Deconstructor Melee Modding Changes (Sisters of Parvos)

[(PSN)Raz_BardOfBeasts]

Give my hound a giant sword like Sif from Dark Souls!

[Doomelf]

The nerf hammer strikes again! Thanks DE for ruining our experience and builds even more!

[maxximuxx]

Leave it to DE to make sentinels completely useless after an update

they should change the name of the update to SISTERS OF NERFS at this point

We get bandage mods that they call buffs

while they nerfs the rest of the entire arsenal to the ground notice its only everything that represents melee mods the vigilante ones still apply at least until they call it a mistake and do a bugfix and remove them too

Nice job 

No really nice job😐

[Red_Terror]

Guess Helios is just a scanner now, I really liked the fact you could use a sentinel to boost your own damage instead of having to rely on some companion ai

[Jarriaga]

19 minutes ago, vrgamr37 said:

Even without a decaying key shieldgating is still better than armor. Removing decaying key only increases the energy cost to get to max shields during the rolling guard iframe. 

It'll probably hurt newer players and than veterans so idk what you're gonna accomplish with that. 

 

1 hour ago, Tuturuu23 said:

because of this "exploit" a lot of frames now can be used in high level content without getting one shot by random missile of a level 2000 bombard. You want to go back to that era?

You should not be building around or optimizing your builds around oversights and exploits. Full stop.

If you want to decrease shield gating activation downtime, use Fast Deflection or put Pillage in your frame as intended. No other Dragon Key is a benefit, and the Decaying Dragon key only became an advantage because something else was changed in the game. It is an oversight.

[kyori]

Hmm.. all these unhappy tenno are probably not the same ones as those who will cheer later when the update drops... or cheer when tennocon comes later this month ya?

[UncleBlueUncle]

Really surprised to see this change coming now after so many years. This change is not addressing any problem, but just removing the sentinels from the game. Panzer and Smeeta are the only viable options which are now left in the game.

I find it also quite a bad idea to bring such a change some hours before the actual update is going life without waiting for any feedback from the community.

[Jarriaga]

2 hours ago, Nyarllathoteph said:

I meant in terms of game design. They always have a way around in terms of game design, they can mix things up mechanic-wise in order to give us mechanical difficulty, they don't have to hammer us into the ground.

Mechanical difficulty is something that can only currently work with bosses due to our power levels though. Making a TSP survival run a challenge or difficult at the 1h mark requires heavy nerfs.

[Bigbluedragon]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb Jarriaga:

 

You should not be building around or optimizing your builds around oversights and exploits. Full stop.

If you want to decrease shield gating activation downtime, use Fast Deflection as intended.

Sorry but aren't the oversights and exploids part of the game and next of who is hurt by using them? Is it the fun? 

Warframe is not really a compatative game. There is no timetrial to win or something. And isn't it also fun to find an exploid ore oversight and try to make something out of it? Its not like modding is a big challange, because weapons have very binary builds and Warframes have builds around thair toolset. If we don't use exploids or eversights there is no real depth in the game.

[Jarriaga]

2 hours ago, Nyarllathoteph said:

I meant in terms of game design. They always have a way around in terms of game design, they can mix things up mechanic-wise in order to give us mechanical difficulty, they don't have to hammer us into the ground.

Mechanical difficulty is something that can only currently work with bosses due to our power levels though. Making a TSP survival run a challenge or difficult at the 1h mark requires heavy nerfs.

[Infinity.X_x]

Appreciate the rectification of this COMPLETE oversight. Now we can completely stop using Sentinals all together. 

"Remember kids you can only have fun the way we want you to!" -DE probably 

[Mediloric]

Errrr... well then. Can't say I'm too surprised this happened, always did find it odd that Helios could be a sort of stat stick for our melee weapons, really shot yourself in the foot though by not addressing the same issue with the Vigilante set for Primary/Secondary weapons and also posting this so close to the release. 

I think the best time to have brought this up was during the Arsenal Divide Workshop, by stagnating this seemly small but critical bit of news (any news that affect builds/mods/etc should always be critical) and being pretty inconsistent with other "oversights" really doesn't put you in a good light, it would have been better to dump all this kind of information in the workshop along with other oversight corrections. 

But all in all, this change, this oversight correction, is a good one, it corrects a error that should have been patched before (because it really didn't make any sense) and hopefully makes you see that weaker melee weapons still need a little more to them to be viable, hopefully this is a starting point for a better change down the road.  

If anything else, these kind of changes also just highlight the fact Sentinels (and by extension, their weapons) need a overall look at, they really don't have that much going for them compared to the Smeeta and what not.  Sentinels/Companion weapons should not just be a stat sticks or a means to melee mod hop. I can only hope this change is the vanguard of a new workshop for companions.

With all that said though, there are a LOT of overreactions here by people, and I mean a lot. I can fully respect the anger, the annoyance this brings, especially since this post/news could have been done MUCH EARLIER IN A CERTAIN WORKSHOP.

There have been quite a few posts that have been nothing more then banging their chest and making noise over something that I hate to say, was really just a exploit, totally should have expected it to be shut down at some stage, granted it should have been much sooner since the devs were clearly aware of it for a long period of time, but quite a few posts here are just... cringe.  

Like I understand you're frustrated but come on... some of you are acting like it's the end of the world.

[maxximuxx]

1 minute ago, kyori said:

Hmm.. all these unhappy tenno are probably not the same ones as those who will cheer later when the update drops... or cheer when tennocon comes later this month ya?

