I have been thinking of Ammo

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

16 minutes ago, Surbusken said:

Same reason transformers and power rangers are giant franchises?

Or McD is the best selling food, or justin bieber has a career even at all, or jake paul is fighting floyd mayweather for 100 million...

 

But hadn't you just said there weren't any rules because it was sandbox.

Now you are saying there is an internal consistency, are you just making it up as you type, having no idea where you are going with any of it?

They are formulaic and generic, just not in the areas where they should be. When it comes time to add a grind it's highly structured and conceptual, mechanical, copy-pasted by the book.

When it comes time to put in work they don't like it's chaos and it's entirely about work ethic and respect of your customer, they can get away with a total lack of concept, balance and vision exactly because people like not just let them get away with it, but straight up apologize for them... if that answers your question, how it is possible.

Because you are an enabler is why.

"Not in the areas where they should be."

Like I said, you don't decide that. I like where they've put things. And others have as well. 

[Captain_Rocket505]

I’m not sure if it’s been said already, so I’ll mention my few ideas:

option 1) infinite ammo for all weapons. How would this work for bows? Ammo recharge delay could be a start. For weapons that have standard clips, they would still have to be reloaded but you don’t have to worry about ammo anymore. 

option 2): ammo drops give a specific % of ammo back based on the weapons max ammo capacity. Overall the most simple solution in my opinion, but barely solves the issue

option 3) sort ammo into 3 categories: primary, secondary, and heavy weapons. No shotgun, rifle, and sniper ammo drops. Simply all classified as the general equipment type the weapon falls into. 

[Surbusken]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

"Not in the areas where they should be."

Like I said, you don't decide that. I like where they've put things. And others have as well. 

So because you like it's great? That's your case?

By your argument, I am not allowed to bring negative points about parts of the game but you are definitely allowed your opinion, right? Your contradict yourself everytime you post.

Wasn't it sandbox, there are no rules, this time the story is you do like the rules... that didn't exist.

It seems like you just type something out and then never think the point through to the conclusion. It sounded good in your head but you didn't think about the implications or consequences.

 

But that has nothing to do with my point, what I am saying is things like weapon balance objectively doesn't exist because there is factually no concept or vision.

Objectively speaking, weapon mods, weapon status types, AOE vs singleshot and on and on, has been deliberately neglected and is objectively, conceptually empty and shallow.

 

From my perspective, I am asking for a better game, you are defending being lazy - what's your goal here, to make the developers work less and put less effort in?

When you sat down and started apologizing, what end-goal did you picture in your mind?

The less work you advocated the more happy players there'd be? What was your ambition, seems like you haven't thought it through to the end.

 

Per default, in anything, demands, workload, ability always go up. Businesses expand, people train harder, read faster, technology gets better. Always forward progression towards the next level as a universal fact.

I don't know where you go this idea of the status quo and being complacent was a solid solution. Let's just sit down and not even try doing better, what is that.

 

So even if this particular case wasn't objectively factual, the method is still universally, eternally true. You are always looking for improvements in everything, forever.

Should things get better, can things get better? Yeah, obviously.

Meaning there is never a time to apologize for the developers, you disable them by allowing destructive behavior, it doesn't help you, it doesn't help them and it doesn't help the game.

Exactly like an obesity enabler, you are just being kind and giving them what they want, cuddling them, right?

 

Step one to improving is locating and recognizing your mistakes, which is what feedback was meant to have been - of course I will come halfway and say it should be diplomatic to protect their egos of course.

But when the truth hurts and the choice is between laying it out or babying people into complacency there is really no option. You can moderate your language to be formal I guess but in the end complaining is always the authentic, univerally correct method.

[(NSW)Greybones]

3 hours ago, Surbusken said:

Well we don't have weapon or damage balance in this game because it's sandbox!!!!1 lol.

Hrm. Out of curiosity, what has been your general experience in Warframe regarding the balance? I remember you saying you ragequit between Venus and Deimos and have been sporadically playing since Deimos (and after re-reading your post, it clicked and I believe I parsed correctly what you meant 👍)

[Surbusken]

46 minutes ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

Hrm. Out of curiosity, what has been your general experience in Warframe regarding the balance? I remember you saying you ragequit between Venus and Deimos and have been sporadically playing since Deimos (and after re-reading your post, it clicked and I believe I parsed correctly what you meant 👍)

Maybe that's the disconnect right there, I am not really interested in my own opinion or individual opinion. I read a lot and I read everything and hear all arguments, then usually the facts speak for themselves.

