Tenet Diplos: So close to perfection

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

Let me start off by saying that I love the Tenet Diplos. They are my new favorite secondaries. And I'm making a feedback post in the hopes that I can raise awareness to DE and get them buffed, because there is a gleaming issue holding them back: the special effect they were built on.

Aiming down sights to mark enemies and launch a burst of homing projectiles is fine to me, but only two shots are fired per marked target and the homing shots have no difference in stats to the hipfire shots; this essentially forces you to only shoot an enemy twice, something that is odd & clunky at best (standard star chart content) and useless & detrimental at its worst (Higher level content and/or anything against armor).

There are two ways to fix the Tenet Diplos:

1.) You can remove the cap of how many bullets you can fire per target. This would allow players to lock onto enemies they want to focus down, hold the fire button as they maintain line of sight, and make the room swim full of energy bees with murderous intentions.

2.) You can give the homing projectiles a boost in stats. This buff is less preferable compared to the idea listed above, but would still help the Diplos a lot. If players are going to be forced to only shoot two enemies per shot while launching the homing burst, then there should be more stats to back it up. Maybe an increase in critical stats and damage specifically while aiming down sights, and it reverts to normal upon hip firing.

Another issue with the Diplos seems to be more of a bug that a design flaw. Shooting homing projectiles at specific enemies will cause the projectiles to miss, and proceed to spin right 'round the marked target (baby right round) like a record player until the projectiles hit their intended mark, or (the most likely case) despawn without hurting anything.

Let me say again that I love the Tenet Diplos, and I'm happy I was able to get my greasy little Equinox Prime hands on a pair of these gems. However, the issues that I found with them are not limited to just being experienced by me. Seriously, I searched "Tenet Diplos warframe forums" on Google, and found three posts with negative sounding titles that provide the same ideas of buffs as mine.

We worked hard to obtain and build our briefcase guns, and the homing projectiles that should be beneficial to us just won't hold up in higher level content unless we are given a better quantity or quantity of angry energy bees.

[MJ12]

I would love it if they removed the per-target cap because the Diplos are fun as hell and have perfectly fine stats but the homing projectile mode is really wonky and clunky. Definitely agree with this suggestion.

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

2 hours ago, MJ12 said:

the Diplos are fun as hell and have perfectly fine stats but the homing projectile mode is really wonky and clunky. Definitely agree with this suggestion.

I think DE is afraid of buffing the Diplos just because they fire homing projectiles, although we have several different weapons and tools with homing projectiles that don't break game balance.

They don't even need to touch the stats. Just remove the per-target cap, and they'll be alright

[(NSW)Titan611]

On 2021-07-09 at 6:39 AM, (XBOX)HollowCube987 said:

Let me start off by saying that I love the Tenet Diplos. They are my new favorite secondaries. And I'm making a feedback post in the hopes that I can raise awareness to DE and get them buffed, because there is a gleaming issue holding them back: the special effect they were built on.

Aiming down sights to mark enemies and launch a burst of homing projectiles is fine to me, but only two shots are fired per marked target and the homing shots have no difference in stats to the hipfire shots; this essentially forces you to only shoot an enemy twice, something that is odd & clunky at best (standard star chart content) and useless & detrimental at its worst (Higher level content and/or anything against armor).

There are two ways to fix the Tenet Diplos:

1.) You can remove the cap of how many bullets you can fire per target. This would allow players to lock onto enemies they want to focus down, hold the fire button as they maintain line of sight, and make the room swim full of energy bees with murderous intentions.

2.) You can give the homing projectiles a boost in stats. This buff is less preferable compared to the idea listed above, but would still help the Diplos a lot. If players are going to be forced to only shoot two enemies per shot while launching the homing burst, then there should be more stats to back it up. Maybe an increase in critical stats and damage specifically while aiming down sights, and it reverts to normal upon hip firing.

Another issue with the Diplos seems to be more of a bug that a design flaw. Shooting homing projectiles at specific enemies will cause the projectiles to miss, and proceed to spin right 'round the marked target (baby right round) like a record player until the projectiles hit their intended mark, or (the most likely case) despawn without hurting anything.

