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Deconstructor Melee Modding Changes (Sisters of Parvos)


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Why don't u deactivate vigilante set bonus while you're at it? Nah cos that's not melee. And those can be equipped on any sentinel not a weak little sentinel who scans things and requires high damage output to kill the thing shooting at him b4 it kills him for the rest of the mission. Nahh that would be absurd

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The only way for new players to deal damage to steel path enemies was using scaling damage. Raw damage is just not enough. Now after the nerf,  cant even damage the enemies and companion stat stick is removed, bless you guys. Time to remove the game from my library.

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At this point I’m convinced you guys are deliberately trying to spite the player base. It’s also extremely shady to make changes at the absolute last second, kinda like that time you guys nerfed Khora. Each patch makes it more and more difficult to justify playing this game and supporting you guys, it’s frustrating and disappointing.

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Are you kidding, like is nerfing melee your primary goal, that too just hours before the update. You idiots have again outdone yourself just like the previous Khora "bug-nerf". And where does this stops? Yall Crazy peoples doin some really terrible Jobs in DE.

 

That deconstructor had one single use and yall dumbos had to take that away too. God damn yall, is this what Tencent pays you for huh. Making poor animations/accessories and nerfing the useful parts of the game. At some point these DE(LAYERS) wud just remove the entire Veteran playerbase because It is what it is.

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Posted (edited)
On 2021-07-06 at 4:54 AM, (NSW)4g3nt_0 said:

Ok so I may sound stupid, but does that mean the dmg from guns will still infinitely increase with every status I proc?

No

Lets use the Epitaph as an example.

With Galvanized Shot against an enemy with 7 procs (which is the most the Epitaph can put onto an enemy without including Warframe abilities) and with Galvanized Shot's effect maxed out at 120% damage per status. Thats 7 x 120 = 840% Damage. It doesn't stack like original CO did, where its exponential, its a damage boost granted for each unique proc on an enemy.

To clarify Epitaph with my build (around the quick shot specifically)
Impact - Dealt by both quick shot and charged shot
Puncture - Dealt by both quick shot and charged shot
Slash - Dealt by both quick shot and charged shot
Blast - Dealt by the quick shot AoE
Viral - Modded on
Heat - Modded on
Cold - Forced by the quick shot AoE

Edited by Nox_Terminus
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Posted (edited)

Khora's whip and Atlas punch scaling off their own equipped melee weapons is different. 

 

It's not the same obviously gross exploit of scaling off mods equipped to a completely different in game unit and having it affect your melee weapon. 

 

Skills that scale off an equipped weapon or gear? Sure. Makes sense. Like every RPG weapon skill almost everywhere. 

 

A weapon scaling wielded by the player because of gear or mods equipped on a follower, meant to be unit specific? Not the same thing. These aren't auras. 

 

Whole lotta conflating in this thread. 

Edited by Balegrim
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il y a 48 minutes, (PSN)JaxsonHammerkawk a dit :

Sure kid bet it was in sp solo too huh

It's even better in solo as you can pause the game.

Good luck doing the Howl of the Kubrow quest, I believe in you ! Those companions are op when equipping them with deconstructor+gladiator, it's true, you said so !

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1 minute ago, dwqrf said:

It's even better in solo as you can pause the game.

Good luck doing the Howl of the Kubrow quest, I believe in you ! Those companions are op when equipping them with deconstructor+gladiator, it's true, you said so !

Try it whenever you get the steel path unlocked. Lol I've got 4k hours in the game how many do you have? My ps name is same as here you can check it out for yourself. And i never said anything about gladiator mods on anything being op lmao. Quote me where i said that. Stop lying about things I've said only because you can't come up with a good argument against them, it's sad really. 

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Hah, I second the person who wants a Forma refund on his Helios and Deconstructor Prime. Spent enough time and platinum to get a good weapon going on that little guy, just to see him done in like that. If you're going to make something I spent time and money on useless, at east give me my money back.

And it's not an oversight if you do it for only one instance in the game, when (As many people pointed out) Vigilante mods on gun sentinels work. Or will we have to wait for some gun-bearing dogs/cats to come out so we get that change implemented as well.

