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Kuva/Tenet Weapons - Maxing out to 60% weapon bonus?


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Just wondering if it's really worth fusing these weapons until it hits 60%?

Assuming you've already got decent mods on, does a +-10% in weapon bonus make a huge difference?

Also, what is the best strategy to do so since it only takes the biggest number? (Assuming you don't want to grind through many Liches over and over)

Scenario 1:

I bought a 55% Kuva Bramma off someone and fused it with my crappy 28% one, which made it 58.6%. Does that mean all I would need is any cheap low roll (25%) Kuva Bramma for it to reach 60%?

 

Scenario 2:

I've got a 4 Forma 33% Tenet Envoy with a potato catalyst.

Hypothetically, if I acquired a 57%+ Tenet Envoy and fused it into the crappier Envoy, would it keep all Forma and potato while making the increase of % based on the higher percentage weapon?

Since the existing weapon is already Toxic and we get to choose any of the 2 elements, could I essentially broaden my search to any high % element?

 

Scenario 3:

I've also got a fully established 49% Kuva Zarr. Is it worth bumping the damage bonus any higher? If so, does the same apply as per scenario 2?

 

Also, is Toxic always the most sought after element followed by Heat?

 

Edited by CrimsonDarkLord
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2 hours ago, CrimsonDarkLord said:

Just wondering if it's really worth fusing these weapons until it hits 60%?

Assuming you've already got decent mods on, does a +-10% in weapon bonus make a huge difference?

Also, what is the best strategy to do so since it only takes the biggest number? (Assuming you don't want to grind through many Liches over and over)

Scenario 1:

I bought a 55% Kuva Bramma off someone and fused it with my crappy 28% one, which made it 58.6%. Does that mean all I would need is any cheap low roll (25%) Kuva Bramma for it to reach 60%?

 

Scenario 2:

I've got a 4 Forma 33% Tenet Envoy with a potato catalyst.

Hypothetically, if I acquired a 57%+ Tenet Envoy and fused it into the crappier Envoy, would it keep all Forma and potato while making the increase of % based on the higher percentage weapon?

Since the existing weapon is already Toxic and we get to choose any of the 2 elements, could I essentially broaden my search to any high % element?

 

Scenario 3:

I've also got a fully established 49% Kuva Zarr. Is it worth bumping the damage bonus any higher? If so, does the same apply as per scenario 2?

 

Also, is Toxic always the most sought after element followed by Heat?

 

I run corrosive on all my weapons not only kuva tenet ones
Only on mesa regulators i have radiation

NEVER EVER i had any problem anything killing something that was in my way
And if i can do that with regular stuff like for example in most cases i run with Astilla + Pyrana + Reaper i dont see any reason for striving to 60% on kuva tenet weapons

Yeah you can do it you will get better damage then me you will kill faster but what will be the difference?

2 secs in my case and 1,5 sec in your case? Totally worth it

Properly modded weapon will do the work no matter of % it have in case of kuva and tenet weapon
 

For crying out loud i think tenet detrons secondary fire is best example i melt hemocyte heads with 1 shot each time (if i aim correctly)

Edited by ZeroX4
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More damage is more damage , so usually a good idea to have it maxed (with few exceptions).

If i remember right the calculation picks the highest value bonus you have and adds 10% to it.

so if you have a 55% bramma and fuse with 25% one, you will gain a 5.5% boost, to max it at 60%.

if you have 35% bramma and fuse 30% to it you will get a 3.5% boost to arrive at 38.5%.

The difference between the lowest roll (25%) and highest roll (60%) is going to be about 28% more flat damage not accounting for modding or faction bonuses.

The difference between 50% and 60% though is only about a 6% more flat damage.

I have kept only a few weapons at lower % (to better weight slash procs) like the livia and flux rifle.

As to the forma and catalyst , you will keep the investment as long as its the one you pick from the upgrade>actions menu.

eg:

you have a weapon with 3 forma and potato, go to upgrade>actions>fusion pick a 0 forma no potato weapon to fuse. you will have everything as is.

But if you use the weapon with no forma , then try to fuse it with the weapon with catalyst and forma you will lose that investment. so pick the one you want to keep.

 

Edited by 0_The_F00l
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I'm happy with 40-ish percent element buffs on my weapons. Is it really worth fusing to reach 60%? No.

48 minutes ago, CrimsonDarkLord said:

Scenario 3:

I've also got a fully established 49% Kuva Zarr. Is it worth bumping the damage bonus any higher?

Short answer, no. Long answer, I hunt liches for fun. So "no I don't think you should exert yourself to try to get another Zarr lich", but if you accidentally come across one it doesn't hurt to get it and upgrade it.

48 minutes ago, CrimsonDarkLord said:

Scenario 2:

I've got a 4 Forma 33% Tenet Envoy with a potato catalyst.

Hypothetically, if I acquired a 57%+ Tenet Envoy and fused it into the crappier Envoy, would it keep all Forma and potato while making the increase of % based on the higher percentage weapon?

