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Unlike Corpus and Grineer, Infested have the LEAST variants encountered. Which is both baffling and disappointing considering what they are. It's only after Deimos do we finally see their first variant.


(PSN)GingyGreen

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The Grineer had variants early in the game's history with Arid and Frontier Grineer alongside the classic ones we see in Ship tilesets. Then CA went really crazy with Tusks where EVERY unit had new weapons and they were given new voices (considering these are just fodders we kill, that's a lot), and gave them Ghouls, Thumpers, etc. as well. For Corpus it took the release of Fortuna before CA started adding variants like Juno, Terra, Axios, etc. where they finally have new helmets, variations in weapons, voices, etc. alongside new robots like Raknoids.

 

The Infested? They're the same guys regardless of what nodes you meet them all in. From Earth to Eris, the Infested never once look different. Chargers are still your classic upside down lancer (not even a variant of a lancer), chargers are still the rectangle helmet crewmen with their hand shoved into their faces. etc. And when we finally get their first variant in Deimos, it's the same, but grey now, with some orange cilia. The new enemies in Jugulus/Diploid/Carnis/Saxums looks pretty cool. But the classic Infested didn't get any make-over like the other two factions did.

 

 

The Infested is more or less The Thing for Warframe, mutating it's victims in all sorts of horrible ways. Yet as a Faction they're by far the least varied. Couldn't DE have, I don't know, made variations on Infested. Like you have your basic Infested for some mission we see now. But in Grineer dominated planets their Chargers will be mutated Ballistas/Scorpions instead of Crewmen, in Corpus planets their Charger will be mutated hyena proxies, or two crewmen melted together to produce the same general silhouette. Make Undying fliers appear in Grineer tilesets while introducing infested raknoids or something to Corpus.

 

The Infested should have had the most variants, yet somehow they have the least, by a large margin.

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Infested tilesets seriously need a revamp to match the quality of the Cambion Drift in terms of variety both in style and enemy. I get the Cambion Drift is meant to be the "heart" of the infested or something, but there is literally no diversity in Infested maps.

Now that Corpus liches exist, when are we gonna see improvements to Infested and Orokin? Orokin have also been relatively identical for ages, too.

I'd love to see Deimos actually be relevant outside of getting Lavos, Necramech, and disease kitties and puppies. (Which almost no one farms for since Smeeta Kavat are still better overall than both Predasyte and Vulpaphyla even with dedicated builds.)

also pls revamp all the living pets so most of them aren't useless. there's little reason to not just use a Smeeta.

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54 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

I was very pleased when Deimos was announced and hella disappointed when the new enemies weren't on regular missions.

Just put them, the ones that can fit at least, on regular missions remove the Deimos from their name and change colors

I figured at a minimum that the thrashers would be thrown into main missions, since they were introduced with the emissary. But I agree, I made a post asking if they could be added, the base game infested faction is stale as hell and in dire need of some new blood.

2 minutes ago, Flannoit said:

Infested tilesets seriously need a revamp to match the quality of the Cambion Drift in terms of variety both in style and enemy. I get the Cambion Drift is meant to be the "heart" of the infested or something, but there is literally no diversity in Infested maps.

I'm going to say the infested tiles will probably get a rework when they prep for infested railjack, they'll need a new tile set for the "microplanets" they showed off concept art for a couple of Tennocons ago. That's basically what they did with the corpus, reworked the tiles, then railjack, then liches. Plus we saw in the New War gameplay video that there is a destroyed variant of the new Corpus ship tileset, so they could easily take that new infested decor from deimos and mix them together to rework that whole tileset.

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My god that title is long lol

TLDR: yeah it sucks theres not alot of variance but its because of how infested gameplay and design limits the ability to eaily create variance beyond whole new enemy types, where alot of the deimos ones have unique movement taht would be hard to merge into ship tiles.

That asside though yeah it's cool other factions have variants and agree it is limited on infested to some degree most likely because design wise they arent compatible with that same easy modulation other factions have.

Like corpus and grineer you can just swap out weapons and have gameplay relatively unchanged with some spice i guess. Bigger variants from cetus/fortuna are literally just "what if we slapped 2 opticors on this guy back but its actually a jet pack with the corpus archwing crewmen animations" or "so we made these artillery turrets, can we just use that effect on a bombard?".

I feel like its just alot harder to do this for infested. They are primarily a melee faction with any other attacks being knockdown, area denial, or ranged chip damage. You could go "give that charger a shotgun for a face" but when you're running at an infested horde and every enemy is at that low height level you wont be able to identify that threat if it was a more difficult twist on the enemy. 

Infested become SO much more reliant on whole new enemey types which creates a boatload more work so its definitely easy to see why they've suffered variance wise for such a long time. The emphasis on player disruption also seemed to have created a lot of caution around making anything too scary as ancient disruptors and healers auras and grapples could make it a nightmare to kill as a priority target in tighter settings with limited visibility.

Maybe when the new tiles get infested variants and an eris remaster we can see some of the deimos enemies in there maybe even to the extent of jugulus spawn spots in walls. Thing is though without the bigger deimos enemies in missions you're not even getting alot of variation. Thrashers are just more direct more stompy moas in humanish shape and things like the carnis are just more projectiles (and would also require making every wall in the game climbable by them to implement them outside of deimos.)

I would love more infested love but it seems like it'd be ALOT of work to get any amount of core warframe content for them that would give them the leg up they'd need for more proper variance.

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They added some new infested with the Emissary NW.  They added more with Deimos.  Some of these newer enemies should be rolled into the bog standard start chart infested faction.  Some, like those rolling centipede (Carnis) types, probably wouldn't work well due to their unique mobility, and could be left on Deimos.