Let me say again that I love the Tenet Diplos, and I'm happy I was able to get my greasy little Equinox Prime hands on a pair of these gems. However, the issues that I found with them are not limited to just being experienced by me. Seriously, I searched "Tenet Diplos warframe forums" on Google, and found three posts with negative sounding titles that provide the same ideas of buffs as mine.

We worked hard to obtain and build our briefcase guns, and the homing projectiles that should be beneficial to us just won't hold up in higher level content unless we are given a better quantity or quantity of angry energy bees.

I have diplos and was very disappointed in them. I also find the homing content of them problematic. a change id like to see would be a lock on slow with a targeting retical increase in size. I would refer you to the workings of the smart pistol from Titanfall 1. I probably spent 15 zenith coins trying to get my diplos to spawn on my candidate. Then the hours to get it to be bummed out. That said love pretty much all the other content in the sisters of parvos way to go.

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

4 hours ago, (NSW)Titan611 said:

a change id like to see would be a lock on slow with a targeting retical increase in size. I would refer you to the workings of the smart pistol from Titanfall 1.

I had to look up what the Smart Gun was because I don't have Titanfall yet, but I watched a gun guide from Ahoy

I can agree that having the Diplos impliment more features that the smart gun has would be nice

[Retea45a]

POV:    Warframe got a new patch

Tenet Diplos rework:

 

 

[(XBOX)KayAitch]

16 hours ago, (XBOX)HollowCube987 said:

20 hours ago, (NSW)Titan611 said:

a change id like to see would be a lock on slow with a targeting retical increase in size. I would refer you to the workings of the smart pistol from Titanfall 1.

I had to look up what the Smart Gun was because I don't have Titanfall yet, but I watched a gun guide from Ahoy

I loved the Smart Pistol from Titanfall. It's in the sequel too but only as a super weapon you briefly get on the last mission.

I really wish the Tenet Diplos was as good, and it feels similar on easy missions.

But yeah, it's busted because just shooting is always more effective (more DPS in less time) than locking on.

On 2021-07-09 at 12:39 PM, (XBOX)HollowCube987 said:

1.) You can remove the cap of how many bullets you can fire per target

Yes, this would be a big help.

Still lock on to up to 8 targets, then fire a bullet per target until you run out of clip.

On 2021-07-09 at 12:39 PM, (XBOX)HollowCube987 said:

2.) You can give the homing projectiles a boost in stats

I'd keep all stats but:

1) Homed in bullets target the head, not the body.

2) (optional) All shots have double the usual headshot multiplier.

Just having really reliable headshots opens a lot of options for Acolyte mods, Galvanized mods and Arcanes.

 

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

10 hours ago, Retea45a said:

POV:    Warframe got a new patch

Tenet Diplos rework:

 

 

That looks awesome. And in a way, we can already do this against anything that doesn't have armor.

If an enemy is high level and/or wearing so much as steel toe boots, the homing mode won't be better than just hipfiring because...

3 hours ago, (XBOX)KayAitch said:

just shooting is always more effective (more DPS in less time) than locking on

Also, the Diplos REQUIRES headshots to do damage instead of politely suggesting it, and they just can't get headshots from the homing bullets.

[FURYDANCE]

a proposed fix of this weapon would be to let the lock-on mode able to lock enemies on screen instead of enemies on the recticle.

 

as for the lock-on head issue, you can just lock and aim upwards, the bullets will bent down and probably land on your target's head 

[(PSN)DBR87]

I love the Tenet Diplos but the homing mechanic is actively trying to kill it for me. I ADS a lot in this game and can only assume many players do. So it is really irrating how the gimmick is forced on to me when I don't want to use it at times. If I am aim gliding I want to rain bullet hose hell down on my target. Not burst off two shots. The homing mechanic needs to be tied to the alt fire button. Warframe has an alt fire button so you can activate the alternate fire mode of guns so why are they not using it with these? It blows my mind to the point where I think they are forcing the homing mechanic on us because they know it doesn't even work on most flying enemies, you know, the highly mobile enemies you would want your bullets to lock on to.

