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Helminth once again frustrates veterans.


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Just look at the early adopters for railjack. We got our 6 million credits, then tons of refunded resources plus rush drones. DE is capable of handling the retro active refund. They choose not to this time. I don't care either way. It's not like the helminth is a system demanding enough to want those 'lost' affinity or those 'lost' resources spent feeding the thing. Just seems like lots of tenno have buyer remorse. Or at least in this case, 'spender's remorse.'

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On 2021-07-07 at 10:40 PM, Tesseract7777 said:

) You are being ludicrously entitled, as are the others who went on my case on that thread. Its just silly.

I don’t think he is, in fact I kinda wish they would let xp be carried over in specific amounts if they do stuff like this in the future. While it’s a reasonable argument that OP is making, overall as someone who could and does care less about the system it’s not that big of a deal to me

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37 minutes ago, (PSN)jaggerwanderer said:

Just look at the early adopters for railjack. We got our 6 million credits, then tons of refunded resources plus rush drones. DE is capable of handling the retro active refund. They choose not to this time. I don't care either way. It's not like the helminth is a system demanding enough to want those 'lost' affinity or those 'lost' resources spent feeding the thing. Just seems like lots of tenno have buyer remorse. Or at least in this case, 'spender's remorse.'

They didnt give 1:1 Resources used. So they gave a sizeable quantity.

And they never refunded XP. Which is what the helminth case is.

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11 hours ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

One of the many reasons the helminth was introduced was because actual players kept saying "What am I supposed to do with all these resources? We need a resource sink."

Farming some plat and buying both 30 day boosters started to put me at the point where I was saying the same thing, and I'm not even a vet.

Yea, those few people who are bored - their attitude won't apply to everyone, I guess? ;)

There are still some people who don't like wasting stuff. Taking one's option doesn't justify the cause. Giving the overflowing affinity, as this isn't a plain simple leveling system like the people arguing here with MMO logic ... players are literally destroying items to get affinity/exp/whateveryouwannacallit, this could be accumulated and applied to everything else.

DE even gave back resources, whenever they caused a script failure. So they are capable of using simplified json queries, yet they deny to do the same with the helminth system. I guess you get what I am trying to point here, and probably many others too.

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13 hours ago, Hypernaut1 said:

40 capacity is just endgame busy work....

Ahh, yes, lets focus on a sarcastic remark (which you didn't even understand) and not the rest of the posts concerning the actuall topic. If you have nothing to add besides a strawman, then remain silent.

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46 minutes ago, iHeuksal said:

Yea, those few people who are bored - their attitude won't apply to everyone, I guess? ;)

There are still some people who don't like wasting stuff. Taking one's option doesn't justify the cause. Giving the overflowing affinity, as this isn't a plain simple leveling system like the people arguing here with MMO logic ... players are literally destroying items to get affinity/exp/whateveryouwannacallit, this could be accumulated and applied to everything else.

DE even gave back resources, whenever they caused a script failure. So they are capable of using simplified json queries, yet they deny to do the same with the helminth system. I guess you get what I am trying to point here, and probably many others too.

The helminth was meant for those bored vets. It was gonna be for MR 15 and up but was changed to MR 8.

You're not even gonna actually use all those extra helminth abilities all at once right away. You just want something because it's new and you don't have it yet.

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7 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

You're not even gonna actually use all those extra helminth abilities all at once right away. You just want something because it's new and you don't have it yet.

Honestly, this could have been resolved by just checking if someone had a non-prime frame mastered that wasn't still in their inventory and just given them the helminth ability. I can see why people might be salty about it. However, claiming you know his motivations, especially in some disparaging manner as you do, doesn't make any point for you nor invalidate his. It just reflects poorly on you. I know you're capable of making better points/arguments than this, but you'd rather troll. Disappointing.

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3 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

Honestly, this could have been resolved by just checking if someone had a non-prime frame mastered that wasn't still in their inventory and just given them the helminth ability. I can see why people might be salty about it. However, claiming you know his motivations, especially in some disparaging manner as you do, doesn't make any point for you nor invalidate his. It just reflects poorly on you. I know you're capable of making better points/arguments than this, but you'd rather troll. Disappointing.

Why would someone need an automatic maxed helminth in day 1?

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1 minute ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

Why would someone need an automatic maxed helminth in day 1?

They don't. These wouldn't have to give exp. The salt comes from having to farm a base frame a second time due to this issue in the Helminth system. Idgaf about the helminth exp, personally, as it just levels up naturally through use, and there's plenty to use it for. I would want access to the abilities for frames I already farmed (and sold) years ago, though.

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1 hour ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

The helminth was meant for those bored vets. It was gonna be for MR 15 and up but was changed to MR 8.

You're not even gonna actually use all those extra helminth abilities all at once right away. You just want something because it's new and you don't have it yet.

