So Revenant's Sentient signature weapons can be primed but not Nidus' infested ones?

[xcrimsonlegendx]

So, on the dev stream they just revealed that Phantasma and Tatsu are coming with Revenant prime, cool that's good.

But what is up with the double standard? Sentient weapons can be primed apparently even though they have had this rule that only Tenno faction weapons can be primed. They left Nidus prime in the dust and gave him two unrelated prime weapons saying that his signature weapons* (Hema and Hirdo) couldn't be primed because they weren't Tenno weapons, then they turn around and prime Revenant's Sentient weapons? As a Nidus main I'm both confused and frustrated.

*Before you try say Hema and Hirudo aren't Nidus' signature weapons, you're wrong.
The weapon design lead that created them confirmed that they are his signatures at last year's Tennocon panel.

[Jivy]

Cause they dint feel like it i guess, sometimes they don't prime signature weapons, EXAMPLE: Valkyr Prime

[xcrimsonlegendx]

2 minutes ago, Jivy said:

Cause they dint feel like it i guess, sometimes they don't prime signature weapons, EXAMPLE: Valkyr Prime

That doesn't bother me so much, its understandable that they might skip some. Its just they threw out the excuse that they couldn't do it because the themes, then turn around and do it anyway with Revenant.

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

6 minutes ago, Jivy said:

Cause they dint feel like it i guess, sometimes they don't prime signature weapons, EXAMPLE: Valkyr Prime

What? She doesn't have any signature pretty sure

[Kokokojo]

14 minutes ago, Jivy said:

Cause they dint feel like it i guess, sometimes they don't prime signature weapons, EXAMPLE: Valkyr Prime

You mean Tigris? That got primed before her
Cestra and Lecta are Corpus

[nslay]

Maybe they were originally Tenno weapons that got corrupted with Eidolon essence too?

[--F--NerevarCM]

48 minutes ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

So, on the dev stream they just revealed that Phantasma and Tatsu are coming with Revenant prime, cool that's good.

But what is up with the double standard? Sentient weapons can be primed apparently even though they have had this rule that only Tenno faction weapons can be primed. They left Nidus prime in the dust and gave him two unrelated prime weapons saying that his signature weapons* (Hema and Hirdo) couldn't be primed because they weren't Tenno weapons, then they turn around and prime Revenant's Sentient weapons? As a Nidus main I'm both confused and frustrated.

*Before you try say Hema and Hirudo aren't Nidus' signature weapons, you're wrong.
The weapon design lead that created them confirmed that they are his signatures at last year's Tennocon panel.

Phantasma and Tatsu existed as weapons before Revenant fought the Eidolon. These are simply their original forms.

Hema didn't exist before as a Tenno weapon. They are not unique Tenno weapons that became infested like Mutalist Cernos.

Hirudo is literally infested Kogake and Hema is a infested life form that we use as a weapon.

48 minutes ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

then they turn around and prime Revenant's Sentient weapons?

Wrong. Tatsu and Phantasma are not Sentient weapons. They're Tenno weapons tainted with Eidolon energy. Just like Revenant is. Totally different from the Shedu, a 100% sentient weapon.

[(XBOX)Ampathetiic]

Signature weapons are not simply whatever weapons came in the bundle with a new frame. Nidus doesn't have any signature weapons, whereas Revenant has 2 weapons that are explicitly his; there's a difference that makes these weapons different.

What you should probably be annoyed about is the lack of Akzani Prime or Fusilai Prime.

[xcrimsonlegendx]

11 minutes ago, --F--NerevarCM said:

Phantasma and Tatsu existed as weapons before Revenant fought the Eidolon. These are simply their original forms.

Hema didn't exist before as a Tenno weapon. They are not unique Tenno weapons that became infested like Mutalist Cernos.

Hirudo is literally infested Kogake and Hema is a infested life form that we use as a weapon.

Wrong. Tatsu and Phantasma are not Sentient weapons. They're Tenno weapons tainted with Eidolon energy. Just like Revenant is. Totally different from the Shedu, a 100% sentient weapon.

Care to share some sources?

[xcrimsonlegendx]

1 minute ago, (XBOX)Ampathetiic said:

Nidus doesn't have any signature weapons

As I said in the OP, the lead weapon dev that made them said themselves at last Tennocon that they are his sigunatures. Doesn't get more definitive than that.

 

[--F--NerevarCM]

4 minutes ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

Care to share some sources?

