Kill More Infested than Grineer (Solo)

[The_Maker]

The Deimos mission in which you are tasked with killing more infested than the grineer is too difficult to do while solo. The grineer all aimbot and kill the infested far faster than I can. This is not a test of combat ability, this is a test of whether I feel like bringing Mesa yet again to out-aimbot them. I'm tired of bringing the same exact frame to Deimos for every single bounty on the off-chance that this mission will appear. I understand that there are a few other methods for dealing with this problem, like Banish, but my point is that this mission should not be more complicated than me + gun + infested = lods of ekills.

As the mission is currently, three infested sacs will spawn periodically in front of them, like we're playing a very slow carnival game. My suggestion is, preferably, to make the infested spawn more fluidly like the other missions and increase the amount needed, or at least decrease the damage of Level 3 SentryGarv so I have a chance of stealing his kill. 

[Leqesai]

Until you're more powerful you should not expect to solo all of the content. There are missions clearly designed with specific frames/loadouts (in this case DPS is very important). If you're unable to meet the requirements solo then try running it with a crew. The mission you're talking about is relatively straight forward but it does necessitate certain strategies. If Mesa is your best DPS option then it is smart to use her for missions like this. She is far from the only viable way of doing this solo, however. Once you have Voidrig you should be able to do these missions solo with little to no problem (once you get a solid loadout for it) with any frame. 

You could also go with Wukong for the celestial twin and use the AI aimbotting against itself. Or you could AOE spam with Xoris or any of the other big hitting AOE weapons. Then there's Ember, Titania, Ash, Gara, Mirage, Zephyr (to name a few) that are all very solid options without need for much investment. 

There are lots of missions that are difficult while solo. Making the missions playout differently to cater to solo play is not necessary.

[The_Maker]

How is DPS very important? I kill the infested INSTANTLY, with ANY gun I have. The problem is that they literally instantly die to the grineer before I can take aim. How is that intentional?

I don't use Mesa because she deals high damage, I use her because she shoots faster than them. But again, none of that is the point. My point is that the purported gameplay of this mission(if that is, "to kill lots of infested quickly") is not currently being met, or is being met to a standard that only very few of my equipment can manage. Maybe I could do it if I got VERY good, but none of the other missions need this level of investment. 

And what exactly is the idea behind loadout-specific content here, anyway? I would totally understand if this was, say, a sortie. But it's not. It's the completely basic open-world bounties. My entire complaint was about having to limit my arsenal for one(1) possible mission out of up to five stages in an otherwise bog-standard and accessible open-world bounty. None of the other bounty stages require the specialization you seem to be describing(again, this isn't about damage, but sheer speed). 

As for "changing the missions for solo play", I simply do not know if it is this way in multiplayer, as I have not tried it. If it is, it should be changed there, too. 

[(PSN)Reaper330011]

I once had a full squad and we still failed because they must use hacks.

their aim  precision, damage, and knowledge of where they will spawn next makes us fail really fast.

[Kainosh]

9 minutes ago, The_Maker said:

The problem is that they literally instantly die to the grineer before I can take aim.

 

He has LoS.  Just kill infested before they get into his sights.

I just climb somewhere high, and shoot from there with something that can hit multiple targets.  Like Kuva Ayanga or such.   Dont even need specific frame.  Just slot AoE archgun in and its done.

 

AI in this game is pretty dull....if you can't beat it, you definitely lack something.    And if its easier, then what is the point? Might as well just remove it.   

[taiiat]

yeah, basically spam AoE around so that you Kill the Infested before they get near the Grineer.

[quxier]

3 hours ago, The_Maker said:

How is DPS very important? I kill the infested INSTANTLY, with ANY gun I have. The problem is that they literally instantly die to the grineer before I can take aim. How is that intentional?

AFAIR, I used to kill weaker enemies without problems and stronger enemies took some time. Yet I get like 3x more than Grineer because Grineer were slow at killing.

However if that's the case then I would consider it as a bug. It would be like Cetus bounty where you need protect the camp.

