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Simple Shadows of the Dead Buff


(XBOX)Nekros9528
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Everyone already knows Nekros' shadows are almost totally useless without augment and do no good to a Necromancer concept.

Many new players falls into deep deception after casting it. They live not long enough, do minimal damage, has bad AI and over all will just spend large amounts of energy for idling around distracting some enemies at best.

Nekros is already a very expensive frame to make a good build with (adaptation, health conversion, shield of shadows, despoil, blind rage maxed, etc) . Most of new players can't afford beyond a simple loot build. But when things get rough and they think: "Oh I will cast my ultimate! My minions will surely support me because that's what 99% of all necromancers' does! :D". They end up dead and dissapointed after 30 seconds.

So simply buff Shadows' damage in a way that they will adapt to enemies' weakness similar to how Baruuk's Reactive Storm works.

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This will solve 50% of Nekros' flawed kit. Impossible to make? No. Hard to do? Probably not. It all depends of the designers good will of listening to the players feedback.

Edited by (XBOX)Nekros9528
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I don't Think this improves Shadows' damage output much.

They're the same ads that you face but on your side, they still do the same damage, but a bit higher with the ability damage's multiplier.

If they don't have 100% status chance, then there is no point in giving them adaptability to enemy weaknesses.

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10 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

I don't Think this improves Shadows' damage output much.

They're the same ads that you face but on your side, they still do the same damage, but a bit higher with the ability damage's multiplier.

If they don't have 100% status chance, then there is no point in giving them adaptability to enemy weaknesses.

What's your argument based off? Have you ever played with Nekros smite infused the shadows and going against enemies weak to radiation or using Nourish on shadows to fight against humanoid corpus or even tried the mess up boring jumpy-jumpy playstyle of the residual arcanes? 

Even if you have done any of the above, I have to say that you're completely wrong and have no idea what you're implying - trolling maybe? Not funny at all.

Damage adaptation is exactly what is lacking for them being useful. Unless you enjoy having your build restricted into using 2x kitguns all the time and doing jumpy-jumpy into colourful circles (arcane procs).

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49 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

I don't Think this improves Shadows' damage output much.

They're the same ads that you face but on your side, they still do the same damage, but a bit higher with the ability damage's multiplier.

If they don't have 100% status chance, then there is no point in giving them adaptability to enemy weaknesses.

Just no. As a Nekros main I’d say it would be a good idea, because right now I have an absurd amount of strength on my build just for that 1 ability.

Thye die too fast, don’t deal enough damage, and only with like 200%+ strength can they be useful. 
 

The thing is, enemies are meant to kill YOU. not each other, so doing this would make shadows much more useful than the current. 
 

But don’t take me wrong, they ARE USEFUL.

Bascially 7 free spectres, deal good damage (if you put an absurd amount of strength like me) can last long (if you also put a absurd amount of duration like me), distract the enemy, crowd control, divide the enemy, divert the enemy, scatter them, and leave them vulnerable.

(Also you can do a trick where if you kill yourself mid-shadows of the dead cast, if you self revive or get revived the shadows that have spawned will be permanent). 

Edited by (PSN)Reaper330011
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42 minutes ago, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

What's your argument based off? Have you ever played with Nekros smite infused the shadows and going against enemies weak to radiation or using Nourish on shadows to fight against humanoid corpus or even tried the mess up boring jumpy-jumpy playstyle of the residual arcanes? 

Enemy health and armor scale much more steeply than their damage, and the shadow damage is based on the enemy damage. Infusing the damage of your shadows will not do much at high level content, because even if you quadruple it, it still pales in comparison to the health scaling.

Your suggestion would be a band-aid fix to the weak shadows only in low level content.

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1 hour ago, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

trolling maybe? Not funny at all.

Ok why does everyone here want to backup their argument by accusing the opposition with Trolling?

This is such a childish move, just don't do it...tell me why you think i'm wrong and improve the conversation.

Stuff like this can't help taking you seriously.

I'm wasting my time here, moving on.

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1 hour ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Ok why does everyone here want to backup their argument by accusing the opposition with Trolling?

This is such a childish move, just don't do it...tell me why you think i'm wrong and improve the conversation.

Stuff like this can't help taking you seriously.

I'm wasting my time here, moving on.

Don’t get it either.

If I had to guess they would probably think the thing you said is so ignorant and dumb that they think you csn’t actually mean it and you must be trying to troll (This is not my opinion, I’m just stating my opinion on why I think people backup their arguments with trolling accusation).

