Jump to content

The awkwardness of (some) Melee stances


0_The_F00l

Recommended Posts

Background:

I recently got the last tenet melee weapon - the tenet livia - i remembered using tatsu and pennant , the only other 2H nikanas , but never really felt they were that great as weapons.

I had some hope for the livia as the stats and quirks seemed interesting.

So here i am going about using the tenet livia , its doing decent damage i am not facing any issues with enemies , and it can pull of some interesting fashion.

BUT, i just feel tired using it for some reason,

i tried to narrow down on the issues,

I modded it a little differently , shifted between light and heavy builds , tried crit , status and hybrid builds,

Maxed out speed , used arcanes to boost damage even further

Added weird elemental combos and weirder frame abilities,

tried different level enemies (from 40 to 100),

But it still felt awkward, then i saw the one thing i had taken for granted , cause there really is no option for it.

The Wise razor stance - the only stance in the game for 2H Nikanas.

It feels so absolutely S#&$ that i am not in the mood to use it, and i don't think i will forma it any further.

Now i am not one to chase the META, i like weapons cause how they feel , not cause of how much damage they provide (of course they do need to perform adequately well and not be an actual handicap) and honestly melee does not need more damage.

i discussed this in the clan chat and they did agree that using wise razor on the 2H nikanas was the equivalent of dipping flowers in S#&$e. Normally i get some "but hey i like that stance" cause not everyone has the same pacing and play style but i did not see anyone defending the wise razor.

So it got me thinking , how many good weapons are never used cause the stances suck and made an off hand comment "if only we could helminth away some of the crap stance moves".

and it hit me ... yeah , why not?

Actual Topic

So here i am discussing about customizing stances.

My thinking is that weapons will be put in much broader categories and can switch between their combos through some "yet to be developed macguffin" (maybe Teshin can help) that lets you customize your martial prowess.

And i dont mean use any stance mod between them , i mean tempo royale smash , during crushing ruin spin followed by staff vault while using a 2H nikana (just an example).

i have considered the following categorization for now, some weapons are far too unique mechanically to be able to use other stances , but they could still use customization within their categories ( like eleventh storm block attacks + final harbinger forward momentum attacks for sword and shields):

Heavy 2H Hammer, Greatsword , Polearm, Staff. 2H Nikana
Medium 1H Sword , machete , scythe, nikana, rapier
Medium Akimbo Dual sword , Tonfa
Light Akimbo Warfans, claws, dual daggers
Martial Fists , sparring
Light 1H Dagger
Sword and Shield Sword and shield
nunchaku nunchaku
Whips whips
Blade and whip Blade and whip
Glaive Glaive
Gunblade Gunblade

 

you may need to jump though a few hoops (or not) to acquire this ability , but i would like to know if you would be interested in mixing and matching your stance combos?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i dont think we need to combine groups in such a huge manner. and that 2h heavy group looks way off. polearms and staves can work fine but those stances would look glitched as hell on heavy blades or two handed nikanas. in fact i think similar issues would be in all of those new categories.

what we need is simply more stance options. it would be way easier to provide at least one generally liked stance to every weapon class than to do this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

38 minutes ago, Zeclem said:

i dont think we need to combine groups in such a huge manner. and that 2h heavy group looks way off. polearms and staves can work fine but those stances would look glitched as hell on heavy blades or two handed nikanas. in fact i think similar issues would be in all of those new categories.

what we need is simply more stance options. it would be way easier to provide at least one generally liked stance to every weapon class than to do this.

I don't think the animations will be an issue , we already have weird cross weapons (volnus is a hammer when it very clearly should be a heavy axe, plague keewar 2H is a staff when it should be a great scythe , there are many skins that also seem to be mismatched )

The categorisation is just an example for reference , we can expand or converge it based on more discussions.

As to the creation of new stances , saying "they should make liked stances "  implies they have intentionally made disliked stances.

