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Public fissures are toxic when new relics drop, time for a change?


(PSN)oo-pH-oo

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42 minutes ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

Why not? if its a public group, and the randos will be carrying random junk relics, then who cares how many there are?

In fact why don't you just run Solo fissures if you aren't trying to unlock anything specific?

 

Are you wanting a full squad on the chance that one of them is carrying something good for you to pick? Sounds like you're fishing just as much as the people you're complaining about.

Just because you aren't leeching Nidus, doesn't mean you aren't still leeching.

If you want to run a full squad, in the hopes of getting something good, that doesn't make you a leach. It means that your chances of getting something better than a 15 ducat part have gone from poor to decent, and greatly increased the chances that you got a hundred ducat part (although the chances still aren't great.) If I see a part that I don't have, that's awesome, but at this point, it rarely happens for me, and it's not something that I'm expecting at all.

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33 minutes ago, T-Shark69 said:

OP is asking for a cure instead of a bandaid.

OOO that is like 100% accurate i 100% agree
Problem here is some of us could not like the cure being forced upon us while means to avoid initial problem are still here

No 1 here wants to have leechers in their squad
We simply dont want to be limited because someone is to lazy to form a squad like EVERYONE ELSE do when we dont like what pure random squads have to offer

So yeah problem is 1 of us dont understand here something

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6 minutes ago, ZeroX4 said:

OOO that is like 100% accurate i 100% agree
Problem here is some of us could not like the cure being forced upon us while means to avoid initial problem are still here

No 1 here wants to have leechers in their squad
We simply dont want to be limited because someone is to lazy to form a squad like EVERYONE ELSE do when we dont like what pure random squads have to offer

So yeah problem is 1 of us dont understand here something

the problem isn't the leeching itself, but bugging missions and dragging others into those bugs. Leeching in warframe rarely impacts anyone.... And again, this isn't about creating squads, but having a deep meaningful conversation with a mutalist moa while drinking some hot chimurr  would be more productive than keep going in circles about this with you, pal.

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1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

the problem isn't the leeching itself, but bugging missions and dragging others into those bugs.

Cool so you just admit core problem is about host migration and that should be fixed

Because imagine what would happen if OPs idea came to life and we would not see other squad mates relic while we go to public squad to do fissure
And ppl would still leave the squad for whatever reason and bug mission for other players

But same as OP many ppl here didnt even think that trough
His idea would solve nothing would add frustration and tons of outrage posts to revert the change so they can see other players relics while we still have bugged missions due host migration

But what can i know? Seems mutalist moa would have better grasp on what is the real problem here ;)

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2 minutes ago, ZeroX4 said:

Cool so you just admit core problem is about host migration and that should be fixed

Because imagine what would happen if OPs idea came to life and we would not see other squad mates relic while we go to public squad to do fissure
And ppl would still leave the squad for whatever reason and bug mission for other players

But same as OP many ppl here didnt even think that trough
His idea would solve nothing would add frustration and tons of outrage posts to revert the change so they can see other players relics while we still have bugged missions due host migration

But what can i know? Seems mutalist moa would have better grasp on what is the real problem here ;)

Removing a potential incentive for players to leave intentionally (like not seeing the relic they want in a PUB of all places) decreases the odds of someone leaving and causing issues. It's the exact same circumstance that caused DE to make rewards show as "unidentified" until you finish the mission.

There is literally no negative repercussions to hiding relic info in a random public match until the reward selection screen pops up. As everyone going into a pub should not have the expectation of seeing specific relics, those who do hold such expectations are the ones who should be going to recruitment chat. The only possible exception would be pub endless missions where it could be helpful to see relics selected after the first A rotation.

 

Not sure why I threw my hat into this mess but man this thread has been a frustrating read...

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12 hours ago, (PSN)oo-pH-oo said:

 

These 'quitters' have an option to form a group,

That's never going to happen....

They don't have the new relics themselves so they are trying to get freebies from the players that do.... What sort of Groups are these types of players going to form ? 😱

12 hours ago, (PSN)oo-pH-oo said:

 

These 'quitters' have an option to form a group

12 hours ago, ZeroX4 said:

But like you dont?

Good point 😝 !!

11 hours ago, T-Shark69 said:

Hes not trying to get specific drops. We shouldnt have to form premade squads to leisuerly crack relics just because people wanna leech. 

That word gets thrown around alot these days...

 

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5 hours ago, trst said:

Removing a potential incentive for players to leave intentionally (like not seeing the relic they want in a PUB of all places) decreases the odds of someone leaving and causing issues. It's the exact same circumstance that caused DE to make rewards show as "unidentified" until you finish the mission.

There is literally no negative repercussions to hiding relic info in a random public match until the reward selection screen pops up. As everyone going into a pub should not have the expectation of seeing specific relics, those who do hold such expectations are the ones who should be going to recruitment chat. The only possible exception would be pub endless missions where it could be helpful to see relics selected after the first A rotation.

 

Not sure why I threw my hat into this mess but man this thread has been a frustrating read...