[xombob89]

7 hours ago, The_Maker said:

the mission is currently, three infested sacs will spawn periodically in front of them, like we're playing a very slow carnival game

Ahahaha, indeee it is. 

What Ive noticed you dont get kill progress from destroying spawn pods which is stupid considering you have to spam AoE attacks to stay ahead of the grineers aimbots since those pods spawn next to them... Which in turn slows down the mission a lot. 

It needs work, like almost every bounty we have in open worlds... 

[Lutesque]

9 hours ago, The_Maker said:

This is not a test of combat ability, this is a test of whether I feel like bringing Mesa yet again to out-aimbot them.

This is literally what I did after Failing the Area Control Bounty twice in a Row....

I would really like to play my Main Warframe once in a while... Please DE !!?

 

 

Oh hey Look:

@The_Maker + @Leqesai+ @xombob89 + @Lutesque

We're all using Ivara Glyphs 😁.... Its almost like we are up to something Sinister 😱 !!!

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

Until you're more powerful you should not expect to solo all of the content.

Is it too much to ask just for the mission to be possible to do Solo... We're not asking for our Main Frames to be the new Effecient Meta... We literally just don't want to get Punished for Playing Them 😭

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

There are missions clearly designed with specific frames/loadouts (in this case DPS is very important).

You would think DE would be trying to Down play The need to use Mesa... Instead they're doing the exact opposite 😱 !!!

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

If Mesa is your best DPS option then it is smart to use her for missions like this.

In my case it's Ivara but the issue here isn't DPS... It's just not being able to Find the enemies in time to even get a chance to Kill them.... With Mesa I don't even know if enemies are over there but I just bullet Jump and Press 4 just to make sure... Aimbot does the rest...

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

Once you have Voidrig you should be able to do these missions solo with little to no problem (once you get a solid loadout for it) with any frame

I have my Void Rig.... It's incomplete though.... Needs Forma... My Mausolon too...

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

. 

You could also go with Wukong for the celestial twin and use the AI aimbotting against itself.

I do that with Wisp Specters... And it actually does help... Until she gets murdered by one of those Orange Carnis Enemies... Those things really hurt....

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

Or you could AOE spam with Xoris or any of the other big hitting AOE weapons

I'm using Glaive Prime with The new Volatile Quick Return Mod just For the Increased Explosion Radius... It's literally the only mod with that specific Stat 😱 !!!

9 hours ago, Leqesai said:

There are lots of missions that are difficult while solo. Making the missions playout differently to cater to solo play is not necessary.

It is if the Matchmaking is going to continue to be this Dated... Seriously... It's so bad...

8 hours ago, The_Maker said:

 

And what exactly is the idea behind loadout-specific content here, anyway? I would totally understand if this was, say, a sortie. But it's not. It's the completely basic open-world bounties

I mean... That just Highlights just how Ridiculous it is... I can Solo a Steel Path Star Chart Defense with Booben super easy but cant do a small Simple level 50 Area Control or Garv Bounty... Clearly something is not right here...

Who knows though.... Maybe things will change once I level up my Helminth Abit....

2 hours ago, xombob89 said:

Ahahaha, indeee it is. 

What Ive noticed you dont get kill progress from destroying spawn pods which is stupid considering you have to spam AoE attacks to stay ahead of the grineers aimbots since those pods spawn next to them... Which in turn slows down the mission a lot. 

Wait... it doesn't ? 😳   Tenno... You have endured such hardship to bring us this Intel... I greatly appreciate it ♥️ !!!

 

[quxier]

38 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

This is literally what I did after Failing the Area Control Bounty twice in a Row....

I would really like to play my Main Warframe once in a while... Please DE !!?

For me Mesa = Cetus, Titania = Deimos.

We won't be able to play more frames in Open world because:

- Bounties consist of different type of missions. While some are fairly easy (and can be done by any frame) some require "better" gear.

- We cannot change gear in Open world.

