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Helminth Grows a New Appetite: 30.5 Update!


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2 minutes ago, wirecard said:

guys i appreciate working on the game, but please focus your resources on important stuff. but this random trash is not good. (same goes for parazon finisher gameplay. noone used before, noone will use after (except doing liches).)

status immunity hemlinth ability.. yeah spellbind exists. by the time u unlock helminth immunity, u should have tossed a titania in helminth, and spellbind gives cc. no point to use this new stuff.

this is a roundhouse kick in the balls for everyone who scanned them by hand. anyway you still have to get the right rooms, and being a helminth ability, it will not work on AW for submerged rooms :)

 

I have scanned almost all the Kuria. I have 4 left to do, which I will probably get done before the update, and my balls feel fine. Personally I have no issue if this makes it easier for other people in the future. You don't feel that way based on your feedback, which is totally valid and fair... but please don't imply that everyone who did it the old longer way are offended/bothered. Also its kind of strange to bemoan the fact that it will be easier for other people and then try to "bu-but sucks for you it might not work in the submerged rooms a Ha" like... any sympathy or empathy a person could feel for those who had a tougher task getting the Kuria gets washed away when people have that sort of attitude. 

Also Spellbind exists, so does Firewalker... Ciphers existed and yet Perspicacity was still created. Maybe the new Helminth ability has a faster cast time, and a longer base duration. Maybe someone doesn't care for the extra stuff that comes with Spellbind and Firewalker, they want a longer more practical status immunity that might be more efficient (whether its the energy cast, duration). At a minimum its another choice for players. Will I personally use it? Probably not, but I personally don't use the majority of the Helminth abilities, and I don't use Spellbind (and I don't use Firewalker for its status immunity) - I find it more engaging to try tactically deal with statues in gameplay, unless I run a really squishy frame, in which case I use Rolling Guard. Point is, a lot of stuff makes other stuff in Warframe seem 'redundant', yet often its more of which fulfil's what particular niche for this player type moment, with small advantages/disadvantages. Then if not that, its just one of the abilities that already doesn't get used much, which is fine. 

 

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4 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

 

I have scanned almost all the Kuria. I have 4 left to do, which I will probably get done before the update, and my balls feel fine. Personally I have no issue if this makes it easier for other people in the future. You don't feel that way based on your feedback, which is totally valid and fair... but please don't imply that everyone who did it the old longer way are offended/bothered. Also its kind of strange to bemoan the fact that it will be easier for other people and then try to "bu-but sucks for you it might not work in the submerged rooms a Ha" like... any sympathy or empathy a person could feel for those who had a tougher task getting the Kuria gets washed away when people have that sort of attitude. 

Also Spellbind exists, so does Firewalker... Ciphers existed and yet Perspicacity was still created. Maybe the new Helminth ability has a faster cast time, and a longer base duration. Maybe someone doesn't care for the extra stuff that comes with Spellbind and Firewalker, they want a longer more practical status immunity that might be more efficient (whether its the energy cast, duration). At a minimum its another choice for players. Will I personally use it? Probably not, but I personally don't use the majority of the Helminth abilities, and I don't use Spellbind (and I don't use Firewalker for its status immunity) - I find it more engaging to try tactically deal with statues in gameplay, unless I run a really squishy frame, in which case I use Rolling Guard. Point is, a lot of stuff makes other stuff in Warframe seem 'redundant', yet often its more of which fulfil's what particular niche for this player type moment, with small advantages/disadvantages. Then if not that, its just one of the abilities that already doesn't get used much, which is fine. 

 

tbh the kuria thingy really might be some side stuff, maybe i was also bit overreacting there as i just woke up few mins before reading and still havent had a coffee yet ':D

well about perpicacity..  i use it for sortie/nightmare missions where i have to hack something i.e. rescue spy and maybe sabotage :D

oh and the thing you said about some abilities / things in general being redundant.. reminds me about the simpsons film where the guy wants some weak guys placed beneath the strong guys to make the strong guys look even stronger lmao. have a great day

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1 minute ago, wirecard said:

tbh the kuria thingy really might be some side stuff, maybe i was also bit overreacting there as i just woke up few mins before reading and still havent had a coffee yet ':D

well about perpicacity..  i use it for sortie/nightmare missions where i have to hack something i.e. rescue spy and maybe sabotage :D

oh and the thing you said about some abilities / things in general being redundant.. reminds me about the simpsons film where the guy wants some weak guys placed beneath the strong guys to make the strong guys look even stronger lmao. have a great day

 

Ahh yeah, I am not a morning person, I empathise with that feeling. All good. Plus even though we have done Kuria the hard way, at least if we ever need Syndicate Medallions will have an option. 