Of course they should still be debate anyway, which is what a forum is for.

 

Things like railjack etc. I'd say flopped, factually, regardless of what I feel about it. The history of failed 'seamless' and fiasco of 'railjack taxi' are recorded history, what I feel about is uninteresting. The debate here is the objective quality of the game.

 

Necramech's been stalled for about a year and so on, it's not developer bashing, that's reality.

People waiting 5 years for the next lore cutscene about the lotus, I mean name anything.

Focus schools being abandoned, the terrible lich grind - like I said, there is always room for improvement and so per default you are looking for it, always, by facing up to mistakes.

To improve you have to find the errors, the bad decisions, flaws and terrible ideas and accept that is on you, then learn from it.

 

Which yes is easy for me to say since it isn't my work getting torn to pieces on the daily lol. I understand the impulse to lock yourself in a room with a gang of yes-men.

[RichardKam]

Ammo is almost the least of the concern in the gameplay. Unless you are playing with k. Kohm with two copies of arcane tempo, otherwise the ordinary ammo drop should get you covered. 

[(NSW)Greybones]

15 minutes ago, Surbusken said:

Maybe that's the disconnect right there, I am not really interested in my own opinion or individual opinion. I read a lot and I read everything and hear all arguments, then usually the facts speak for themselves.

Of course they should still be debate anyway, which is what a forum is for.

 

Things like railjack etc. I'd say flopped, factually, regardless of what I feel about it. The history of failed 'seamless' and fiasco of 'railjack taxi' are recorded history, what I feel about is uninteresting. The debate here is the objective quality of the game.

 

Necramech's been stalled for about a year and so on, it's not developer bashing, that's reality.

People waiting 5 years for the next lore cutscene about the lotus, I mean name anything.

Focus schools being abandoned, the terrible lich grind - like I said, there is always room for improvement and so per default you are looking for it, always, by facing up to mistakes.

To improve you have to find the errors, the bad decisions, flaws and terrible ideas and accept that is on you, then learn from it.

 

Which yes is easy for me to say since it isn't my work getting torn to pieces on the daily lol. I understand the impulse to lock yourself in a room with a gang of yes-men.

Erm. I was thinking more about the in-mission balance, and I’m interested in your perspective on the matter. I like hearing about how others play, and that can extend into  how others approached Warframe from the start

edit: Saw a topic someone posted where they’re doing like a video journal of their starting experience, and was watching them use their Mk-Braton in the tutorial mission, and was thinking “Personally, that looks like a satisfying TTK for the enemy faced, I wonder what they think of it”

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

3 hours ago, Surbusken said:

So because you like it's great? That's your case?

By your argument, I am not allowed to bring negative points about parts of the game but you are definitely allowed your opinion, right? Your contradict yourself everytime you post.

Wasn't it sandbox, there are no rules, this time the story is you do like the rules... that didn't exist.

It seems like you just type something out and then never think the point through to the conclusion. It sounded good in your head but you didn't think about the implications or consequences.

 

But that has nothing to do with my point, what I am saying is things like weapon balance objectively doesn't exist because there is factually no concept or vision.

Objectively speaking, weapon mods, weapon status types, AOE vs singleshot and on and on, has been deliberately neglected and is objectively, conceptually empty and shallow.

 

From my perspective, I am asking for a better game, you are defending being lazy - what's your goal here, to make the developers work less and put less effort in?

When you sat down and started apologizing, what end-goal did you picture in your mind?

The less work you advocated the more happy players there'd be? What was your ambition, seems like you haven't thought it through to the end.

 

Per default, in anything, demands, workload, ability always go up. Businesses expand, people train harder, read faster, technology gets better. Always forward progression towards the next level as a universal fact.

I don't know where you go this idea of the status quo and being complacent was a solid solution. Let's just sit down and not even try doing better, what is that.

 

So even if this particular case wasn't objectively factual, the method is still universally, eternally true. You are always looking for improvements in everything, forever.

Should things get better, can things get better? Yeah, obviously.

Meaning there is never a time to apologize for the developers, you disable them by allowing destructive behavior, it doesn't help you, it doesn't help them and it doesn't help the game.

Exactly like an obesity enabler, you are just being kind and giving them what they want, cuddling them, right?

