...Am I supposed to like Parvos Granum?

[Galoain]

I gotta agree with the folks here saying he's dangerous: I had a good first impression of him from watching clips of his epic PWNing of Nef Anyo on YouTube, but when I played through the actual quest itself, I felt "Okay, this guy's actually REALLY scary!"

And honestly, I should have seen that earlier: Parvos is a surviving remnant of the old order, of the Orokin, and apart from the Warframes and the other Tenno (and I guess the Entrati), ANYTHING from the Orokin that survived the empire's fall to wake up in the modern era has been major bad news: the Infestation, the Grineer Queens, Ballas, the Sentients, Nihil and now Parvos.

[(PSN)Unstar]

If you're using terms like "good guy", you won't be able to adequately engage with the lore of Warframe.  There are no "good guys" to be found here.

[Tesseract7777]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

If you're using terms like "good guy", you won't be able to adequately engage with the lore of Warframe.  There are no "good guys" to be found here.

It's kind of like W40K that way.

You pick which bad guys you like the most.

This is not a universe with true heroes and villains that are that cut and dried. 

[Godzilla853]

I do not like him, I want to Cut off his other hand.

[(XBOX)The Neko Otaku]

I like how parvos is in this moral grey area, he preaches charity and pursuit of your ambitions but all in the conquest of personal greed. He want to reform the corpus and prepare for the sentients but seems to take what ever mesures he needs to pursure his goals like nuking a base to kill warframes to get data to make specters.

 

[(XBOX)The Neko Otaku]

2 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

If you're using terms like "good guy", you won't be able to adequately engage with the lore of Warframe.  There are no "good guys" to be found here.

I guess cetus and fortuna are the only good people we have, everything else is choice of who commits the worst atrocities 

[(XBOX)Skiller115]

10 hours ago, (PSN)Unstar said:

If you're using terms like "good guy", you won't be able to adequately engage with the lore of Warframe.  There are no "good guys" to be found here.

What about Konzu and his lunch?

[Almxce]

In reference to OP, I think Parvos being good or evil more so depends on your own personal viewpoint. We're all villains to somebody and even some villains are heroes within their own minds. In a world full of genocidal maniacs and sentients looking to eradicate everything I do find that anyone willing to offer the Tenno and Solaris a seat at their table to be of interest but also someone to be extremely wary of - he's very dangerous man, some of his goals align with ours and some don't, he's both a friend and an enemy and yet in all of that none of the decisions he makes for or against you are personal, just business that benefits him first and foremost. Scary stuff tbh

I consider my character to be neutral for the most part but definitely on the side of the little guy (Solaris, Ostrons, Myconians, etc) so if the option became available in-game to work alongside Parvos at different times and it benefitted those little guys/myself, I don't think my character would reject him outright.

[RazerXPrime]

20 minutes ago, Almxce said:

In reference to OP, I think Parvos being good or evil more so depends on your own personal viewpoint. We're all villains to somebody and even some villains are heroes within their own minds. In a world full of genocidal maniacs and sentients looking to eradicate everything I do find that anyone willing to offer the Tenno and Solaris a seat at their table to be of interest but also someone to be extremely wary of - he's very dangerous man, some of his goals align with ours and some don't, he's both a friend and an enemy and yet in all of that none of the decisions he makes for or against you are personal, just business that benefits him first and foremost. Scary stuff tbh

I consider my character to be neutral for the most part but definitely on the side of the little guy (Solaris, Ostrons, Myconians, etc) so if the option became available in-game to work alongside Parvos at different times and it benefitted those little guys/myself, I don't think my character would reject him outright.

He's a psychopath, they are good at making you feel important and that you have value until they don't need you anymore. Parvos is no ones friend or ally.

[Galoain]

3 hours ago, RazerXPrime said:

He's a psychopath, they are good at making you feel important and that you have value until they don't need you anymore. Parvos is no ones friend or ally.

EXACTLY! And what's even more disturbing is that his subordinates KNOW this, and still follow him.

