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Deconstructor Melee Modding Changes (Sisters of Parvos)


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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

The Sisters of Parvos update will bring three new Modular Hound Companions, each with a unique Melee weapon. While reviewing these Companion Weapons, we noticed the Helios-old problem that there’s a lot of Melee Mods that you can equip, but don’t really function on companion Melee. There’s also some ‘invisible gear hopping’ where if you put Mods on your Deconstructor (or Prime), the carry over to your Melee which is a many-year-old oversight we’ve lived with, but are approaching changes more thoroughly with this Update and as a result we’re patching up this behaviour. 

 

 

So a few questions here:
1. With how long it took to fix this, why are the other set mods not on the chopping block for this change like the vigilante set? It seems unfair to remove the interaction with melee mods, seeing as melee is receiving, what many believe, is a huge nerf, while leaving the primary interaction alone. I personally don't see that happening due to them benefiting from the mods. 
2. Why was this not posted in the main thread the other day? Is this a last minute thing? This is a big change for a lot of people basically using the sentinels as stat sticks. 
3. Will gladiator might be changed to work again in the future, should a companion melee weapon be released that has more critical focused stats? 

Edited by TheGuyver
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Just out of curiosity, will DE be addressing Riven Mods buffing Warframe abilities that scale off of stat-sticks? It seems to be in a similar vein to these current changes, but I've not seen anyone mention it in quite some time.

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46 minutes ago, Tuturuu23 said:

now everyone will use the immortal cat as companion lmao nice diversifying usage of things lol

Was already a panzer main before these nerfs. Guess who is never using any companion BESIDES panzer or smeeta ever again.

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8 minutes ago, Jarriaga said:

I hope they remove Riven scaling and in turn and let you mod those abilities separately. I'd be happy to pay a forma tax if it meant building Shattered Lash and Whipclaw without making my melee unusable for actual melee use.

You won’t be playing if statsticks abilities would get a different slot.

Think for a second how those warframes work,you woudn’t pay just a forma tax you would pay around 50% if not even more tax on damage output.

Just because the frame does not play you want it doesn’t mean is a bad design

 

At least stat sticks make really bad weapons used and wanted.

9 minutes ago, -AoN-CanoLathra- said:

Try looking at Amphis rivens with good statstick rolls. 1k+ at the busiest times.

Sure, a riven that's good for general use is dirt cheap, but not the ones with the stats the statsticks look for.

They are pretty cheap if your not looking into min maxing…you can get a groll statstick riven for 100 plat if you’re looking at any riven over 1.3 dispo

 

In conclusion

 Changing statsticks will bring the warframes that are created around them to their knees next to hydroid.The damage loss can’t be balanced through number pumping

Rivens and statsticks are another layer of moding,it allows you to optimize change and adapt(something that exalted weapons don’t).

If you don’t like a warframe as it has a statstick skills there are 50 frames to choose from…

 

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53 minutes ago, Uhkretor said:

This will most likely make people stop complaining about Sentinels when they're using them as stat sticks... Or not, people will still complain anyway.

I mean, I complain because they're considerably harder to keep alive through high-level content than other companions for no apparent reason, with many enemies that seem specifically tuned to assassinate them. This change does literally nothing to resolve the problems I have with them, so yeah I'm going to keep complaining (bear in mind that 99% of the time I don't even give my sentinel a weapon, so the stat stick argument is entirely divorced from my gripes).

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, (PSN)RuTweN said:

You won’t be playing if statsticks abilities would get a different slot.

Think for a second how those warframes work,you woudn’t pay just a forma tax you would pay around 50% if not even more tax on damage output.

Just because the frame does not play you want it doesn’t mean is a bad design

No, it would be a buff for me because I still add things like Primed Reach and Primed Fury to me melee so it doesn't become unusable for the sake of boosting the stats-stick ability.  As Voltage said: Sacrificing an entire weapon and mods for the sake of an ability is not healthy for the game. Abilities should require nothing more than mods.

This is something DE should have done years ago when they first did it for exalted weapons back in 2018; they should have made it the same for all exalted abilities back then rather than just the exalted weapons.