Yes it would keep your potato and formas that you already installed. With this scenario, you will have a 60% Tenet Envoy. You will not lose any value even though you are upgrading "the crappier Envoy".

48 minutes ago, CrimsonDarkLord said:

Scenario 1:

I bought a 55% Kuva Bramma off someone and fused it with my crappy 28% one, which made it 58.6%. Does that mean all I would need is any cheap low roll (25%) Kuva Bramma for it to reach 60%?

  Thanks to Leqesai for doing the math!

3 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

This is actually not correct.

A 55% weapon fused with any other weapon will result in a 60% weapon. This is why 55% or higher is where real value comes into play for kuva/tenet weapon pricing. 

 

Edited by LillyRaccune
Mathframe injection.
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I say if you like the weapon then get it to max. It isn't necessary to max the weapons for them to be useful but I like my "go-to" weapons as good as they can be. 

Also, getting the weapons to 60% is a nice way to keep grinding liches/sisters if you have nothing else to do. 

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8 minutes ago, LillyRaccune said:

 

48 minutes ago, CrimsonDarkLord said:

Scenario 1:

I bought a 55% Kuva Bramma off someone and fused it with my crappy 28% one, which made it 58.6%. Does that mean all I would need is any cheap low roll (25%) Kuva Bramma for it to reach 60%?

Yes that is correct. But it is not worth the effort unless you really, really, really, like your Kuva Bramma.

This is actually not correct.

A 55% weapon fused with any other weapon will result in a 60% weapon. This is why 55% (technically you only need 54.6% to get to 60% in one fusion but 55% is the safe bet IMO given trading practices) or higher is where real value comes into play for kuva/tenet weapon pricing. 

The 55% bramma would not result in a 58.6% bramma. To end up with 58.6% the damage of the bought weapon would be like 53%.

Edited by Leqesai
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Worth it? I'd say it depends on you.

For example, myself, personally, for most of them I don't think its worth it per say, but I actually enjoy Lich/Sister hunting and quite a few Sister/Kuva weapons are my favs, and I also want to get all the Ephemera. They also made a change on how you get to chose the bonus element with the Sister update, as far as Fusing. So with that all in mind, I am keen on maxing out some weapons, like the Tenet Arca Plasma. At the moment I have all the Kuva/Sister weapons in the element I want, so when I look for a candidate, if its for a weapon I like, I will take it, if its not, I won't. 

There are maybe 7 or so weapons I would like to max out, but def not doing that for every weapon. Also I could max out one or two more then decide I don't care and stop. 

If you are at 58 percent yeah you only need one more weapon of any percent to get to max. You can now separately chose the element between the two weapons you fuse, without any drawback. That was a nice change. So yeah go for any element if your preexisting weapon already has the element you want. As for the 49% Zarr... really up to you. Do you like the Zarr and use it a lot? Personally I would be fine with that, but if it was the Kuva Hek or Tenet Arca Plasma, I'd probably try to max. Thats just me though and my pref. 

As for which element is best... uhh depends. Like how you want to mod the weapon or if you have a Riven or whether its status based etc whether the weapon also has an innate element aside from the bonus. Some weapons I want a lot of status on, so I will go Heat, since I know I will mod for viral or corrosive. If I know I am trying to build for more AOE/HM etc plus have a Riven, then will usually go Toxin to save on that mod spot. 

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Others have already answered your question to an incredible amount to clarity, but I do want to add this additional caveat / point of consideration. If you are aiming to valence fuse a weapon to max, then remember that order matters.

Suppose you had 3 Kuva weapons:

A: 25%, Potato'd and Forma'd.

B: 30%.

C: 50%.

Clearly, you should always fuse B and C into A, in order to preserve your potato and forma investment. But what order should you fuse them in? If you fused B first, then your bonus would go to 33%, and then 55%. But if you fused C first, then your bonus would go to 55%, and then 60%.

So if your goal is to reach 60% and get two low bonus weapons in a row, then it might be smart to hold off on fusing until you get one with a jump in the bonus %. The element order really does not matter now since we always get to choose that.

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Unless you're min/maxing to hell and back, it ain't worth it. A 25% weapon will delete stuff on the star chart and basic Steel Path as hard a 60% weapon would.

Only reason I've any guns maxed is either achieved through ephemera hunting or I got lucky rolls

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Thanks for the clarification, guys.

I bought a Kuva Nukor at 55%, which is lucky I suppose!

In the case with someone wanting to max out a weapon to 60%, the difference between a 54% and a 55% weapon is essentially an additional weapon to fuse?

Imagine an achievement/pride junkie reaching 59.4%!

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it's up to you, but there isn't really a major need to min-max Tenet/Kuva weapons: I'd understand if fusing also yielded helpful stat bonuses like reload speed, fire rate etc with each fusion, but all it does is increase your damage slightly, and not really to a noticeable degree, at least in regular starchart content. might be a noticeable difference in Steel Path but I've taken my low-roll Lich/Sister weapons there and they've worked really well (once the Galvanized mods kick in anyway).

if you want to shoot for 60% on your weapons and fight more Sisters and Liches, then go for it. personally I'm not that bothered.

