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Roll to Remove Volt's Speed Buff instead of Backflip


acevezwing
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1 hour ago, TARINunit9 said:

You CAN. It has to be a backflip-roll, but it's already in the game

I forgot to put it down but I already know it exists. Roll is easier and it actually moves you forward.

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  • acevezwing changed the title to Roll to Remove Volt's Speed Buff instead of Backflip
23 minutes ago, acevezwing said:

I forgot to put it down but I already know it exists. Roll is easier and it actually moves you forward.

See, I'm still not sure that's a good idea. Rolling can be used while moving forward, yes, but it's also used to preserve (and in some cases, increase) forward momentum, such as when ending an aim glide, or when landing from a bullet jump to cancel the "hard landing" animation. If I'm doing those with Volt's 2 buff, I actually want to KEEP the buff

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2 hours ago, acevezwing said:

Limbo's Rift can be removed with roll. Make it the same with Volt's Speed.

The main problem with this IMO is that forward rolling is part of our regular movement, which means that anyone looking to make use of the speed buff would end up accidentally cancelling it. This is likely why the opt-out was implemented on a backflip instead.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that if a person dislikes Speed, and has to opt out of an effect that is imposed on them, the damage is already done. Speed and Limbo's Rift I think both ought to be opt-in, or otherwise made to not be disruptive to play, as clearly making those effects opt-out doesn't stop people from complaining when they get hit by them.

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Posted (edited)

Just using rolls to get out of it hampers the buff too much since rolling gives a bonus to movement speed on top. 

I personally am not a fan of random Speedy Volts, but least good modded Volts buff your movement to the point that switching to walking is enough to get back to my normal running speed. 

It's the crappy low power volts that are the problem, as their buff is just high enough to distrub my timing and I feel like a ping pong ball trying to get through the doors.

Edited by bubbabenali
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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

Can someone explain why the speed buff hampers your gameplay so much?

it makes it hard to control ur frame, making it feel super janky even if it not

it should just stay as a backflip tbh cause jumping then rolling backwards is a lot easier then people make it out to be

my volt speed build has negative range

my capacitance build has speed removed to not annoy people

but what people dont understand is it doesn't harm melee at all after thy removed pause and hold, and it buffs reload speed soooo....

 

Edited by (PSN)Spider_Enigma
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2 hours ago, RazerXPrime said:

Can someone explain why the speed buff hampers your gameplay so much?

A lot of Volt players spam the ability every 4-6 seconds in spite of building for 16-18 seconds' duration. (It's not like energy has been a concern for the last 3-4 years...)
That turns the mission into a backflip simulator by default, not to mention the severe inconvenience in cramped and/or varied tilesets with plenty of traps, mines and drops like Kuva Fortress or Eris.

Worse than that, even though melee has devolved into 'mash E' for the most part, many of us know the stances and want to use them without our timing constantly getting thrown off. Or we build for crit with Argon Scope and don't want our weapons to become less accurate than a garden hose because we got an unwanted speed buff or a Haste mote placed in the only path forward. 
Or we don't want to pre-aim for a sensor beam we know is coming up only to go flying into it. Or be robbed of a finisher because a Shock Mote causes the enemy animation to be overwritten. And so forth.

I'm sure many Volt and Wisp players think their buffs are a universal boon and don't actually realize that they're messing with the flow of the game for others; I can understand that even if I think it's a bit lacking in rapport, and I generally don't hold it against them. 
Then there are those who insist that in a public game no-one else has the right to an opinion on how they build and play while conveniently ignoring that they themselves dictate how up to three others are going to spend the mission. 

There's a reason this type of thread turns up regularly.  

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2 minutes ago, Wiergate said:

A lot of Volt players spam the ability every 4-6 seconds in spite of building for 16-18 seconds' duration. (It's not like energy has been a concern for the last 3-4 years...)
That turns the mission into a backflip simulator by default, not to mention the severe inconvenience in cramped and/or varied tilesets with plenty of traps, mines and drops like Kuva Fortress or Eris.

Worse than that, even though melee has devolved into 'mash E' for the most part, many of us know the stances and want to use them without our timing constantly getting thrown off. Or we build for crit with Argon Scope and don't want our weapons to become less accurate than a garden hose because we got an unwanted speed buff or a Haste mote placed in the only path forward. 
Or we don't want to pre-aim for a sensor beam we know is coming up only to go flying into it. Or be robbed of a finisher because a Shock Mote causes the enemy animation to be overwritten. And so forth.

I'm sure many Volt and Wisp players think their buffs are a universal boon and don't actually realize that they're messing with the flow of the game for others; I can understand that even if I think it's a bit lacking in rapport, and I generally don't hold it against them. 
Then there are those who insist that in a public game no-one else has the right to an opinion on how they build and play while conveniently ignoring that they themselves dictate how up to three others are going to spend the mission. 

There's a reason this type of thread turns up regularly.  

As far as I know volt's speed buff only affects movement and not attack speed of any kind. Unlike Wisp's Motes.

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2 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

As far as I know volt's speed buff only affects movement and not attack speed of any kind.

"Affected players will gain 7.5% / 12.5% / 15% / 17.5% weapon Reload Speed and 10% / 15% / 25% / 50% melee Attack Speed and movement speed bonuses, lasting for 5 / 6 / 8 / 10 seconds."