Edited by Jarriaga
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1 hour ago, Voltage said:

If you're going to fix these oversights, please fix stat sticks and Riven Mods affecting unrelated abilities and other sentinel weapons increasing the set bonus of other weapons (such as Vigilante). If Gladiator mods carrying over from my sentinel weapon to my melee is unintentional (which is a very fair oversight to fix), then so are Jaw Sword, Mire, Laser Rifle or any other Riven Mods affecting Landslide, Whipclaw, Shattered Lash, Vaporize, and other weapon abilities that scale off equipped mods. Likewise, removing the functional oversight for other set mods to benefit from sentinel weapons would be consistent and be a step toward solving the problem that arose in the first place.

The maximum potential of your abilities should absolutely not rely on a Riven disposition. Likewise, creating suboptimal weapon builds to "stat stick" for an ability is equally unhealthy for the player's arsenal. Allowing players to mod abilities separately like what was done to Exalted Blade and other exalted weapons is the best way to go for these problems.

Fixing Xoris back when it released (which was good for the game) while ignoring the root problem (allowing any mods to affect other items in your arsenal when not within the mod's description) has created the very inconsistency and "age-old" problem that builds up to be years old in the first place. 

I want to reiterate that this is a healthy change for the game, but you need to apply this consistently. The longer you ignore the scope of the whole problem, the worse it becomes.

how are rivens being a stat sticc affecting mod an oversight? you literally just said 'affected by equipped mods' while rivens are in effect an equipped mod.

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How about you stop nerfing things that don't make a huge impact on the game and focus on improving the stuff that is bad and or game breaking, instead of panic nerfing all of the things players CLEARLY enjoy using. That way it will stop creating all these new metas and players are free to just use what they want instead of what is the best. Its so annoying that the immediate response is to nerf stuff, instead of reworking or improving the things that are inferior. What is the hidden game plan with all these nerfs? It seems to me like all these nerfs are trying to make it harder for players to get plat, forcing us to buy it. Because if you have someone who can get a ton of plat from using really good synergies, they can say, farm Steel Essence really easily, trade it for kuva, roll rivs a lot, then sell those for plat, which potentially takes 1 person away from the plat buying market. (Btw I am very confident that is the reason SE and Khora were nerfed before and are nerfing it AGAIN this update, regardless of the frankly irrelevant and flimsy argument that she was too popular. Anyway.) But if you hobble that person by taking all of those synergies away, it suddenly makes it that much harder or inconvenient for them to farm those resources. I just have a strong gut feeling that a lot of these nerfs have to do w the in game plat economy and the way it affects DE's profits. Since its a F2P game, they make most of their money from players buying things like Prime Access and Plat Bundles, so they would have a vested interest in keeping those things popular and frequently sold. And as we all know, money is the driving force behind any business decision. They might say that they care about us as players, but then why keep beating us over the head with downgrades like this? Not just Gladiator mods but I mean all the previous nerfs that were un-needed. Like seriously? Maybe trust the feedback and advice from players who are on this game every single day and have mastered every aspect of it through extensive play, who really care about the game and not just how much money can be earned from it, which is more than I can say for some people on your team who just don't seem to care much.

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3 minutes ago, Jarriaga said:

No, it would be a buff for me because I still add things like Primed Reach and Primed Fury to me melee so it doesn't become unusable for the sake of boosting the stats-stick ability.  As Voltage said: Sacrificing an entire weapon and mods for the sake of an ability is not healthy for the game. Abilities should require nothing more than mods.

Again,you don’t understand the way the statstick frames are meant to be played.

Stastick frames are casters,if played right you don’t need to use any weapon.

It’s 3 warframes…is doesn’t affect the health of the game you have close to 50 to choose from…asking for changes on frames that you don’t understand on the other hand,is not healthy for the game

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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Hi Tenno,

The Sisters of Parvos update will bring three new Modular Hound Companions, each with a unique Melee weapon. While reviewing these Companion Weapons, we noticed the Helios-old problem that there’s a lot of Melee Mods that you can equip, but don’t really function on companion Melee. There’s also some ‘invisible gear hopping’ where if you put Mods on your Deconstructor (or Prime), the carry over to your Melee which is a many-year-old oversight we’ve lived with, but are approaching changes more thoroughly with this Update and as a result we’re patching up this behaviour. 

