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Yareli Movement & Stat Changes!


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Exciting changes! Finally some word on Yareli! 

 

So,  first off, those dashing changes to Merulina look phenomenal. It at least addresses the biggest problem yareli has with aerial movement. Good stuff. Can't wait to try it.

25% increased range on riptide is nice, and *might* be enough but riptide's range (or lack thereof) wasn't it's biggest issue.  Horrible cast time and that explosion doesn't help at all. If we could get a little bit of time in the ball (like an exploding larva) or maybe a Hold/Tap functionality that gives us some options with it? As it stands, raw cold damage and a poor man's vortex isn't good

Aquablade's range is (contrary to belief) fine. It's the giant DEADZONE in the middle that's bad. Giving it another meter or two only serves to make the ability even MORE frustrating to deal damage with. Make it scale with range, just do it INWARD. Problem solved. Hopefully the damage increase will help, and the extra duration might mean I cast it on my high range builds.  

and finally, we get to sea snares.  What a lousy ability. Seek time will help? Maybe? The real issue is that even though it cannot go through walls, it LOVES to target enemies on the other side of walls, cover, pillars, basically any and everything that will get in the way. More often than not most of my bubbles either a) target the same enemy or b) slam into a wall the second I cast it. Zero synergy with her kit, no priming no extra anything. I take time to cast it, wait for it to pick up mooks, only for me to what? shoot them? wait for it to deal the 300 or so damage it's going to do? Why would I ever cast sea snares in it's current (or proposed) form??

 

Overall, If this is the extent of changes Yareli is going to get, color me disappointed. Don't get me wrong, the dash is a godsend and while the raw stat changes are appreciated, I honestly think they solve virtually nothing that the community has elevated as problems. I and I'm sure many other tenno here were expecting if not "better" changes, at least more creative ones. 

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6 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Sea Snares:
-Increase seek speed by about 60% and slightly increase bubble visibility to better register your casts. 

Why do the Snares get destroyed when they come into contact with solid objects/the environment? Change it to prevent that from being destroyed.

6 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Aquablades:
-Increase range by just about 25%
-Increase damage and duration by 50%

Aquablades do very little at the moment, even with the repeated Slash procs. While ability synergy isn't always required for good frame gameplay/kits, Aquablades do almost nothing while having nearly no interaction with Yareli's kit. Some ideas for changes:

  • Have the Blades absorb and multiply parts of the damage Yareli/Merulina takes, then adding to its damage
  • Hitting enemies Snared by Sea Snares with the Blades will release a small healing pulse capable of healing Merulina, Yareli, and her allies. Something slightly stronger than Titania's Upsurge passive, but it should be far weaker than Wisp's Health Mote.
  • Hold to fire the Blades like the Cedo's Alt-Fire elemental glaive, where it bounces and homes onto enemies. Tap to make the Blades into the defensive stance, similar to the current implementation of Aquablades.
  • Have the damage registration be a circle, not a ring. This means that currently. enemies too close to Yareli won't take any damage.

Finally, while Merulina offers several QoL perks compared to normal K-Drives, certain tilesets is near impossible to use Merulina in (Corpus Ice Planet, Infested Corpus Shp). Merulina's movement should be more fluid along with the rest of K-Drives. While this is similar to Hildryn's Aegis Storm changes, there needs to be more especially for Yareli/

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Have there been any changes to increase Merulina's general air control? A big issue with her mobility is that she doesn't have any float control while in midair, and while the roll change will help with that, being entirely at the mercy of your initial jump trajectory is a bit limiting especially in scenarios where you are jumping from somewhere that you can't get a very good runup.

Have any considerations been made for allowing primaries to be used on Merulina? Being restricted to secondaries isn't fun as it kills any loadout variety on her, and at higher levels you need Merulina's damage reduction to reliably survive, limiting her in a way that can't really be worked around.

Is it possible that Merulina could be allowed to bowl through enemies ala Gauss' mach crash, at the very least on the new dash? It's super unsatisfying to bonk an enemy that stepped into your way as k-drives are heavily reliant on momentum due to their slow acceleration.

Can Sea Snares perhaps be given a little more? Their big problem is that they don't actually do much to speed up your kills, and considering Merulina is all about going fast and keeping a flow going, and having to recast them every few seconds doesn't help as it interrupts your flow. It'd be nice if they made enemies in their grasp more vulnerable to damage, and/or automatically sook out new targets when their initial victim died. Just something so that they don't require as much micromanagement and to give us more of a reason for casting them.

