Ash

[SenorClipClop]

8 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

Bladestorm's waggle

In fairness it's more of a sweep now. They buffed it so three marks are applied to an enemy all at once.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

4 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

What's the advantage of Ash, then? The others didn't requires such an extensive efforts like as making the stitches on the battlefield and makes the better result on the same time.

The advantage is you can hit single targets much harder, survive more easily etc. And on top of that you don't seem to be understanding that variety is good. It doesn't have to better, it just has to be different. Just because it doesn't appeal specifically to you, doesn't mean others don't use him. You don't see him in public often becauae he's more of a solo frame, kinda like how there are players that love Ivara despite her being slow to play missions with.

[DroopingPuppy]

Just now, -CdG-Zilchy said:

The advantage is you can hit single targets much harder, survive more easily etc. And on top of that you don't seem to be understanding that variety is good. It doesn't have to better, it just has to be different. Just because it doesn't appeal specifically to you, doesn't mean others don't use him. You don't see him in public often becauae he's more of a solo frame, kinda like how there are players that love Ivara despite her being slow to play missions with.

Isn't Gara or Khora can do the same thing with better performance? Simply spamming 1 seems much easier than aiming Bladestorm one by one, while provides good power even on end game contents. And more importantly, you ignore the fact that the enemy is almost countless and you need to keep killing the enemy rather than AoS styled game that your opponent has the same number as your team.

[LillyRaccune]

7 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

What's the advantage of Ash, then?

Originally Finisher attacks were crazy lethal. Then Ash was nerfed (and/or Ash's 4), then daggers were nerfed, then Covert Lethality was nerfed...  Now Impact status proc and Parazon kills are the new finisher kills.

What's the advantage of Ash? Looks like awesome ninja... in a "space pirate, magical girl anime" fighting game.

RIP Ash.

3 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

And on top of that you don't seem to be understanding that variety is good.

That's true. The Helminth invigorations are making that easier too. I know Baruuk is powerful, but I don't use him much. 1000 armor and +200% ability strength (seems overkill) made using him fun while I'm still learning to fight effectively.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

12 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

Isn't Gara or Khora can do the same thing with better performance? Simply spamming 1 seems much easier than aiming Bladestorm one by one, while provides good power even on end game contents. And more importantly, you ignore the fact that the enemy is almost countless and you need to keep killing the enemy rather than AoS styled game that your opponent has the same number as your team.

Tell ya what, go hit a lvl 9999 demolyst with Khora, let me know how it goes. I don't know how long you've been playing but when your time ticks over the 6000 hour mark perhaps you'll realise that there's more than 1 way to play and you might want to try other frames and weapons. Case in point, I did all of Steel Path with Nova and a Rubico Prime and Kronen prime. Was it fast using a sniper rifle? No. Was it fun? Yep. Can Wukong go fast like Nova with less effort? Yes. So why use Nova? Because it's more fun for me. If you stick to meta only, well that's boring but if you enjoy that go right ahead. And guess what, people enjoy Ash as he is also. Now go kill that demolyst for me with Khora. *hint* you won't be able to.

Also since when do endless enemies cause a problem? It's called CC, use it.

[DroopingPuppy]

2 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Tell ya what, go hit a lvl 9999 demolyst with Khora, let me know how it goes. I don't know how long you've been playing but when your time ticks over the 6000 hour mark perhaps you'll realise that there's more than 1 way to play and you might want to try other frames and weapons. Case in point, I did all of Steel Path with Nova and a Rubico Prime and Kronen prime. Was it fast using a sniper rifle? No. Was it fun? Yep. Can Wukong go fast like Nova with less effort? Yes. So why use Nova? Because it's more fun for me. If you stick to meta only, well that's boring but if you enjoy that go right ahead. And guess what, people enjoy Ash as he is also. Now go kill that demolyst for me with Khora. *hint* you won't be able to.

Also since when do endless enemies cause a problem? It's called CC, use it.

Yes, it proves that Ash is not a good choice then. Your personal fun does not proves that it is good. Perhaps your own hands and eyes are able to handle such a punishment, but don't expect that everyone can endure such a painful experience.

