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PSA: Fomorian Sabotage & Razorback Armada


[DE]Marcus
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Hm, that explains a fair bit. I've been wondering what caused the invasions to not occur yet on the Switch, after someone mentioned about it elsewhere.

 

That said @[DE]Marcus, is there any chance of a new cross-fire invasion type involving the Railjack in case the Grineer / Corpus meters max out simultaneously again? Just some food for thought :)

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12 hours ago, TheLexiConArtist said:

I highly doubt it's a matter of "can't" automate. It's a matter of them executively deciding not to automate them for whatever reasons they have - for example, not wanting to have these mini-events launch at inconvenient times with other stuff going on that they'd rather people be focusing on, like some sort of.. new major content update or something. You know.

The quest takes a few hours.  The farm afterward is on a stupidly long rotation, so once you start getting new stuff you'll eventually have to wait hours before the rotation you need comes back up.  Resurgence lasts several days for each rotation.  People have had a lot of time to farm aya. 

A Fomorian or Razorback take less than 10 minutes each.  Why in the world do I keep seeing people acting like these events are totally delayed so that people don't have to spend less than an hour to gather resources, make keys, do the mini-event and then go back to the farming they probably needed a break from anyway?  This excuse literally makes zero sense.

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2 minutes ago, (XBOX)TehChubbyDugan said:

The quest takes a few hours.  The farm afterward is on a stupidly long rotation, so once you start getting new stuff you'll eventually have to wait hours before the rotation you need comes back up.  Resurgence lasts several days for each rotation.  People have had a lot of time to farm aya. 

A Fomorian or Razorback take less than 10 minutes each.  Why in the world do I keep seeing people acting like these events are totally delayed so that people don't have to spend less than an hour to gather resources, make keys, do the mini-event and then go back to the farming they probably needed a break from anyway?  This excuse literally makes zero sense.

Ok. Let me explain why it makes 100% sense.

Currently on PC there are thermia fractures and prime resurgence live. There are people who will log in for resurgence and there are people who will login for fractures, BUT there are also people who will login for both. Those players login once and participate in 2 things and then log off. 

If they ran razorback too this week, it would be third thing people can do in one login. That's something DE don't want.

When  ONLY razorback or fomorian is live there are two possible outcomes:
a) you login, do the event, logoff
b) you login, do the event, since you are already in game you play something, you logoff

outcome b) is more favorable for DE of course, but both outcomes are great

tl;dr 
Spacing out events across multiple weeks and not running them simultaneously is the smart way to do live service game, because it forces people to login more often, increasing the chance thay play the game, increasing the chance they will participate in the economy, increasing the chance DE make money.

 

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27 minutes ago, (XBOX)TehChubbyDugan said:

Why in the world do I keep seeing people acting like these events are totally delayed so that people don't have to spend less than an hour to gather resources, make keys, do the mini-event and then go back to the farming they probably needed a break from anyway?  This excuse literally makes zero sense.

I am not the one who made the (probable) executive decision to not automate them. My example reason may or may not be accurate to one (of an unknown number) of the factors that caused that decision to be reached at DE.

Why in the world do you act like people speculating such plausible reasons is an excuse they are making for a decision they had a hand in?

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Just now, TheLexiConArtist said:

I am not the one who made the (probable) executive decision to not automate them. My example reason may or may not be accurate to one (of an unknown number) of the factors that caused that decision to be reached at DE.

Why in the world do you act like people speculating such plausible reasons is an excuse they are making for a decision they had a hand in?

I swear you always make something up to argue against when you respond to me.

I am saying that it makes no sense for people to keep making an argument on DE's behalf that holds no water.  Even if that is the reason they made the decision, it still makes no sense.  Making the excuse for them is just that much more bizarre because the argument doesn't work.  There is zero reason to hold up an event that takes practically no time just because there's new things for people to do in the game.  

Oh no, the Fomorian showed up and I just started a 3 hour quest.  How will I ever finish this 3 hour quest in time to do the event that will be here for longer than 3 hours?  What if I have to stop running these bounties that are permanently added to the game in order to spend less than an hour running this mini event?  How will I ever get back to these bounties that aren't going anywhere if I run this Fomorian for like 10 minutes?  
 

 

30 minutes ago, Cerikus said:

If they ran razorback too this week, it would be third thing people can do in one login.

Wow, imagine doing three things in warframe.  Man, that would be crazy.  You're so crazy even suggesting that people would run more than one type of content before logging back off.  DE would never want people to play the game longer than like 10 minutes at a time.  

Seriously though, who exactly is running fractures?  There is literally no point in running them after you first complete the tiers, unless you somehow don't have a truckload of excess thermia for Exploiter.  And it's not like farming relics isn't something you can't drop out of for like 10 minutes to run a fomorian, get your potato and go right back to grinding aya.  

There is literally no reason for this to not be automated, and making vapor thin excuses on DE's behalf is just weird.  They could drop a fomorian and razorback at the same time during some completely insane mainline content drop and it still wouldn't matter because they're quick to run.