 

38 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

 

Oh hey Look:

@The_Maker + @Leqesai+ @xombob89 + @Lutesque

We're all using Ivara Glyphs 😁.... Its almost like we are up to something Sinister 😱 !!!

And I'm bunny hopping (Wisp glyph) looking at Ivaras planning something. :D

[Lutesque]

3 hours ago, quxier said:

For me Mesa = Cetus, Titania = Deimos.

What about Fortuna ?

 

[quxier]

1 hour ago, Lutesque said:

What about Fortuna ?

I don't remember. I've not been in Fortuna for a very long time. It's probably Titania because she has better archwing or something.

[Lutesque]

2 hours ago, quxier said:

I don't remember. I've not been in Fortuna for a very long time. It's probably Titania because she has better archwing or something.

Me it's:

Cetus: Chroma (Helps with The Thumpers)

Fortuna: Booben.

Deimos: Mesa 😞.

There was a time I could do Bounties on the plains with Nova or Loki but those Days are over thanks to Status Rework 😭.

 

[OmegaVoid]

On 2021-10-10 at 9:58 AM, The_Maker said:

The Deimos mission in which you are tasked with killing more infested than the grineer is too difficult to do while solo.

That's not the task, though. It's a bonus objective.

Bonuses should be difficult -- they're the reward you get for doing particularly well.

EDIT: okay, I misremembered this. Killing more Infested is the main objective, the bonus is for doubling Garv's bodycount. But I'm now genuinely mystified how anyone with good weapons can fail the Bounty.

On 2021-10-10 at 11:25 AM, The_Maker said:

I kill the infested INSTANTLY, with ANY gun I have. The problem is that they literally instantly die to the grineer before I can take aim.

Yeah, don't stand next to the Grineer. Venture forth and find things to kill before they get into Garv's range!

I didn't get the bonus the first time I did this Bounty stage, but after I realised the Grineer didn't need babysitting it ceased to be a problem.

I've done it lots of times in lots of 'frames. A fast-moving Warframe helps, as does extra Enemy Radar, but neither are mandatory.

[(NSW)Greybones]

1 hour ago, OmegaVoid said:

I've done it lots of times in lots of 'frames. A fast-moving Warframe helps, as does extra Enemy Radar, but neither are mandatory.

Just wanted to pop in to say It’s weirdly nice to hear someone say they’ve done a thing with lots of frames, instead of a specific few.

Like, I get that defensive frames like Frost (or whatever) can be great for defense missions, but what can impress me personally is when someone can wield the different frames or equipment so well that Frost isn’t necessary for defense, he just has innate capability to do it well. The idea that we must use so-and-so frame kind of runs counter to the idea that any frame can do any content.

Anyways, don’t mind me.

Good tips for showing Garv how it’s done, I’ll keep them in mind 👍 

In contribution to this topic, personally I keep an eye out for those floating sacks and get a good kill on whatever drops out of them

[Wret]

Hi just popping in to say in a furious rage that it really isn't just solo, had this as the last bounty segment with a full squad and the Grineer had 20%  in the first 5 seconds. Dozens of Infested were spawning underneath them, meaning we couldn't kill them before they got in range. I was using a fully upgraded Void Rig and Mausalon to kill anything that showed up near them for more than 3 rendered frames. Oh the pods don't count GOOD TO KNOW. Still could not possibly keep up with them it just felt random.

 

I grinded out all my Family stuff closer to release and I don't think it was nearly this bad, meaning it somehow got worse since then. I'm only doing this because I need Mother Tokens for the...I can't even remember what I was grinding for. Like the Naeberus stuff is meant to keep us occupied until we're closer to the New War since they're not going to have anything new gameplay wise for a period of months, and it's just shining a giant glaring light on how broken or just Not Entertaining At All stuff is sometimes. Really tempers my expectations for any new gameplay systems the New War adds because I imagine it's going to be...like this. That might be a positive.