And while they could keep adding new weapons (just like they add frames ) they have also given use the helminth system which allows you to play the same frame differently. So why not weapons as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, about Wise Razor - when it was initially released (and with older combo/melee phase) it was awsome. Then it was "tuned in" and now, despite me running with Tatsu alot (not really a fan of Pennant and don't have tenet one yet) it feels sluggish now. Not horrible, but it was initially WAY batter...

Edit. Yup, as mentioned above, some weapons are in wrong cattegory (heavy scythes and such), or are oversized (or downsized) type - like our current scythes are oversized sickles, axes are heavy blades (kind-off fits, though), you get the picture...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have to say, I'm always a bit impressed when I hear about players actually using the various combo's within stance mods.  On xbox (for me at least), they always seem incredibly clunky and I really can't be bothered memorising half a dozen combo's 4-6 key presses long for each stance.   It's maybe easier on pc with a kb.

I'm an E masher ;-)

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, (XBOX)Hyperion Rexx said:

Have to say, I'm always a bit impressed when I hear about players actually using the various combo's within stance mods.  On xbox (for me at least), they always seem incredibly clunky and I really can't be bothered memorising half a dozen combo's 4-6 key presses long for each stance.   It's maybe easier on pc with a kb.

I'm an E masher ;-)

 

I am surprised console players can actually pull off half the stuff that exists in this game without connecting an aftermarket controller or kb.

And I suppose it is easier to manage on pc.

Anyway , you want your eeeeeee combo for one weapon to actually function like another ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For me I hate the lifted effect, because it ragdolls them across the room if the hit didn't kill and I'm not using a dot build. I'm trying to kill them, either for exterminate missions or to keep War Cry's duration going, etc. and now I'm wasting my time playing fetch. So weapons stances that have lift in their combo are a no go for me which limit my choices or even removes an entire weapon category if the other stances aren't to my liking.

More stances or an ability to customize stances would be a welcome addition.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

33 minutes ago, DemonHoundRider said:

For me I hate the lifted effect, because it ragdolls them across the room if the hit didn't kill and I'm not using a dot build. I'm trying to kill them, either for exterminate missions or to keep War Cry's duration going, etc. and now I'm wasting my time playing fetch. So weapons stances that have lift in their combo are a no go for me which limit my choices or even removes an entire weapon category if the other stances aren't to my liking.

More stances or an ability to customize stances would be a welcome addition.

speaking about lifted effects there is one that yeets enemies into another dimension, of course i talk about the reaping spiral, its so ridiculous and entertaining to see a nox being flung to the sky  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

yes, another 2HN Stance would be really nice. before the last melee changes the flip appeared too soon in the combo, now on the occasions I call for it, it's right at the end. the forward R2 combo with the AoE also feels pretty clunky. on the normal starchart missions and lower level railjack I'm usually killing everything with the basic 3 swing spam combo, so the combos aren't really an issue. but on Steel path or Veil Missions, you gotta use full combo to proc elements properly, or to AoE groups, and that's where the clunkiness lies.

I'd be fine if we just had a two-handed version of Swooping Falcon, or Vengeful Revenant: the single sword stances flow nicely, and look good IMO. that said, I'd appreciate just getting more of these &^%$&* Holokeys  so I can buy the Tenet Exec and Tenet Agendus: heavy blades and Sword & board class weapons are more fun to work with long term IMO.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, (XBOX)Hyperion Rexx said:

Have to say, I'm always a bit impressed when I hear about players actually using the various combo's within stance mods.  On xbox (for me at least), they always seem incredibly clunky and I really can't be bothered memorising half a dozen combo's 4-6 key presses long for each stance.   It's maybe easier on pc with a kb.

I'm an E masher ;-)

 

There's nothing to really memorize anymore though. You have 2 things that influence your attacks: Moving forward or not moving forward and blocking or not blocking. You can combine the two actions to form the 4 combos (most) stances (should) have:

  1. Not moving forward (+ not blocking)
  2. Moving forward (+ not blocking)
  3. (Not moving forward +) blocking
  4. Moving forward + blocking

The rest is just actually pressing what you have melee bound to.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...