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4 hours ago, (XBOX)TehChubbyDugan said:

Wow, imagine doing three things in warframe.

Yes, I can imagine. I would ever prefer that, just as you do. The problem is that you are thinking about it from players perspective. I am trying to explain DEs perspective which is a perspective from a business point of view. It really is quite simple to understand.

If you have multiple events and space them out and not run them simultaneously you get more traffic in game. These are no vapor thin excuses, this is just how it works in live-service games. It doesn't matter how many people run fractures, because even if there is one person who runs them, spacing the event will force that person to login more often.

You may not like it, I may not like it, but this is just a fact. It's smart management and human psychology. Yes, you are being manipulated to play the game more often and login more often. That's what it is. I understand it and respect it. I even welcome it, because I know it actually helps me enjoy the game more. 

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20 hours ago, [DE]Marcus said:

Tenno,

Thanks to player reporting, we’ve noted that the Fomorian Sabotage and/or Razorback Armada are fully constructed and ready for their appearances on all platforms, but haven’t taken place yet. As much as we’d like to say that Vay Hek just has some lingering holiday Turkey brain and forgot, these limited-time events are initiated manually server side and won’t be able to go live until some of our team return from some well deserved vacation. 

Sorry for the delay, we expect to launch these in the near future and to also simplify the process for future deployments. We’ll update here with details for their launch when we have them. 

Thank you!

thank you take your time

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23 hours ago, SilentMashiko said:

meanwhile ghoul purge and thermia fractures pop up on their own

I feel like this is because ghoul purge and thermia fractures are just events that come up with time and aren't affected by player actions, whereas the amount of invasions players complete has a direct impact on the construction process for the Fomorian and the Razorback

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9 hours ago, (XBOX)TehChubbyDugan said:

I swear you always make something up to argue against when you respond to me.

I am saying that it makes no sense for people to keep making an argument on DE's behalf that holds no water.  Even if that is the reason they made the decision, it still makes no sense.  Making the excuse for them is just that much more bizarre because the argument doesn't work.  There is zero reason to hold up an event that takes practically no time just because there's new things for people to do in the game.  

Oh no, the Fomorian showed up and I just started a 3 hour quest.  How will I ever finish this 3 hour quest in time to do the event that will be here for longer than 3 hours?  What if I have to stop running these bounties that are permanently added to the game in order to spend less than an hour running this mini event?  How will I ever get back to these bounties that aren't going anywhere if I run this Fomorian for like 10 minutes?  

Exactly where in my post you quoted first, did I make any statement of validity of that possible example? I'd argue against anyone whose authorial tone is blaming "people" of faction A for the decisions of mutually exclusive faction B.

Cop an attitude, earn a response, aye?

 

But hey, just for fun, let's dive deeper.

  • There are some people still struggling with the quest to this day whom have been sequestered in it for weeks, not hours.
  • There may be people who are yet to commence the quest when the mini-event fires under automation, whom only arrive with a decision thrust upon them to go tackle the mini-event in its final hours because the quest would elapse that remaining time.
  • Not everyone wants to only get the catalyst from the Fomorian and run. Maybe someone wants to put in time and grind the archmelee mods or Imperator Vandal as well.
  • Compounding with the above (and its respective analogue in Razorback), maybe that player also has no stock of Isotopes and Crypto-ALU, further extending their engagement time with the mini-event by needing to farm for their runs.

That's just weight for the one possibility of DE's decision making (actual player engagement with other content). Perhaps they don't want to run things concurrently because there's some behind the scene conflict issues they're aware of and want to avoid. Perhaps they want to ensure they can focus bug-swatting efforts on the Big New Thing and not get bogged down with collateral damage of surprise bugs or crashes from other limited-time events that might have been incidentally caused in the same update just yet.

We don't know. But we can logically deduce that they specifically chose to withhold some things from automation rather than being incapable of doing so. Stating that is not stating agreement - in fact we really don't have a stable basis for judging agreement unless we were better aware of the context on the dev's side of the matter.

 

So instead of "Y U EXCUSES FOR DE" animosity, maybe you could have channelled that effort more constructively into petition for transparency in their decision here?

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1 hour ago, TheLexiConArtist said:

Exactly where in my post you quoted first, did I make any statement of validity of that possible example? I'd argue against anyone whose authorial tone is blaming "people" of faction A for the decisions of mutually exclusive faction B.

Cop an attitude, earn a response, aye?

 

But hey, just for fun, let's dive deeper.

  • There are some people still struggling with the quest to this day whom have been sequestered in it for weeks, not hours.
  • There may be people who are yet to commence the quest when the mini-event fires under automation, whom only arrive with a decision thrust upon them to go tackle the mini-event in its final hours because the quest would elapse that remaining time.
  • Not everyone wants to only get the catalyst from the Fomorian and run. Maybe someone wants to put in time and grind the archmelee mods or Imperator Vandal as well.
  • Compounding with the above (and its respective analogue in Razorback), maybe that player also has no stock of Isotopes and Crypto-ALU, further extending their engagement time with the mini-event by needing to farm for their runs.