Also I like the person who did the math and made it obvious how red crits on melee are practically impossible now. Fine, since you've been pushing a status meta so hard for so long now, at least give us more than three free build presets per weapon. As well as a way to quickly switch between them outside the Arsenal, because it's annoying enough as it is to have to run to the middle of my ship and wrestle with the arsenal screens before every mission.

Finally, even though the new mods and arcanes look fun, I think that "buffing" primary and secondary weapons by introducing mods that need 40k endo and several million credits each is misguided. A buff to guns would be to buff base stats of guns and remake some really old ones that are useless in general. What you did is endo- and credits-laden powercreep, combined with an actual nerf to (specifically) crit-oriented melee builds. This ongoing crusade against critical-oriented weapons in favor of status ones is getting a tad annoying, especially since playing with status weapons is still an annoying juggling act.

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7 minutes ago, dwqrf said:

It's even better in solo as you can pause the game.

Good luck doing the Howl of the Kubrow quest, I believe in you ! Those companions are op when equipping them with deconstructor+gladiator, it's true, you said so !

Nvm it really doesn't matter anyway cuz you've already proven yourself to be a liar. Nothing you say is credible. 

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Please give us universal vacuum and move all companions into the MR fodder category. Sentinels already can't be kept alive more than several waves, smeeta is getting the "increased drop was unintended reduction of grind" nerf and dogs are just dead useless. Like do you guys remember we have companion riven mods lmfao? Well at least sentinels do not have "AI" and do not get stuck on drop ships in Railjack.

My solution fixes companion "AI" problems, "unintended interactions" and heartache of formaing these garbage. Give us universal vaccum and let us subsume companions into Helminth, each subsume will just grant us -1 fodder garbage to inventory. 

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27 minutes ago, dwqrf said:

It's even better in solo as you can pause the game.

Good luck doing the Howl of the Kubrow quest, I believe in you ! Those companions are op when equipping them with deconstructor+gladiator, it's true, you said so !

All of this coming from the guy that put an ad in WTS for an Ignis Wraith BP FOR 49p. That's just low dude. You're blocked. 

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6 hours ago, (PSN)JaxsonHammerkawk said:

All of this coming from the guy that put an ad in WTS for an Ignis Wraith BP FOR 49p. That's just low dude. You're blocked. 

That's because some people sell it for 50pl, so I have my own ad for 0-49pl. But you can't read, or understand sarcasm, can you ?

 

6 hours ago, (PSN)JaxsonHammerkawk said:

Nvm it really doesn't matter anyway cuz you've already proven yourself to be a liar. Nothing you say is credible. 

So I'm a liar for pointing out that what you says is wrong ? Right...

 

6 hours ago, (PSN)JaxsonHammerkawk said:

Try it whenever you get the steel path unlocked. Lol I've got 4k hours in the game how many do you have? My ps name is same as here you can check it out for yourself.

Same, but the main difference is that I check my information, you don't.

 

On 2021-07-06 at 2:54 PM, (PSN)JaxsonHammerkawk said:

Yet again you show your inexperience. Using the random button you can in fact put the Deconstructor on other sentinels. 

Pure gold.

 

On 2021-07-06 at 2:54 PM, (PSN)JaxsonHammerkawk said:

Yet again you show your inexperience. Using the random button you can in fact put the Deconstructor on other sentinels. 

Pure gold.

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On 2021-07-06 at 7:54 AM, Jarriaga said:

That's fine. You are sacrificing another aura for Brief Respite. Most often than not that is going to result in lost DPS in some way, shape, or form for the sake of survivability, which is exactly how the modding system balances itself. My issue is with the DDK.

That's still their choice to sacrifice all other auras for the sake for shield gating in a controlled way.

It is an exploit. The function of the DDK itself has remained intact for years. It only suddenly became an advantage when shield gating was introduced to the game. It is an oversight because all other Dragon Keys remain as handicaps with no changes made to them at all. Refusing to recognize this is an exploit is nothing more than disingenuous, and that is not open to interpretation or opinion. 