[Lutesque]

On 2021-10-11 at 7:36 AM, (NSW)Greybones said:

 

Like, I get that defensive frames like Frost (or whatever) can be great for defense missions, but what can impress me personally is when someone can wield the different frames or equipment so well that Frost isn’t necessary for defense, he just has innate capability to do it well. The idea that we must use so-and-so frame kind of runs counter to the idea that any frame can do any content

What are you talking about ? Frost is terrible for Defense Missions 🤔... 

Also the whole "Any Frame Can Do Any Content" tends to fall apart when you realise exactly how this is actually Achieved.... I remember getting into an Argument with someone on Profit Taker being for Chroma and Inaros only.... He said he did it with Banshee.... Case Closed right ?

Well it wasn't until he posted a video of exactly how he did it I saw the issue... He was literally Spamming the Living Hell Out of Spoiler Mode.... I think he spent more Time in Spoiler Mode Healing than he did in his Warframe.... And he didn't use a single one of Banshee's Abilities... Not even on adds....

So I ask you.... If you claim that every Warframe can do every content but don't actually utilize your Warframe to actually achieve this... Then have you made your point ? 

I personally don't think so....

Hell I even did this myself one time... I took Booben out to an Eidolon Hunt with an all Over Driver Build... Because that's literally the only Ability that works in Eidolon Hunts.... And Did just fine... I one Shotted all the Limbs and even the Eidolon's themselves.... But the whole experience was just aggravating because I might have looked like I was playing Booben but in actualality I was merely Channeling Discount Chroma while Disguised as Booben. 😐

On 2021-10-11 at 7:31 PM, Wret said:

I'm only doing this because I need Mother Tokens for the...I can't even remember what I was grinding for.

Night Of Naberus 😝...

On 2021-10-11 at 7:31 PM, Wret said:

Really tempers my expectations for any new gameplay systems the New War adds because I imagine it's going to be...like this. That might be a positive.

Out of Curiosity.... What Content Launched Along Side The Sacrifice ? Was it Fortuna ?

[(NSW)Greybones]

10 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

What are you talking about ? Frost is terrible for Defense Missions 🤔... 

Also the whole "Any Frame Can Do Any Content" tends to fall apart when you realise exactly how this is actually Achieved.... I remember getting into an Argument with someone on Profit Taker being for Chroma and Inaros only.... He said he did it with Banshee.... Case Closed right ?

Well it wasn't until he posted a video of exactly how he did it I saw the issue... He was literally Spamming the Living Hell Out of Spoiler Mode.... I think he spent more Time in Spoiler Mode Healing than he did in his Warframe.... And he didn't use a single one of Banshee's Abilities... Not even on adds....

So I ask you.... If you claim that every Warframe can do every content but don't actually utilize your Warframe to actually achieve this... Then have you made your point ? 

I personally don't think so....

Hell I even did this myself one time... I took Booben out to an Eidolon Hunt with an all Over Driver Build... Because that's literally the only Ability that works in Eidolon Hunts.... And Did just fine... I one Shotted all the Limbs and even the Eidolon's themselves.... But the whole experience was just aggravating because I might have looked like I was playing Booben but in actualality I was merely Channeling Discount Chroma while Disguised as Booben. 😐

Huh. I thought Frost was okay for defense (he was the one I tended to gravitate towards). Wasn’t sure who else counts as an excellent Defense mission frame; Limbo sprang to mind, so I was like “Frost (or whatever)”.

🤔 That’s a fair point regarding Banshee vs Profit Taker.  It’s possible your friend was just bad at the game and had to rely on spoiler as a crutch, but this does give me a goal to test towards; gonna try Banshee against Profit Taker and see whether the claim that “Any frame can do any content” holds water. If no matter what I try I just can’t do it, I would consider it a suspect claim

[xombob89]

On 2021-10-11 at 8:31 PM, Wret said:

Hi just popping in to say in a furious rage that it really isn't just solo, had this as the last bounty segment with a full squad and the Grineer had 20%  in the first 5 seconds. Dozens of Infested were spawning underneath them, meaning we couldn't kill them before they got in range. I was using a fully upgraded Void Rig and Mausalon to kill anything that showed up near them for more than 3 rendered frames. Oh the pods don't count GOOD TO KNOW. Still could not possibly keep up with them it just felt random.