My source is the lore? Revenant was send to Earth to keep the Sentient that Gara killed from coming back to life

"Why do I remember this? The land here, killing hot, full of strangeness. This is where Gara vanquished the Sentient! Where its essence fell into the ground, trapped in some unworldly between. It wanted out. At moon rise its ghostly tendrils would emerge, seeking form, seeking... return... And this... this was the warden... a Warframe. I can see it, like a dream repeating... The tendril emerging night after night, and the warden, night after night, cutting it down... until the warden himself was lost. How?

I see... the tendril once again. Instead of striking it... the lost one... he extends a hand to the Eidolon?! Khanung! What was he thinking? He's like Mukha on the tower. Every day, Mukha clamored across the tower ledges and scaffolds - nothing happened, day in and day out... Routine took his fear away. Uhh... Tenno - I see the tendril has him now. The lost one. He's become an anchor for the Eidolon - to pull itself onto our world! The lost one struggles, pulling back, but it's too late! The Eidolon begins to emerge. But... the lost one realizes - he stops... he lets go... And so he falls. Falls from this world of the living and down, down, down into the next.

"By the Unum, you've done it! The lost one is reborn, made Revenant. A Warframe, infused with the powers of an Eidolon!"

Mask of the Revenant Quest

When Revenant fell to the Eidolon, both him and his weapons become tainted with Eidolon energy. Thats why they're like that. They're not Sentient weapons. And Revenant is not a Sentient Warframe.

 

The Hirudo is a infested Kogake. It requires a Kogake to make and infested materials. And the Kogake Prime already exists. No reason in the lore for the Hirudo to get a prime version.

The Hema is infested living being:

"A bloodsucker. This symbiotic burst-rifle leeches health to forge its ammo and then restores health with each headshot."

Many infested weapons are like this. Made of bones, bile sacks, living beings, nerve systems etc. These weapons are not mechanical. These weren't normal weapons before. Makes no sense they having prime versions.

Some weapons like the Proboscis Cernos and Paracyst were weapons before, so it makes sense.


 

 

[bad4youLT]

Imagine Prime Hema , build cost 5000 mutagen samples .

[xcrimsonlegendx]

39 minutes ago, --F--NerevarCM said:

My source is the lore? Revenant was send to Earth to keep the Sentient that Gara killed from coming back to life

"Why do I remember this? The land here, killing hot, full of strangeness. This is where Gara vanquished the Sentient! Where its essence fell into the ground, trapped in some unworldly between. It wanted out. At moon rise its ghostly tendrils would emerge, seeking form, seeking... return... And this... this was the warden... a Warframe. I can see it, like a dream repeating... The tendril emerging night after night, and the warden, night after night, cutting it down... until the warden himself was lost. How?

I see... the tendril once again. Instead of striking it... the lost one... he extends a hand to the Eidolon?! Khanung! What was he thinking? He's like Mukha on the tower. Every day, Mukha clamored across the tower ledges and scaffolds - nothing happened, day in and day out... Routine took his fear away. Uhh... Tenno - I see the tendril has him now. The lost one. He's become an anchor for the Eidolon - to pull itself onto our world! The lost one struggles, pulling back, but it's too late! The Eidolon begins to emerge. But... the lost one realizes - he stops... he lets go... And so he falls. Falls from this world of the living and down, down, down into the next.

"By the Unum, you've done it! The lost one is reborn, made Revenant. A Warframe, infused with the powers of an Eidolon!"

Mask of the Revenant Quest

When Revenant fell to the Eidolon, both him and his weapons become tainted with Eidolon energy. Thats why they're like that. They're not Sentient weapons. And Revenant is not a Sentient Warframe.

I missed the part in there that says his weapons fell in with him.

and if Revenant isn't a Sentient/Eidolon themed frame, why isn't his prime the Warden then? His prime and his prime weapons are orokin upgrades of the corrupted version of the character. So yeah, he is Sentient/Eidolon now. He might not have been before but this is Revenant prime, not Warden prime.

 

[p_silveira]

1 minute ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

I missed the part in there that says his weapons fell in with him.

Question: what is the alternative? He snagged a warframe-size nodachi and a warframe-sized beam shotgun from the sentient remains at the bottom of the abyss?

[xcrimsonlegendx]

4 minutes ago, p_silveira said:

Question: what is the alternative? He snagged a warframe-size nodachi and a warframe-sized beam shotgun from the sentient remains at the bottom of the abyss?

