so overpowered.

I mean... That is in no way connected to the "issue" that I'm presenting here => the amount of enemy numbers/spawns in regular missions for solo players. I'm not saying I don't have a challenge in regular missions. I'm saying I don't have enough enemy numbers/spawns in regular missions for solo players. While you try to pull away from this very clear and narrow point here into deep woods of Warframe "identity" (a horde shooter or not?), public opinion of Warframe as a game, weapon/warframe modding, power-creep and all other things you mentioned in your posts.

I am not saying you are wrong on some of those things. I'm not saying Warframe has no issues with those things either. Yes, Warframe is not perfect. Nor we are - you, me and every other human being. Everything has issues.

However... this particular thread does not rise the questions to those other issues that you mentioned. This thread is ONLY about enemy numbers/spawns in regular missions for solo players. ONLY ABOUT THAT particular thing. That's it. NOTHING. MORE. I am asking for an option to have full-squad numbers/enemy spawns in regular missions for solo players, just exactly like there is ALREADY EXISTING full-squad numbers/enemy spawns in Steel Path for solo players. That's it. Nothing more. 

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23 minutes ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

Maybe we're approaching from two different directions as to what a horde shooter is?

I'll go first; I'm thinking Dynasty Warriors type, where enemies become fancy-looking particles because of how many there are. Suck 'em all up into a big attack, and watch the satisfying fireworks of ragdoll bodies.

This is Warframe, sure it's horde shooter style is not to the extent of Dynasty Warriors, but it's still most definitely a horde shooter. I love to run fissures, I do plenty of endless missions, there are hordes upon hordes of enemies pouring into the tile I am in from all directions that I am constantly murdering with the click of a button.

35 minutes ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

For most of the content, we don't need so many DPS mods.

This would be true for any RPG. As your gear progresses, you become so powerful to the early game levels/missions/enemies that you can easily walk through killing them in a single hit without any mercy. This is an RPG element, sure we don't need every slot to be fit with a DPS mod for most of the game's content, but people still like their damage numbers. If we had dedicated QoL slots, similar to the exilus in nature but more tuned for magazine capacity, reload speed, etc, then people would find use for them much more often. QoL mods are fantastic, I run them on plenty of weapons.

37 minutes ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

The higher-level you go, the less QoL mods you can equip because they need to start having DPS mods instead. This is part of why I don't think I'll be engaging in Steel Path very much; it sounds like you need nothing but DPS and survival mods (I'll poke around, but I don't think I'll be treating it as my main gameplay)

Basically, the same as my above point. Enemies scale, this isn't unique to Warframe. The Division, Destiny, Monster Hunter, every single game I can think of with some form of progression, enemies scale in difficulty. This means to counter their now increased health/armour/shields and what-not, you require higher damage to kill them. This is just a function of having progression and scaling content.

Steel Path is very poorly balanced and implemented, which is why I find it boring. Despite being a "difficult" mode, with proper builds it's still a cake-walk, as well as it further pushing the slash/armour ignore meta due to the ridiculous level of armour all armoured enemies now have.

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1 minute ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

I won't quote your posts there, Greybones, since it will just make mine look too bloated...

But I'm asking you specifically now. Am I understanding this right... You want me to stop using the tools that I'm given?

Aka not use mod setups, warframe+weapon combos, etc? Want me to just grab unmodded Mk-1-Braton, unmodded Mk-1-Bo , unmodded MK1-Furis and unmodded Mag? And then go and try do regular missions, to see that "enemy spawns are fine" or something? Is that what you're saying here when you say:

I mean... That is in no way connected to the "issue" that I'm presenting here => the amount of enemy numbers/spawns in regular missions for solo players. I'm not saying I don't have a challenge in regular missions. I'm saying I don't have enough enemy numbers/spawns in regular missions for solo players. While you try to pull away from this very clear and narrow point here into deep woods of Warframe "identity" (a horde shooter or not?), public opinion of Warframe as a game, weapon/warframe modding, power-creep and all other things you mentioned in your posts.

I am not saying you are wrong on some of those things. I'm not saying Warframe has no issues with those things either. Yes, Warframe is not perfect. Nor we are - you, me and every other human being. Everything has issues.

However... this particular thread does not rise the questions to those other issues that you mentioned. This thread is ONLY about enemy numbers/spawns in regular missions for solo players. ONLY ABOUT THAT particular thing. That's it. NOTHING. MORE. I am asking for an option to have full-squad numbers/enemy spawns in regular missions for solo players, just exactly like there is ALREADY EXISTING full-squad numbers/enemy spawns in Steel Path for solo players. That's it. Nothing more. 

