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[Devstream 163 Feedback] Steel Path fissures


Uan91

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I mean... Yeah?

Chances are you have A LOT of Lith Relics or even Axi Releixs depending on who you are, and Steel Essences are still a pretty semi-rare resource unless you use mega drop boosters mixing. You'd probably be doing those Relics over and over again, and depending on how good you are probably get more out of it than farming the Acolytes.

Anyone that wants to do Steel Path Relics are probably kitted enough to still rush through them, if only slightly slower due to the increase health and armor.

Personally, this is great. If you don't want to deal with Acolytes you can just do this and still get Steel Essences, once the dailies are used up.

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23 minutes ago, Uan91 said:

1 Steel essence per round/mission

is that it? possibly even higher level base and you reward  *1* Steel essence just because we are opening relics aswell? 

not to sound toxic

BUT

is that a joke?

 

No? I wasn't even expecting to get a reward at all from spf be grateful we even get 1 essence

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It all depends what you are doing the fissures for.

The example they gave was farming the new prime access. That usually means premade groups, and that usually means higher-level players running the fissure together (higher-level players tend to be able to farm the requisite relics faster). For that, SP fissures are perfectly viable and the extra essence is a nice bonus.

But (at least in my experience) that's not how most of the fissures get run. In my experience, most of the fissures are run in public squads, with random relics. And you want that squad to fill up, since that gives you the highest chance at getting a more valuable reward. And for newer players, that gives the extra benefit of ending up in a squad with more experiences players who might be using some random vaulted relics.

Splitting out SP fissures simply serves to split all the matchmaking into two. At peak times, this won't matter. But at less busy times of the day or on less busy platforms/servers, that will just cause fewer squads filling up, making the whole experience even more grindy than it already is.

 

The number of SE they  give you per fissure really doesn't matter all that much (unless it's enough to make this the primary SE farm). The big problem with the idea is that they are making fissures (of both kinds) harder to efficiently use for their primary purpose - cracking relics.

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The big issue with Steel Path is the necessity to keep it as a secondary route whenever you feel ready.
Some people complain about the lack of reward there, but the truth is more reward would make even more people angry, because you would feel forced to play there.

I personally play Steel Path simply for the higher enemy spawns and levels because it's much more fun and the increased affinity and enemy drops are cool, but I know some people that hate it because enemies are just too tanky for their level and aren't tempted to go there for the rewards at the cost of fun, because they are not worth it.

I agree with the fact higher difficulty deserve more better reward, but Steel Path isn't difficult, it just require better build to play, and it's good that way.

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2 hours ago, Jivy said:
2 hours ago, Uan91 said:

No? I wasn't even expecting to get a reward at all from spf be grateful we even get 1 essence

I was expecting better relic cracking but got nothing.

1 hour ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said:

The number of SE they  give you per fissure really doesn't matter all that much (unless it's enough to make this the primary SE farm). The big problem with the idea is that they are making fissures (of both kinds) harder to efficiently use for their primary purpose - cracking relics.

That's what I'm thinking. It's some pluses for SP guys but 0 or even nagatives for cracking relics.

54 minutes ago, ZoubitronPrime said:

Some people complain about the lack of reward there, but the truth is more reward would make even more people angry, because you would feel forced to play there.

It's not like you are not forced to 4 rad/intact relics to get specific drop...

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The 1 steel essence reward should probably be per round, right? So if you run a survival 20 minutes you get 4 steel essence + acolyte drops? :)

I can't wait for the steel path requiem survival runs. A way to earn kuva, steel essence AND riven slivers. :)

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I love this update, tbf. Archon-hunt seems amazing! Steel path fissures is cool (although doing a capture/exterminate or other fast mission it might not be that rewarding). I think riven sliver droprate should be increased. I don't want to be forced to run requiem relics (unless it's survival for above mentioned reasons) for them or buy a booster. With a booster it feels more regular but without you can go an hour in steel path with not a single drop. Seems abit slimy to paywall riven sliver drops and counter-intuitive with the higher eximus difficulty. :(

That said, with this update I feel like DE is finally looking to add more for the playerbase that has done everything else and maybe it's a sign for the future with even more stuff for us veterans. I've been doing my dailies religously but there's a certain something to be said about the amount of things available that feels worthwhile in the game. Sure I could grind for kuva and reroll some fringe-build rivens but it just doesn't feel that worthwhile or fun after awhile. With archon hunts and their rewards I feel like DE has made a huge leap forward to amplify everything I personally like about the game. Not only a very interesting reward at the end but also the concept of buffing certain weapons/loadouts like in arbitration. When I saw that korrudo flash by in the stream I couldn't help but smile and think about my 2 korrudo rivens. xD

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Im just concerned this will dilute the pool of players for relic popping.   Both random and recruited squads.   