 

Step one to improving is locating and recognizing your mistakes, which is what feedback was meant to have been - of course I will come halfway and say it should be diplomatic to protect their egos of course.

But when the truth hurts and the choice is between laying it out or babying people into complacency there is really no option. You can moderate your language to be formal I guess but in the end complaining is always the authentic, univerally correct method.

Sure....pick any game, and there will be people of all kinds doing the same thing. People love to type paragraphs about how the game isn't realizing the potential some individual player had for them and if they don't follow their amazing plan for how other people should play, everyone will leave and the game will die. 

Some people just realize if you have to go on a campaign to completely change a video game to your liking, it's probably time to take a break. Oh wait you have taken a break, because you couldn't handle Venus, correct?

[Aldain]

Honestly the only ammo problem I've run into lately has been my Twin Grakatas...good lord do these things CHEW through ammo.

[Surbusken]

1 hour ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

Erm. I was thinking more about the in-mission balance, and I’m interested in your perspective on the matter. I like hearing about how others play, and that can extend into  how others approached Warframe from the start

edit: Saw a topic someone posted where they’re doing like a video journal of their starting experience, and was watching them use their Mk-Braton in the tutorial mission, and was thinking “Personally, that looks like a satisfying TTK for the enemy faced, I wonder what they think of it”

Thanks for wanting to hear my opinion but I don't know if it's qualified. I think I am very atypical, so I'd never recommend a company to build their product around my profile.

Mass appeal means simplying the product, which isn't all bad when it comes to video games. I always said one of the best things about warframe is how friendly and causual people are becasuse the fail-rate is so low.

Simply said my thinking it what is best for the gameplay with a as wide as possible appeal. So for example I am a huge supporter of lore, even though it means less than zero to me personally, knowing how much it means to the community.

 

The concrete mission balance I think is double missing the mark. It's not really casual and it's really not a challenge either. Too much grind for casuals and too little challenge for experienced players. I said before the grind is the challenge if you can mentally cope with it.

That's just a terrible thing to be able to say about a video game, when it's supposed to be relaxing and fun.

I don't feel embarrased at all to say I mentally broke when they copy-pasted the second planet venus, it's not on me, that's on how terrible the gameplay is.

 

So overall I'd say, I'd never presume to dictate the actual direction of the game, especially with me being a 'huge' minority. I am just saying not having any gameplay concept damages the product, whatever people think the concept should be, I will support if it's best for the game. But it has to have one.

 

For instance with weapons and mission balance. Let's say okay, it's a speed running, animation clipping dps race to cut down on grinding.

Then you can go back and correct everything that doesn't fit the formula. Say you had a frame that has long casting times or a locked build up animations, then you know it doesn't work with your formula.

Or you on stealth gameplay, metal gear solid, splinter cell, orginal deux ex, thief, hitman - then you are able to do something like give pistols stealth mechanics while larger weapons are used for boss fights.

Could also have projectile weapons being high damage and aoe and rapid fire being tied into trash mobs. If you played left4ead you see the clear functionality of each item tied into gameplay mechanics.

Throwing knifes could become smoke bombs to escape or whatever, but it has to have a function tied into gameplay.

 

Just random ideas to illustrate the point that when everything is just a notepad edited damage number the game becomes shallow.

If people wanted a giant bioware dialogue system in place I'd support that, is just this whole playing with lego and no blueprint doesn't work.

[(NSW)Greybones]

5 hours ago, Surbusken said:

Thanks for wanting to hear my opinion but I don't know if it's qualified. I think I am very atypical, so I'd never recommend a company to build their product around my profile.

Mass appeal means simplying the product, which isn't all bad when it comes to video games. I always said one of the best things about warframe is how friendly and causual people are becasuse the fail-rate is so low.

Simply said my thinking it what is best for the gameplay with a as wide as possible appeal. So for example I am a huge supporter of lore, even though it means less than zero to me personally, knowing how much it means to the community.

 

The concrete mission balance I think is double missing the mark. It's not really casual and it's really not a challenge either. Too much grind for casuals and too little challenge for experienced players. I said before the grind is the challenge if you can mentally cope with it.

That's just a terrible thing to be able to say about a video game, when it's supposed to be relaxing and fun.

I don't feel embarrased at all to say I mentally broke when they copy-pasted the second planet venus, it's not on me, that's on how terrible the gameplay is.

