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Why are Primary Kitguns so awful?


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Seriously. With the exception of maybe Rattleguts and Tombfinger, they’re pretty much all substantially inferior to their Secondary counterparts. I don’t think there’s a single primary kitgun that’s even remotely steel path viable either. If you wanna talk about making guns better, I feel like that’s something that definitely needs looked at.

Catchmoon, Gaze, Sporelacer are definitely the worst offenders for it I reckon. They’re borderline unusable as primaries. I honestly think even with a max disposition, they still wouldn’t be worth using. 

 

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vor 2 Stunden schrieb (PSN)DidelphisV:

Seriously. With the exception of maybe Rattleguts and Tombfinger, they’re pretty much all substantially inferior to their Secondary counterparts. I don’t think there’s a single primary kitgun that’s even remotely steel path viable either. If you wanna talk about making guns better, I feel like that’s something that definitely needs looked at.

Catchmoon, Gaze, Sporelacer are definitely the worst offenders for it I reckon. They’re borderline unusable as primaries. I honestly think even with a max disposition, they still wouldn’t be worth using. 

 

old content! not only kitguns are the last rubbish. popular weapons like kuva nukor are also food from the garbage can.
devs apparently want to sell new content. and tenet weapons are extremely better than existing 95% garbage weapons.

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11 hours ago, (PSN)DidelphisV said:

I don’t think there’s a single primary kitgun that’s even remotely steel path viable

I just went through SP Adaro with a Primary Catchmoon, with a "standard" Viral + HunMun build
(yay being able to reach 100% Crit Chance with a single Mod now), stuff melted easily enough.

No OP Riven, no gun Arcanes, no enemy debuffs via abilities.

My "Mutalist Amprex" Vermisplicer did similarly well, if not better.

9 hours ago, Battle.Mage said:

not only kitguns are the last rubbish. popular weapons like kuva nukor are also food from the garbage can.

I also tried Kuva Nukor, and ... it wrecked stuff in that mission, what are you talking about.

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vor 42 Minuten schrieb NinjaZeku:

I also tried Kuva Nukor, and ... it wrecked stuff in that mission, what are you talking about.

better question is: what kind of stuff you say ???
with your mk1-braton you probably also do top damage in the mission ???

and if you already answer my contribution, how about reading it completely and not taking a sentence out of context!

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33 minutes ago, Battle.Mage said:

better question is: what kind of stuff you say ???

I clearly said Steel Path Adaro.

33 minutes ago, Battle.Mage said:

and if you already answer my contribution, how about reading it completely and not taking a sentence out of context!

Okay, what part about you calling strong weapons "garbage" was out of context?

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11 hours ago, Battle.Mage said:

kuva nukor are also food from the garbage can.

Cant tell if joking or serious...

Kuva Nukor is still the best secondary in the game. Are you saying this because of the recent nerf? I mean... we also got arcanes and galvanized mods that make it much stronger than before, it just has a small ramp up now with required kills. But this is really easy to maintain. 

There are some big issues with this update (yareli) but kuva nukor is absolutely not one of them.

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vor einer Stunde schrieb Leqesai:

Cant tell if joking or serious...

Kuva Nukor is still the best secondary in the game. Are you saying this because of the recent nerf? I mean... we also got arcanes and galvanized mods that make it much stronger than before, it just has a small ramp up now with required kills. But this is really easy to maintain. 

There are some big issues with this update (yareli) but kuva nukor is absolutely not one of them.

"Cant tell if joking or serious ..." -> you mean your post?
because performance of Tenet Cycron you have not compared on SP. best secondary??? ...... about what should we discuss there.

In addition, my contribution again ignored and completely ignored the topic! single target was the strength of kuva nukor ?? yes of course ...
kuva zarr blows the whole room away on SP. and that thing has 11.62 range and hunter munitions!
which kitgun or sausage secondary can keep up? and someone wants to tell me that this chain nerf was fair.

🤦‍♂️

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5 hours ago, Battle.Mage said:

and someone wants to tell me that this chain nerf was fair

It definitely was fair.

And it definitely is still very powerful. You may not think so but you are wrong.

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9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

Cant tell if joking or serious...