I am glade people are finding ways to use the weapon but we really shouldn't be coming up with work around ways to bypass the mechanic or adjust to it's clunkyness. The DEvs should just fix it. Let us activate homing mode with the alt fire button so we can ADS on target and spray the whole magazine. It's so awkward I have to hip aim, hold trigger then ADS.

I really don't like how the homing mechanic is so clunky and directly tied to ADS.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb (PSN)DBR87:

I love the Tenet Diplos but the homing mechanic is actively trying to kill it for me. I ADS a lot in this game and can only assume many players do. So it is really irrating how the gimmick is forced on to me when I don't want to use it at times. If I am aim gliding I want to rain bullet hose hell down on my target. Not burst off two shots. The homing mechanic needs to be tied to the alt fire button. Warframe has an alt fire button so you can activate the alternate fire mode of guns so why are they not using it with these? It blows my mind to the point where I think they are forcing the homing mechanic on us because they know it doesn't even work on most flying enemies, you know, the highly mobile enemies you would want your bullets to lock on to.

I am glade people are finding ways to use the weapon but we really shouldn't be coming up with work around ways to bypass the mechanic or adjust to it's clunkyness. The DEvs should just fix it. Let us activate homing mode with the alt fire button so we can ADS on target and spray the whole magazine. It's so awkward I have to hip aim, hold trigger then ADS.

I really don't like how the homing mechanic is so clunky and directly tied to ADS.

Yes. devs could solve it better. Another problem is that the damage is rather small compared to other secondarie!

different tactics are needed here. example would be: headshots! because that way the players are more likely to choose other secondaries with more aoe / chain. it's just worth more!

[Crabopoulos-Michael]

I'm still investing/wasting forma in this weapon because I totally love the concept, shame it was so poorly executed. I still have faith it will get a fix or something, I just refuse to believe this was QA approved unless they test with lvl 5 enemies.

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

10 hours ago, (PSN)DBR87 said:

I love the Tenet Diplos but the homing mechanic is actively trying to kill it for me. I ADS a lot in this game and can only assume many players do. So it is really irrating how the gimmick is forced on to me when I don't want to use it at times.

I feel your pain. I am an impulsive ADSer, and will aim with any weapon (Even with something with bad accuracy, like a Kuva Bramma). How I bypass the homing mode is to pull the trigger first, and then aim down sights without releasing the fire button. That will allow you to full auto the Diplos and take advantage of reduced spread and ADS specific mods.

The reason the homing mode messes up so badly is because the Tenet Diplos is a weapon meant for sustained damage over time, not one-and-done burst damage. Forcing the Diplos to only shoot two shots per locked on target and expect them to kill with just those two shots is the equivalent of forcing a Vectis to shoot 10 rounds a second to maintain a buff. It just can't be done.

[GitGud66]

Bump I cannot let DE miss this. Tenet Diplos alt fire is INCREDIBLY clunky. Was there nobody play testing this? Why isn't the alt-fre full auto and why is there such a long delay between trigger pulls and lock-on reacquires? 

[JuGGaStyle]

I suggest that diplos would keep its lock after shooting so you can just keep clicking those bursts without delays until enemies die or you run out of bullets.

 

EDIT: here is a short clip of Tenet Diplos not being able to hit static camera 

 

[Ceryk]

For me, the problem with these is that the lock on doesn't stick. It feels REALLY clunky and slow because of that and makes the Buzzlok's clunky lock on feature seem really good. If they just changed it so the lock on stayed on until the enemies died, it would be great. Even just making it until the end of the magazine would be better. Homing bullets for one burst of damage is completely and utterly pointless in this game. Would be one thing if you had to lock on every time in a game where a bullet would take out like a quarter or half of an enemy's health or something, but this is a game where emptying entire magazines into an enemy isn't always enough to kill them. Lock on needs to better for this weapon's alt fire to be meaningful, especially since it goes for body shots apparently. The way it is now, I'd rather hip fire with the automatic mode... or better yet, use my Akstilletto that lets me aim with auto mode.

