Looks like it's time to tone down slash and viral

[TheArmchairThinker]

Seeing how people start saying they take down steel path sentients in one shot using Glaive Prime, I think it's really time to tone down slash and viral.

Viral combined with slash makes a ridiculous amount of DoT where armor ignoring damage ticks with viral multiplier makes even grineer heavy armor pointless. I think you can tone down viral damage increase to 50% - 100% on 10 stacks, making them strong enough and doesn't come out over the rest of the elements.

For slash itself, you can change the bleed damage tick to deal slash damage instead of true damage, Making slash still a viable element for bare flesh and not making armor irrelevant.

[Lutesque]

11 minutes ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

I think it's really time to tone down slash and viral.

Wheres the fun in that ?

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

4 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

Wheres the fun in that ?

Exactly. I think viral is fine where it is, and I wreck grineer with it in SP, but get wrecked by them corpus. You can’t tone down slash. You just can’t. 1, it makes them bleed, if your angry we need to torture them. 2, we need slash, chop chop enemies = x 5 desecrate. More slash more loot. If you make slash weaker it’ll have significant impact. If you tone down viral, it’ll have too much impact on those warframe players we know and rely on to guide us until we get strong. Viral and slash should not be toned down at all. 

[ARM0R3D_WARFRAME]

No offense here, but no matter how much you change the stats of some weapons... there will always be those who find ways around it ...  Please stop suggesting that this or that get nerfed.  I've been trying to get into the Steel Path for a week now and its actually not fun trying to fight a bunch of bullet sacks.  I keep seeing how people are getting nothing but Red Crits on almost every weapon they use and I'm here like wow I cant get more than 50%... why? because they nerfed the Crit stacking.. (well at least for someone like me who is a casual player.... I'm a Dad first, gamer 2nd).  Finding a Balance is hard I will agree, however dont make it worse for those of us who are not "Die Hards" 

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

4 minutes ago, ARM0R3D_WARFRAME said:

No offense here, but no matter how much you change the stats of some weapons... there will always be those who find ways around it ...  Please stop suggesting that this or that get nerfed.  I've been trying to get into the Steel Path for a week now and its actually not fun trying to fight a bunch of bullet sacks.  I keep seeing how people are getting nothing but Red Crits on almost every weapon they use and I'm here like wow I cant get more than 50%... why? because they nerfed the Crit stacking.. (well at least for someone like me who is a casual player.... I'm a Dad first, gamer 2nd).  Finding a Balance is hard I will agree, however dont make it worse for those of us who are not "Die Hards" 

This. I agree. Everybody will find loopholes around every nerf that is made. Stop nerfing, more balancing. I spent 2 months, 2 months trying to make myself strong. Selling every item in my inventory for strong gear, (My trusty reaper prime and Nekros prime included), spending weeks farming acceltra, Kuva Zarr, trying to get Ignis wraith, Kuva nukor, farming mastery and prime relics for days, and I only got my full die hard gear set a few days ago. I just got my reaper prime, I use a Ignis wraith with viral damage, Nekros prime, and Dual Grakata. Even then, I’m not that powerful. You’ll make it so much harder and people like me will go back to square 1 if everything gets nerfed,

[taiiat]

that's what tips you? you could already Kill Sentients in the number of Shots that they have Health Gates (since you can't deal Damage any faster than that). so, 5 Shots.

people that get all uppity about stuff like this always seem to be Years behind the curve.
it's not that __ is 'op' - it's that it's something that works even if you don't know how to deal Damage in the game.

 

by the way, i oneshot Stalker in Steel Path the other day. he's immune to Status.

[Tyreaus]

Maybe armour needs a tweak? As is, it's a massive contributor to EHP values. The problem is that there's an equally large performance difference between bypassing it and not. One's a slog, one's a cakewalk. The less armour factors in, the smaller that difference becomes.

And there's been plenty of suggestions on how to adjust it, from making it a shield-like health type to capping its DR / value.

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

47 minutes ago, taiiat said:

that's what tips you? you could already Kill Sentients in the number of Shots that they have Health Gates (since you can't deal Damage any faster than that). so, 5 Shots.

people that get all uppity about stuff like this always seem to be Years behind the curve.
it's not that __ is 'op' - it's that it's something that works even if you don't know how to deal Damage in the game.

 

by the way, i oneshot Stalker in Steel Path the other day. he's immune to Status.

^

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

44 minutes ago, Tyreaus said:

Maybe armour needs a tweak? As is, it's a massive contributor to EHP values. The problem is that there's an equally large performance difference between bypassing it and not. One's a slog, one's a cakewalk. The less armour factors in, the smaller that difference becomes.

And there's been plenty of suggestions on how to adjust it, from making it a shield-like health type to capping its DR / value.

Lol, at the same time I’ve been replying to threads about the armour scale and dr being ridiculous.

[Zhuge1234]

STOP YOUR NERF HINT 😕

[kyori]

I guess slash and viral are ok, as people feel fun and boast about how they can kill high level enemies now... it's actually a good thing that DE is making people happy in these covid time. Imagine they make the game harder and people can't kill stuffs and they will get sad cos they can't boast anymore.

