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What do you guys think of those who try not to execute Liches or Sisters?


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3 hours ago, NecroPed said:

That's my bad then I guess. Didn't know it was intended that way. Personally think it's something that should still change. 

Change how? There arent many ways to do it in order to allow proper "investigation" and blind stabbing at the same time. So you want the old system back that instead frustrates a whole group since you cannot drive off a lich without a stab? Since the first iteration of liches DE have been pretty clear that you are given both options, either chance it or do the detective work to get the right mods and then try the sequence.

 

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On 2021-08-03 at 5:38 PM, o0Despair0o said:

Doesn't matter what excuse you come up with, if you have a Lich/Sister and join a public squad, you stab them.

I don't care if you're already getting your butt kicked by a level 1 lich, you stab them or GTFO. Stop wasting my squad slots.

This sounds so selfish, you only see your personal interests.
I personally play the first missions solo, until I know the first one, to avoid those situations.

But if you don't understand why people avoid to kill their lich, you shouldn't play in PUG.
Each player has the same rights and there is NO EXCUSE necessary how they play the game.
For some people reasons exist not to kill it, even if you don't agree with it
- it takes longer for the player for each false try
- player wants to let the lich spawn more thralls (has been up to 10 afaik)
- maybe the player/clan cannot kill a lvl4 lich, especially the teleporting and fast shield regenerating ones
- player simply don't want to guess and wait to know all three before trying it.

My advise to all of you who complained in this thread: 
Please don't blame the other players for their play-style and live with it.
If you cannot do it, run it solo/clan.

-c0y
 

 

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21 hours ago, -JT-_-R3W1ND said:

 Am i wrong, or in reality it's much better?

In all my runs i've never encountered someone not stabbing their lich after Venus. And im nearing 50 sisters now. Even when they dont stab its a rare occurence due to the random matchmaking. My first mission in Venus might be somone's 3rd and they're already uncovered the first mod. Even when someone doesnt stab it's not a big deal since they usually down them and we move on to the next. You only need one Sister stabbed  in two missions before you uncover the first mod and thats easy to encounter before yours ever spawns. Sister spawning at the 3rd missions so far for me has been the rule. Which also means, me not stabbing her on the second mission is the exception.
 

9 hours ago, LillyRaccune said:

Yes I have experienced this glitch too. At the time I thought it was because of bad ping (because that was a commonality I noticed). But (for me) I feel like it is normal to expect the next lich-sis to appear after the first has left.

I haven't seen this since the hotfix, but that isn't conclusive evidence. It wasn't addressed in the hotfix notes either, so I think it is still possible to happen.

This has been a common glitch for me. In my experience tho new hounds and sisters keep spawning anyway. The old one just stays there and is marked as well, but doesnt seem to stop progress.

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10 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

Change how? There arent many ways to do it in order to allow proper "investigation" and blind stabbing at the same time. So you want the old system back that instead frustrates a whole group since you cannot drive off a lich without a stab? Since the first iteration of liches DE have been pretty clear that you are given both options, either chance it or do the detective work to get the right mods and then try the sequence.

 

Not sure exactly to be honest. But i didn't mind an idea I saw where downing a lich 3 times gives the rest of the squad murmurs. At least then if my lich is being blocked from spawning in I'm not having to help someone down their lich 3 times for nothing. 

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Imagine not stabbing your lich and farming all the murmurs until you know the 3 mods and still have to stab the lich 4 times, because you are simply unlucky with the order kek.

Yeah I heard leaving a signature is cool again.

-sitfesz

Edited by sitfesz
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14 hours ago, NecroPed said:

Not sure exactly to be honest. But i didn't mind an idea I saw where downing a lich 3 times gives the rest of the squad murmurs. At least then if my lich is being blocked from spawning in I'm not having to help someone down their lich 3 times for nothing. 

That would be horribly abused by groups since driving off a lich through 3x down doesnt reset their aggro. So they could just cheese this node by node until a planet is empty, and if they really make sure to get all to spawn on every node that would be 30 murmurs extra per node cleared from the moment the lich starts to show up.