That's just weight for the one possibility of DE's decision making (actual player engagement with other content). Perhaps they don't want to run things concurrently because there's some behind the scene conflict issues they're aware of and want to avoid. Perhaps they want to ensure they can focus bug-swatting efforts on the Big New Thing and not get bogged down with collateral damage of surprise bugs or crashes from other limited-time events that might have been incidentally caused in the same update just yet.

We don't know. But we can logically deduce that they specifically chose to withhold some things from automation rather than being incapable of doing so. Stating that is not stating agreement - in fact we really don't have a stable basis for judging agreement unless we were better aware of the context on the dev's side of the matter.

 

So instead of "Y U EXCUSES FOR DE" animosity, maybe you could have channelled that effort more constructively into petition for transparency in their decision here?

You stepped into DE's shoes to say that they probably wouldn't want the events to coincide with the content update they just dropped.  I said there is no reason for them to not want that because those things aren't mutually exclusive, unless you only play like an hour a month.  That reasoning holds no water, so it's weird for me to keep seeing multiple people making this same excuse on their behalf.  I don't get how that's hard to follow.

And if people are stuck in this quest for weeks:  They were warned, and they need to learn to actually play and not just follow cookie cutter builds so that things like this don't happen to them.  I am all about trying to talk people through where they have issues, and I am against going into their threads to dunk on them, but the sympathy stops there, except for that one dude I saw that was having problems with the fight for medical reasons.  And I already allowed for the time it takes to farm mats for keys for the events in a response to you.  This is how I know you aren't actually reading anything I say and you're just arguing with yourself lol.

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On 2022-01-13 at 10:04 PM, Lightning_Bloom said:

This should definitely be automated.

It seems that it’s not an issue of complexity, or a problem with automating it. Others have brought up that the devs do it to avoid the Razorback or Formorian events clashing with major updates or other events so players won’t be split or feel forced to divide their attention. This is an extremely good reason for this, because of course both events will result in the loss of a relay if they aren’t completed. Plus it doesn’t happen very often so it can’t be too taxing on devs. I can’t speak on how complicated it might be, but it could be as simple as adding or modifying a line of code for the event (but I don’t know, so don’t take my full word for it)

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On 2022-01-13 at 10:21 PM, 3thereal said:

IF( RazorbackEventPercentage >= 100)

{

StartEvent.Razorback();

}

If(FomorianEventPercentage >= 100)

{

StartEvent.Fomorian();

}

 

Fixed, seems like a silly thing to have as a manual process. Let me know where to commit this :-)

It is not made like that to avoid overlay with other ingame events. It is not the first time razorback and fomorian are ready when a new event is going on and DE delay to avoid 2 events at the same time.

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В 14.01.2022 в 00:16, [DE]Marcus сказал:

Tenno,

Thanks to player reporting, we’ve noted that the Fomorian Sabotage and/or Razorback Armada are fully constructed and ready for their appearances on all platforms, but haven’t taken place yet. As much as we’d like to say that Vay Hek just has some lingering holiday Turkey brain and forgot, these limited-time events are initiated manually server side and won’t be able to go live until some of our team return from some well deserved vacation. 

Sorry for the delay, we expect to launch these in the near future and to also simplify the process for future deployments. We’ll update here with details for their launch when we have them. 

Thank you!

May I be curious when the vacation ends for all members of the DE development team? And other players will be interested, I dare suppose. Well, it's just that it's probably a certain number of days/weeks, and therefore there are at least approximate dates when we can expect hotfixes, updates, event launches and everything else. Or not..?

Edited by ChillrendVN
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On 2022-01-13 at 3:21 PM, 3thereal said:

IF( RazorbackEventPercentage >= 100)

{

StartEvent.Razorback();

}

If(FomorianEventPercentage >= 100)

{

StartEvent.Fomorian();

}

 

 

 

if( !OtherEvents.Active)

{

     Goto(QuotedSection)

}

 

 

Fixed for those of you who stated this did this to not to interfere with other events.

Yes, this was previously/is a joke. I'm just adding this to state that either way this can be automated not that this will be 'that simple' .

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  • 1 month later...
On 2022-01-13 at 1:16 PM, [DE]Marcus said:

simplify the process for future deployments.

Fomorian on PC is at 100% now. Time to see if DE held true to their word or if this is another case of being delayed for no apparent reason again. I obviously don't expect them to launch it right this minute since it is nighttime EST, so hopefully it gets turned on by the end of the weekend. Fingers crossed.

E: Up to 107% according to the API, lets see what happens first: Primed ammo stock becomes linkable *and readable by the api) or Fomorian sabotage is launched.

Edited by XHADgaming
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