I actually want nothing of the entirety of that abilities available past Rank 10. I am just a completist and this nonsense of failing in accumulating simple SQL tables, where this was possible in the past, is just beyond common sense.

Before preassuming anything further, just stop arguing with me.

I am a bored vet, but not as braindead as others.

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2 minutes ago, iHeuksal said:

I actually want nothing of the entirety of that abilities available past Rank 10. I am just a completist and this nonsense of failing in accumulating simple SQL tables, where this was possible in the past, is just beyond common sense.

Before preassuming anything further, just stop arguing with me.

I am a bored vet, but not as braindead as others.

Being a completionist is a choice. I can go full Karen and say I'm a completionist so therefore I deserve access to primed sure footed and anything I want.

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13 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

Being a completionist is a choice. I can go full Karen and say I'm a completionist so therefore I deserve access to primed sure footed and anything I want.

Completionist or no, locking those behind daily logins was a terrible choice. I actually do think those should be accessible by other means.

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Myyyy goooood... there still are children crying and whinning and screaming here ? 

And for what ?

You used an inconcequential amount of useless ressources into helminth, you gained the benefits from it, but oh no, oh my god the humanity... you did not get the 5 new levels of helminth that came out months later...

It's not like if those levels gave nearly useless abilities, it's not like if you could farm those levels in a couple days (if not 10 minutes if you have sentient stuff to dump), it's not like if you could get those levels in a week simply by doing the invigoration thingy... right ?

Imagine that a game does not give you instantly a chunk of an update because you played beyond max level for a bit... I mean, all those guys that ran Ragnaros for months, they were given max level when burning crusade came out right ? Why would devs ever want players to play their game right ?

 

Seriously, I have seen such nonsense pathetic arguments... one of my favorite was "b-b-b-but we had to destroy ressources !"...

Yeah buddy, it's so terrible, how are you gonna do it without those nanospores ? If only there was a way to get a ton of helminth ressources at all times, no matter what you play and in large quantities.... oh wait, there is a way, I think it's called "playing litteraly any mission for 10 minutes".

Why not go one step further then ? I have played hundreds of hours with weapons at max level and without a lens, therefore, I DEMAND that all the next weapons I get receive that overkill xp. I have spent hundreds of hours on nodes that I already completed, so I DEMAND that all further node added to the starchart be instantly completed for me. Why not after all right ? Sounds legit right ?

That's really something, when people can be SO lazy and entitled that such a thread can stay up for so long, trully pathetic.

Now stop crying like insufferable children and let this nonsense thread die already.

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Sure, we didnt get xp retroactively but with invigorations there are easy new ways to gain xp. At first I was a bit reserved with invigorations but now I enjoy them quite a bit. Then again the new helminth abilities dont really excite me all that much, so for me personally it didnt feel like I was missing anything.

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So I waited until I hit rank 15 to decide if I was a "frustrated veteran player" I am not. I did not grind the 5 ranks out I merely added my Gara did a few invigorations and swapped out some abilities that I wanted to play around with and hit rank 15 with no issues what so ever.

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50 minutes ago, Fallen77 said:

What else does it cost ?

That's just it. It has nothing to do with cost. The problem (if there is one) is that many of us played for years before this system and there was nothing to use our non-Prime frames for, so we sold them for a tiny sum of measly credits because we needed the Warframe slot more. Then this system came out and we have to re-farm those frames again instead of already having those ones subsumed retroactively. For most frames, this actually isn't a big deal. Some of them are a huge PITA though.

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il y a 3 minutes, FrostDragoon a dit :

That's just it. It has nothing to do with cost. The problem (if there is one) is that many of us played for years before this system and there was nothing to use our non-Prime frames for, so we sold them for a tiny sum of measly credits because we needed the Warframe slot more. Then this system came out and we have to re-farm those frames again instead of already having those ones subsumed retroactively. For most frames, this actually isn't a big deal. Some of them are a huge PITA though.

Oh the humanity...

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8 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

That's just it. It has nothing to do with cost. The problem (if there is one) is that many of us played for years before this system and there was nothing to use our non-Prime frames for, so we sold them for a tiny sum of measly credits because we needed the Warframe slot more. Then this system came out and we have to re-farm those frames again instead of already having those ones subsumed retroactively. For most frames, this actually isn't a big deal. Some of them are a huge PITA though.

You can sell 2 syndicate augments or really any number of things to get a slot.

Simaris blueprints were lowered to 50k, and the still obvious fact that the 1st helminth wasn't supposed to be maxed on day 1. 

And....DE still gave people a month to farm those extra frames beforehand.

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1 hour ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

You can sell 2 syndicate augments or really any number of things to get a slot.

Simaris blueprints were lowered to 50k, and the still obvious fact that the 1st helminth wasn't supposed to be maxed on day 1. 