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Sometimes its ideal not to do it, example being u know first and second one ia right after u tested, your requiem murmur is about full, so u wont finisher the lich to keep the fury level so he/she got more chance of coming in next mission, but if u just started the third murmur then finishing is a better option

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On 2021-08-03 at 5:27 PM, (PSN)Boomstickman98 said:

Ah, now I see where you are coming from

It is exaclty this. In the old system you had a choice never to meet the lich, never play missions where your lich was present, you coudl find at least 1 requiem easily and without risk.

Now the system changed and lichy shows up on first mission. I did this, and ended up fighting the damn thing on the Kuva Fortress - it was not pleasant, that location is not 1st choice for normal missions.

So now if it turns up early, i ignore it. TBH I try hard to get in matches where other people are running murmers on planets other than the one mine is at (ie venus for sisters) but its hard as everyone else with a new lich will be there too. Its a system tat was not thought through by DE at all.

Now, when hosting murmers I always put the planet in, so others can see if they'd like to join, or not.

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I have to admit that I've slightly changed my position on this issue. Here's why:

1) Trying to get your final stabs on Kuva Fort is just plain awful because there are so few good mission nodes there. In the (now rare) instances where my lich ends up on this planet, I just run the first exterminate to see if it spawns. If not, abort/reset. If it does and it's the wrong order, abort/reset. I'm not going to try to farm this in most of the available nodes in this sector. Period.

2) I have a method that works a lot better, but there are instances where stabbing too early is inefficient and needlessly levels up my lich while offering me no benefit. I wrote up a quick guide for it.

 

Hopefully DE can find a better solution for how this stuff works, but I won't hold my breath.

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On 2021-08-03 at 11:51 AM, Voltage said:

Because it gives you murmurs and you should be guessing every stab? If you can't handle a level 5 Lich/Sister you shouldn't be in the system to be honest. Not stabbing while in a squad griefs others' progress.

if were thinkign this through to a logical conclusion and from both sides, 

someone is being "griefed" (as idiotic as that statement is in this context) regardless of which action is taken.

think about it. i either dont stab, and slow youre progress down by 10 murmur points but then unlock a murmur that mission and then stab the lich/sister the following mission, thus speeding my progress up. 

OR

i stab my lich to speed up youre murmur progress at the cost of learning a murmur but not being able to test it because now i have to spend 5 or more missions building up the rage meter again?

either way, someone is getting the short end of the stick, and naturrally those in control prefer to not be the one who gets it. thus in this context, they wont stab. 

and again calling it "griefing" is a idiotic statement to make because youre not griefing anyone. its a public match and you take what you can get or leave. just because you get a group that doesnt play like you do or how you want them to doesnt mean their griefing you. 

 

Griefing pertains to purposely killing teammates, or sabotaging the mission by making the objective purposely fail. thats griefing. being teammed up with a player in PUG's who doesnt want to stab thier lich is an inconveniance.

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1 hour ago, FrostDragoon said:

Anyone could easily turn this around on you as doing precisely the same thing--telling people how they can or should behave in the game. This type of whining is just as pathetic and pointless.

PuGs = Anything goes, dont expect others to need the same as you. Doesnt matter if it is RMM Pub PuGs or PuGs through invites.

Premades/solo = Made for a specific outcome.

It's been like that since MMO's introduced the whole PuG/Premade concept in gaming. Doesnt matter what game it is, if it has those mechanical options, the same applies and should be respected. Yelling about people not stabbing their lich is like going on a rage spree in a PuG WSG chat because a team mate happens to be distracted midfield with a random enemy throughout the match and not actively defending the flag spot or putting pressure on the enemy's.

So it cant really be turned around, since the player not stabbing still follows and respects the general values that comes with PuGing. They dont demand people to play their way etc. They simply play.

