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One handed sword... and?


_R_o_g_u_e_
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The combination of glaive and pistol is really cool, and I use it often. But I was thinking that this sort of combination should happen more often.

It would be really cool if we could also use one handed swords with our secondaries. Obviously still retaining the functionality of “holding switch weapons” to “main hand” your melee and break the combination when desirable.

Would other people like to see this? Would you use one handed swords more if you could combine them with your secondary like with glaives?

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... considering you switch between melee and guns instantaneously you already are doing it.

Glaives are a little unique cause they have the ability to not be near you for some time (leaving you rather vulnerable/ less dangerous) hence we have dual wield options for glaives.

How exactly do you propose it for other one handed weapons though ? Unique stances ? Or does the weapon just not holster? What exactly would be different than what we already have ?

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17 hours ago, _R_o_g_u_e_ said:

Would other people like to see this? Would you use one handed swords more if you could combine them with your secondary like with glaives?

yes I very much would, especially since DE actually planned on doing it... and then forgot about it.

7 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

How exactly do you propose it for other one handed weapons though ? Unique stances ? Or does the weapon just not holster? What exactly would be different than what we already have ?

unique animations alone would be nice. I know you're saying "why bother when gun/melee switching is instant" and yes, it is, but some of warframe's advertisments, including that newer one for PS5 that depicts Excalibur, Baruuk and Mesa, depict a warframe dual wielding in a way that is not possible in the game: in the screenshot I see on PS5, Baruuk has a Guandao (correct), Mesa has Akmagnus (correct) and Excalibur is holding a Lato in one hand and a Skana in the other, in reverse-grip style (totally incorrect). 

Ember Prime was shown dual wielding her Sicarus and Glaive primes long before it was ever actually added. it bothers me because it's still false advertising, even if only in a minor way. 

all I'd ask for with in Game Sword/Machete/Dagger & Pistol is to have it's own unique melee animations that aren't ultra-slowed down and don't affect the stats of either the gun or melee weapons in any way.

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9 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

... considering you switch between melee and guns instantaneously you already are doing it.

Glaives are a little unique cause they have the ability to not be near you for some time (leaving you rather vulnerable/ less dangerous) hence we have dual wield options for glaives.

How exactly do you propose it for other one handed weapons though ? Unique stances ? Or does the weapon just not holster? What exactly would be different than what we already have ?

I am a concept artist, I’m discussing this idea with players so the developers might think of a way to make it happen. I have some ideas about how I would implement, but DE is better after doing DE things than me.

 

The pairing of one handed melee and one handed guns shouldn’t interfere with anything at all, as the animations shouldn’t need to change much, and it would allow DE a platform to make exciting additions and make one handed melee and one handed guns more exciting. 

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I never use glaives because when dual wielding pistol/glaives the Eject Magazine mod only works if you swap to primary.

I'd hate it if DE implemented the same mechanic on any other melee weapon type because it would never use those weapons again. 

It would be a completely pointless "feature" and waste of DE time because of this.

15 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

... considering you switch between melee and guns instantaneously you already are doing it.

 

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Eh, with how quickly you can switch between melee and gun these days, I don't even use the setup for glaives very often anymore. And I almost always carry a Glaive Prime into Steel Path - Acolytes hate the Glaive Prime.

So I don't really see the point if that anymore - aside from enacting the old "drive me closer, I want to hit them with my sword" meme.

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10 hours ago, _R_o_g_u_e_ said:

I am a concept artist, I’m discussing this idea with players so the developers might think of a way to make it happen. I have some ideas about how I would implement, but DE is better after doing DE things than me.

 

The pairing of one handed melee and one handed guns shouldn’t interfere with anything at all, as the animations shouldn’t need to change much, and it would allow DE a platform to make exciting additions and make one handed melee and one handed guns more exciting. 

I read your words but I can't really see it. I don't need the implementation method. I am trying to understand the difference during playing as a user once the implementation happens. Your OP is not very descriptive.

What would be different conceptually compared to what we have now ?  Will we be able to parry incoming bullets while shooting? Aimgliding ? Have chance to shoot in the middle of an animation ? Have a stab and tap finisher ? Unique mods (similar to thrown melee / secondary mods that feed each other) , special animation stances ? What exactly is the cool thing you want to see happen which we cannot already do?

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I don't see the point.  This seems like a minor aesthetic change with no gameplay functionality, something that would take DE quite a lot of work for almost negligible results.

Which isn't to say that it doesn't sound neat, but the juice just royally isn't worth the squeeze here.

Edited by (PSN)Unstar
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8 hours ago, Berzerkules said:

I never use glaives because when dual wielding pistol/glaives the Eject Magazine mod only works if you swap to primary.

Hah, I've never seen anybody else mention this before.  It's irksome in general, and drove me nuts when I was on my Falcor - Ocucor kick.

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Le 13/09/2021 à 18:40, 0_The_F00l a dit :

... considering you switch between melee and guns instantaneously you already are doing it.

Glaives are a little unique cause they have the ability to not be near you for some time (leaving you rather vulnerable/ less dangerous) hence we have dual wield options for glaives.


I believe those two sentences are contradictory.

Glaives may be far from you for a little time, but you could switch and shoot with any weapons instantly as well, while it returns, with or without dual wield.