 

So overall I'd say, I'd never presume to dictate the actual direction of the game, especially with me being a 'huge' minority. I am just saying not having any gameplay concept damages the product, whatever people think the concept should be, I will support if it's best for the game. But it has to have one.

 

For instance with weapons and mission balance. Let's say okay, it's a speed running, animation clipping dps race to cut down on grinding.

Then you can go back and correct everything that doesn't fit the formula. Say you had a frame that has long casting times or a locked build up animations, then you know it doesn't work with your formula.

Or you on stealth gameplay, metal gear solid, splinter cell, orginal deux ex, thief, hitman - then you are able to do something like give pistols stealth mechanics while larger weapons are used for boss fights.

Could also have projectile weapons being high damage and aoe and rapid fire being tied into trash mobs. If you played left4ead you see the clear functionality of each item tied into gameplay mechanics.

Throwing knifes could become smoke bombs to escape or whatever, but it has to have a function tied into gameplay.

 

Just random ideas to illustrate the point that when everything is just a notepad edited damage number the game becomes shallow.

If people wanted a giant bioware dialogue system in place I'd support that, is just this whole playing with lego and no blueprint doesn't work.

Cool cool. Personally I don’t have the fortitude to play the grind; got bit by it already, and had to put something between me and it, haha.

Alright, I think I got a sense of what your experience is like, thanks 👍. Your answer was a bit more in-depth into your philosophy than I was expecting, but that’s cool too; I like seeing how people think

[Rakosta_Kai]

16 hours ago, Aldain said:

While I agree on paper, there are some weapons that just can't because of how mods work.

The Ambassador, a recently released MR10 rifle as it currently is cannot get past the drawback of having the same base damage as the MR0 Braton and a similar base Crit chance. The Charge Shot mode isn't much better, only two shots per 96 round magazine and the 6m radius on the AoE is currently bugged and seems to not function right.

The older Stahlta does basically everything it does, but better, the Fulmin achieves the two different fire modes concept better because both modes are good for something.

I can only agree with the "It's your job to mod around drawbacks" if the drawbacks aren't on the level of the Ambassador, where the baseline function of the weapon gets in the way of it actually properly interacting with the mod system (which is strictly percentage based with no flat increase options for things that have low bases).

Gotta love single case scenarios... It's your job to mod around drawbacks regardless. 

That said, Your instance sounds more like a need for experiential feedback and comparison offered up in the feedback forum in the hopes DE tunes the weapon itself because the weapon, on paper, looks to be tuned lower and made insanely in-efficient regardless. I can only assume it's another "balanced choices" scenario from DE. 

I say this because just looking at the base numbers between it and the Stahlta would suggest it's intended to be worse.

That said, It is my opinion that DE seems to have their weapons (and frames) fall inside undocumented performance tiers that appear to have undocumented damage ranges.
If correct, It would be nice if that was a lot more transparent even though it might potentially damage interest in the weapon itself. 

Sadly, the Ambassador is one of those rifles I would rather have had as a weapon skin option as opposed to an actual weapon. 

[Aldain]

3 hours ago, Padre_Akais said:

That said, Your instance sounds more like a need for experiential feedback and comparison offered up in the feedback forum in the hopes DE tunes the weapon itself because the weapon, on paper, looks to be tuned lower and made insanely in-efficient regardless. I can only assume it's another "balanced choices" scenario from DE. 

I say this because just looking at the base numbers between it and the Stahlta would suggest it's intended to be worse.

Logistically I can't fathom why DE would have intended it to be worse when arguably it is harder to farm, being on Railjack Survival C rotations and all.

I also fully believe in the mindset of "If you're going to make something intentionally bad, don't make anything in the first place" in terms of game design, outside of actual joke weapons, and even those in some games aren't terrible.

However I have done my due diligence, I have provided a feedback thread on the weapon, one I'm sure has fallen on deaf ears, but a feedback thread nonetheless.

[Rakosta_Kai]

1 hour ago, Aldain said:

Logistically I can't fathom why DE would have intended it to be worse when arguably it is harder to farm, being on Railjack Survival C rotations and all.

I also fully believe in the mindset of "If you're going to make something intentionally bad, don't make anything in the first place" in terms of game design, outside of actual joke weapons, and even those in some games aren't terrible.

I can't either... If you compare the numbers between the Ambassador and the Stahlta though it does appear to be the case.

That is unless someone sees something I don't— I never rule out that possibility. 

I just wish it was a first...