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Really nice buffs, but I was hoping to see a few other things: 

K-Drive Mods on Merulina. Some could be restricted if need be, but I think it would add a unique flavor to Merulina and make use of otherwise irrelevant Mods.

A reason to kill with, or otherwise use, Aquablades over shooting or her ult. She's kinda being pulled between 3 different playstyles that, with a little tweaking, could all fuse into one symphony of aquatic destruction. 
A few suggestions for this would be: Damaging an enemy trapped in Sea Snares with Aquablades drops a Sea Gift from them when they die. Sea Gifts heal Merulina, replenishes ammo to players, and grants secondary weapons 25% Ammo Efficiency for 10s. Ulti helps with this by killing them later on.  
This is just an example suggestion of something that can be done to tie the playstyle together. It is not the only option.

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Why isn't Merulina moddable? It should be an Exalted K-Drive. Give more of a reason to obtain K-Drive mods. Also, buffing the damage and duration of Aquablades isn't going to change the fact that the power has really nothing going for it. All it does is deal menial, non scaling Slash damage and stagger enemies that (for whatever illogical reason) isn't affected by range mods. Which isn't helpful as Yareli will be on her K-Drive at all times pretty much anyways. The player won't be able to take advantage of the additional Mercy opportunities. Also, I still don't understand why we can't use Primary weapons on K-Drives. That would help Yareli a lot in of itself rather than restricting her to Secondary weapons. The other buffs are.... fine I guess and the additional movement options are a nice QOL, but in the end Yareli remains a fun but ultimately confusing, unfinished mess of a frame that needs a serious Xaku tier revamp. No idea why you guys aren't planning on any Warframe reworks. I'd very much like to see the data that allegedly suggests that reworks don't lead to frames being played more often because that sounds ridiculous. Ever since Zephyr got her rework, I've played as her much more often legitimately rather than just "haha birb go zoom" in the open world areas. I'm not the only one either. I've seen many more people play as Zephyr within the last 6 months than I had for years as someone who plays every day. I know that alone isn't enough to disprove actual hard data but man it would be nice to see the data that supports this claim. Yareli, Hydroid, Nyx, and Chroma are all frames that are in desperate need of reworks whether it be because they don't hold up well to other frames or they simply aren't as fun. I was very excited for this frame and its honestly a real shame that she hasn't been given the same amount of love and care that Xaku got after their initial release to make them fun, unique, and useful.

Edited by DawnoftheWhiteFury
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7 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Yareli improvements are incoming, Tenno! You’ve been patiently waiting for word on what changes will come to our latest Warframe, and this Dev Workshop covers our current plans for her kit. Read on!

We have 2 areas that are being buffed: Stats, and Utility. 

Utility Changes: We are introducing a foundational change to Yareli’s movement: Merulina Dashing (tap Roll/Dash)! 

This can be executed in any direction and is effectively a new way to close gaps (or quickly retreat!) and alter the direction of Yareli aboard Merulina! This also enhances the way you can traverse vertically with responsive directional input while in the air. We’ve made a handy .gif to demonstrate just what we mean: 
 


What you see in this .gif is a vertical traversal that’s currently tough to do with Yareli. However,  with the forward dash the momentum movement now allows for directional maneuvering. Then, we see Yareli Dash both Forward AND Back in the .gif, showing how you can certainly take advantage of this new movement tool!

This is a change that’s best experienced in your hands, but it is certainly a huge improvement for navigating all of Warframes tilesets! 

We have also made some changes to general Merulina movement by allowing for shorter jumps, and reducing overall jump charge time.

Yareli Stat Changes:
We’ve made some Stat changes to Yareli’s abilities as well. These are buffs across the board, and details are as follows: 

Sea Snares:
-Increase seek speed by about 60% and slightly increase bubble visibility to better register your casts. 


Aquablades:
-Increase range by just about 25%
-Increase damage and duration by 50%
 

RipTide:
Bigger is better. The bigger we Rip, the more enemies, the better scaling, and so on!
-Increase radius by 25%
 

You can look forward to this in our next update, Tenno! 

Cheers! 

So in other words you've done nothing to yareli? Congratulations shes still going to blow goats, rework her and just abandon her

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7 hours ago, Fairmoon said:

awesome, now if only there was an easier way (other than Platinum) of getting her, I'm not good at snowboarding/skateboarding games and I'm stuck on page 4 of Waverrider, I am unable to do any of the grinding or anything to get a combo up to 1500 pts and previous pages were only scored by just launching off highest tower in Fortuna and doing tricks on the way down. Yareli looks like a lot of fun but until I either invest in the platinum to buy her I'm unable to complete the Waverider quest

 

Long pipe next to Fortuna. Grind on it, when you come close to its end, jump, do 180°, take care to land on it again, keep grinding, repeat.