Yeah, I also have maxed Voidrig and Ive had to resort to spamming his cannons many times because the enemies just spawn right under the grineer... And since the pods dont seem to count, its slooooow. 

[Cenyn]

On 2021-10-12 at 5:03 PM, (NSW)Greybones said:

Huh. I thought Frost was okay for defense (he was the one I tended to gravitate towards). Wasn’t sure who else counts as an excellent Defense mission frame; Limbo sprang to mind, so I was like “Frost (or whatever)”.

Broadly speaking, it's rare for the defense target to take a lot of damage because we kill everything so fast. A nuke mirage is an excellent lower level defense frame as she can spawn kill enemies. I presume @Lutesquewas referring to this paradigm, which frost can only weakly contribute to.

[(NSW)Greybones]

1 hour ago, Cenyn said:

Broadly speaking, it's rare for the defense target to take a lot of damage because we kill everything so fast. A nuke mirage is an excellent lower level defense frame as she can spawn kill enemies. I presume @Lutesquewas referring to this paradigm, which frost can only weakly contribute to.

Ah yeah, I can see that. When we can overkill everything super easily, Frost and his bubble can only do so much. As is the case with many things, Warframes or weapons, there’s just no substitute for massive amounts of death at the hands of overtuned equipment.

In situations where overkilling isn’t a thing, Frost shines a little more the closer we get to the actual fight, and requires less making up for shortcomings to get a decent defensive frame out of him. But according to common wisdom, those situations are meant to diminish the more we progress in the game and get the chance to make overkill builds, so certain Frames are meant to not be used

[(NSW)Greybones]

3 hours ago, Cenyn said:

Broadly speaking, it's rare for the defense target to take a lot of damage because we kill everything so fast. A nuke mirage is an excellent lower level defense frame as she can spawn kill enemies. I presume @Lutesquewas referring to this paradigm, which frost can only weakly contribute to.

I’m just…. so over this paradigm. It’s a paradigm that says things are Useless, that says Warframe is an easy game, that uses terms like Mastery Fodder and compares one piece of equipment to another with no regard to how a certain thing stands on its own merit, no, it must be efficient.

It’s a paradigm that got so heavily ingrained in some players that when Steel Path came and kicked their once-overpowered build down a notch or two, they go “Oh my, the game’s challenging again, this must be the Hard Mode that I’ve been searching for in my thousands of hours of self-inflicted cookie clicker grind”. They equipped overpowered builds and then got bored and wanted the game to meet them instead of, you know, not using the nuke build that destroys things by player design and simplifies the game by player design because that was what the player wanted. And Steel Path is broken! This is not a secret! But what better measuring system to use then the one game mode that forced players to die? So anything that doesn’t meet the SP standard gets shat on.

It’s a paradigm that says Warframe is innately a horde shooter instead of large amounts of enemies being the result of spawns just matching our rate of killing, and it’s a paradigm that says the game is the grind because what else is there to do when we’re “supposed” to simplify the game until there’s only the reward left?

I can respect that players have fun with the overpowered nature and huge variety of build options, but then some players go a step too far and say that this is what Warframe is and what it should be. To the point that something like Yareli drops and people are like “WTF, DE? You don’t even play your own game! If only you understood the trials and tribulations of the veteran player, you‘d understand what would make us happy!” while those same players are probably falling asleep while grinding and complaining that the game’s too easy

edit: Was reminded of another consequence of this paradigm; some players want self damage to make a return because otherwise, they’re just so powerful that the only thing that can give them a sense of skill-check is not blowing themselves up. I get that it’s a pain to see some players running around destroying everything in multiplayer for the sake of grinding fast (hello again, paradigm), stealing kills and making an already-boring mission even more boring, but there’s also this idea that self-damage is a better way to indicate capacity to play well, which is absolutely questionable when the current stagger can be deadly if the player can’t just face-tank everything.