Yeah, sorry. I knew it was getting pretty off-topic

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, scam said:

This is Warframe, sure it's horde shooter style is not to the extent of Dynasty Warriors, but it's still most definitely a horde shooter. I love to run fissures, I do plenty of endless missions, there are hordes upon hordes of enemies pouring into the tile I am in from all directions that I am constantly murdering with the click of a button.

This would be true for any RPG. As your gear progresses, you become so powerful to the early game levels/missions/enemies that you can easily walk through killing them in a single hit without any mercy. This is an RPG element, sure we don't need every slot to be fit with a DPS mod for most of the game's content, but people still like their damage numbers. If we had dedicated QoL slots, similar to the exilus in nature but more tuned for magazine capacity, reload speed, etc, then people would find use for them much more often. QoL mods are fantastic, I run them on plenty of weapons.

Basically, the same as my above point. Enemies scale, this isn't unique to Warframe. The Division, Destiny, Monster Hunter, every single game I can think of with some form of progression, enemies scale in difficulty. This means to counter their now increased health/armour/shields and what-not, you require higher damage to kill them. This is just a function of having progression and scaling content.

Steel Path is very poorly balanced and implemented, which is why I find it boring. Despite being a "difficult" mode, with proper builds it's still a cake-walk, as well as it further pushing the slash/armour ignore meta due to the ridiculous level of armour all armoured enemies now have.

Sorry man, author came down like I expected they would. Can't keep going like this in their topic, not after they'd already complained once before

Edited by (NSW)Greybones
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To be fair, this is exactly what we solo players were asking for before Steel Path. Most cases, maybe we wouldn't mind the level bump that SP came with, but never wanted the artificial sponge modifiers added on top of that.

 

We also never wanted Survival life support drop chances to be commensurately reduced according to the increase in spawn rates we got, solo Surv being one of the most annoyingly inconsistent experiences that made us want to scale the spawn rates up.

We just wanted to have the same number of targets and overall drop potential that squads get, without having to deal with the average Billy No-Mates player with his tryhard builds crowding out more casual enjoyment, or inevitably suffering host migration if we wanted to go longer than the rando squad we got matched into (with spawns then also reducing back down to problematic).

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On 2021-06-10 at 3:50 PM, TheLexiConArtist said:

 

We also never wanted Survival life support drop chances to be commensurately reduced according to the increase in spawn rates we got, solo Surv being one of the most annoyingly inconsistent experiences that made us want to scale the spawn rates up.

 

Exactly this. The 4 players spawn rate pretty much came with the need to have 4 players kills per second numbers (to be fair, I'm not sure about exact numbers in full squad gameplay).

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3 hours ago, Uhkretor said:

@_Kit_Kat_Cat_

 

Allow me to resume your entire OP into a single line:

  • Steel Path everything please, kthxbye.

 

... This, I approve... You're welcome.

Uh... No? That is NOT what I said or implied.

I was only talking about ENEMY SPAWN NUMBERS INCREASE TO FULL WHEN PLAYING SOLO outside of SP. That's it. Please, do not change what I said or meant.

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... meh, semantics...

 

... If you think you can change the minds of a massive majority of players that think "full spawns = too hard", then keep at it... Until then, I'll just keep suggesting

4 hours ago, Uhkretor said:

Steel Path everything please, kthxbye.

because it makes more sense anyway.

Edited by Uhkretor
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7 hours ago, Uhkretor said:

... If you think you can change the minds of a massive majority of players that think "full spawns = too hard", then keep at it... 

That's not always incorrect. Small interception tiles as a solo player basically don't function if the spawn rate is too high, for example, since there's always a swarm of new enemies to contest your point just by 'generally existing in the area'.

But, having it optional works just fine.

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10 hours ago, TheLexiConArtist said:

That's not always incorrect. Small interception tiles as a solo player basically don't function if the spawn rate is too high, for example, since there's always a swarm of new enemies to contest your point just by 'generally existing in the area'.

But, having it optional works just fine.

But isn't Warframe a game of "Using the right tool for the job"? Warframes like Nyx(Chaos) or Octavia(Resonator+Stealth) make any interception trivial. Even better if subsuming Octavia's ability onto Nyx for extra safety(maybe even overkill too lol). Just confuse everyone, cap points and don't kill enemies. Let the control counter go up, with enemies aimlessly wandering around without desire to cap points. Those who would try to cap - just either kill or cast Chaos again so they forget it.

This makes Interception trivial. Yes, even Steel Path. Yes, even as a solo. And I'm sure there are a few more ways to do it(Sleep Equinox? Ivara sleep arrows+stealth?), those two just the easiest to do and from the top of my head just now.

Edited by _Kit_Kat_Cat_
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