Jump to content

AoE is nerfed, but Aimbot gets a pass?


-Moctezuma-
 Share

Recommended Posts

I don't understand how DE operates when it comes to nerfing stuff

Did AOE deserve a nerf? Yes.

But if AoE was such a big problem because it didn't allow players who used non aoe weapons to enjoy the missions they were in (as in, the entire room was dead before they could even kill one)

Then why does Mesa's peacemaker ability still exist? it is a literal aimbot, and all it costs is a little bit of energy, which btw, getting energy in warframe is extremely easy nowadays due to how many energy sources we have now (energy pizzas, operator energy bubble, etc)

"Oh but the line of sigth for the weapon to shoot decreases which each enemy shot at" 

People can easily recast the ability lol, just press 4 again and there you go

"Oh but that ability has its drawbacks, such as consuming energy while using it"

Do you know how easy it is to get energy in 2022? it doesn't matter if it is a high energy cost, you see these little blue things? these things are hella cheap and restore 100 energy per pulse (DE needs to fix the energy economy!!!!)

LargeTeamEnergyPack.png

So yeah, I think peacemaker should be removed and replaced with something that isn't a literal aimbot? lol

jTsMRJi.gif

Edited by -Moctezuma-
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

In most of the video gaming world, skills like Mesmer Skin, Vortex, Peacemaker, Strangledome, Warframes like Octavia and Saryn, concepts like operators being able to become invulnerable for a minute at a time and many other Warframe concepts would result in the intern / developer that implemented the idea having to find a new job immediately lol. They're basically skills that are literally unable to work within the framework of a balanced, curated game and destroy any semblance of a developer having a handle on game design.

But this is WARFRAAAAME ^^

  • Like 17
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, -Moctezuma- said:

I don't understand how DE operates when it comes to nerfing stuff

I agree , you do not understand.

I suggest going through the earlier devstream where they explained it.

And they did Nerf mesa a long time ago where it targeted all enemies in range and didn't have an area to focus on.

Let's also not forget that you are immobile while using it (though you can augment it a bit for some mobility) , need line of sight , energy drains over time and get reduced area to focus on over time.

  • Like 18
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, 0_The_F00l said:

I agree , you do not understand.

I suggest going through the earlier devstream where they explained it.

And they did Nerf mesa a long time ago where it targeted all enemies in range and didn't have an area to focus on.

Let's also not forget that you are immobile while using it (though you can augment it a bit for some mobility) , need line of sight , energy drains over time and get reduced area to focus on over time.

I like seeing Warframes that are super imbalanced and then reading that they used to be even worse. I never saw them because I'm just a 2020 noob. Rookie hours.

What were old Saryn and Ember like? ^^

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Let's also not forget that you are immobile while using it (though you can augment it a bit for some mobility) , need line of sight , energy drains over time and get reduced area to focus on over time.

Yeah, none of this really matters in practice for Mesa.

Congratulations OP, you just seemingly discovered old Warframe problems that existed well before the AoE meta. If not for the widespread ammo nerf, everyone would probably be using Ignis like a continuous hose again (another very old problem).

Edited by nslay
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, cute_moth.npc said:

I like seeing Warframes that are super imbalanced and then reading that they used to be even worse. I never saw them because I'm just a 2020 noob. Rookie hours.

What were old Saryn and Ember like? ^^

Old ember was hit 4, run around while everything in 50m is cc'd and constantly bombed by fire.

Old saryn was cast spore on molt over and over to pop all enemies in range constantly with no effort.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would 100% go for a rework that lets you run around and aim to shoot with her Regulators. On top of reducing the huge fire rate boost she gets in Peacemaker. But at the same time, boost the damage abit and allow you to recast abilities during the time Peacemaker is active.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know if this is actual spite posting, but this sort of comes off as spite posting. "Oh yeah, well if I can't have fun with AOE, then these things should be nerfed too, hah". Especially when you use certain framing and rhetorical techniques, that many people are just attuned to. 

Just saying. 

To put it more bluntly, in cold hard logical terms? The real truth of it, is that DE wanted to kill AOE, so people would be forced to buy more Forma, for the upcoming Phantasma Prime meta, when Revenant Prime comes out. Everyone knows this, its no secret at this point. The sooner we all accept this fact... 

See all the little rhetorical techniques I used? To make what I say, seem more real, because its appealing to people to just be honest with themselves? For real? Like straight up. You get me? Facts though. 

AOE wasn't just about being a "problem" to players who could find it disruptive. Its more like an issue that needed addressing and thus was. Via reducing some types of effectiveness rather than eliminating it. You can still destroy whole rooms with AOE, you just can't do it as easily, mindlessly and frequently as before. Its still very effective. When you address ideas without really accurately detailing them, it can often make further conclusions drawn pointless to address because they exist off flawed premise. 

LMAO just j/ks, I think everything should be nerfed, lmao, insert GIF to show a point that will definitely convince people of something lulz kek lmao. #LetsAdmitIt #Truth

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:

I don't know if this is actual spite posting, but this sort of comes off as spite posting. "Oh yeah, well if I can't have fun with AOE, then these things should be nerfed too, hah". Especially when you use certain framing and rhetorical techniques, that many people are just attuned to. 