Vala Glarios says it herself in the song: "There's a man on high with a devil in his eye and a golden hand I'm told, it can hurt you it can hold you, he can kick you or console you, when you're sleeping in the cold below."

That's part of what puts him on a Man-In-The-Wall tier of scary for me: most of the other enemies of the Tenno, it's clear what they want, and that makes them easy to predict. The various leaders of the Grineer want to crush their opposition, Corpus Board Members like Nef Anyo or Frohd Bek want profit, Alad V wants profit too, but mostly cares about saving his own skin, and the Infestation just wants to feed and spread. Parvos Granum? You don't know WHAT he wants. Yes, he plans on reshaping the Corpus back to his vision, but what will he do with the Corpus once that's done? What ends is the Corpus' vast power, wealth and research capability means to? So far, we just don't know, just like we don't know what purpose the Man-In-The-Wall is messing with the Tenno for...

[MqToasty]

1 hour ago, Galoain said:

EXACTLY! And what's even more disturbing is that his subordinates KNOW this, and still follow him.

Vala Glarios says it herself in the song: "There's a man on high with a devil in his eye and a golden hand I'm told, it can hurt you it can hold you, he can kick you or console you, when you're sleeping in the cold below."

That's part of what puts him on a Man-In-The-Wall tier of scary for me: most of the other enemies of the Tenno, it's clear what they want, and that makes them easy to predict. The various leaders of the Grineer want to crush their opposition, Corpus Board Members like Nef Anyo or Frohd Bek want profit, Alad V wants profit too, but mostly cares about saving his own skin, and the Infestation just wants to feed and spread. Parvos Granum? You don't know WHAT he wants. Yes, he plans on reshaping the Corpus back to his vision, but what will he do with the Corpus once that's done? What ends is the Corpus' vast power, wealth and research capability means to? So far, we just don't know, just like we don't know what purpose the Man-In-The-Wall is messing with the Tenno for...

Really?  You don't know what he wants?  All he wants is profit for himself.  If you were his subordinate, then he will keep you around for as long as you can provide profit for him.  He will never respect you or actually treat you as an equal, but he will keep you around and even feign interest in you because you are still useful.  But you better keep up the productivity!  Because the moment someone better comes along and he has no more use for you, prepare to have an unpleasant encounter with a dumpster.

The sad thing about humanity is that people like this very easily rise to positions of power.  For some weird, inbred reason, we are all very keen to rabidly following and supporting strongmen, especially when we are scared.

[Mediloric]

The only thing I like about him is his cool ass pharaoh hat thing. 

[Soy77]

For me, he was never a good guy.

He's just a smarter bad guy than anyo. Which is cool.

It's like the og mortal kombat movie where they just defeated sang tsung only for the movie to reveal shao khan. Or thanos and galactus.

[(NSW)Symberzite]

He's a person from a different historical epoch that got transported into an age where he's essentially seen as a deity. Unlike Balas, he still has most of his brains functioning. If there's anything I got from his fragments it's that he wants to build a civilization that will become a worthy successor to the Orokin empire by promoting his idea of self-reliance. He never actually worshiped money, but use of wealth in order to invest and self-actualize. That and social mobility not based on genetic or familial lineage. He's closer to Confucius by the way of Adam Smith, but with more of an emphasis on being a statesman. 

Basically, he isn't actively malevolent like the Grineer Queens, but a pragmatist with his own set of plans. Currently he's planning to basically pull a protestant reformation on his own philosophy after Nef decided to take way too many liberties.

He isn't a villain, but more likely a Magnificent Bastard as the big wiki implies. 

[(NSW)Symberzite]

On 2021-06-02 at 10:44 PM, Galoain said:

And honestly, I should have seen that earlier: Parvos is a surviving remnant of the old order, of the Orokin, and apart from the Warframes and the other Tenno (and I guess the Entrati), ANYTHING from the Orokin that survived the empire's fall to wake up in the modern era has been major bad news: the Infestation, the Grineer Queens, Ballas, the Sentients, Nihil and now Parvos.

