Idea for the combination of Umbra and Prime

[Vibranium]

(It was once said (unfortunately I no longer know in which DE stream) that there should be more umbra frames, just not when and this text deals with the idea of what could be done with the umbra and the prime)

If there are more Umbra Warframes in the game, they could be merged with their respective Prime counterparts to get an Umbra Prime that combines the strengths of both systems.
In China there is already the Excalibur Umbra Prime and I and a friend thought about how to explain the existence of it.
And how you could get such a Warframe later for every other frame with the respective effects.

One could use the "fusion" via the helminth system or the space of the helminth.
The combination should take about 3 days (we think that's appropriate) and should require different resources depending on the Warframe,
In addition, Kuva should always be used (as it is also needed for the Umbra itself).

And as soon as the Umbra and the Prime have become a combined Umbra Prime, you have the choice between 3 skins.
The Umbra Skin, the Prime Skin or the then newly created Umbra Prime Skin. (You can of course change the skins at any time, as well as being able to use other skins for the frame as before)
After completion you should be able to boost one of the 4 skills, the boost remains in place until you change it but can only be changed once a day, i.e. every 24 hours.

[Xaero]

31 minutes ago, Vibranium said:

In China there is already the Excalibur Umbra Prime

Which is completely identical to Excalibur Prime except the looks. Excalibur Umbra Prime is not superior to Excalibur Umbra.

[VoidArkhangel]

hace 31 minutos, Vibranium dijo:

(It was once said (unfortunately I no longer know in which DE stream) that there should be more umbra frames, just not when and this text deals with the idea of what could be done with the umbra and the prime)

If there are more Umbra Warframes in the game, they could be merged with their respective Prime counterparts to get an Umbra Prime that combines the strengths of both systems.
In China there is already the Excalibur Umbra Prime and I and a friend thought about how to explain the existence of it.
And how you could get such a Warframe later for every other frame with the respective effects.

One could use the "fusion" via the helminth system or the space of the helminth.
The combination should take about 3 days (we think that's appropriate) and should require different resources depending on the Warframe,
In addition, Kuva should always be used (as it is also needed for the Umbra itself).

And as soon as the Umbra and the Prime have become a combined Umbra Prime, you have the choice between 3 skins.
The Umbra Skin, the Prime Skin or the then newly created Umbra Prime Skin. (You can of course change the skins at any time, as well as being able to use other skins for the frame as before)
After completion you should be able to boost one of the 4 skills, the boost remains in place until you change it but can only be changed once a day, i.e. every 24 hours.

The problems comes when explaining how could that happen, sure you can say "just stick it into the game, nobody really cares about anything else" but things shouldnt made because reasons.

-Umbra is Ballas' greatest mistake: Ballas saw the warframes as mistakes and Umbra is one of them if not the greatest since he has consciousness. Also Ballas gave Umbra a very special strain of the infestation and his quirks (sentient adaptation removal and consciosness) were consequences of his story as far as we know, maybe the adaptation removal was because of the strain but the fact that Umbra can free roam is because of all the pain he felt along the way.

-Umbra is a name: unlike the word "Prime" Umbra reffers to the Dax name so another Umbra would be strange to say the least.

-Umbra's consciousness: Afair DE didnt want to implement the Echoes from Umbra because having free spectres would only make the game more trivial than what already is and also this is what makes Umbra unique and they wanted to keep it that way.

 

Umbra was introduced as a very special warframe and some could say its an entirely new warframe and not just a variation but anyways, iirc they didnt gave up on the idea of having more umbra frames but, as long as I would love to see an Volt Umbra or even Xaku Umbra, I dont see how they would fit the game right now. Maybe we could get Umbras from parallel universes? in one universe Umbra was given the strain to become a Volt, Mag in another and so on....

[Operativ]

Heck, no. I already believe the Prime Warframes should just be an upgrade module to existing regular Warframe, adding free polarities in any slot desirable and keeping the level without the need to re-farm it and re-forma it.

Keeping people playing based on the fact that "people will always like grinding forever" is going to leave Warframe deserted once newer games take a more progressive approach on player engagement. I say, less farming, more engaging content for long-term (can be, but not necessarily more open, more sandbox capabilities).

Besides that, Excalibur Umbra was to give Excalibur an in-line upgrade with the rest of Primes, having noted the fact that Excalibur Prime is locked for Founders, as is Skana Prime and Lato Prime (and as such, there are non-prime different variants for these as well).

[BiancaRoughfin]

1 hour ago, Vibranium said:

(It was once said (unfortunately I no longer know in which DE stream) that there should be more umbra frames, just not when and this text deals with the idea of what could be done with the umbra and the prime)

Actually they never confirmed there would be other "Umbras" they did hint there could be other variations of frames in the future tho i doubt they will be called Umbra because the frame inherits the name of the person that got turned into the frame.

1 hour ago, Vibranium said:

If there are more Umbra Warframes in the game, they could be merged with their respective Prime counterparts to get an Umbra Prime that combines the strengths of both systems.

Status wise Umbra and Prime are exactly the same, only difference is Umbra has the Spectre mode and Prime has the Void energy pulse.

Also, this would bring up another issue because Excalibur Prime is not obtainable and people who desire him would flood the forums complaining they dont have him to merge.

1 hour ago, Vibranium said:

In China there is already the Excalibur Umbra Prime and I and a friend thought about how to explain the existence of it.