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Will you consider changing Sea Snares so they don't pop on contact with an obstacle?

Their homing/targetting goes for enemies behind walls or cover, and pops on contact rendering them useless most of the time.

I thought having an army of floating orbs would be fun, similar to Vauban's teslas, but instead they just nullify themselves on even the most minor corner and don't reach enemies.

If not, at least let them pass through objects or go around them.

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I hope this changed merulina wouldn't stuck in the door. Ability change solve only one thing; sea snares's seek speed. Aquablades still has no level scaling or way to increase damage even conditionally. Riptide also has no level scaling and it still scatter gathered enemies. Yareli with Merulina can use only secondary weapon and this isn't match well with Aquablades. Make condition that makes aquablades temporaily more usefull. These are examples; when dash with merulina 50% more range and 300% initial damage, enemies that caught by sea snares take double damage to aquablades, when perform landing slam with aquablades slam radius will increase and guarantee to slash proc. And suggests for riptide; if there are any dragged enemies suffer from sea snares, last blast won't scatter enemies, if enemies bleeding by aquablades get caught up in riptide, last blast of riptide will cause slash proc that based by blast's damage.

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4 hours ago, Perfectly_Framed_Waifu said:

Not that DE seems to care about giving overpowered frame abilities to Helminth anymore.

  Hide contents

754303e95ad3e4f73a32c4566422b7894b104b27

 

I should expand on my thoughts, cause reacting with a laugh emote cause your post is funny AF is fun, but it isn't feedback. 

I feel like Gloom is a reminder that they only did the "pre-nerfs" in the first place, because a bunch of vets like Zilchy, Voltage and a slew of others were like "bruh you are just going to nerf these abilities in subsumed form down the line anyways, so just do it before they are released and there will be less drama" (And I mean most of us saw that coming tbh) and they got it for THAT particular situation. 

But I don't think they learned a general lesson for subsumed abilities. I think they are going to let Gloom go too long instead of pre-nerfing it because they don't want to throw too much cold water on the excitement for a recently released frame, and are going to end up dealing with greatly increased backlash when they do inevitably nerf its subsumed version. 

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Sea Snares

How about making it do Cold procs as well. And the bubbles burst to affect multiple enemies. (Maybe make it a hold/tap difference. Tap will lift enemies like it currently does, but could work like follows if held)

Then, release an augment down the line that makes the ability work like saryn spores but in the form of cold procs i.e it will make an alternative to Slowva but using the mechanics similar to Saryn spores.

Merulina

It's health could scale like Nezha's Warding Halo, allowing to be invulnerable for 2-3 seconds and converting all the damage dealt to Merulina's health.

While on merulina, we can have a cycle ability, that allows '+50% str / +50% range / +50% duration / +50% efficiency' flat on the casts. This would greatly help with build diversity if anyone wants to kill faster using more str or maybe cc more enemies with a bit more range or have the cc / blades last longer or even messed up energy economy. Tapping 2 will go into merulina, holding 2 will cycle through the buffs. Default being str. The buffs is permanent while on merulina but lasts for only 10 seconds (unmoddable) when exiting the k-drive.

Aquablades

Instead of the current 3 procs every tick/second, it would be better to have 3 procs every 0.5 seconds. Effectively doubling the damage instead of increasing the best damage. Or maybe allow Casting speed to affect how often the ticks occur. Might be something unique and fun.

A fun thing: if the ability is held, it could create 4 frontal vertical glaives spinning in front of yareli. Similar to some car in mad max. And this could deal like 4 slash procs every 0.5 secs or something. Mowing down through enemies like shredding paper or something?

Rip Tide

I think it should be a 1 hand animation instead of the current 2 handed. Since while casting the ability itself, yareli is prone to damage. The casting (in my opinion) is a quite slow.

For the enemies affected by rip tide but survived, should have a debuff thrown upon them. Like 2x vulnerable to damage from any source, and the visual could be similar to microwave effect / an indicator on their head similar to when garuda uses her ultimate on enemies. This 2x vulnerability is also affected by strength and the duration of the debuff is affected by the duration. This 2x vulnerability can stack on top if itself allowing for 2x, 4x, 8x, ... if multipe yarelis / multiple casts of rip tide. (Call this debuff, soggy).