I leave squad whenever on defense i see wisp frost slow nova or vauban
So i would cause host migration and bugs for players left in that squad and many ppl do exact same thing
Some leave for other reasons while some leave at random

And no reward would make us stay anyway
So OPs solution could only help to negate some host migrations on fissures but would not fix the problem

Its same case scenario as preventing ppl from bringing inaros to defense
It would not magically make ppl bring offensive frames to defense it only would prevent them from bringing inaros
In same regard OPs solution would not prevent ppl from leaving fissures after new prime parts are released
It only would make ppl not see each other relics on public squads while ppl would still leave for whatever reason

So again OPs solution would solve nothing other than maybe letting him more efficiently leech on loot of other ppl
Which is what he want prevent other ppl from doing in the first place which is kinda hypocritical

When simple solution for him to take at least 1 person with him so he or that person be host and then 2 random players would join or leave but no harm would be made
But nope! We need to change system for everyone so OP can leech in peace

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3 hours ago, ZeroX4 said:

Its same case scenario as preventing ppl from bringing inaros to defense

No it's not. Literally everything you said has nothing to do with what OP is saying. Your analogies are extremely bad.

 

3 hours ago, ZeroX4 said:

When simple solution for him to take at least 1 person with him so he or that person be host and then 2 random players would join or leave but no harm would be made
But nope! We need to change system for everyone so OP can leech in peace

Meme Wtf GIF

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3 hours ago, trst said:

The only possible exception would be pub endless missions where it could be helpful to see relics selected after the first A rotation

I agree, surprises myself!

The only time you need to know what relic anyone has equipped is in the relic selection screen that you get in between missions. You don't see this in the loading screen, only after each rotation where you can choose to stay or leave. Though, TBH its too late then, but if you don't like the other's selection, too bad, maybe they don't like yours!

So in other words, the fix is simply to remove the relic listed in the player list you get off the ESC menu. That's it.

5 hours ago, ZeroX4 said:

I leave squad whenever on defense i see wisp frost slow nova or vauban

Then you are the griefer.

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21 hours ago, krc473 said:

That’s not a viable option. Everyone is in your squad so nothing will happen.

Slightly off topic, but we have need a better squad system forever.  This is the worst matchmaking in any game I have personally played.  Not only is it incredibly buggy just joining pub squads half the time, but there's literally no party system.  There's no option to form a group that stays until someone decides to leave or the party leader disbands.  In a squad and want to stay together?  Don't visit a Dojo or Relay unless you want to run missions from there or have to reinvite every single damn time you leave one of them.  At an open world hub and want to go run fissures?  Better pray there's no "failed to join" f*ckery happening when you all go back to orbiters because heaven forbid they do what nearly every other game does and let us create an actual squad that doesn't get randomly disbanded.  

Most of us are used to it now, probably to the point that other experienced players think I'm making a mountain out of a molehill but I can remember how I felt about it when I started, how all my friends felt about it when they were new and how nearly ever new person I play with feels about it.  You explain you're going to get auto disbanded and every single one of them things it's stupid.  

If we had the option to actually form a squad you could do exactly what OP was talking about.  Premade squads could see each other's relics and pub joiners could not.  Which would go a long way to fixing multiple issues all at the same time.

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Am 9.9.2021 um 12:39 schrieb (PSN)oo-pH-oo:

The solution is simple, don't show relic or refinement for people not in your squad until end of run.  Still show the relics of squad mates so people can do radshares etc, and showing people with no relic is probably fair (ish).  There is no reasonable decision you can make in a public fissure mission based on what other people's relics are except quit or stay, which is the terrible behaviour that the current system is promoting.

Yeah, your "simple solution" will lead to people exploiting the system. So let us join a Loki Systems Radshare with any other relic and hope for the best.

I have a super simple solution for you, feel free to copy the text:
"H Relic group for all relics other than Nidus Prime 1/4"

Done, there is your simple solution. Why do you guys need the developers to hold your hand through everything?

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20 minutes ago, Dunkelheit said:

Yeah, your "simple solution" will lead to people exploiting the system. So let us join a Loki Systems Radshare with any other relic and hope for the best.

I have a super simple solution for you, feel free to copy the text:
"H Relic group for all relics other than Nidus Prime 1/4"

Done, there is your simple solution. Why do you guys need the developers to hold your hand through everything?

They said the hiding Relic mechanic would only apply to public missions, if it's a premade squad then it would still be the same as we have now

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23 hours ago, Tsukinoki said:

And the only thing this would leave to is:
"What relics does everyone have?"
And then if they don't get an answer they are happy with they leave the group and repeat doing that until they get the group that has relics

Exuse me, but your logic is broken. Somehow from a "no answer" we came not to "get answer" but to "group that has relics".

First off all i dont think you can expect everyone will just report to a random guy what relics they are use.

Secondly -- you can't expect this to be true. Like guy who has relic has no motivation to keep leacher in group, and nobody can stop me from baiting and saying "yeah, i have %nidus% relic".

This will lead us to the state, there doing public fissures just to get specific drop absolutely unreliable. You can't leave mission and be sure there was no %nidus% relic, you can't stay at mission and be sure there is %nidus% relic. This is how it will work.