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14 minutes ago, (PSN)Reaper330011 said:

Don’t get it either.

If I had to guess they would probably think the thing you said is so ignorant and dumb that they think you csn’t actually mean it and you must be trying to troll (This is not my opinion, I’m just stating my opinion on why I think people backup their arguments with trolling accusation).

Look: 

2 hours ago, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

Even if you have done any of the above, I have to say that you're completely wrong and have no idea what you're implying

they didn't even give me a chance to reply.

if i didn't try these extremely situational an inefficient methods, i'm wrong, and if if did then i'm...

2 hours ago, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

completely wrong and have no idea what you're implying

like how defensive must he get if he gets this sensitive when someone just SLIGHTLY disagrees with him?

i didn't even say that he's wrong, i said i THINK that it MIGHT not be effective, implying that with some work it can be.

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seems like that should be more like a buff for revenants ult.

now I'm not sure how useful this actually would be but I always thought a real good necromancer theme buff for nekros would be a synergy between desecration and his ult, where enemies that are successfully desecrated are added to the ults queue.

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9 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Look: 

they didn't even give me a chance to reply.

if i didn't try these extremely situational an inefficient methods, i'm wrong, and if if did then i'm...

like how defensive must he get if he gets this sensitive when someone just SLIGHTLY disagrees with him?

i didn't even say that he's wrong, i said i THINK that it MIGHT not be effective, implying that with some work it can be.

 

Yeah a bit unnecessarily defensive…

 

 

 

ANYWAY back to the topic, 

Shadows scale based on the level of the enemies you kill. The time they last and the damage they deal can be upgraded with duration and strength. However if you want to make them REALLY useful, your slots will be filled with duration mods, Umbral mods, strength mods and maybe 1 range mod for terrify.

If they don’t have any status chance it’s useless (like you said)


Maybe a maximum of 75% status chance at rank 3 which can be further upgraded with ability strength?

If they did have status chance and different damages then that would be extremely useful (but then again you’ll have to put absurd strength still, but this buff if there was status chance  would save me 2 mod slots which are currently occupied by strength mods).

 

 

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5 hours ago, cococciolo said:

seems like that should be more like a buff for revenants ult.

now I'm not sure how useful this actually would be but I always thought a real good necromancer theme buff for nekros would be a synergy between desecration and his ult, where enemies that are successfully desecrated are added to the ults queue.

So desecrated enemies are added to the shadow queue?

Edited by (PSN)Reaper330011
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2 hours ago, (PSN)Reaper330011 said:

Yeah a bit unnecessarily defensive…

 

 

 

ANYWAY back to the topic, 

Shadows scale based on the level of the enemies you kill. The time they last and the damage they deal can be upgraded with duration and strength. However if you want to make them REALLY useful, your slots will be filled with duration mods, Umbral mods, strength mods and maybe 1 range mod for terrify.

If they don’t have any status chance it’s useless (like you said)


Maybe a maximum of 75% status chance at rank 3 which can be further upgraded with ability strength?

If they did have status chance and different damages then that would be extremely useful (but then again you’ll have to put absurd strength still, but this buff if there was status chance  would save me 2 mod slots which are currently occupied by strength mods).

 

 

Even then their damage falls off really fast. Changing the status types I feel would only be a minor buff, I'll test the strength build you're talking about but I honestly can't see taking any less than 30 seconds for them to down one enemy which is absurd

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4 hours ago, (PSN)Frost_Nephilim said:

Even then their damage falls off really fast. Changing the status types I feel would only be a minor buff, I'll test the strength build you're talking about but I honestly can't see taking any less than 30 seconds for them to down one enemy which is absurd

By themselves, depending on what shadows you get, I can get some of them to kill enemies in less than 7 seconds.

Hyekka Masters can spawn more and shred armies of grineer so it’s a good shadow to get. 
 

Nox is tanky but doesn’t deal satisfactory damage as a shadow.

Napalm is second choice after hyekka masters because flamethrowers can wave around and damage multiple enemies at once.

Bombard is good and can keep enemies occupied.

Drahk master isn’t as good as hyekka master but can spawn more enemies for your army as well. The more the merrier right?

Lancer/Elite Lancer: Eh.. try other choices.

Heavy gunner: Now if you get enough of them and have enough strength they’ll shred easily…

If your going for grineer always get heavies. Hyekka master and drahk master are best choices, napalm and bombard is also very efficient. (Trust me I’ve used literally every single shadow).

Oh and get Eximus if possible.