China has "Umbra Prime" because it was their Founder Exclusive, DE later introduced Umbra into the global build as replacement for the Prime players couldnt get and because practically everyone in the community was asking for it.

Also, the game's lore is completely different in China from what i know so they have a completely different approach to why Umbra exists there.

1 hour ago, Vibranium said:

One could use the "fusion" via the helminth system or the space of the helminth.
The combination should take about 3 days (we think that's appropriate) and should require different resources depending on the Warframe,
In addition, Kuva should always be used (as it is also needed for the Umbra itself).

I think you should replay the Sacrifice quest again and pay better attention to the lore on how Warframes are created.

1 hour ago, Vibranium said:

And as soon as the Umbra and the Prime have become a combined Umbra Prime, you have the choice between 3 skins.
The Umbra Skin, the Prime Skin or the then newly created Umbra Prime Skin. (You can of course change the skins at any time, as well as being able to use other skins for the frame as before)

2 Skins because Umbra and Umbra Prime are exactly the same frame.

1 hour ago, Vibranium said:

After completion you should be able to boost one of the 4 skills, the boost remains in place until you change it but can only be changed once a day, i.e. every 24 hours.

Hah, no... An absolute no. Power Creep is bad enough already, the helminth's invigoration system worsened it a lot and having "Umbra Primes" get a boost of their own would further add to the problem. 

[LillyRaccune]

51 minutes ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Actually they never confirmed there would be other "Umbras" they did hint there could be other variations of frames in the future tho i doubt they will be called Umbra because the frame inherits the name of the person that got turned into the frame.

Yeah, it doesn't look like it will happen. DE also hinted at "Memories of Umbra" or "Umbral Essence". I remember when Megan injected Octavia during a stream to demonstrate how the frame would fight autonomously.

I pulled up a Reddit thread with some info for those that are interested: https://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/hcap9m/memory_of_umbra_or_something/

[BiancaRoughfin]

28 minutes ago, LillyRaccune said:

Yeah, it doesn't look like it will happen.

Personally i dont bother, Umbra was just a way to give non-founders something special to replace Prime.

I just wish DE would add more value to the Primes, they should be able to benefit from their passives in other mission types aside the Void too.
I did make a topic years ago asking DE to put dismantled DeathOrbs or orokin relics around missions as spoils enemies could have managed to steal/recover from the Void and allow these to activate the Prime`s passives too.

[(XBOX)KawaiiAsa]

1 - no, as far as I know, we don't need more Umbral frames in the game. And as far as I know, even if more were added, they wouldn't be called 'Umbra' variants, since it seems to be pretty accepted(?) that Umbra was the name of the dax who was turned into Excalibur Umbra (EU for short). Unless you want something like Volt Lux. EU was only really added as an equivalent to Excalibur Prime for those that didn't have the founders pack.

2 - also, as far as we know, EU is the only Umbral frame to actually exist, at least in lore terms, and as far as we know, Ballas regrets making EU, thus meaning the existence of other Umbral-type frames unlikely, especially considering they were made using a special strain of the infestation, and most likely not the Helminth Strain used currently. Unless they use some alternate universe explanation for why there are more Umbral-types, which then requires explaining how 2 (or more) universes combined and how nothing bad has come out of them, causing even more lore chaos than just not adding another Umbral-type.

7 hours ago, Vibranium said:

In China there is already the Excalibur Umbra Prime and I and a friend thought about how to explain the existence of it.

3 - as far as I know... Excalibur Umbra Prime is just the Chinese equivalent to Excalibur Prime, and the name does not imply anything. Plus, they have the exact same functionality as Excalibur Prime as far as I know, meaning they are in no way associated to EU, aside from sharing a design and a name.

4 - I swear that in a slightly later devstream they mentioned that they had no plans for additional Umbral frames, unless I missheard or am just going crazy. Plus not everyone may want additional Umbral-types.

[Xaero]

On 2021-09-21 at 8:20 PM, BiancaRoughfin said:

Actually they never confirmed there would be other "Umbras" they did hint there could be other variations of frames in the future tho i doubt they will be called Umbra because the frame inherits the name of the person that got turned into the frame.

They in fact did in a couple devstreams. Umbra is a variation of warframes, not a unique name.

[LagartoPunkarra]

I think the only way we will get more Umbra Warframes is when DE makes another exclusive Prime that you can only obtain by paying money for a limited time and then make it unobtainable, thing that DE said that will never happen again. I may be wrong, who knows, a Mag Umbra or a Loki Umbra could appear one day.

And combining a Prime and an Umbra to get a new variation that has a buff to one of the skills for free? No, this sounds awful because:

1. Warframes aren't made like a robot, their base is biological and are made with an individual, and as far as we know there's no Warframe that did a "Dragon Ball fusion" with their Prime variant.
2. The powercreep in this game is already bad enough, boosting a skill for the "hahas" would damage that powercreep even further.
3. Excalibur Umbra Prime is the chinese equivalent of Excalibur Prime, it's not a new exclusive version that the chinese have that is better than Umbra. In fact, Excalibur Prime is considered "weaker" than Excalibur Umbra because Umbra is stronger against Sentients and him being autonomous while in operator mode, so Excalibur Umbra Prime is "weaker" than Excalibur Umbra. I say "weaker" because the three of them has the same stats, it's just that change that make Umbra better.