These are mostly Mods that deal with combos or heavy attacks, since Companions do not have these features as well as other certain outliers. As a result the following Mods will be incompatible with the upcoming three Hound weapons and retroactively will no longer work with the Deconstructor and Deconstructor Prime:

  • Amalgam Organ Shatter
  • Corrupt Charge
  • Enduring Strike
  • Body Count
  • Blood Rush
  • Dispatch Overdrive
  • Drifting Contact
  • Energy Channel
  • Finishing Touch
  • Focus Energy
  • Focused Defense
  • Guardian Derision
  • Killing Blow
  • Life Strike
  • Maiming Strike
  • Parry
  • Quickening
  • Reflex Coil
  • Relentless Combination
  • Seismic Wave
  • True Punishment
  • Weeping Wounds
     

 

  • Gladiator Might
  • Gladiator Rush
  • Gladiator Vice
  • Carnis Mandible
  • Jugulus Barbs
  • Saxum Thorax
  • Motus Impact
  • Proton Snap
  • Tek Gravity
  • Strain Infection

Amazing changes. While dev team are on it, the whole "stat stick" situation would be fixed if every single warframe ability that get some benefit from melee could be modded in the same way that exalted abilities are. Please, consider it.

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I can't wait for a Vulpaphyla nerf too.

Inb4 "we thought the immortal functionality of these infested foxes (cat reskins) was too strong and made the only option for players who wanted to retain vacuum functionality without a second thought. So now, Vulpaphylas take 10 minutes to return from fox sentinel state (curiously does not function with color options of the loadout still) and by default cannot have vacuum range extend beyond 1m with a max rank fetch. Have fun, Tenno"

I'm also expecting 5 forma for each sister hound.

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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:
  • Gladiator Might
  • Gladiator Rush
  • Gladiator Vice
  • Carnis Mandible
  • Jugulus Barbs
  • Saxum Thorax

Nooooo...

In all seriousness though, that means Helios is no longer useful. Another Sentinel for the heap of useless things.

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Ok so hold up. Let me get this straight. A day before the update drops you decide to "fix" some interactions with some mods.
Is this supposed to be a joke or something? You think most people don't realize that you are literally just nerfing the remaining exalted weapons?
Or even more, that we can't see you are removing our ability to "burn" our sentienel slot to make bloodrush be as effective as before?
Yeah sure, let's just nerf Baruuk, Excalibur, Wukong and Valkyr for no reason! Surely nothing of value was lost.

Yet... isn't it weird how we can still use rivens as statsticks like on Khora and Atlas? Oh how dare we change the fact that rivens are applying, right?
If this is the nerf we are getting, can we at least remove the rule of acolyte mods not being able to be equipped on exalted weapons then? That sounds like a fair trade to me. It's not like Exalted melee is any better than normal melee in most situations.

Anyways, I am very dissapointed with the change. Not because its a nerf. It's because you are not admiting its a nerf. And you are not being consistent about it either.

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So, huh, can you nerf the immortal cats while you're at it? This nerf with destroy the last little bit of companion diversity we had, and the immortal cats will show up as the most used companion and, because you seem to think this way, need a nerf.

Just do it now, and save us all the wait... Thanks!

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hace 1 hora, [DE]Rebecca dijo:

The Sisters of Parvos update will bring three new Modular Hound Companions, each with a unique Melee weapon. While reviewing these Companion Weapons, we noticed the Helios-old problem that there’s a lot of Melee Mods that you can equip, but don’t really function on companion Melee. There’s also some ‘invisible gear hopping’ where if you put Mods on your Deconstructor (or Prime), the carry over to your Melee which is a many-year-old oversight we’ve lived with, but are approaching changes more thoroughly with this Update and as a result we’re patching up this behaviour. 

Congratz , so now will you fix NPC lack of AI , map cliping , weapon and wf cliping animations , addons that aren't aligned on wfs ... the 3rd orb mother , raids , fix to eidolon flash bangs -like effects and the long list that is actualy 200 pages long ?

 

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46 minutes ago, (PSN)RuTweN said:

If you are planning on fixing oversights…maybe you should look at fixing all the pets and make them viable.

Look at smeeta usage compared to other pets…

They are not gonna make other companions better.

They gonna nerf smeeta... 🤣

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