Yeah I use Perspicacity for Lua Hostage, its great. Yeah thats a good example/reference. Like I get it, the Status ability sounds kinda... meh, but I'm sure some people out there will use it. Maybe people that don't have Prime Surefooted (which I also don't use).

Cheers, I hope you have a great day too and get to have your coffee! 

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I suggest adding Golden Instinct ability to show the location (or the fact of having a mission) Rare and Reinforced Storage Containers.

Now I am filling in the Codex and spent 3 (three) months in search of the Reinforced Orokin Container. Results: 1 Rare Container from which I received 1 Credit Booster. My friend is lucky more. During these three months, he found 2.

Considering such a small chance of appearance, maybe you should give an opportunity find them if they appear on the mission?

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17 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Every week, your Helminth will have an Affinity toward 3 Random Warframes.

Then you will only use these three warframes every week.

Just like before, "Maiming Strike" made people use only slide attack.

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If you decided to let this randomization system a thing, then reduce the required invigorations for the guarantee pick from 10 to 6. Waiting almost an entire month for your favorite frame to show up is too long in my opinion.

There is also concerns for leaderboards that allowed competition to be very wildly unbalanced. It would be great for the leaderboards only be eligible if the competitor does not used an invigorated frame.

Regarding recruiting chat and the amount of elitism this will create, then the only solution is.. well it's a self solving problem. Just don't join or get close to those groups, simple. This can be solved with a fully fledged LFG system, but that's another topic.

Edited by DrivaMain
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8 hours ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

We're not using kuva to roll these. It's nothing like a warframe riven. Many people have plenty of extra resources as well.

And there's no bad frames because the game isn't rocket science and the player determines how good something is.

I'm facepalming so much...

Have you even read post made by DE line by line???

I'll help you understand: (expand the below message to see the core of the point)

Quote

INTRODUCING: INVIGORATIONS

Son has been busy developing new bio-technologies for Helminth. Visit SON in the Necralisk on DEIMOS to obtain the New Segment required to upgrade your Helminth to perform a new operation: Invigorations! 

Our main objective with this system expansion is really simple: give players a way to engage with Warframes they may not have used in a while!

 

That's DE's goal with this system, and like I said this system will fail make players use warframes have not being used in a while, so together with all the other reasons the majority of people listed in those comments, this system fails under every aspect and it's getting closer to warframe rivens which is very harmful for game itself.

I'll do my best to provide feedback and avoid DE hurt their own game.

Edited by Radu10
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8 hours ago, Blyker said:

I like the invigorations, i might actually play other frames then the ones i now normally use.

For all the people who talk about meta etc the question, how many times do you need the arbitration bonus frame and weapon to be allowed to play in that arbitration? I have never heard that as a requirement!

That's the point so nobody will use bad frames, with useless abilities, stat buffs wont make a difference, so considering this was the main goal for DE with this system, it already fails at the start and they need 180 asap!

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6 minutes ago, Radu10 said:

I'm facepalming so much...

Have you even read post made by DE line by line???

I'll help you understand: (expand the below message to see the core of the point)

That's DE's goal with this system, and like I said this system will fail make players use warframes have not being used in a while, so together with all the other reasons the majority of people listed in those comments, this system fails under every aspect and it's getting closer to warframe rivens which is very harmful for game itself.

I'll do my best to provide feedback and avoid DE hurt their own game.

If people use wukong for the clone and cloudwalker, that doesn't mean every frame needs the same. A frame isn't bad just because it's not used for quick spys.

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7 hours ago, Maka.Bones said:

1) I only liked #3 as a Warframe ability. (Trade energy for health, and give energy to allies)

4 & 5 do sound interesting, but I'd only consider using them as an arcane/mod for a companion. 

 

2) > #5 would only be useful 1-3 times per mission, unless you already have all the scannable items, and then it's only useful if an ayatan statue actually spawns in said mission... I wouldn't want to take up an entire ability slot for an ability that might even be (literally) useless. 

3) > #4 could be useful, but it seems like something that should go on a companion/pet, or a weapon arcane. Not as an ability that you'd need to spend 25-50 energy on, every 10-30s... Talk about a huge energy sink. Not to mention that this is only gon a be worth using with Saryn/ember, or other nuke warframes, or AoE nuke weapons.... But Saryn & ember can already simply re-apply those status effects. So that makes me think that we're getting an ability just to make our weapons more functional...? Then why not just *shoot more*?