We will have:

  • Normal Void Fissures
  • Steel Path Void Fissures
  • Normal Void Storms
  • Steel path Void Storms ???? 

Now whether you wanna just join a random squad to try for a forma or ducat or a new prime drops and you wanna farm it....where do you go... 

---------

I feel like Steel Path Fissures should treat EVERY RELIC like its radiant.    This would drive ALL players to want to do Steel Path Fissures.   (But I dont see them ever doing this because it would screw with the in-game economy)

Yeah like even if they offered liek a crapton of Void Trace for SP fissures that would still screw with the economy....   I cant really think of what rewards they could give for SP Fissures to make them worth it..    10-15 Steel per round (no boosting).   

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You don´t get it do you?

 

The reward is that you finally don´t have to play the mind-numblingly painful and boring lvl 5 fissures and instead you can play vs Steel Path enemies AND crack relics AND farm SE ( 4SE + 1 every 5 minutes basically)

 

And of course... this is a choice, not a must. So you can play your mind-numbing lvl 5 fissures all you want.

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1 hour ago, Mag_Gaming said:

You don´t get it do you?

 

The reward is that you finally don´t have to play the mind-numblingly painful and boring lvl 5 fissures and instead you can play vs Steel Path enemies AND crack relics AND farm SE ( 4SE + 1 every 5 minutes basically)

 

And of course... this is a choice, not a must. So you can play your mind-numbing lvl 5 fissures all you want.

So is it confirmed somewhere that you get +1 essence per round? Or is it just +1 essence for starting the mission?

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1 hour ago, Mag_Gaming said:

You don´t get it do you?

 

The reward is that you finally don´t have to play the mind-numblingly painful and boring lvl 5 fissures and instead you can play vs Steel Path enemies AND crack relics AND farm SE ( 4SE + 1 every 5 minutes basically)

Do you find level 105 SP enemies that much more exciting than level 5 enemies? As long as you have semi-decent kit, they tend to die almost as fast. And pose almost as little a threat.

And your "5SE per 5 mins" estimate seems to assume that you are only playing endless missions for relics (over multiple runs, with a resource booster) - while most people (in my experience) prefer to use shorter fissure missions - because they are much more efficient for the fissure missions' primary purpose - cracking relics. So the reality won't be "5 SE per 5minutes" - it will be "1SE per 3-4 minutes" (shorter mission + loading time, enemies dry up long before an acolyte spawns).

But at the same time, splitting the playerbase between normal and steel path missions will mean that public squads will be significantly less populated. If you go into a pub Lith fissure now, you're likely to end up with a full squad by the end of the mission. And out of the 4 rewards you choose from, you'll probably have a rare, a forma and maybe even something sellable.

Once the fissure missions are split into two, you'll end up with half the people going into the normal fissure and half going into the SP one. And unless this happens at a peak time, you'll end up alone in that squad, maybe with one other player. Sure, you'll get that 1 SE - but you will also only get a Paris lower limb or something equally useless out of your relic. With much less opportunity to pick a better prime part. Sure, you'll be getting some SE at a snail's pace - but the prime farm is going to become several times more grindy!

1 hour ago, Mag_Gaming said:

And of course... this is a choice, not a must. So you can play your mind-numbing lvl 5 fissures all you want.

You don't get it, do you?

Once the matchmaking is split, the matchmaking is split! And matchmaking will be split exactly by giving people a choice of the two mission levels! People will end up doing fissure missions in smaller squads, with smaller yields. This won't affect the few hermits who only ever do fissures in solo mode - but this will affect everyone who uses public matchmaking for cracking relics. And they will not have any choice in that matter - that's the whole problem!