And why you use Ash since you need a CC frame for you need to aim Bladestorm one by one but you have countless of enemy, sir?

 

 

[PublikDomain]

22 minutes ago, SenorClipClop said:

In fairness it's more of a sweep now. They buffed it so three marks are applied to an enemy all at once.

I might have to dust Ash off and take another look.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

27 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

Yes, it proves that Ash is not a good choice then. Your personal fun does not proves that it is good. Perhaps your own hands and eyes are able to handle such a punishment, but don't expect that everyone can endure such a painful experience.

And why you use Ash since you need a CC frame for you need to aim Bladestorm one by one but you have countless of enemy, sir?

 

 

How does that prove it's not a good choice lol. It's not a good choice for the easy missions you play, someone who plays endless disruption for example, might disagree. Do you understand yet? You seem stuck on the mindset of "moar powa = better". It depends entirely on the mission type, the skill level of the player and the preferred playstyle of the player. 

Let me put it a different way. Say you like beer. But your local alcohol store sells beer AND wine. Well why do they bother with selling wine if beer is obviously better to you? Could it be that people's opinions vary on what they do and don't like the same things or value them the same way?

And again even CC is subjective, not all missions have endless enemies lol. And they're very easy to kill en masse with just about any frame anyway. 

[DroopingPuppy]

15 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

How does that prove it's not a good choice lol. It's not a good choice for the easy missions you play, someone who plays endless disruption for example, might disagree. Do you understand yet? You seem stuck on the mindset of "moar powa = better". It depends entirely on the mission type, the skill level of the player and the preferred playstyle of the player. 

Let me put it a different way. Say you like beer. But your local alcohol store sells beer AND wine. Well why do they bother with selling wine if beer is obviously better to you? Could it be that people's opinions vary on what they do and don't like the same things or value them the same way?

And again even CC is subjective, not all missions have endless enemies lol. And they're very easy to kill en masse with just about any frame anyway. 

It proves that you prefer Ash just because you like it, not because it is actually 'better'.

If simply more power is better then Ash may had a place, but it isn't. At least we all know that the damage output of Bladestorm is good, but that's not the point. The problem is you need considerable efforts to actually use it in the real games, while the other frames does the same or better by more easier ways. At least no one needs such 'mark' in order to attack something. Else did you want to kill the enemy by the scan? As if all the enemies are the target of the synthesis scan?

Also not all missions are endless, but if you really need to kill much and required to have such high damage outputs on non-endless missions? At least for extermination? But your weapon does it faster.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

10 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

It proves that you prefer Ash just because you like it, not because it is actually 'better'.

If simply more power is better then Ash may had a place, but it isn't. At least we all know that the damage output of Bladestorm is good, but that's not the point. The problem is you need considerable efforts to actually use it in the real games, while the other frames does the same or better by more easier ways. At least no one needs such 'mark' in order to attack something. Else did you want to kill the enemy by the scan? As if all the enemies are the target of the synthesis scan?

Also not all missions are endless, but if you really need to kill much and required to have such high damage outputs on non-endless missions? At least for extermination? But your weapon does it faster.

You still seem stuck on the idea that "more easy = better for everyone" which is false. It's better for YOU. It's less fun for others, how is that a hard concept to grasp for you?

[DroopingPuppy]

1 minute ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

You still seem stuck on the idea that "more easy = better for everyone" which is false. It's better for YOU. It's less fun for others, how is that a hard concept to grasp for you?

If you gain something with some efforts, while the other requires ridiculously complex tasks but the result is the same or similar, then what do you say something other than that?

[-CdG-Zilchy]

18 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

If you gain something with some efforts, while the other requires ridiculously complex tasks but the result is the same or similar, then what do you say something other than that?

I would say that I find things that are more challenging to be fun and I'm not the only one. Whereas playing in a brainless manner quickly makes me want to logoff before I fall asleep. 

Again the concept of people having fun in different ways seems to elude you entirely.

[White_Matter]

I don't think Ash needs his ultimate rerolled back  to what it was.  As an Ash main player, I hated it back in the day. Way back in the day where you had to insert abilities like mods, I didn't even have it on.