 

I can’t remember too much of the corpus because they have so much variants but let’s see:

MOAS: Average, deal decent damage and provide nice support.

Drones: Easily killed but gives you benefits such as shields restore.

Crewman: Less than Average, MOAS are better.

Corpus Tech: Quite efficient if they have supporting ranged enemies around you.

Raptors: A very good choice. VERY GOOD.

Hyenas (orb Vallis): They have abilities so they work well.

Nullifiers: Unknown (I don’t know if the bubble works on enemies and how it works on enemies). 
 

Bursa: Unknown.

 

Just have a good combination of enemies. Infested recommendations

Ancient Healer. (You know why)

 

Disruptor??? (Seems useful but doesn’t know what it does to allies).

MOA tar muralist.

Swarm mutalist.

Parasitic Eximus.

 

 

 

 

They actually kill enemies VERY fast if you get good shadows. 
 

ANYWAY, if you have a choice, go for Hyekka masters. They are (in my opinion) THE BEST choice.

 

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4 hours ago, (PSN)Frost_Nephilim said:

Even then their damage falls off really fast. Changing the status types I feel would only be a minor buff, I'll test the strength build you're talking about but I honestly can't see taking any less than 30 seconds for them to down one enemy which is absurd

I use things like Power Drift, Umbral Intensify and the other umbral mods for set bonus, Augur set mods (for energy) Hunter Adrenaline, Augur Message and Augur Secrets, etc.

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On 2021-09-20 at 12:30 PM, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

So simply buff Shadows' damage in a way that they will adapt to enemies' weakness similar to how Baruuk's Reactive Storm works.

Not gonna work.

 

Shadows must deal % based True damage to be actually effective at killing.   That % must be calculated from their total HP.  More HP Shadow has, mode damage it does.

Example:   At 250% power STR  Shadow with 10000 HP will deal  2500 True damage per hit (25% of its own current hp).   Add Fire rate modifier to keep fast firing shadow DPS in check.

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On 2021-09-20 at 7:26 PM, cococciolo said:

seems like that should be more like a buff for revenants ult.

now I'm not sure how useful this actually would be but I always thought a real good necromancer theme buff for nekros would be a synergy between desecration and his ult, where enemies that are successfully desecrated are added to the ults queue.

 

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Revenant/Abilities

 

Danse Macabre
Erupt with a multitude of Eidolon energy beams and sweep a circle of death around Revenant. The beams will modify their Damage Type to target select defenses, while incoming damage is redirected back into the beams. Hold fire to boost Status Effects and Damage, at the cost of increased energy consumption. Thralls killed by this leave overshield pickups.

On 2021-09-20 at 3:44 PM, (PSN)Reaper330011 said:

Don’t get it either.

If I had to guess they would probably think the thing you said is so ignorant and dumb that they think you csn’t actually mean it and you must be trying to troll (This is not my opinion, I’m just stating my opinion on why I think people backup their arguments with trolling accusation).

^

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1 minute ago, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

^

such a #$&(% personality, for heaven's sake! 

Kid, i've been on this forums for four years, i've seen and had so many discussions, arguments and topics, i'm not going to pick up a fight with a person who's too closed minded and immature to accept a healthy discussion.

 

and it has to be me, i'm gonna have to point out that

6 minutes ago, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

Erupt with a multitude of Eidolon energy beams and sweep a circle of death around Revenant. The beams will modify their Damage Type to target select defenses, while incoming damage is redirected back into the beams. Hold fire to boost Status Effects and Damage, at the cost of increased energy consumption. Thralls killed by this leave overshield pickups.

is actually a WEAKER version of Baruuk's reactive storm

when it says reacts, it doesn't react accurately.

all it does is: when it damages shields it turns into magnetic, when it damages armor it turns into corrosive, and when it damages health it turns into gas, which is an Old feature that SHOULD actually get buffed to be like reactive storm.

now who's one who has "no idea what he's implying"?

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5 hours ago, (XBOX)Nekros9528 said:

The beams will modify their Damage Type to target select defenses

you forgot the part where the beams only change into 3 damage types depending on the enemys health and 1 doesn't even fully work, also compare the damage adaptation on revenants ult to baruuks reactive storm augment.

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On 2021-09-20 at 7:26 PM, (PSN)Reaper330011 said:

So desecrated enemies are added to the shadow queue?

yeah, so then shadows of the dead can snowball better in both lower and higher levels as it has the same problem that nidus passive has except with a less efficient upkeep.

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