And....DE still gave people a month to farm those extra frames beforehand.

It does nothing for the people who played before Helminth existed. That's the point people keep missing here. It was a slap in the face to veterans. A few players are calling it out for the obvious issue. Others here just say, "Hit me harder, DadDE!"

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On 2021-07-26 at 8:55 AM, (PSN)JustJoshinEnt said:

Why do you, and other posters like yourself, always make the baseless assumption that the PROFESSIONAL GAME DEVS that've kept a F2P game going on multiple platforms for over 8 years DIDN'T "give it some thought" before updating?

you would be suprised how often "PROFESSIONAL GAME DEVS" forget exactly THAT... and i can tell you this exactly because on my daily working experience. not say that they all are scatterbrained at work but far too many (imo) are far too often. most problematic are those who thought themself 'artists' and not so much software engineers - dealing with those is often like dealing with divas and when it comes to technical procedures you sometimes wish to strangle them... sadly (or luckily, depending on ones point of view) they also are often damn talented in the other parts of the job, so firing their arses is usually a bad idea.

On 2021-07-26 at 8:55 AM, (PSN)JustJoshinEnt said:

More likely is that they DID give it thought, and decided ANYWAY to proceed, and YOU just don't like the outcome. 

i partly agree aith that but if you are around here as long as your profile say, you should remember a lot of 'incidents' where they either did not or came previously to a very bad decision that they soon after (always AFTER releasing what they might have though a good idea) had to rectify again... ofc, it sure is a difficult thing to predict how some changes/contend will be recived with userbase and that's usually why there are closed and open beta versions to be tested by as many people as possible before it gets released but sometimes DE did things that were so obviously to get negative respond, that i can only say what i did. with a complete new 'product' that wouldn't be suprising at all but after all the years and a forum where many player do voice their opinions (be they whatever they are) DE should have at least a certain feeling about what goes and what will very likely sink to the ground.

On 2021-07-26 at 8:55 AM, (PSN)JustJoshinEnt said:

And you're allowed your opinion, of course...  but to make such accusations as fact, with so much conviction based on nothing but your own opinion... seems like a poor way to start a conversation.

ther wasn't any 'accusations' at all - only observations and they weren't based on my opinion (alone) but on years of experience of this one product here and because of my own working in a very similar business. if that isn't enough for you as a base for conservation, i wonder what is...

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1 hour ago, FrostDragoon said:

That's just it. It has nothing to do with cost. The problem (if there is one) is that many of us played for years before this system and there was nothing to use our non-Prime frames for, so we sold them for a tiny sum of measly credits because we needed the Warframe slot more. Then this system came out and we have to re-farm those frames again instead of already having those ones subsumed retroactively. For most frames, this actually isn't a big deal. Some of them are a huge PITA though.

And?

People decided, completely on their own, to sell the frames.
Hek people were selling some frames back before simaris offered their  BPs making them impossible to farm up again.
It was their choice when there were other choices available to them.

Its not like its some massively huge inconvenience.
Its not like it takes you any longer than it does anyone else to complete the system.

Further part of the goal of the system was to be a resource drain for vets....and that can't very well happen if they go "Yeah....lets just give everything in the system to vets for free without having to ever intact with the system in any way what-so-ever!!!!!"

You're acting like it is some huge monumental effort needed to get the frames for subsumption when that simply isn't true.
You're acting like it is some huge massive effort needed to make sure you have slots and everything to deal with Helminth when that simply isn't true either (Since you can just have frames sitting in the foundry waiting to be collected and immediately subsumed).

26 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

It does nothing for the people who played before Helminth existed. That's the point people keep missing here. It was a slap in the face to veterans. A few players are calling it out for the obvious issue. Others here just say, "Hit me harder, DadDE!"

Except that its not a "slap in the face" at all.
Nothing in Helminth hurts or damages your prior experiences and achievements and progression.
Nothing in Helminth is easier for a newer player than an established vet.
Nothing in Helminth takes a shorter amount of time for a newer player than an established vet.
If any of those things were the other way around then you might have a point on it being a "slap in the face"

Further your "solution" just creates more problems and inequities.
What about the players that are collectors and want to have both normal and prime variants?  Why should they have to farm up the frame all over again to give to Helminth when people who just sold their frames get all that for free?
And so on and so on and so on.

None of the helminth system is a "slap in the face" to vets.

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3 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

snip

Your points--and especially your tone--tell me that you're one of those "Hit me harder, dadDE" types. I can't respect your views on the matter as they are completely nonsensical. Further, you keep attempting to make character attributions to me instead of seeing what the problem is. As long as that's the case, your opinion has less worth to me than a new player who has absolutely no clue how anything works, because at least they are still innocent in their ignorance.

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