Edited by (PSN)robotwars7
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My philosophy is only worry about valence fusioning it to max if it really becomes one of your regular go-to's. If you like it a lot a lot, max it. Otherwise, the elemental buff is just a nice bonus, just think of it as an extra status% mod, it helps but those extra percentages aren't that gamebreaking if you just like busting that weapon out here or there. 

You don't need to go crazy completionist and max them all out to perfect element and valance fusion just to do it. Do it for your very top favs you can't stop using. 

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2021/9/20 PM2点06分 , CrimsonDarkLord 说:

Just wondering if it's really worth fusing these weapons until it hits 60%?

Quick answer is, depends. 

Kuva and Tenet variants are already strong weapons, even at a low percentage. Ask yourself - at your current percentage bonus, are they doing what you expect them to do? For me, a 30% k. bramma allows me to grind SP grineer survival with khora just fine, so it will stay that way, while I specifically max my mighty k. Seer to 60% because I love it so much (sorry t. Spirex).

You can do some simple maths to see if +/-10% bonus matters a lot. Remember +/-10% bonus is just the elemental bonus, which is a portion of your weapon damage output only. So +/-10% may account for like +/-5% or less for some weapons. You can max it to 60% does not mean you HAVE to max it to 60% to make it viable. Farming and grinding toward a particular weapon just to max it really does not worth the time. Even my k. Seer was a casual encounter in my lich hunt, it just reached maximum eventually.

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7 hours ago, stormy505 said:

kinda related kinda not. Is there a way to check the % of a kuva weapon in arsenal? I could do the math from combining all the liches I've done but I want to know if there's an easier way that just tells you.

Yes.  In your Arsenal, click on "Equip" and then highlight the weapon you want to check (click ONCE).  You should see the bonus % on the right-side comparison panel, behind the weapon name in parenthesis.

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On 2021-09-20 at 1:46 PM, LillyRaccune said:

Short answer, no. Long answer, I hunt liches for fun. So "no I don't think you should exert yourself to try to get another Zarr lich", but if you accidentally come across one it doesn't hurt to get it and upgrade it.

at this point lilly could simply yawn and somehow i'd still agree 🤣
spits nothing but the truth, folks.

yeah a 60% element wouldn't magically kill what a 50% couldn't.
but as 0thefool said, more damage is more damage.

warframe has no linear progression. it's about finding activities that entertains you, then do it. i happen to find amusement from hunting liches, so i do it. and it's worth it.
but if you can see yourself doing something else instead, or not enjoying the hunt as much as you should, then it's not worth it.

On 2021-09-20 at 1:06 PM, CrimsonDarkLord said:

 

Scenario 1:

I bought a 55% Kuva Bramma off someone and fused it with my crappy 28% one, which made it 58.6%. Does that mean all I would need is any cheap low roll (25%) Kuva Bramma for it to reach 60%?

Scenario 2:

I've got a 4 Forma 33% Tenet Envoy with a potato catalyst.

Hypothetically, if I acquired a 57%+ Tenet Envoy and fused it into the crappier Envoy, would it keep all Forma and potato while making the increase of % based on the higher percentage weapon?

Since the existing weapon is already Toxic and we get to choose any of the 2 elements, could I essentially broaden my search to any high % element?

Scenario 3:

I've also got a fully established 49% Kuva Zarr. Is it worth bumping the damage bonus any higher? If so, does the same apply as per scenario 2?

 

Also, is Toxic always the most sought after element followed by Heat?

 

pardon me but i get the impression that you haven't tried the valence fusion tab yet.
i mean just try clicking it. you will be provided with both possible outcomes, you can see what the exact end product will be like, the elements, the formas, the name. and you can always press back to cancel the process.
just seeing the screen should explain it to you more than any words we can type here. but the short answer is yes, don't be afraid to try it. valence fusion is one of the most player-friendly mechanic in the game, it will do pretty much anything you imagine it would, just see the screen it will explain itself.

my personal experience with bonus elements, is there are no right answers.
i know, disappointing, right...
but everyone have different elements that they believe is the best, and it works for all of them. every time i thought an element is undisputed for certain weapon, i found a person who have different element and totally killing it. last thread i saw is about a dude who're doing absolutely awesome in high level corpus missions WITHOUT magnetic element. nobody would've predict that, he went with his choice and it works.

so just go with your own choice. which progenitor you like playing more for the larving farm?
to my understanding toxin is more sought after because back in the days gas builds was meta. but nowadays, viral who happen to also use toxin is pretty great as well. while heat, is just a great single element, because damage.
don't forget that even after you hit 60%, you can still change the element by finding same weapon of said different element. so just go with your guts and make the build that you want

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