 

I am not, I was actually pretty in favour of nerfing AOE and what made AOE OP, but I don't understand why a literal aimbot gets a pass

you can check my wf profile, I mostly use single target weapons and underrated warframes like gauss

Edited by -Moctezuma-
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

Old ember was hit 4, run around while everything in 50m is cc'd and constantly bombed by fire.

Old saryn was cast spore on molt over and over to pop all enemies in range constantly with no effort.

Wow. We are moving up in game design ^^

I mean unironically I think that is a good change to make. There's creative license with allowing flying Warframes, aimbots and things like that and then there are playstyles where you are a single keyboard macro away from "mastery"

Thanks for the explanation!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • -Moctezuma- changed the title to AoE is nerfed, but Aimbot gets a pass?

She was nerfed 3 times. I mean she’s  rooted in place, needs LoS, only had a 50m radius, needs ramp up time to full damage, Has reduced area of effect over time in PM such resets after a few seconds of no shooting, can only hit center mass also scales like garbage without mods and arcanes to make up for her damage shortcomings. Nerfing her anymore you might as well just give her completely new abilities or make a new frame, which DE did and named him Styanax lol. 

Edited by (XBOX)YoungGunn82
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

Mesa has energy requirements and other setbacks.

Any frame could spam a bramma for no drawback besides the initial farm.

The setbacks are just a formality so-to-speak. They don't really matter in practice.

As an exaggeration of what I mean: It's like making an insta-kill aimbot ability and making it cost 1 energy to activate and 1 energy per second to channel and then saying, "Oh, but this frame has to spend energy to insta-kill everything." Yeah, but it's not actually limiting you in any meaningful way, right?

These "setbacks" are there so DE or someone else can say, "Well, Mesa needs energy to use that skill", so it's balanced. Except, when built correctly, no Mesa will have energy problems. The reticle narrows over time? Oh... just tap 4 and have a giant reticle again. Not like the base ability cost is very high or anything. Line of sight... who cares? Everything visible in a 200m radius dies instantly. There's commonly more volume of visible map than occluded map anyway. Where is the meaningful "drawbacks" here? There are none... these are faux hurdles for a Mesa player to overcome.

Yeah, Mesa right now is pretty much identical to "spam bramma with no drawbacks." And she has always been this way since I've been playing.

 

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, nslay said:

Yeah, none of this really matters in practice for Mesa.

Congratulations OP, you just seemingly discovered old Warframe problems that existed well before the AoE meta. If not for the widespread ammo nerf, everyone would probably be using Ignis like a continuous hose again (another very old problem).

I was more highlighting them to differentiate it from the AoE weapons that needed none of this.

And there are quite a few situations where LoS is an issue in many tilesets as you can't bend your bullets around corners or through walls.

 

P.s. Not saying mesa is not powerful , but comparing it to the spammability of a bramma or zarr (pre ammo changes ) is not quite right. 

Maybe she too will get some changes if she gets to that popularity level. We shall see. 

 

Edited by 0_The_F00l
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I swear some of you are more annoying than pokemon genwunners. do you only play Lith fissures or?

44 minutes ago, -Moctezuma- said:

I don't understand

jTsMRJi.gif

ya you don't, if you want to do interaction baiting how about talking about things that actually need to be talked about like bugfixes? mediocre frames that need work?

"a bit of energy" LOL. 

Edited by Skoomaseller
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, nslay said:

The setbacks are just a formality so-to-speak. They don't really matter in practice.

As an exaggeration of what I mean: It's like making an insta-kill aimbot ability and making it cost 1 energy to activate and 1 energy per second to channel and then saying, "Oh, but this frame has to spend energy to insta-kill everything." Yeah, but it's not actually limiting you in any meaningful way, right?

These "setbacks" are there so DE or someone else can say, "Well, Mesa needs energy to use that skill", so it's balanced. Except, when built correctly, no Mesa will have energy problems. The reticle narrows over time? Oh... just tap 4 and have a giant reticle again. Not like the base ability cost is very high or anything. Line of sight... who cares? Everything visible in a 200m radius dies instantly. There's commonly more volume of visible map than occluded map anyway. Where is the meaningful "drawbacks" here? There are none... these are faux hurdles for a Mesa player to overcome.

Yeah, Mesa right now is pretty much identical to "spam bramma with no drawbacks." And she has always been this way since I've been playing.

 

Mesa has many drawbacks, AoE weapons didn’t. You are being very disingenuous. Also your mental gymnastics are truly astonishing. calculating the hangover GIF
The fact of the matter is Mesa can’t do this as seen below while in PM: 

So using the AoE nerf as a justification to nerf Mesa for a 4th time is really really stupid and make you guys look really salty and childish.

Edited by (XBOX)YoungGunn82
  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

I was more highlighting them to differentiate it from the AoE weapons that needed none of this.

And there are quite a few situations where LoS is an issue in many tilesets as you can't bend your bullets around corners or through walls.

 

No, IMO, not really.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, cute_moth.npc said:

In most of the video gaming world, skills like Mesmer Skin, Vortex, Peacemaker, Strangledome, Warframes like Octavia and Saryn, concepts like operators being able to become invulnerable for a minute at a time and many other Warframe concepts would result in the intern / developer that implemented the idea having to find a new job immediately lol.

I think you've just made a great point about how other developers need to get more creative.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...