 

23 hours ago, ZeroX4 said:

Public is made for random ppl and not for ppl to behave in SOME way

If I hadn't met you before, I would have thought it was just fat trolling. Now I know it's just an honest mistake.

This whole topic is about preventing the behavior of people who expect special effect from public missions.
And why are you wrong? Because "start a mission, complete a mission, extract" is not "the SOME way". This is just the way. The bare minimum. If someone has reasons to leave mission this is bad game design and should be solved.

And yes, no one cares that you personally don't like Frost and Wisp and can't just explain to people why. That has nothing to do with the topic at all. If you think this is game problem and not yours/players problem, you can try to invent solution. But "there is problem X, so we don't need to deal with problem Y" just make no sense.

P.S. And thats not only "i have less options to choose" problem. You have to collect reactant. If someone is forced to join in the middle of a mission it can lead to a problem. And I don't think creating an environment where players objectively make everyone else's game worse is a good idea.

 

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8 hours ago, T-Shark69 said:

No it's not. Literally everything you said has nothing to do with what OP is saying. Your analogies are extremely bad.

 

Meme Wtf GIF

Sure it doesnt when you take 1 part of my whole explanation and use it to prove something

I would explain it again but i think you will again understand what you want out of it
Remember just because you think you understand something does not mean you understand it
 

6 hours ago, gbjbaanb said:

Then you are the griefer.

I dont want to play with some ppl so i just leave i dont join with intention of leaving i just see frames in mission i dont see fit i got option to leave so i just use it
Seems you missed the point
 

3 hours ago, -JT-_-R3W1ND said:

If I hadn't met you before, I would have thought it was just fat trolling. Now I know it's just an honest mistake.

This whole topic is about preventing the behavior of people who expect special effect from public missions.
And why are you wrong? Because "start a mission, complete a mission, extract" is not "the SOME way". This is just the way. The bare minimum. If someone has reasons to leave mission this is bad game design and should be solved.

P.S. And thats not only "i have less options to choose" problem. You have to collect reactant. If someone is forced to join in the middle of a mission it can lead to a problem. And I don't think creating an environment where players objectively make everyone else's game worse is a good idea.

 

Whole topic is about 1 guy want everybody to stay in mission from start to finish in random squad just because he wants it and his solution would affect everyone
Yet many of us if not most just get 1 person to be a host and then randoms can join and leave and we dont care since wy overcome that kind of issue
Yet OP wants to change system for everyone because he is too lazy to create environment where it would just not happen

And correct me if im wrong here but arent we able to leave mission when we want and for whatever reason we want just because "That is just the way"?
If we would be obligated to finish mission we join dont you think we would not have that option available?

So maybe instead of limiting other players lets ask for something to be done with host migration which is actual problem?
Because if you dont understand it even if ppl wont see each other relic some players will just leave for whatever reason and there still be case of bugged mission after host migration

P.S. NO ONE is forced to join any mission or stay in it at any state
 

3 hours ago, -JT-_-R3W1ND said:

And yes, no one cares that you personally don't like Frost and Wisp and can't just explain to people why.

By all means

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1280062-public-fissures-are-toxic-when-new-relics-drop-time-for-a-change/?do=findComment&comment=12283112
 

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15 minutes ago, ZeroX4 said:

Sure it doesnt when you take 1 part of my whole explanation and use it to prove something

As I said. nothing you wrote has anything to do with the topic at hand because your analogies are bad. Didnt need to quote everything you said to get that point across. But it seems like I'm wasting my time.

 

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1 hour ago, T-Shark69 said:

As I said. nothing you wrote has anything to do with the topic at hand because your analogies are bad. Didnt need to quote everything you said to get that point across. But it seems like I'm wasting my time.

As i said just because you think you understand something does not mean you actually understand it

When i compare situation where someone leaves OPs squad because of X reason and i present same situation where i leave squads because of XY reason
Where no matter how you look at it cause its the same situation (player see something he dont want in his mission)
And effect (player chooses to leave than just go with that kind of squad)
Solution at least by OP (prevent players ability to see something that could make that players decide to leave)
While for some ppl it could be useful information so by extend fixing his problem he would punish others players
And you say it have nothing to do with the topic? Where obviously its about IDEA to hide some information from players which would solve nothing
Where initial problem is expecting some kind of behavior in public squad
And like he said "quitters have option to form a group"
Well guess what? He also does
Public squads are not reserved for any1 they are public for everyone

Imagine someone coming here complaining that ppl quit from public eidolon hunt bounties
And ask for option to prevent ppl from seeing some information about other players (which most likely is the cause of why they leave)

We know we want something from our squad on eidolon hunting we form a squad with ppl that will do what we want with stuff we want them to have
We go to public bounty we expect whatever idk what is hard in it to understand?

And yeah i do admit i wish i could join any squad to anything and dont see ppl quit because they see X thing
But thats the charm of PUBLIC squads

BUT anyway id say yeah you are 100% correct
You are wasting your time so better stop

 

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