This vulnerability could double dip if the enemy is attacked/damaged by a status type. (Basically similar to that of sickening pulse cast) OR the base damage of Rip Tide increases additively based upon the number of lifted enemies i.e. number of enemies  affected by sea snares. (0x enemies = 1x base damage, 1x enemy = 2x base damage, 2x enemies = 3x base damage, ...)

 

Sorry to not say this earlier in the comment, I love the demonstrated movement changes :)

Might as well make yareli's collusion size reduced ~20% allowing for easy lesser collusions with the doors, etc

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Thank you for giving buffs to Yareli, however there is still no synergy between her abilities.

Giving her for sole scaling the number of enemies she catches in her 4 makes her a worst Grendel as a casterframe.

Her CC is not good, and her passive doesn't go with the rest of her kit. What is she supposed to be in a team?

 

And I need to point something out:

Sea Snares:
-Increase seek speed by about 60% and slightly increase bubble visibility to better register your casts. 

This serves NO purpose, as Sea Snares still seek enemies through walls but cannot pass walls without popping.

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I like the dash given to merulina, it seems like a good replacement for a roll/bullet jump. However, there are some things that could still be improved on merulina (and k-drives in general).

  • Aim-gliding:
    • Aim-gliding in Warframe is one of those surprising mechanics you would never think to be that important to gameplay, but trying to jump, aim and shoot on a k-drive has shown how annoying not having it is. being able to aim-glide on a k-drive would solve more problems than just being able to aim easier, such as maneuverability. Aim-gliding allows you to take much more precise movements, and with how jumping on a k-drive is, we need all the help we can get.
  • Standardized jump height:
    • I would recommend, rather than a sliding scale for jump height, there should be 3 stages. a quick tap would be the 1st stage, after 1-2 seconds you would get the second stage, and fully charged would be the final stage. Of course, jump charge speed mods may need to be looked at to make sure they are usable. Double jumps would use the same stage as you had charged.
  • "Wall-riding":
    • there are countless user reports about trying to go over what seemed like a small bump, but actually sent them rag-dolling off their k-drive, and as funny as that is to watch, there's got to be a better way. while real-world skateboards can have trouble with a random pebble on the sidewalk, this is a hover-board, it can just float over such obstacles. But what about walls, sometimes doors don't open in time (that's actually a different and much broader issue, doors should have larger detecting range for when to open up), or maybe you just didn't see a barrier and couldn't react in time. What if, instead of flinging us of the board, we simply rode up the wall. the distance upwards could depend on the speed that you're going, and if you reach the top, you simply ride over and back onto the ground on the other side. "well what about ceilings," then the board will simply turn around and ride down the wall (I know that isn't simple, but you understood that bringing a vehicle into main missions would bring issues, so that's on you). in a perfect world, we could ride on the ceiling, but that seems a little far-fetched. Also, if the wall is approached at an angle, the board will still go up the wall, continuing the trajectory of the board. last thing, this wouldn't change the camera of player, as all of this can be just lower body animations. all of that would make traversing narrow spaces much more fluid and fun
    • to add onto this, If you were to reach the top of a wall and there wasn't a ceiling, like in outdoor tile sets, you would go over the edge and be back on the ground at the top of the wall.
  • Side inputs while boosting:
    • When you input a side direction, such as a or d on keyboard, while you are boosting on a k-drive, instead of strafing like you do when you aren't boosting, you turn. This makes traversing a level while boosting significantly harder, I don't want to turn, I just wanted to move to the side out of the way of a barrier. We already have a way of turning, through the camera controls.
  • Increase friction:
    • Look I get it, its a hover board, it seems like it should be floaty, but learn from your previous mistakes with archwings. You removed the leftover momentum so you could stop on a dime, and it worked, archwings are much more usable and enjoyable now. And archwings literally float, if anything was to be floaty, it would be that.

That's all I could think of, I may add more later. Either way, these changes to k-drives in general, not just merulina, could make them much more fun.

Edited by budderchew
fixing grammer issues
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In all honesty while these buff are good, sea snares should be your focus imo, I think you should make an augment that when theyre killed in a bubble it spawns another bubble or 2 and chains to more enemies, give it some more scaling and youll have a very solid frame for even high level content

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All decent additions, in their realm of effect.

I'm gonna wait for the update to launch and review the bugfixes for her because she is currently riddled with them. Maybe after the fixes we can hope to see more advanced mechanical changes to her kit, rather than basic stats.