And this thread and the behavior by some people in it, is the reason why I think it was unwise of DE to reimplement the group wide murmur gain on stabs. People complained prior to it already about people not stabbing cause it "griefed" them out of Kuva...

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On 2021-08-04 at 3:20 AM, (PSN)max141064 said:

a way to prevent this is not rewarding players if they don't kill the lich/sister.

a way to prevent it is taking away the murmur they farmed in that specific mission if they don't stab. 

GOOD LORD! the amount of horrid ideas and "solutions" you people come up with just because you cant Leech off other peoples liches, youd make the entire system horrendously bad and stupid just to fullfill youre entitlement. 

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On 2021-08-04 at 4:54 AM, (PSN)max141064 said:

"free murmur"? like if it was actually hard to fill up all murmurs. 

The problem here it's not that i don't want you to play the way you want, the problem here it's that people that play like you do slow down incredibly the murmur farm. 

if you don't want to give "free murmur", again...this statement is laughable in my honest opinion, go farm murmur solo. 

Or are you trying to be the jailer of other people? "oh, it's my lich? good, now i'm in charge!" dude lol.

if Murmur's arent hard to get then why are you fretting so much and crying over it? it shouldnt be a big deal but its not much or not hard to get it yourself. 

but yet youre still trying to dictate to others in order to get them?

either their not a big deal to you and thus not a issue if someone doesnt stab their lich, or they are a big deal by being "slowed down" otherwise if they dotn stab. OR you feel somehow entitled to their murmur? IE you want "Free Murmur"

pick one because youre contradicting yourself.

and yet you want to be the jailer of other peoples lich? you are a hypocrite dude.

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3 hours ago, FrostDragoon said:

Anyone could easily turn this around on you as doing precisely the same thing--telling people how they can or should behave in the game. This type of whining is just as pathetic and pointless.

not really. 

im not making demands of othe rplayers and then telling them to stick to 1 set of the game because i didnt get my way.

its public people are free to do as they please long as their not actually griefing players. and no one can make demands of others. 

i cant tell people to leave a lich up and they cant tell me to stab. we can just tell eachother to F off in those cases. 

ive not seen anyone actually complain from the no stab side, but rather a ton of crying from the "Always Stab" Karens. or my other nickname for them. Public Dictators (with a added K after dic to get it across more accurately)

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2 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

PuGs = Anything goes, dont expect others to need the same as you. Doesnt matter if it is RMM Pub PuGs or PuGs through invites.

Premades/solo = Made for a specific outcome.

It's been like that since MMO's introduced the whole PuG/Premade concept in gaming. Doesnt matter what game it is, if it has those mechanical options, the same applies and should be respected. Yelling about people not stabbing their lich is like going on a rage spree in a PuG WSG chat because a team mate happens to be distracted midfield with a random enemy throughout the match and not actively defending the flag spot or putting pressure on the enemy's.

So it cant really be turned around, since the player not stabbing still follows and respects the general values that comes with PuGing. They dont demand people to play their way etc. They simply play.

And this thread and the behavior by some people in it, is the reason why I think it was unwise of DE to reimplement the group wide murmur gain on stabs. People complained prior to it already about people not stabbing cause it "griefed" them out of Kuva...

No, people are going to play how they want. They are going to complain how they want. The cross-section for harmony is where etiquette forms. All the friction, toxicity, wailing, and gnashing of teeth comes from people either not knowing or not following it. It's plenty easy to turn around because he's trying to dictate that you can't complain about other players' behavior. You totally can. He is.

However, my larger point here is that this is mainly only an issue because (yet again) DE put the incentives and design at cross purposes. Instead of going at each other about it, we should be asking DE to fix it.