For the record, because it should be said clearly and abundantly: decaying dragon key was used in parallel with self-damage on Chroma for Hex Armor long before shield gating.  It's not used now because self-damage was yeeted from the game, but that doesn't mean it was "never an advantage prior to shield gating", and those keys have been around far longer than Chroma has (think adding-Nekros-update if anyone wants to ask "how long ago?") so why should shield gating be the reason to yeet the DDK when at this point for years it's been a thing, it's just used on more frames than Chroma now.

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On 2021-07-07 at 1:24 AM, (PSN)SolarPhantom82 said:

its called BS,  Like Then they tried to say they “ FIXED” Venari’s Defense Target healing, because of scarlet spear…

Hah.  No that was so much worse than this.

They fixed it where it was working as intended, because the description of Venari explicitly stated that heal worked on objectives.  So because DE forgot that Venari could heal objectives when they were singling out abilities to remove healing on the Op-Links (which they did a good job of hitting all the big ones, no surprise that they forgot Venari, since afaik no one ever used (I don't think they even use it to this day) heal on the objectives.  So even if they had a list of all the commonly used healing, Venari wouldn't have been on that list, since people using Khora were more or less just treating Venari as a perma-animal instinct.

 

This, on the other hand, is arguably just fixing something they didn't want to for 3 years.

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DE Pls, buff the companions to survive for more time in steel path, buff the companions weapons too and give more buff to utility to mods like medi-ray, shield charger, coolant leak and repair kit because they are very very very bad...

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I didn't even know this thread or nerf was a thing myself until now and I've been playing every day since the update came out.

As someone who used to use Helios for its benefits, its limited survivability (even the prime version suffers) means you go without Vacuum or the ability to scan specific enemies for long periods of time, probably the only useful thing sentinels do besides Oxylus having the Simaris mod to scan plants.

I have used the gladiator mods on deconstructor myself solely for the set bonus, as the mods themselves don't really add much to melee weapons where other mods do a better job (see Berserker and Gladiator Vice, or the focus school that gives you a better benefit than Gladiator Rush)

Gladiator Might however is a wierd choice, the weapon does benefit from the critical damage, but does not benefit from the set bonus due to not having a combo meter, however the warframe does.

Does this mean that warframe Hunter mods should be removed because the Warframe isn't a companion?

I've since been using a Panzer Vulpaphyla, with the right mods it never dies, wipes out trash mobs, and provides utility and mod bonuses on top of that. (Barring the frequent bug where it appears to die permanently), because it's a beast you can also use Health/Armour/Shield/Crit link mods, making them infinitely more useful companions, as well as Bite and other very powerful mods.

Not being able to use mods companions can't utilise fully anyway isn't a huge change, just means a less cluttered modding experience, and I personally appreciate the change.

However, sentinels now are suboptimal to have as companions, as they don't offer much in the way of support outside a couple gimmick mods (see Sanctuary), and their functions aren't explained very well in that they do their equipped mods in order, where beast effects are very immediate, especially as you can influence what enemy they attack with Hunter Command.

Sentinels do have health/shield regen capabilities, which make me think they're supposed to be combat/utility oriented companions, but they just don't survive long enough to be of any use without the recent parazon mod that makes Regen/Primed Regen functionally useless. 

I feel like at least there needs to be robotic set mods that provide benefits to the warframe, or mods that are meant solely for the weapon (see Bite) so sentinels have at least somewhat viable survivability or support, currently we only have Melee/Primary/Warframe/Beast or Kavat oriented mod sets. 

Edited by DarknessNightshade
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Okay; first up - I do have to say - I'm not a happy Tenno here.  This was definitely not an unknown bug, it has been posted, Youtubed, and explained at length from multiple sources, enough so it was valid to see this as a feature (and thus a reason to use Sentinels).

Let's examine the reality of this.  By choice of companion you could:

1) get more loot, and random buffs

2) get consistent DPS boost by buff

3) have an eternally respawning shoulder turret that out  DPS's most players using ranged weapons. (no I'm not going to say which senti weapon, because given this thread exists I don't need it trash-canned) 

OR

4) give that up to have some increased set bonuses. aka - Stat Stick.

Now, the Melee (and Melee ONLY) only set bonuses part of that has been removed, that makes zero sense. 

The real issue: those first 3 options I presented all required one thing in common, the companion being alive.  The "Stat Stick" did not have a check to see if the companion was "alive", and frankly it should - that would be the point of balance of it - for Melee AND Ranged mod sets with "Stat Stick" Companion weapons.