 

If DE does move some of the newer infested to more locations, I hope that the arbitrary immunity to viral and radiation is changed.

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When they released the corpus scrambus and comba enemies they showed that they have a "randomizer" system for that enemy type where it picks between several different body parts to provide variation for them, Liches and sisters are probably running on the same system. Infested grunts could massively benefit from that kind of thing.

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3 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

The Infested should have had the most variants, yet somehow they have the least, by a large margin.

I do totally agree, but you're forgetting something: Infested still have yet to receive their nemesis system and Railjack Proximas. that's when we'll get the perfect opportunity for some interesting new designs!

it is also probably harder to design infested due to how incredibly detailed they look in their grotesqueness. I saw a screenshot of the Jugulus Projectile once, something you barely ever get to see in game before it hits or misses you, and the amount of detail on it was astounding; someone put a LOT of work into that, and yet only a handful of people have ever been able to appreciate it. I do love the Deimos infested, especially the Carnis, as I've always though Centipedes would be great inspiration for a horrifying creature, but I imagine it must have taken even longer than with other factions to draw their concepts, then render them into 3d and then try to animate them without them looking too janky. 

I think a system like with the Corpus captains, who have their gender and face gear randomized, could work, giving them different colours and texture appearances, different things on and in their bodies like decayed limbs, bone spikes, pustules, tentacles etc. I'm also hoping that Infested Nemesis enemies (whatever they'll be called), will actually evolve as they rank up starting out as just a bigger version of a regular unit and then turning into a more unique monster from various randomized parts as they rank up, until at rank 5 they become their ultimate form with a variety of different attacks. 

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3 hours ago, (PSN)GingyGreen said:

The Infested should have had the most variants, yet somehow they have the least, by a large margin.

The counterpoint to this would be the mentality of the hive mind:

It hates variants.

Whenever the hive mind sees another variant of itself, it gets EXTREMELY angry and persecutory. "Infestation classic" loathes and fears Helminth. The Deimos Grey Strain, the only other variant, is locked in a civil war between Vome and Fass, because an infested being cannot tolerate anything it cannot assimilate. The two wyrms would rather destroy themselves, than live in a world with other infested they are not linked to

The Infested would rather have one singular homogenous strain, than multiple variants running around each separate from the others

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I think there is absolutely a lot of missed opportunity for the Infested faction, not just in terms of their lack of enemy variants, but also in terms of types of enemies in general. If Infested were to truly be a faction based around taking a host and twisting it to their own creation, I feel like some Infested units would be more complex and intricate. For example, perhaps Chargers and Runners on the first few planets are basic and standard, but as you progress to later planets, they maybe obtain some new variants. Like a Shield Charger that carries a shield on their back making that part (mostly) invulnerable, Runners that now cough grenades out of their mouth; heck there's a lot of potential to make them more interesting.

And I'm not just talking about already existing enemies, but completely new ones as well. The new Infested during The Emissary, were pretty dang cool, especially the Dying Flyer. That enemy felt like you didn't just shoot them and be done with them besides killing some extra fodder, you needed to pay close attention to it. There's many ideas for new Infested that could have similar ideas like this, where you really have to pay attention to less they get outta control (which would be fitting for the Infested 100%):

  • Roller Hermit: A distorted tentacle-like Infested that hosts itself inside of a Roller, where most of it is invulnerable besides a specific weak spot. Once it gets close to a player, it will finally pop out and start lashing with long-reaching tendrils covered in Corrosive/Viral-inflicting mucus.
  • Mutalist Tech: A Corpus Tech that seems to have most of it's upper torso covered in Infested tissue, with one arm mutated completely (possibly using a Tysis or whatever). However, if a headshot is performed on it, it won't damage them traditionally, instead it will spawn a Mutalist Osprey as the Tech continues to fight.
  • Noxious Charger: A Charger that uses the body of a Nox instead, while general slower, will be much stronger and tankier. Instead of simply producing a Toxic cloud on a headshot however, it will produce a fume that will strengthen nearby enemies as well, but also greatly weaken the Charger.
  • Dead Ranger: A Ranger (the Corpus units that fly by the way) that keep their distance by staying in flight most of the time. However, once their 'jetpack' is malfunctioned, a claw-like tendril will instantly reach out to whoever shot last to create a large Gas-like explosion with the (dead) Ranger now being propped up on the back of the Infested that was once it's mode of flight.

Obviously, these wouldn't be 1:1 and I would imagine it would somewhat difficult to balance these to some extent considering the existence of Ancients BUT... I don't really care. The reason why Infested for the most part have mostly been a 'push-over' faction (as in the easiest to fight in my opinion) have mostly been to their very simple enemy designs. At least The Emissary felt somewhat like a challenge, and the Deimos Infested definitely do have some presence of power, but I wished every Infested node/planet had more to them. I don't think it would be crazy for DE to add at least, one new enemy to every few planet, one that is challenging to deal with. At least, add the Dying Flyer in Grineer-Infested missions for a start (also because I like the enemy design).

Considering how Infested are probably going to be next inline to gain a bunch of changes and updates related to them, as Infested Railjack and Nemesis will definitely be a thing, I'm hoping DE makes way for some more interesting enemy design. Especially if we're going to get some sort of lore expansion/revelation for them, I hope it doesn't disappoint.

Also, please let us play as an Infested in the New War. Might be too late to ask, and I know it won't make sense to play as "Scrimbolosis the Charger" but I feel like there's a great opportunity there to just do so.

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