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1 minute ago, RazerXPrime said:

As far as I know volt's speed buff only affects movement and not attack speed of any kind. Unlike Wisp's Motes.

Reload, movement and melee attack speed are affected by Speed. 
Wisp tends to get brought up since her duration is so much longer.  

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

As far as I know volt's speed buff only affects movement and not attack speed of any kind. Unlike Wisp's Motes.

Volt's speed affects attack speed.

To OP: No thanks. Rolling can be used in tandem with Speed to go even faster. Removing that because of people who can't manage the buff is detrimental to skilled players.

Edited by Voltage
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1 minute ago, Voltage said:

Removing that because of people who can't manage the buff is detrimental to skilled players

This is the sort of comment I've gotten used to over the course of Bog knows how many years of this type of thread, and it always signals the end of any meaningful discussion. 

I do agree that a roll to cancel would be detrimental for mobility as well as for those of us who sometimes use Rolling Guard.

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1 minute ago, Wiergate said:

This is the sort of comment I've gotten used to over the course of Bog knows how many years of this type of thread, and it always signals the end of any meaningful discussion. 

This is how these threads always go because the entire premise is based on people who can't handle buffs. The discussion doesn't suddenly lose meaning once the facts are presented. If the player could handle the speed bonus, they wouldn't make the thread. It's that simple.

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1 minute ago, Voltage said:

This is how these threads always go because the entire premise is based on people who can't handle buffs. The discussion doesn't suddenly lose meaning once the facts are presented. If the player could handle the speed bonus, they wouldn't make the thread. It's that simple.

No. It isn't.
Read my post above about the detriments of unwanted buffs; I don't think it's going to help in the slightest, nor is me telling you that you couldn't be more wrong. 
Nevertheless. 
(See what I mean about dead thread?)

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5 hours ago, spiralmenace said:

honestly i would prefer if volt's speed just got rolled back to when it was a personal buff or a pickup. tired of max range/strength volts inflicting attack speed "buffs" on me in void fissures

Or at the very least, make buff have a fixed radius unaffected by ability range

then Volts can make Discharge cover the map if they want to, without Speed doing the same.

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34 minutes ago, Wiergate said:

A lot of Volt players spam the ability every 4-6 seconds in spite of building for 16-18 seconds' duration. (It's not like energy has been a concern for the last 3-4 years...)
That turns the mission into a backflip simulator by default
, not to mention the severe inconvenience in cramped and/or varied tilesets with plenty of traps, mines and drops like Kuva Fortress or Eris.

Worse than that, even though melee has devolved into 'mash E' for the most part, many of us know the stances and want to use them without our timing constantly getting thrown off. Or we build for crit with Argon Scope and don't want our weapons to become less accurate than a garden hose because we got an unwanted speed buff or a Haste mote placed in the only path forward. 
Or we don't want to pre-aim for a sensor beam we know is coming up only to go flying into it. Or be robbed of a finisher because a Shock Mote causes the enemy animation to be overwritten. And so forth.

I'm sure many Volt and Wisp players think their buffs are a universal boon and don't actually realize that they're messing with the flow of the game for others; I can understand that even if I think it's a bit lacking in rapport, and I generally don't hold it against them. 
Then there are those who insist that in a public game no-one else has the right to an opinion on how they build and play while conveniently ignoring that they themselves dictate how up to three others are going to spend the mission. 

There's a reason this type of thread turns up regularly.  

 

I think a reasonable fix that wouldn't hamper Volt-mains in any way

would be to add a Duration to the backflip opt-out, where it remains in effect for a set duration (say 1min?) regardless of how many more times Volt recasts Speed. If you choose to opt-out, you stay opted out.

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3 hours ago, RazerXPrime said:

Can someone explain why the speed buff hampers your gameplay so much?

throws off Melee combo timing, making some combos more difficult if not impossible

increases gun recoil, making it harder to land hits

increases gun ammo consumption -But does not increase Reload speed!- reducing overall gun DPS for some weapons when the recoil loss of hits is taken into account.

leads to an Unexpected Change in movement speed, for some people this leads to motion sickness. Running is fine, but having the change in speed be Random is nauseating.

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1 hour ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

increases gun recoil, making it harder to land hits

increases gun ammo consumption -But does not increase Reload speed!- reducing overall gun DPS for some weapons when the recoil loss of hits is taken into account.

Is this a joke? Because you got it 100% the wrong way.  Volt's Speed increase Reload speed and not Fire Rate.  

Back on topic: People use Volt in missions, especially fissures, precisely because they want you to move quickly and get to extraction as soon as possible. So everyone can collect the loot and move on. If they really want speed they can use Wukong or Titania (or Nova if they are really skilled) but what's the point? They're just getting to the extraction 30 seconds earlier than everyone else so they have to wait an extra 30 seconds minimum anyway.  

Combo Melee is just mash E, or Forward Mash E, or Forward Block Mash E, depending on the stance. There's nothing deeper than that.

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17 hours ago, Yrkul said:

Just give us a toggle for Volt and Wisp's speed buffs.

You will not be getting a toggle. 
 

If these thing bother you, you will need to workshop an idea they might implement. 
 

Perhaps a gear item like the keys that once equipped makes it so certain warframes with abilities like this can’t buff you. 
 

Because they’ll delete speed before they give you a toggle for it.

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