To be fair, if you survived the equivalent of the collapse of the Roman Empire and lived long enough to carve out your own little kingdom amidst the chaos, you must be one heck of a specimen no matter the time period. 

[MqToasty]

1 hour ago, (NSW)Symberzite said:

He's closer to Confucius by the way of Adam Smith, but with more of an emphasis on being a statesman.

I really don't see where you get that from.  Where/when does he state the duty and expectation of each party in a dichotomous relationship (a key in Confucianism)?  When/where does he state his views on market forces and the benefits of competition (Adam Smith's invisible hand)?  If anything, I think he would balk at Confucius' expectation of loyalty, filial piety and brotherly love.  As well, I think he would fully embrace the abuse of any monopoly, as long as it is his monopoly.

[Galoain]

On 2021-06-03 at 12:26 PM, MqToasty said:

Really?  You don't know what he wants?  All he wants is profit for himself.  If you were his subordinate, then he will keep you around for as long as you can provide profit for him.  He will never respect you or actually treat you as an equal, but he will keep you around and even feign interest in you because you are still useful.  But you better keep up the productivity!  Because the moment someone better comes along and he has no more use for you, prepare to have an unpleasant encounter with a dumpster.

The sad thing about humanity is that people like this very easily rise to positions of power.  For some weird, inbred reason, we are all very keen to rabidly following and supporting strongmen, especially when we are scared.

Right, but the general vibe I've gotten from every encounter with Parvos is the profit is the means to a greater end, that he has a much grander scheme cooking that he'll need the resources of the Corpus to complete, probably tying in to his specter particle research that we learned he developed during the Deadlock Protocol spy mission.

Self-aggrandizement through profit is something he chides Nef for as a corruption of his values. If profit were the goal, I imagine he'd say that goal lacks ambition.

Gotta agree with you that he doesn't seem all that Confucian. He seems more a model of (and I hate that I'm saying this) the Nietzschean ubermensch, abandoning the outdated morality of his society and forging his own through sheer force of will.

[Greymist123]

On 2021-06-02 at 1:18 PM, -SilverWolfPrime- said:

Ever since Deadlock Protocol, I've been so confused by this guy. At first I loved him so much since he seemed to be completely different from any other Corpus leader we've seen so far, but recent content suggests he's not necessarily a friendly force. I guess I might have misinterpreted some things from the Deadlock Protocol, but am I supposed to like this guy? He is supposed to be a sort of good guy for the Tenno or is he just another foe to face?

I'd love to hear more of the lore behind it, this is one of the most perplexing characters in the lore to me.

To summarize him, he is lawful neutral, just because he is a villain, it doesn't mean that he's a bad guy, I like him because his principles are rooted in hard work and independence, he admired the solaris because he remembers his past life through them, he became powerful through his hardwork and became wealthy not because of other people working for him but because of his desires that are strong enough for him to be powerful, he became our enemy because we were standing in his way, that's it, he isn't necessarily evil. He is the true embodiment of capitalism, and the corpus is its twisted version that's why he despises them especially nef.

[-SilverWolfPrime-]

10 hours ago, Greymist123 said:

To summarize him, he is lawful neutral, just because he is a villain, it doesn't mean that he's a bad guy, I like him because his principles are rooted in hard work and independence, he admired the solaris because he remembers his past life through them, he became powerful through his hardwork and became wealthy not because of other people working for him but because of his desires that are strong enough for him to be powerful, he became our enemy because we were standing in his way, that's it, he isn't necessarily evil. He is the true embodiment of capitalism, and the corpus is its twisted version that's why he despises them especially nef.

I'm kinda interpreting the whole Sisters of Parvos thing to simply be an extension of this logic as well. It doesn't feel like he's gunning us down, it feels like he's just...testing us. And we're once again on opposite sides solely because we're in the way.