Kuva Nukor is still the best secondary in the game. Are you saying this because of the recent nerf? I mean... we also got arcanes and galvanized mods that make it much stronger than before, it just has a small ramp up now with required kills. But this is really easy to maintain. 

There are some big issues with this update (yareli) but kuva nukor is absolutely not one of them.

My Akbronco Prime would have a word with you, about the best secondary in game. When it comes to multitarget status applicators, Kuva Nukor may top the tables for sure. But singletarget? Akbronco would have a word then...

And I do agree, Kuva Nukor is most definitely not a weak outdated weapon now, but a very, very strong and useful weapon.

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5 hours ago, Battle.Mage said:


because performance of Tenet Cycron you have not compared on SP. best secondary??? 

 

Tenet cycron is certainly good, but it is not best secondary. Nukor is better, a kitgun which you seem to hate, Gaze, is better, epitaph is better, etc. You find out Nukor got a nerf, but you see a lich beam weapon with decent cc and high sc, so you immediately decide that its better, without even comparing their performance.

 

5 hours ago, Battle.Mage said:


kuva zarr blows the whole room away on SP. and that thing has 11.62 range and hunter munitions!
which kitgun or sausage secondary can keep up? and someone wants to tell me that this chain nerf was fair.

 

Yes, kuva zarr is big AoE with high dmg and its more efficient than the topic secondaries. However, the secondaries can keep high life support in sp survival, and have better single target dmg. Although less efficient at horde killing, since they can keep efficiency and have higher single target dmg, they are good enough to contest with AoE primaries in a war of preference.  

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vor 7 Minuten schrieb (PSN)namsilatalisman:

Tenet cycron is certainly good, but it is not best secondary. Nukor is better, a kitgun which you seem to hate, Gaze, is better, epitaph is better, etc. You find out Nukor got a nerf, but you see a lich beam weapon with decent cc and high sc, so you immediately decide that its better, without even comparing their performance.

 

Yes, kuva zarr is big AoE with high dmg and its more efficient than the topic secondaries. However, the secondaries can keep high life support in sp survival, and have better single target dmg. Although less efficient at horde killing, since they can keep efficiency and have higher single target dmg, they are good enough to contest with AoE primaries in a war of preference.  

where did you read that?!?!?!?
how about facts and staying neutral!
I have nothing against other opinions (as long as they are clearly marked). you just don't need to lie.

and if you're already talking about kuva zarr, have you tested it at all? today i was in a top group with nekros and zarr. After an hour of SP surv, I had over 60% of the groups damaged. and I don't even have maxed arcanes!
so really now ...........

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22 hours ago, (PSN)DidelphisV said:

With the exception of maybe Rattleguts and Tombfinger, they’re pretty much all substantially inferior to their Secondary counterparts.

Lower base damage and modding. By and large, secondary versions have more base damage pre-modding, and have better base damage mods to boot - arguably better multishot mods, too. Plus things like Arcane Precision vs Arcane Rage. The updated weapon Arcanes make those matter a little bit less but it's still there.

Not that they can't still wreck face, but there's definitely differences. Maybe differences that, one day, will be evened out. That'd be nice.

I don't think it's just a kitgun problem, but kitguns do provide the most direct comparison. We don't really have a secondary equivalent of a Sybaris, for example, so you run into comparing apples and oranges a fair bit. But you can build a primary and secondary Rattleguts and those are a lot closer related.

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On 2021-07-10 at 1:37 PM, (PSN)DidelphisV said:

Seriously. With the exception of maybe Rattleguts and Tombfinger, they’re pretty much all substantially inferior to their Secondary counterparts. I don’t think there’s a single primary kitgun that’s even remotely steel path viable either. If you wanna talk about making guns better, I feel like that’s something that definitely needs looked at.

Catchmoon, Gaze, Sporelacer are definitely the worst offenders for it I reckon. They’re borderline unusable as primaries. I honestly think even with a max disposition, they still wouldn’t be worth using. 

 

 

It's backlash from the Catchmoon Secondary.

the thing was OP and overused when first introduced, and DE being overcautious made all the Kitguns that came later suck to avoid that kind of situation again.

 

Same pattern with New Weapons and Riven Dispositions, etc. DE seems to be taking a stance lately of avoiding power creep.

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