I think the solution to make Ash great again is simple. Buff his base stats a notch, maybe add a more useful passive, and change the mechanics of the shuriken. Make it similar to Vauban's 2 or Ivara's 1. Tap to cycle between different shuriken(armor stripping, explosive, slash, etc.) and hold to use. 

Also rework his useless aguments while at it.

[(PSN)thowed]

My most used frame.  But I also play solo alot.  He's great for solo liches, void storms, demos bounties etc.  Anything that's not a defend objective mission.  I always laugh at topics where people are complaining about how hard things are and I know how easy they become with Ash.  Then those same people say he sucks, ironic I know.  I second bringing back the old 4th, only because I'd take anything to see less Wukong at this point (talk about something that actually deserves a nerf based on usage numbers).

[Rakosta_Kai]

15 hours ago, Speerel said:

I would like to bring back his lazy 4th ability so that he becomes more popular.

That's not going to happen given the fact that DE changed it due to complaints from players in the first place.

Likewise, the new version of Blade Storm glitches less which I am sure DE sees as another benefit.

That said, Ash's nuke was the slowest in the game compared to the aoe nukes from other frames even though it was (imo) vastly more fun.

I'd rather they plug that amount of time and attention into Hydroid because Ash is in a great (albeit slightly more clunky) place all things considered. 

[DroopingPuppy]

It doesn't need to be the old bladestorm. What it needs is just make it usable.

[(XBOX)InductiveBag46]

Ash is great, just because you don't see him often doesn't mean people don't play him

[mrpyro12345678]

Me with Ash (default): I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROOOOOACHING

PROVOOOOOOOKING

BLACK CLOUDS IN ISOLATIOOOOOOOON

I AM RECLAIMER OF MY NAAAAAAAAAAAAME

BORN IN FLAMES

I HAVE BEEN BLESSED

MY FAMILY CREST IS A DEMON OF DEAAAAAATH

Yeah he's very fun to play with, especially with Bury the Light in the background.

Decent speed, and his 4 is still really good against swarms of enemies, literally Judgement Cut in my build.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

3 hours ago, DroopingPuppy said:

It doesn't need to be the old bladestorm. What it needs is just make it usable.

Finally home and able to check profile for context here. You have less than 150 kills with Ash, how one earth would you know? Take a look at the players above saying they use Ash cos he's fun. I suggest sticking to talking about frames you actually know something about.

[Redfeather75]

6 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Finally home and able to check profile for context here. You have less than 150 kills with Ash, how one earth would you know? Take a look at the players above saying they use Ash cos he's fun. I suggest sticking to talking about frames you actually know something about.

How do you check profiles? Do you mean typing a players name here in game lets you see their stats? 😯

[(XBOX)Hyperion Rexx]

Ash is worth it just for his passive alone.   Makes him god tier against SP grineer. 

[DroopingPuppy]

32 minutes ago, Redfeather75 said:

How do you check profiles? Do you mean typing a players name here in game lets you see their stats? 😯

If I remember correctly it is possible, perhaps you may check the 'friend' menu or something else to check it.

[S1mplyFresh]

19 hours ago, (PSN)CommanderC2121 said:

 

That wont make him popular, especially nowadays. Neither damage nor (as some people claim) clunkiness his true issue, its his speed. Simply put, he is too slow.

Lol, one of the worst takes in these forums I have ever read.

You don't know how to build or play him. Simple as that. Or you're just not good at the game.

[DroopingPuppy]

41 minutes ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Finally home and able to check profile for context here. You have less than 150 kills with Ash, how one earth would you know? Take a look at the players above saying they use Ash cos he's fun. I suggest sticking to talking about frames you actually know something about.

Yep Ash wasn't my favorate frame, but I do have some chances to test it, especially for the Bladestorm change and I did try it to have seen how ridiculous it is.

[Redfeather75]

2 minutes ago, DroopingPuppy said:

If I remember correctly it is possible, perhaps you may check the 'friend' menu or something else to check it.

I think I got it figured out. I never thought to check people's in game profiles but it works. 😯