Grr. Rant is probably over for now

[OmegaVoid]

1 hour ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

Ah yeah, I can see that. When we can overkill everything super easily, Frost and his bubble can only do so much. As is the case with many things, Warframes or weapons, there’s just no substitute for massive amounts of death at the hands of overtuned equipment.

Truth is, the bubble ain't always so durable as you might think -- it's HP gets inflated by the damage it takes in the first (four?) seconds after casting, during which it's invulnerable.

So if you start an Extractor in Excav, or a Console in MD, and you cast the bubble immediately, when there's only a couple of enemies around... it just takes chip damage and doesn't get tanky. Then, when a bunch more enemies show up, the bubble starts melting real fast (assuming you're in a mission where the enemies are a real threat to the objective).

That was kind of an issue when Kuva Liches were a new thing and the Extractors in their territory could get trashed by a stiff breeze. I actually defended more Extractors to the full 100 Cryotic in Titania than I managed in Frost (her Razorflies basically do what your wall-hopping trick achieves, but without any effort from the player 😃).

Also, Railgun MOAs can shoot straight through Snow Globe. Just because.

The bubble does rock for the Exploiter fight, though. That cannon of hers ramps it up to stupid HP instantly, and then I have a nice safe place to stand for the next 15 minutes while I throw canisters at her vents and repeatedly miss. 😆

On 2021-10-11 at 6:36 AM, (NSW)Greybones said:

It’s weirdly nice to hear someone say they’ve done a thing with lots of frames, instead of a specific few [...] what can impress me personally is when someone can wield the different frames or equipment so well [...]

Please don't mistake me for someone with skills 🤣 I use lots of different 'frames 'cos I'd get bored with maining just one, but I wouldn't say I've mastered any of them.

The subject of this thread just reduces to running around killing as many things as possible, and if you're in a 'frame which can cast anything that helps with that, so much the better.

[(NSW)Greybones]

23 minutes ago, OmegaVoid said:

Please don't mistake me for someone with skills 🤣 I use lots of different 'frames 'cos I'd get bored with maining just one, but I wouldn't say I've mastered any of them.

The subject of this thread just reduces to running around killing as many things as possible, and if you're in a 'frame which can cast anything that helps with that, so much the better.

Man I ain’t care about M4d sKi1lz. I’m just glad that someone doesn’t feel shoehorned into a specific frame for a specific mission. I’m similar; I much prefer mixing it up, and it’s nice to hear when someone else isn’t always going for The Best Tool To Grind With (I’ll take the one that’s the funnest to use, thanks).

Regarding Frost’s bubble, yeah, it can be shredded kind of easily if not set up right (such as when it’s quiet all around), and SP can chew through it real fast. Standard game is fine though, which is 1.) where most of the game is, and 2.) I can use a whole lot more of my options outside of a handful of stupidly-powerful builds that I’d take into SP if I was curious about how they’d do. Sometimes it’s nice to have an on-hand defensive thing instead of having to rely on kill-before-they-kill (which can be tough sometimes) or building up innate weaknesses of a not-so-defensive-frame

[Lutesque]

12 hours ago, Cenyn said:

Broadly speaking, it's rare for the defense target to take a lot of damage because we kill everything so fast. A nuke mirage is an excellent lower level defense frame as she can spawn kill enemies. I presume @Lutesquewas referring to this paradigm, which frost can only weakly contribute to.

Indeed I was 😁.

6 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

The bubble does rock for the Exploiter fight, though. That cannon of hers ramps it up to stupid HP instantly, and then I have a nice safe place to stand for the next 15 minutes while I throw canisters at her vents and repeatedly miss. 😆

You don't use Gauss for Exploiter ? ? 😱

6 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

Please don't mistake me for someone with skills 🤣 I use lots of different 'frames 'cos I'd get bored with maining just one, but I wouldn't say I've mastered any of them.

 Be like me and Main 2.5 Frames 😝.... There's no rule that says you can't have Multiple Mains...