Now that I've thought about it more, #4 sounds just as bad/pointless/redundant as "status immunity"

1) We have already healing abilities. For me is just redundancy.

2) It's indeed not so useful as abilitiy but it can be useful when you are doing some Cephalon scans or something. I won't use it because I've scanned most cephalons' fragment & I don't care about unscanned kurias.

3) It really depends what/how it does, its speed and how much does it cost. As someone said, it could either just add +1 status OR multiply it (e.g. you have 5 heat -> the Ability gives you another 5 => you have 10 heat after the cast). It's like Mark of death (as fair I remember) that could spread status but it's not so good to use.

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8 hours ago, (PSN)Po_Lod7 said:

Lol. A lot of these people who are complaining about invigorations can be boiled down to. 

"I'm used to this thing, I don't want to stop using this thing." 

As for the argument with arbitrations. That buff lasts a whole 1 mission. Why would anyone change a build for 1 mission and the mission are only endless types. A week long buff is a totally different mindset. 

For a week you can do something with that time it will change. Like People are so scared to change their precious meta it's so sad. 

Like wow gate keeping match making because of a lack of buffs is some next level cringe especially since plenty of abilities already have stat caps for their effectiveness. 

 

I'll love to see you play hydroid/whatever frame with low usage in specific missions!

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1 minute ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

If people use wukong for the clone and cloudwalker, that doesn't mean every frame needs the same. A frame isn't bad just because it's not used for quick spys.

They also don't need random stat buffs when the ability themselves are bad, that's the issue here!

I doubt you ever picked the warframe/weapon for arbitration if wasn't one YOU like using.

'Cause arbitration system goal was really similar, but all I see are Wisps, buffer frames, resource farming frames, and never those frames DE's defined have low player usage...

There's nothing more to say about this, you can keep go around the core issue, and stating this system is perfect and needs be implemented, while majority of players are disagreeing with this system and do you know what's the sad part? DE wont even take a look at those comments (neither mines or yours) and get the feedback.

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7 hours ago, General_Durandal said:

Elite Sanctuary Onslaught has leaderboards?

huh... why?

I guess some people care about it.

If you know the game you well know isn't just about ESO leaderboards, the whole recruiting system will be affected, and those minor player doing leaderboards content will be affected as well while those frames are n't used that much, will still not be used.

So the main goal for DE with this system fails right at the start, there's really nothing more to say about this. 

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13 minutes ago, Radu10 said:

If you know the game you well know isn't just about ESO leaderboards, the whole recruiting system will be affected, and those minor player doing leaderboards content will be affected as well while those frames are n't used that much, will still not be used.

So the main goal for DE with this system fails right at the start, there's really nothing more to say about this. 

Or you're just using hyperbole....unless you have some empirical data to back this up... instead of "the sky is falling" rhetoric.

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21 minutes ago, Radu10 said:

They also don't need random stat buffs when the ability themselves are bad, that's the issue here!

I doubt you ever picked the warframe/weapon for arbitration if wasn't one YOU like using.

'Cause arbitration system goal was really similar, but all I see are Wisps, buffer frames, resource farming frames, and never those frames DE's defined have low player usage...

There's nothing more to say about this, you can keep go around the core issue, and stating this system is perfect and needs be implemented, while majority of players are disagreeing with this system and do you know what's the sad part? DE wont even take a look at those comments (neither mines or yours) and get the feedback.

The comments against are just people that have issues not being in control of others, and people that have some moral reasons that they feel all games should abide by. 

You're welcome to not use this system, but you don't get to tell others how to play.

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Not a fan of the Invigorations.

It feels like things in game will be balanced around them a little to much and it being a random system that decays i do not feel engaged with a system like that. It will also bring about requirements if raids come back so yea... Bad on paper and it will be bad in execution.

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15 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

The comments against are just people that have issues not being in control of others, and people that have some moral reasons that they feel all games should abide by. 

You're welcome to not use this system, but you don't get to tell others how to play.

You're the one blind, and you don't see the consequences of this system to the general gameplay experience both for casuals and veterans.

I made so many examples and such and so much detailed comments, you only reply with 2 lines not even proving why the game should need this system in the first place, 'cause it doesn't.

And you can't expect people accept it just because you for whatever obscure reason need those stupid random dmg buffs.