 

So make it an actual FEATURE: if the Sentinel carrying part of a set isn't dead, it counts toward set bonuses (melee or ranged).  Every player I personally know that is actively playing Warframe uses Stat Sticks to varying degrees in builds, because it's a fun modularity to the game that was neat.  IE - with knowledge comes power.  I don't think any of us would have an issue with accepting RISK along with that power - pet go BOOM - set mod's powers go EEP! - seems fair.

 

Now COMPLETELY separate from that recommendation:

A lot of the mod removal does just avoid confusion about what works and what literally did nothing, stuff I had to test out for myself, so for that thanks.

 

However, SOME of the mod's removed where removed ONLY because they were part of a set, and that was a glaring mistake imo.

So I'd like to address the set mods that I feel should be allowed, and why, and those that should stay unusable (even if I don't "like" it) based on interactions with combos or heavy attacks or other mechanics that make them useless to the weapon. This is addressed at melee Sentinel weapons, not specifically Deconstructor.

 

  • Gladiator Might - ALLOW - increased crit damage in general (perhaps not allowed on Deconstructor specifically since it can't crit)
  • Gladiator Rush - Not Allowed - Combo Duration
  • Gladiator Vice - ALLOW - attack speed
  • Motus Impact - ALLOW on HOUNDS if Hounds can use Aerial Attacks, if not then not allowed, not allowed for Helios.
  • Proton Snap - ALLOW on HOUNDS if Hounds can Wall Latch, if not then not allowed, not allowed for Helios.
  • Tek Gravity - ALLOW on HOUNDS if Hounds can use Slam Attacks, if not then not allowed, not allowed for Helios.
  • Strain Infection - Not Allowed - This set is designed to be used with a Helminth (companion not the ships system), not for Sentinel weapons, and requires "Cysts" to activate effects, which Sentinels don't gain..

    The ones ones this list that showed that no one on the team  looking at what was being done seemed to understand the Senti weapon in questions operation: - ALLOW -
  • Carnis Mandible
  • Jugulus Barbs
  • Saxum Thorax

    Destructor cannot Crit - let me say that again more clearly - Crit Chance BASE ZERO - it must spec into condition builds to be useful.  Those mods made it useful, on each of the 3 throws, you could determine if it was elemental or physical damage you wanted to have the advantage on the  proc'ing based on the % of damage from the mods used, it was nuanced, fun, and interesting, now it's a club that's not worth using - again.

To summarize: 

When we choose a companion, we not only choose what abilities we are increasing, we choose what abilities we are fore going to do so.  It should be a meaningful choice, not simply Smeeta because I need more loot, and I can get buffs (even if they are rando), conversely - there should be *some* risk - if the companion doesn't survive, the ability they provide they should end, Sentinel "Stat Sticks" should be formalized, and depend on the companions continued functions.

 

The Check to do this is already in the code btw:  If the companion goes down Animal Instincts stop working - it should be something similar imo.

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On 2021-07-05 at 11:20 AM, SephirothWS said:

With the continued nerfs heading for Melee, maybe its time to just remove Melee and its mechanics from the game and just require people to use guns in this looter shooter game.... Well played DE.

Because as we know no looter shooters have melee builds except warframe not borderlands no sir (and this doesn't nerf melee as a whole only crit melee which is the worse in-between crit and stat chance so it doesn't even matter lol just made the bad worse and the good better giving you even less choice in what to use) don't mind nerfs but this is a bad why to bridge gap in-between guns and melee and crit melee to status.

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I hope someone out there who needs to read this does. And I’ll preface it with: respond however you want, I will not be following up on it. 
 

If you’re upset at the changes to the game, please leave. 
 
I know it’s hard when the only way you can play a game is to look up on overframe to find a build someone else comes up with to misuse an oversight that a developer has not gotten around to fixing yet. And if you aren’t capable of using any of the other dozens of frames, companions and weapons then you should just go back to call of duty. I hear they have a zombie thing now. 
 

Thank you de for constantly upgrading and developing a game I enjoy so much.

And thank you Rebecca for putting up with the obnoxious community gaming has become. 

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