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I'm a bit on the fence on this issue.

1 SE feels bad, but I also agree that I'm just generally pretty happy to not have to endure level 10 enemies in order to crack lith relics anymore. I'd play it either way.

It'll probably normalize after release, and won't bother me, but it sure would be nice if DE understood that these kinds of pittance rewards feel bad and it would help a lot if they just made it FEEL more worthwhile. Doesn't even have to be anything, just add like +5000 alloy plates and +50 hexanon and a few other bonuses or some nonsense, so that it doesn't feel like we're just being thrown a solitary piece of currency.

Like throw us 25 pennies and a dozen dimes and couple dozen nickels and a couple quarters. It won't add up to more than a buck or two, but it will feel way better.

As for splitting the matchmaking - there's pros and cons, but I think that sooner or later DE is going to need to decide whether we're all migrating into a higher power zone or what, because as time goes on more and more of the player base are going to be shifting to the harder content like these fissures and the matchmaking for the old fissures will progressively dwindle... but there's probably tons of time still before that happens, years even.

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3 hours ago, (PSN)AbBaNdOn_ said:

Im just concerned this will dilute the pool of players for relic popping.   Both random and recruited squads.   

We will have:

  • Normal Void Fissures
  • Steel Path Void Fissures
  • Normal Void Storms
  • Steel path Void Storms ???? 

Now whether you wanna just join a random squad to try for a forma or ducat or a new prime drops and you wanna farm it....where do you go... 

...

some players say there are 700k active accounts but i don't feel it, maybe my limited internet connection but all the game places and missions seem desertic for me.

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4 hours ago, vixenpixel said:

So is it confirmed somewhere that you get +1 essence per round? Or is it just +1 essence for starting the mission?

I´d show you a screenshot of the last devstream where they showed it but tbh I don´t feel like looking for that right now but basically it´s +1 SE per relic crack from what I understand yes.

4 hours ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said:

Do you find level 105 SP enemies that much more exciting than level 5 enemies? As long as you have semi-decent kit, they tend to die almost as fast. And pose almost as little a threat.

And your "5SE per 5 mins" estimate seems to assume that you are only playing endless missions for relics (over multiple runs, with a resource booster) - while most people (in my experience) prefer to use shorter fissure missions - because they are much more efficient for the fissure missions' primary purpose - cracking relics. So the reality won't be "5 SE per 5minutes" - it will be "1SE per 3-4 minutes" (shorter mission + loading time, enemies dry up long before an acolyte spawns).

But at the same time, splitting the playerbase between normal and steel path missions will mean that public squads will be significantly less populated. If you go into a pub Lith fissure now, you're likely to end up with a full squad by the end of the mission. And out of the 4 rewards you choose from, you'll probably have a rare, a forma and maybe even something sellable.

Once the fissure missions are split into two, you'll end up with half the people going into the normal fissure and half going into the SP one. And unless this happens at a peak time, you'll end up alone in that squad, maybe with one other player. Sure, you'll get that 1 SE - but you will also only get a Paris lower limb or something equally useless out of your relic. With much less opportunity to pick a better prime part. Sure, you'll be getting some SE at a snail's pace - but the prime farm is going to become several times more grindy!

You don't get it, do you?

Once the matchmaking is split, the matchmaking is split! And matchmaking will be split exactly by giving people a choice of the two mission levels! People will end up doing fissure missions in smaller squads, with smaller yields. This won't affect the few hermits who only ever do fissures in solo mode - but this will affect everyone who uses public matchmaking for cracking relics. And they will not have any choice in that matter - that's the whole problem!

clown-nose.gif

 

Literally just another copy paste argument spammer " oh this will split the playerbase " bs.

You won´t have issues finding other similar players that enjoy no challenge whatsoever and " enjoy " running lvl 5 missions and play only for the loot aspect and then quit the game and cry, you don´t have to worry about that.

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17 minutes ago, Venus-Venera said:

because why should I get fewer se than in sp surv

For every round you spent in a regular SP survival, you'll now get an additional SE in a SP survival fissure.

And you'll be cracking relics at the same time.