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1 hour ago, (XBOX)Madinogi said:

not really. 

im not making demands of othe rplayers and then telling them to stick to 1 set of the game because i didnt get my way.

its public people are free to do as they please long as their not actually griefing players. and no one can make demands of others. 

i cant tell people to leave a lich up and they cant tell me to stab. we can just tell eachother to F off in those cases. 

ive not seen anyone actually complain from the no stab side, but rather a ton of crying from the "Always Stab" Karens. or my other nickname for them. Public Dictators (with a added K after dic to get it across more accurately)

You're saying they don't have a right to complain. They absolutely do. You can mute them, ignore the chat, retaliate, deescalate, explain your rationale, or any number of other options. Instead, you're going to act immature about it and call them "Karens" based solely on your confirmation bias. 🤷‍♂️

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On 2021-08-03 at 4:23 PM, Berserkerkitten said:

Eh, I try not to think anything if I team up with randoms. Everybody has the same right to be on here and play any way they want. If I don't like how others play, I can always solo or group up with friends.

Same in life the individual should always come before the society...thats why we're screwed.

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Just now, (XBOX)SwiftBMF said:

Same in life the individual should always come before the society...thats why we're screwed.

It's not actually supposed to be that binary. There's supposed to be a dialogue of sorts, social norms, tolerance, manners, etc. 

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1 minute ago, FrostDragoon said:

It's not actually supposed to be that binary. There's supposed to be a dialogue of sorts, social norms, tolerance, manners, etc. 

Supposed to be but we both know thats not how it actually works,in real life just like public lobbys everything revolves around the idividual & there own self fulfilment.

Like the guys who stand just off of extraction dancing while 3 others are on it untill it auto extracts just because thats what they want to do because they find winding people up & wasting peoples time fun & I have no right to tell him otherwise...You just read practicall every comment saying exactly that so it doesnt matter whats "Supposed" to happen mate.

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6 minutes ago, (XBOX)SwiftBMF said:

Supposed to be but we both know thats not how it actually works,in real life just like public lobbys everything revolves around the idividual & there own self fulfilment.

Like the guys who stand just off of extraction dancing while 3 others are on it untill it auto extracts just because thats what they want to do because they find winding people up & wasting peoples time fun & I have no right to tell him otherwise...You just read practicall every comment saying exactly that so it doesnt matter whats "Supposed" to happen mate.

Ngl, I do that exact extraction thing to people with rude behavior/chat, minus the dancing/emotes. Especially the ones that uber rush exterminate/capture missions in SP or murmer runs, because they reduce the amount of spawns you get and usually don't even clear each room before proceeding to the next. Sometimes I'll run off and look for Ayatans while I wait for the countdown. Doesn't hurt me to make an impatient person wait, especially when they are ruining the mission. There are some unspoken etiquette for pubs, so if people want to violate them, they are free to do so--at their own risk.

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5 minutes ago, FrostDragoon said:

Ngl, I do that exact extraction thing to people with rude behavior/chat, minus the dancing/emotes. Especially the ones that uber rush exterminate/capture missions in SP or murmer runs, because they reduce the amount of spawns you get and usually don't even clear each room before proceeding to the next. Sometimes I'll run off and look for Ayatans while I wait for the countdown. Doesn't hurt me to make an impatient person wait, especially when they are ruining the mission. There are some unspoken etiquette for pubs, so if people want to violate them, they are free to do so--at their own risk.

Bold mine.

That sounds just like an elementary schoolyard playground to me, the actions and reactions you describe are incredibly sophomoric and petty from my POV.

I simply don't understand why people subject themselves to that kind of atmosphere, it's baffling to me.

The Internet is a strange and terrifying place.

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10 minutes ago, Zimzala said:

Bold mine.

That sounds just like an elementary schoolyard playground to me, the actions and reactions you describe are incredibly sophomoric and petty from my POV.

I simply don't understand why people subject themselves to that kind of atmosphere, it's baffling to me.

The Internet is a strange and terrifying place.

As you guys keep saying, if you don't like it, don't join pubs. 😉

I told you it was easy to turn these things around.

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I don't know if this has been said, but Warframe is a game about murder, so ostensibly you should always stab your lich at every opportunity. Everyone who doesn't stab their lich, is a failure as a tenno, and disappoints me personally.

It's not about the loot, it's about sending a message.

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