Addition:

Ammo efficiency in homing mode is abysmal and I think it goes beyond just lack of head shots. I went into the Simulacrum and spawned 5 level 100 gunners. Homing mode took ALL of my ammo and only killed 2 of them and took a really long time. Hip Fire took about half my ammo to kill all 5 with body shots and went pretty quickly. Headshots went very fast and I reloaded once and didn't use all of the second clip. Not sure if the homing mode does less damage or costs more ammo to use, but after testing it out, I see absolutely no reason whatsoever to ever use the homing mode on this weapon. Only reason I can think to use this weapon at all at this point is hip fire mode paired with the Envoy so you can have constantly switch for the holstered reload.

[NeonXray]

It would be good if the devs put the lock-on fire system in a proper alt-fire mode like the Sepulcrum and have the Diplos work in a bi-modal fashion.

Please DE, I want to use this gun, but it broken at the moment.

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

The biggest problem with it is that you cannot Fire while Locking-on and vice-versa.

that's a huge dps drop because you aren't shooting during the time you're aiming and locking.

 

Suggest: allow continuous fire of unguided bullets during aiming; if you sweep over an enemy and lock-on the bullets will just redirect while in-flight. Now there's no stuttering pauses of alternating between firing and locking. DPS will stay the same as hip-fire mode.

 

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

21 hours ago, Ceryk said:

Homing bullets for one burst of damage is completely and utterly pointless in this game.

The only time they got this to work was with the Sepulcrum. And the only reason why people tolerate it is because the Alt fire has high damage that scales with mods, and AOE.

The Diplos have neither on the homing projectiles. You are essentially shooting an enemy with the hipfire mode two times, for 28 base damage each, for two ammo per shot.

[Dariel]

I thought Diplos was bugged to hell and wanted to report it.
Then someone told me it was the way it is supposed to work.

Thought it was an amazing weapon but since the mechanics is so messed up with auto homing, it is not usable for me at all.
Pass until they move this homing to secondary fire or remove completely.

[PhenonIV]

On 2021-07-10 at 8:15 PM, (XBOX)HollowCube987 said:

I had to look up what the Smart Gun was because I don't have Titanfall yet, but I watched a gun guide from Ahoy

I can agree that having the Diplos impliment more features that the smart gun has would be nice

"Yet"

I know it isn't warframe related but titanfall 1 is completely unplayable due to the hacker situation and titanfall 2 is also experiencing extreme ddos and shutdown issues. 

I wouldn't count on it getting better anytime soon...

[ThomasK3d]

shut

[Brynslustafir]

I honestly hate the Diplos alt-fire mechanic. I'd rather have no alt-fire at all. The pitiful number of projectiles released and their poor accuracy make them less effective than normal fire and a flat-out annoyance during normal gameplay. Some of the Other Tenets have decent alt-fire, so I don't know why this one came out so bad. 

This weapon would perform better if it was literally just the Corpus Twin Grakata, with no alt-fire mechanics whatsoever. Of course, that will never happen because every Tenet weapon has to have a gimmick, so maybe we'll get lucky and someone will actually implement one of the suggestions in this thread. 

If they ever do go with the proposition of uncapping the number of projectiles, it might be worth right-clicking every now and again. As of right now, the Tenet Diplos is only viable for hipfire. 

Well, I say as of now, but it's been 2 months. 

[Ryme]

What is the intended application of the 2 shot fire burst of the lock-on mode? Especially at this stage of the game's power levels, when the meta largely revolves around burst aoe and high volume rapid fire attacks. What is the situation the design team though that a 2 shot plink would be uniquely effective over other options?  I almost want to ask it they just forgot to remove the shot cap that was coded in just to streamline testing of the homing function.

Just want to throw out that the Buzlock has existed for a long time now. So it's not like homing shots are something that is just too new for them to freely permit.

[(XBOX)HollowCube987]

On 2021-09-22 at 1:47 PM, Ryme said:

Just want to throw out that the Buzlock has existed for a long time now. So it's not like homing shots are something that is just too new for them to freely permit.

Buzlok is a fully automatic crit based weapon with a lock on mechanic that allows you to choose who you want to target, and we can have a free trigger on that.

But the Tenet Diplos, a fully automatic crit based weapon with a lock on mechanic that allows you to choose who you want to target, restricts itself to only shooting twice per enemy.

Alright. Awesome. Cool.. Warframe 2021 ladies and gentlemen