21 minutes ago, Venus-Venera said:

decisions are made that even small children would not make.
there is a lot going wrong there...

There are things to be concerned about with SP fissures.  But maybe make a slight effort to understand these decisions before insulting the people making them.  Better yet, stick to constructive criticism and leave the insults out of it.

8 hours ago, vixenpixel said:

So is it confirmed somewhere that you get +1 essence per round? Or is it just +1 essence for starting the mission?

+1 per relic cracked.   https://clips.twitch.tv/WiseSlickKleePraiseIt-tq18DZjaCMa0pnOR

Look at the top of the fissure navigation menu.  Also, from the overview:

That’s why we’re working on Steel Path Fissures. These high level Fissures have the usual Steel Path modifiers and Acolytes, with an additional reward of Steel Essence for each Relic you open!

My main question is whether there'll be enough people doing them to make random  co-op worthwhile.

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Do you know how valuable 1 Steel essence is? its 666 kuva!

Besides it's for the veterans who are simply bored out of regular fissures where mobs cant put up a fight making it a non-combat. People will play it just for that and essence is only a bonus.  Then you have several missions types where level doesnt even matter so it's a free bonus for no extra effort, whats not to like.

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7 hours ago, Venus-Venera said:

they should have waited until april 1st to make the change.

decisions are made that even small children would not make.
there is a lot going wrong there...

because why should I get fewer se than in sp surv and somehow play with a few playable warframes and severely limit the choice of weapons???

 

Then don't do it? It's not like you are losing steel essence by playing sp surv. You are just not gaining as much as if you had been playing it during a fissure but actually the amount you are not gaining, given that an acolyte spawns every 3-8 minute interval is negligeble. Regardless, riven slivers will drop at an even lower rate in fissures, because chances are it will lack that 30% increased oomph from special mission types. 

Calling other people children only makes you seem like one.

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You can run Ukko SP missions in 35-50 seconds depending on the map design and how good you fly with Titania.
Just imagine what would happen, if DE give +5 SP essences per relic... that would be way too much for such an easy farm.

So +1SP essence per mission is OK in my opinion. I see it as a nice little bonus

-c0y

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5 hours ago, Monolake said:

Do you know how valuable 1 Steel essence is? its 666 kuva!

Besides it's for the veterans who are simply bored out of regular fissures where mobs cant put up a fight making it a non-combat. People will play it just for that and essence is only a bonus.  Then you have several missions types where level doesnt even matter so it's a free bonus for no extra effort, whats not to like.

Actually, I'd like to see them boost the kuva mission's amount of blood or even make those steel path missions with higher drops of kuva because as it stands, the kuva missions are just not worth playing unless you are like farming that orvius weapon. But even then kuva survival is probably better for kuva. The way to get kuva is steel essence (or possibly arbitration). It's never going to be "let's do kuva flood, guys". And that doesn't seem right to me. I really hope they adress that in a future update.

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On 2022-08-29 at 4:20 AM, Uan91 said:

1 Steel essence per round/mission

is that it? possibly even higher level base and you reward  *1* Steel essence just because we are opening relics aswell? 

not to sound toxic

BUT

is that a joke?

No?
I mean it's in addition to the accolytes....so really that "1 steel essence per round/mission" is "3-5 steel essence per round/mission" with the accolyte being taken into consideration (and whether you have a booster or not).

So if you're going to run a SP survival mission might as well do it while cracking a few relics as you'll get 25-50% more steel essence per rotation and you'll be getting ducats/plat depending on what you get and what you're going to do with it.

Overall that is a considerable bonus...especially for people that aren't running boosters all the time, and we shouldn't be considering the people running boosters 24/7 as the "baseline" when comparing how much more rewarding something is...

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15 hours ago, (NSW)BalticBarbarian said:

I guess if you actually find Earth-level steel path challenging - then you would feel an improvement. But then you should probably work on the builds, since the ones you are using must be really bad!

For me, the difference in "challenge" between a normal Lith fissure and what will be a Steel Path Lith fissure is not particularly significant. This removes any positive aspect of this change, keeping only the negative ones.

So yeah, if low--level Steel Path is your idea of "challenge" - enjoy forever being a noob!

Quote me where I said I personally find low-level SP a challenge kid.

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