Don't know about the rest but for me nope i don't buy tenocon digital key since 2018 because they don't deserve it nor i will watch the tenocon to ear more lies about stuff that they say next year but will prob take 2 to 3 years to make 

will i quit no

Am i happy to what they are doing no

will i still play the game ofc didn't invest 7years to quit now

[Jarriaga]

1 minute ago, Bigbluedragon said:

Sorry but aren't the oversights and exploids part of the game and next of who is hurt by using them? Is it the fun? 

The health of the game itself is hurt. People getting used to or optimizing their builds around exploits just results in the anger we have in this thread when said exploit is patched out.

2 minutes ago, Bigbluedragon said:

Warframe is not really a compatative game. There is no timetrial to win or something. 

That doesn't matter. A balanced game is more fun than a brain-dead cookie-cutter game for some people. Just because WF is not competitive doesn't excuse the push for powercreep or broken mechanics as if they should be the norm. That's bad game design.

3 minutes ago, Bigbluedragon said:

And isn't it also fun to find an exploid ore oversight and try to make something out of it?

For fun in a meme video? Sure. 

Making your builds around them for normal or high level play? No, unless your definition of fun is tied to brain-dead broken.

5 minutes ago, Bigbluedragon said:

Its not like modding is a big challange, because weapons have very binary builds and Warframes have builds around thair toolset.

It is a big challenge when modding actually takes a toll in your performance. Adding Rolling guard + the Decaying Dragon key is just 1 mod. Adding RG + Fast Deflection is 2 mods, so something else in your build takes a hit and the idea here is for you to prioritize and balance survivability vs. damage/range/duration. The DDK breaks that even though it was originally a handicap just like all other Dragon Keys because of a change made to shield gating and not the key in question. 

8 minutes ago, Bigbluedragon said:

If we don't use exploids or eversights there is no real depth in the game.

In my opinion, if there are no exploits or oversights that's a sign of a very high quality and thorough testing process. You know, like most people have been asking DE to do so they don't have to nerf something after release? Pick your lane. You can't go left and right at once.

[kebra]

Only 2 viable companions among dozens of them... thanks DE. Smeeta charm and Vulpaphyla evasion are waiting for their nerf.

[maxximuxx]

Just now, kebra said:

Only 2 viable companions among dozens of them... thanks DE. Smeeta and Vulpaphyla are waiting for their nerf.

Even smeeta got a indirect nerf remember drops now despawn after 5 min no more strategic smeeta farming

[OrsonBear]

I really hope there's a dislike button... 

[PollexMessier]

This just feels like one last middle finger to players who were upset about the mele nerfs. The only other way to interpret this would just be that every single person involved with this decision has never played this game at a level where this interaction has any meaningful benefit before.

I'm assuming what happened is, you saw a lot of players saying "Just use gladiator helios to offset the mele nerfs" and thought "Oh S#&$ we need to deal with that".

Except, it wouldn't do that at all. Players using this setup before wouldn't be offsetting the nerfs by using it because, they were using it already. They can't get back power with a system they already had that power from. They ate the nerf harder than everyone else did already. And players that weren't using it would quickly find out that gladiator helios is unusable trash anyways (or knew this already), because sentinels can't survive two seconds in levels where the gladiator buff would be remotely relevant. You wouldn't lose the gladiator buff when your sentinel died sure, but what you do lose is vacuum and animal instinct which are HUGE qol mods, as well as not having the abilities of any of the more useful companions. It would be a power trade off of: All of the qol companions give, in exchange for a fraction of the mele power they lost in the nerf.

It might've seen an uptick in use for a while but I bet it would've been dropped by players pretty quickly as they figured out the downsides. I severely doubt more than 2% of players (and that is a generous estimate) would have used this setup in levels where it would actually make any difference once things settled. This interaction functionally only benefited early to mid game players, and marginally at that. Hardly any effect on the power ceiling at all where it matters.

[icBee]

LOL, just remove combo counter already

[Opyt]

19 hours ago, NoLazyShadow said:

Can't stop nerfing things, DE?

Well, at this rate you might actually adress other long standing problems

Or just address long standing actual problems.

Because they didn't think it was a big enough problem in Heart of Deimos to address it then.  And they've had the ability to do this since exalted weapons.

I like how they squeezed it in the day before the big patch seeming like they didn't want to clutter the forums with a lot of ire, but then at least they announced it.  So they told us what they were going to do before doing it lmao.

[sunderthefirmament]

Just now, icBee said:

LOL, just remove combo counter already

I feel like the combo counter has more or less failed at what it was supposed to do.  DE seemed to want us to build up a combo and then release it with a heavy attack.  Yet most builds either focus exclusively on building up the combo or exclusively on heavy attacking (with a decent initial combo).

[Drachnyn]

Anyone remember how they specifically changed set mods so equipping the same set mod on both companion weapon and real weapon would no longer count for two set mods and only each unique set mod counted but regardless where it was equipped? It might have been an oversight initially but after that it was legit.

[GSilverSky]

Holy...
You CAN NOT be serious! You take away the only thing sentinels have going for them?! That has been "unintentional" since these mods came out?! Yeah sure. Why not take away all variety and interactions that we have. This is absolutely outrageous!!!

[maxximuxx]

4 minutes ago, icBee said:

 

 

2 minutes ago, Drachnyn said:

Anyone remember how they specifically changed set mods so equipping the same set mod on both companion weapon and real weapon would no longer count for two set mods and only each unique set mod counted but regardless where it was equipped? It might have been an oversight initially but after that it was legit.

Straight up FACTS 

At this point they are just making excuses to do even more nerfs 

[Snake]

Oh yes - Please make the game less fun....

 

This change does not do anything good for the game. You should have dubbed down on this stuff to make it more consistent and useful.

 

RIP Sentinels - You only had one purpose after Years of neglect. Now there is none.