 

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Yareli comes out of her sprint toggle when getting off merulina, it's really annoying at times when you have to disengage merulina to traverse some points quickly, andhave to shift toggle again, breaks the flow. Also happened during lavos, sprint toggle turns off after vial rush, but that feed back fell on deaf ears. 

Other suggestions: 

1) Add aim glide to merulina while jumping

2) shrink her size to atleast ventkid level, just try in your game engine and see, I bet navigation would vastly improve. Its the same reason why titania isn't a full blown archwing sized in her ultimate. That's why she can navigate as easily as she can. Not saying to shrink yareli as small as titania, but atleast the size of those kids. Like by 25%. Will help a lot. she literaly gets stuck on normal grineer and ship corpus maps. u can't afford to crouch every single door. imagine telling ppl to crouch on foot to pass every door. ruins the momentum

3) bug fixes for vaccum on kdrive. When you're not a host, vaccum often doesn't work on clients. You've to get off merulina to collect things. 

4) perhaps aqua blades, rip tide dmg can be scaled up to some percentage of dmg absorbed by merulina. Scaling dmg is what's required or else it really doesn't matter how much % dmg increase u give on base stats. Its still gonna be insignificant at some level. 

5) let idle sea snares catch enemies once they are ability range. For example my sea snare range is 50m. But if enemies aren't initially in 50m it'll sit idle near some 2-5 m of the ability cast location and it catches enemies only when they are like almost point blank range to the idle sea snare bubble. Why not just let the bubble catch the enemy after its in the idle state.

6) 

33 minutes ago, budderchew said:

Increase friction:

  • Look I get it, its a hover board, it seems like it should be floaty, but learn from what your previous mistakes with archwings. You removed the leftover momentum so you could stop on a dime, and it worked, archwings are much more usable and enjoyable now. and archwings literally float, if anything was to be floaty would be that.

 

7) her passive should have a grace time? you literally can't keep moving literally every single time just to get extra cc on ur gun. zephyr doesn't have the condition to only get cc when u in the air but 'also moving' if u stop moving u stop getting cc. zephyr can stay stagnant and get cc .

 

Edited by krrysis.
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Lack of actual synergy across abilities is what makes her boring and then we can talk about clunky K-drive and survivability issues. Compare ability synergy to atlas. I probabaly dont want frame that's easy to get to powercreep hard to farm frames but currently she is just a flop no matter which stats gets buffed. Not a single dual cast or hold cast on any ability. Just as boring as octavia but not as op. Also the ult cast time is too long for it to be so short lived. With a lot of effort and helminth I can make her ult kill steel path corpus (and survive holing up in a corner) but which aoe doesnt? 

Edited by DhatZ
Completeness
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11 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

What you see in this .gif is a vertical traversal that’s currently tough to do with Yareli. However,  with the forward dash the momentum movement now allows for directional maneuvering. Then, we see Yareli Dash both Forward AND Back in the .gif, showing how you can certainly take advantage of this new movement tool!

This feature should also be applied on regular K-Drives.

For example, using forward dash while during K-Drive Boost will let players reach places faster.

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I normally reserve judgement until i actually try the changes but this does not feel like it will alter my opinion and willingness to use her (which is rather low),

The movement system should help with the traversal a little , BUT i dont see any vertical movement as mentioned in the notes , i only see a horizontal dash AFTER a jump which already suffers from vertical control, will the dash be omni directional , i.e. it just dashes wherever i am aiming?

The stat changes... i really dont see helping her significantly, She needs mechanical/synergy changes more than any stat buffs.

Seasnares will definitely be better with the seek speed.

Aquablades i have mixed feeling about , when you say range , do you mean the radius of the blades themselves or the distance from yareli? A larger blade radius would be nice , but them being further while still having the same radius will not be helping (unless their speed is also increased).

Riptide , i guess is better? doesnt change the fact that it is expensive, you are rather vulnerable during the cast , you cant actually do anything to the enemies while grouped and then it spreads enemies around which is not ideal for a grouping ability.

And no mention of Merulina stats ? she really needs a better means of self sustain , either by being able to regain health (for merulina) or boost the max health in some way (in mission , not just strength based). Being able to mod her would also be a good start.

Honestly , these changes arent bad but they arent good enough by themselves to make her worthwhile for me. Its like me asking for some coke with my burger and fries abut i only get extra salt in my fries and more onion in my burger, its technically more than what i have but ultimately not what i wanted.

Edited by 0_The_F00l
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