[DrivaMain]

The "Fairest" nerf I can think of for Viral is to make it scale additively with Crit multipliers. Warframe's damage system is a mess of multipliers, trimming down the multiplication by making certain multipliers scales additively with each other would make managing player damage more controllable. This change mainly targets Hybrid builds because they overwhelmingly outshines everything.  Of course, enemy durability needs to adapt to these changes because BulletSpongesAreTediousAndNotFun^TM.

Edited September 13, 2021 by DrivaMain

[AEP8FlyBoy]

Or just make Magnetic, Impact, Puncture, Gas and Blast Damage less of a meme.

[PublikDomain]

Slash would probably be fine if Armor scaling wasn't so busted and countering it wasn't so critical, but Viral has clearly been overperforming since it usurped Corrosive as The Damage Type™. It just needs a lower starting point.

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

I prefer corrosive over Viral to be honest, but anyway. Like @kyoriand @DrivaMainsaid, if you nerf them, everything will be less fun (and that’s the point of all games right?) and bullet sponges will cause frustration, salt, toxicity, and anger. (Which is bad, so we need ways to deal with them)

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

35 minutes ago, AEP8FlyBoy said:

Or just make Magnetic, Impact, Puncture, Gas and Blast Damage less of a meme. 

 

This is exactly what myself and many other people have been saying: Don’t nerf the strong stuff, BALANCE OUT THE WEAK STUFF.

[(PSN)Tomplexthis]

4 hours ago, TheArmchairThinker said:

Seeing how people start saying they take down steel path sentients in one shot using Glaive Prime, I think it's really time to tone down slash and viral.

Viral combined with slash makes a ridiculous amount of DoT where armor ignoring damage ticks with viral multiplier makes even grineer heavy armor pointless. I think you can tone down viral damage increase to 50% - 100% on 10 stacks, making them strong enough and doesn't come out over the rest of the elements.

For slash itself, you can change the bleed damage tick to deal slash damage instead of true damage, Making slash still a viable element for bare flesh and not making armor irrelevant.

yeah please dont, iam sick of the nerfs in warframe, just let players have fun, with fun strong weapons. i mean its just a horde looter shooter.

having a power fantasy is great, but i think these endless nerfs are getting out of control, and really kills any hype for anything in the game.

[(PSN)Tomplexthis]

1 hour ago, AEP8FlyBoy said:

Or just make Magnetic, Impact, Puncture, Gas and Blast Damage less of a meme.

i was thinking about magnetic and blast mostly, but there was a guy talking about gas blinding enemies, or choking them too.

puncture and impact i dont know. 

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

4 minutes ago, (PSN)Tomplexthis said:

yeah please dont, iam sick of the nerfs in warframe, just let players have fun, with fun strong weapons. i mean its just a horde looter shooter.

having a power fantasy is great, but i think these endless nerfs are getting out of control, and really kills any hype for anything in the game.

Exactly. The game is supposed to be fun, bullet sponges and salt = NOT FUN.

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

3 minutes ago, (PSN)Tomplexthis said:

i was thinking about magnetic and blast mostly, but there was a guy talking about gas blinding enemies, or choking them too.

puncture and impact i dont know. 

Gas damages enemies around the target you shoot at.

[iPathos]

4 hours ago, Tyreaus said:

Maybe armour needs a tweak?

Armor always needs a tweak. DE never tweaks it a little one way or the other, it's always either a huge swing too far, or literally nothing.

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

11 minutes ago, iPathos said:

Armor always needs a tweak. DE never tweaks it a little one way or the other, it's always either a huge swing too far, or literally nothing.

Yep. Armour scale is insane. Needs a cap.

[iPathos]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Reaper330011 said:

Yep. Armour scale is insane. Needs a cap.

No, I meant they hit armor scaling too hard with every tweak.
The latest one made higher level scaling a joke.

[Loza03]

49 minutes ago, iPathos said:

No, I meant they hit armor scaling too hard with every tweak.
The latest one made higher level scaling a joke.

Armour scaling as a concept is a bad idea.

It basically makes everything that has it behave on functionally different rules to that which doesn't. For Corpus, your average 'heavy' unit (the Techs) are looking at 80,000 effective hit points at level 100-ish, which is less effective health than a Grineer Scorpion. Y'know, those weak 'light' melee enemies?

 

When you've got a game where the low-tier enemies of one faction are tougher than the heavies of another, and they're meant to be equivalent, then the game's fundamental maths is pretty sorely broken, somewhere.

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

9 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

Armour scaling as a concept is a bad idea.

It basically makes everything that has it behave on functionally different rules to that which doesn't. For Corpus, your average 'heavy' unit (the Techs) are looking at 80,000 effective hit points at level 100-ish, which is less effective health than a Grineer Scorpion. Y'know, those weak 'light' melee enemies?

 

When you've got a game where the low-tier enemies of one faction are tougher than the heavies of another, and they're meant to be equivalent, then the game's fundamental maths is pretty sorely broken, somewhere.

^