I've waited before making this post but when is blast damage not going to be worthless

[Tiltskillet]

1 hour ago, Tyreaus said:

Frankly, I'd prefer the knockdown of old.

I'd still dislike this, and yeah, it's because I'm one of those silly players who still plays the headshot game from time to time.

But somebody made the suggestion before that when prone targets get hit with precision weapons, it automatically counts as a headshot.  That could actually be great.

1 hour ago, Tyreaus said:

You're no longer required to sacrifice some status chance if you want to avoid the knockdown effects. What's the harm if it's the player's choice?

The problem for me was never me using Blast. 😉  And nowadays I think Blast procs are more common than ever, because the weapons with innate Blast are more popular than ever.  (Plus they have a lot more multishot now.)

[Silligoose]

7 hours ago, quxier said:

Just because killing isn't required it doesn't mean that game doesn't incentivize you to kill. If game requires to interact with enemies (e.g. enemies want to destroy you or something you are protecting) then killing is one of thing you will do. Killing might be way you can win that missions.

Only spy and sabotage (not counting destroying some not living stuffs) make killing not option to win (you need to do something different to win). However those missions doesn't require you to interact with enemies so you don't need to think about procing statuses.

ps. another mission is treasure hunt from Maroo

 

I remember with old blast I've been running with my sonicor stunning everything.... however killing were still huge part of it.

 

If game had - I don't think game has it. Lots of things could be solved with "big enough gun". When game introduce new ways to interact with enemies that makes killing then bad choice then we can put different elements on our weapons/frames.

Without those things our options are limited.

"Killing is the best form of cc" is a phrase quite apt in Warframe. Thing is, we get to a point in Warframe where we get big enough guns  to solve our problems and this "best form of cc" becomes extremely easy to do.

When the best thing to do becomes extremely easy to do, all lesser forms become less viable and used, falling away to the meta. That's where lategame finds itself: Most forms of cc from elemental procs do not matter, or is seen as a waste of time/useless, because everything dies.  I feel this detracts from the variety in viable it tactical play at lategame.

[Tyreaus]

11 hours ago, Tiltskillet said:

I'd still dislike this, and yeah, it's because I'm one of those silly players who still plays the headshot game from time to time.

But somebody made the suggestion before that when prone targets get hit with precision weapons, it automatically counts as a headshot.  That could actually be great.

The problem for me was never me using Blast. 😉  And nowadays I think Blast procs are more common than ever, because the weapons with innate Blast are more popular than ever.  (Plus they have a lot more multishot now.)

Fair points: clearly I play solo too often...

The "global headshot" would probably be even better than a blind, given how it synergizes with all of the "on headshot / headshot kill" mods and arcanes. And it's pleasantly niche: it isn't the top of the meta, but also doesn't need to be to find use. That's gold IMO.

[Tiltskillet]

26 minutes ago, Tyreaus said:

Fair points: clearly I play solo too often...

The "global headshot" would probably be even better than a blind, given how it synergizes with all of the "on headshot / headshot kill" mods and arcanes. And it's pleasantly niche: it isn't the top of the meta, but also doesn't need to be to find use. That's gold IMO.

Yeah, add that and it's kind of perfect status effect.  Affects the game in a visible and thematic way, and has both CC utility and a neat little perk that one can imagine building around. 

There are some details that might cause problems.  Like, if the auto headshot on prone targets applies to electric procs, that could get a little out of control, maybe.   Although I doubt it would be more out of control than plain ol' Viral is now.

[lukinu_u]

Il y a 17 heures, quxier a dit :

Blast could cause you headache, your vision could be blurred etc. So accuracy reduction fits.

So... another gas... nah.

I think another gas (which is not entirely true, since it works differently) is much better than another worthless CC.

Right now across all status, we have  :

• 4 DoT status
• 7 CC status
• 3 damage buff status
• 1 AoE

Packing slows, stun and attack debuffs in "CC" might seem unfair, but at the end why would you care about slowing or reduce damage/accuracy when you can simply stun the target ? It's not like combining corrosive and viral for more damage, since once the target is stun there is nothing more you can do for more benefits.

This cause CC status to be worthless because they don't help each other, they just encourage players to use the best one and completely ignore the rest, further increasing the already existing damage meta.

As a player who rely a lot on CC status to survive at high level (mainly voic and electricity), I can say Blast is not only expensive to use (taking 2 mod slots, preventing viral/radiation/heat on the weapon, not contributing to the toxin multiplier, is bad against most health types), but also a worst effect than heat/electricity/void provides alone.

The only reasons you might want to use blast status are :

• It's innate on the weapon so you use it as a soft CC in combination with some non-CC status.
• You want more status for Condition Overload and similar mods.

[quxier]

4 hours ago, lukinu_u said:

I think another gas (which is not entirely true, since it works differently) is much better than another worthless CC.

Right now across all status, we have  :

• 4 DoT status
• 7 CC status
• 3 damage buff status
• 1 AoE

It might be better but it doesn't bring anything unique. It might be good - it depends on implementation.