Dual wield doesn't change anything. It's just cosmetic ; except for the malus of not being able to use certain mods, as stated above.

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17 hours ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

yes I very much would, especially since DE actually planned on doing it... and then forgot about it.

They haven’t finish the melee rework from 2 years ago, So who knows.

On 2021-09-13 at 1:28 AM, _R_o_g_u_e_ said:

It would be really cool if we could also use one handed swords with our secondaries.

Oh you mean this? 
1RX5X8D.jpg

I mean this ^ has been advertised sense 2014 so who knows. I mean took DE 7 years to introduce birds. So I wouldn’t hold my breath. 

Edited by (XBOX)YoungGunn82
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9 hours ago, dwqrf said:


I believe those two sentences are contradictory.

Glaives may be far from you for a little time, but you could switch and shoot with any weapons instantly as well, while it returns, with or without dual wield.

Dual wield doesn't change anything. It's just cosmetic ; except for the malus of not being able to use certain mods, as stated above.

Not sure how it is contradictory , 

You cannot switch back to melee while the glaive is in flight (you have to wait for the return). Hence it is a little unique. Other melee weapons are always with you and so you can switch between (choose either melee or gun) at any time.

Dual wield does have a few mechanical changes like the method of heavy attacks and interaction with few secondaries that have alternate fire. I also notice a little difference in attack speed ( when using combo attacks).

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16 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Not sure how it is contradictory , 

You cannot switch back to melee while the glaive is in flight (you have to wait for the return). Hence it is a little unique. Other melee weapons are always with you and so you can switch between (choose either melee or gun) at any time.

Dual wield does have a few mechanical changes like the method of heavy attacks and interaction with few secondaries that have alternate fire. I also notice a little difference in attack speed ( when using combo attacks).

It made sense a while ago when a dedicated melee mode allowed use of a stance, but currently I dont notice the difference much.

It would've been cool if there were special dual wield "devil may cry" style combos though. 

As it stands now, it feels more like a cosmetic thing to me.

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To answer OP's Q1: I'd rather not see more dual wielding.

The functional benefit to dual wielding is being able to auto-block without swapping to a melee weapon (via quick melee or otherwise). With default controls where shooting can be done by pressing the fire button, that's the only difference. Yet auto-blocking has had famed issues with triggering aim-glides when players don't want it, so even that benefit is questionable.

The major drawback is in things like Eject Magazine and other holster-based mods straight-up not functioning with melee attacks.

But the other bit is that, at least for Glaives, if you don't like the aim-dot design and / or the stance (the idle animation, not the melee stance mod), tough chesticles. There's no option to turn it off. This actually has practical implications, too: I haven't tested it in a bit, but last I checked, I believe the visual hit markers around the aim-dot don't appear when dual-wielding.

If I was able to turn off dual wielding, I would have no problem - obviously. It'd be something I could enable or disable based on builds and personal inclinations. But if I had to choose between dual wielding or not, forever, I would go without.

And to answer OP's Q2: it wouldn't make me use single-handed weapons more than I do now. Slightly more readily accessible auto-blocking isn't enough of a change to alter what weapons I use.

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Dual wielding should be a stance option rather than a default state for secondaries  and specific one handed melee. 

Such a stance would simply incorporate shots from the secondary into the melee combo without breaking the combo flow.

Sort of like how Gunblades mix shots fired with swinging the blade.

Could make for some interesting choices in secondaries to couple with the melee option. 

Would be fun to see seamless weaving of shots with slashes. 

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Honestly I think this might even be a good opportunity to talk about “invisible power.”

I’ll start with glaive + secondary. There is no UI that tells you you can combine these weapons, and there’s no way to opt out. I think it might be interesting if DE was to actually release a series of items purely for the “offhand slot.”

Which, brings me to my point, that one handed weapons should have an off hand slot. For example, when you equip your secondary weapon, there could be a single new option called “Off-hand.” When you open it, you can view all the possible combinations you could make with that weapon.

This way you could intentionally choose to world glaive and secondary in unison, or disable it in the arsenal.

If DE wants to pursue this, we could see them add other off hand items like;

Shields, parrying daggers, whips, wrist mounted crossbows, or even something as simple as a bracelet that gives a buff to your main hand.

 

That concludes my comments on combinations, but while addressing invisible power, I also want to tackle stat sticks. I believe they should also be incorporated into the UI, so players can actually see exactly what that stat stick is doing etc.

 

My two cents. 

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6 hours ago, Hypernaut1 said:

It made sense a while ago when a dedicated melee mode allowed use of a stance, but currently I dont notice the difference much.

It would've been cool if there were special dual wield "devil may cry" style combos though. 

As it stands now, it feels more like a cosmetic thing to me.

Yeah ,  the differences are minor if you only use the glaive for throw attacks and ignore the melee combo part , It would indeed be cool to have an actual "gun-fu" Stance.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hmm...
Perhaps add some interaction between offhand weapons? For example a thrown glaive can be shot with secondary to be redirected for higher damage at an enemy, but at the cost of the glaive not returning automatically. Or just the Glaive straight up exploding harder with the selected pistol's element.

Could be something to make a deeper combo system. I can imagine if offhand sword ever appeared it could allow for some special gun combos. And it could make even more varying stances (though there's a bit too many here to implement that immediately).

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