Talking with you started getting ridiculous

Edited by Radu10
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27 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

Or you're just using hyperbole....unless you have some empirical data to back this up... instead of "the sky is falling" rhetoric.

Where are your data proving the opposite, proving players will use those low-usage frames DE wants us to use, where are the data proving nothing will change in recruiting system?

Have you ever did eidolon runs/ resources farm using recruiting chat? It seems you don't even know how the game community actually works.

You're just here keep trying debunk whatever I say (failing at it) while at same time ignoring all the other people being concerned about this system exactly like me!

Like I said in other comment this is just ridiculous and discussing with you isn't a constructive experience at all.

Edited by Radu10
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5 minutes ago, Radu10 said:

Where are your data proving the opposite, proving players will use those low-usage frames DE wants us to use, where are the data proving nothing will change in recruiting system?

Have you ever did eidolon runs/ resources farm using recruiting chat? It seems you don't even know how the game community actually works.

Even toxic players have to be obeisant to what expectations are actually plausible.

It's grossly unnecessary to demand 300 Hydrolyst caps to join a squad, but it's plausible that almost everyone can do that if they put in the time and don't get sick of it.

It's not plausible to expect a certain buff on a certain frame to be available at any given time out of thousands and thousands of possible permutations and for that player to happen to want to do that exact thing at that exact time. Possible, but not plausible enough to restrict for.

I don't see this realistically changing recruiting demands unless that recruiter wants to get nothing done for three months while satisfying their infinitesimal ideals.

Edited by TheLexiConArtist
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1 minute ago, TheLexiConArtist said:

Even toxic players have to be obeisant to what expectations are actually plausible.

It's crap to require 300 Hydrolyst caps to form a squad, but it's plausible that almost everyone can do that if they put in the time and don't get sick of it.

It's not plausible to expect a certain buff on a certain frame to be available at any given time out of thousands and thousands of possible permutations and for that player to happen to want to do that exact thing at that exact time. Possible, but not plausible enough to restrict for.

I don't see this realistically changing recruiting demands unless that recruiter wants to get nothing done for three months while satisfying their infinitesimal ideals.

Leaderboard players will be affected, future events will be a chore for clans aiming at top places, and yes recruit is full of players ofc I can expect to find one with the right frame and the right buff.

All those unneeded changes 'cause DE believes random stat buffs will make low-usage frames used being used more?

It wont make them being used more, so the whole logic to wanting implement this system fails at the start! Why should I agree about this nosense?

 

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5 minutes ago, XiPoohBear said:

You will find that the vast majority of posters on the forum love DE no matter how badly DE screws up. They will attack you for pointing out routine things that have been busted for years and say "Oh well that's been like that for 5 years, how can you be mad about that?". As if that's even a defense.

 

The sad fact of the matter is that Warframe fits a very specific niche in the game market that is completeley devoid of competition. Add in the extremely overprotective fanbois and it's a recipe for a parent company who doesn't finish what they start, because they are not required to. The fanbois will gobble up every new frame release. Many of them will just straight buy the frames for RL currency. There is no other explanation for this *EXPLETIVE DELETED* game pulling down $170 M in revenue last calendar year. For what?  Orphix venom and Helminth? THATS IT!!??!?!?!?!?!

That's why bugs aren't fixed and suggestions feedback not considered, it's in part thanks to those players!

It's a lost cause I guess, I'm still happy for all the points I proved in this topic and happy the majority of comments seems to agree this system wont work and is a really bad idea for game itself considering what DE itself stated.

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Invigorations will be bad and everyone already hates them. Don't do it.

IMO if you want us to play different warframes rework them one by one starting from the least used. It's a lot of work, I agree, but nobody is rushing you.

Also, you are trying to make warframes "fun to play" which is not a bad thing by any means but maybe the focus should a bit towards "how is this warframe useful in a mission"

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23 minutes ago, Radu10 said:

Where are your data proving the opposite, proving players will use those low-usage frames DE wants us to use, where are the data proving nothing will change in recruiting system?

Have you ever did eidolon runs/ resources farm using recruiting chat? It seems you don't even know how the game community actually works.

You're just here keep trying debunk whatever I say (failing at it) while at same time ignoring all the other people being concerned about this system exactly like me!

Like I said in other comment this is just ridiculous and discussing with you isn't a constructive experience at all.

I didn't make the claim.....

If you say the earth is flat, it's your job to prove it.

Like I said before, what you think is bad for the game and the players is rhetoric and conjecture. That means it's not true.

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