Who knows, possibly. As we've seen many times before, DE doesn't really regard the lore as an end-all set of rules as to what can and can't be done in their game. They change anything and simply choose not to explain the decisions they make, regardless of if it contradicts established lore or themes. We've seen it before, we'll see it again.
 

I just get frustrated when folks use lore as a weapon, trying to explain every decision DE makes in the game when they themselves are just making it up as they go and changing things to suit whatever update they're working on currently. The lore isn't a holy text that dictates everything in the game and a lot of the arguments made don't actually cite any proof, just fantheory and assumptions.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

4 hours ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

But what is up with the double standard?

I'd argue that Phantasma isn't a *true* Sentient weapon, but rather a tenno weapon that was "eidolonized" like Revenant and Tatsu was: since they started out as Tenno weapons, they could still be primed (thoguh by this logic we could expect infested weapons like Lesion to also be primed, which I'd still be OK with), whereas Basmu and Shedu were straight up made by Sentients. the lore from Revenant's quest supports this, as he was dragged into the Eidolon's realm, weapons and all.

Hema and Hirudo Priem for Nidus Prime would have been interesting, but at least the far more neglected Strun and Magnus got primed as a result. Tatsu prime was inevitable, but I did originally expect maybe a companion or somethignt o get primed instead of Phantasma. either way, it's more MR for the collection if nothing else.

 

[Voltage]

4 hours ago, Jivy said:

Cause they dint feel like it i guess, sometimes they don't prime signature weapons, EXAMPLE: Valkyr Prime

Valkyr has no signature weapons. Signature weapons come with passives associated to the specific Warframe wielding them with a few exceptions. Nidus has no signature weapons nor does Valkyr. 

It does suck that they haven't added passives on some signature weapons like Euphona Prime for Banshee Prime.

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Signature_Weapon

[xcrimsonlegendx]

4 minutes ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

I'd argue that Phantasma isn't a *true* Sentient weapon, but rather a tenno weapon that was "eidolonized" like Revenant and Tatsu was: since they started out as Tenno weapons, they could still be primed (thoguh by this logic we could expect infested weapons like Lesion to also be primed, which I'd still be OK with), whereas Basmu and Shedu were straight up made by Sentients. the lore from Revenant's quest supports this, as he was dragged into the Eidolon's realm, weapons and all.

Hema and Hirudo Priem for Nidus Prime would have been interesting, but at least the far more neglected Strun and Magnus got primed as a result. Tatsu prime was inevitable, but I did originally expect maybe a companion or somethignt o get primed instead of Phantasma. either way, it's more MR for the collection if nothing else.

 

As someone who's LR2 and who's most used primary is the Hema, I sure hope they finally give it an upgraded variant with Infested Liches whenever that happens.

[EternalDarkness666]

i would have loved Nidus Prime to have gotten weapons related to him, its not like they couldn't have used the same excuse they used for priming nidus himself, primal strain of infested weapons.

however wasnt revenants weapons technically tenno weapons before becoming corrupted by eidolon? or is Phantasma, like made from sentients?

[(PSN)Cargan2016]

5 hours ago, Jivy said:

Cause they dint feel like it i guess, sometimes they don't prime signature weapons, EXAMPLE: Valkyr Prime

umm pretty sure her signature was her claws that where essentially her exaulted as are attached to her 24/7 and just defaulted to when dont equip a mele

[--F--NerevarCM]

4 hours ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

I missed the part in there that says his weapons fell in with him.

and if Revenant isn't a Sentient/Eidolon themed frame, why isn't his prime the Warden then? His prime and his prime weapons are orokin upgrades of the corrupted version of the character. So yeah, he is Sentient/Eidolon now. He might not have been before but this is Revenant prime, not Warden prime.

 

Yeah, he was unarmed when he was fighting the Sentient. That's why he was "SLASHING" him.... /s

He is an Eidolon themed Warframe. Doesn't mean he is Sentient. Even Caliban is not 100% Sentient. Warden was just a nickname in the Ostron legends. Like the Lost One. Warden because he was a #*!%ing Warden....

4 hours ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

just get frustrated when folks use lore as a weapon, trying to explain every decision DE makes in the game when they themselves are just making it up as they go and changing things to suit whatever update they're working on currently. The lore isn't a holy text that dictates everything in the game and a lot of the arguments made don't actually cite any proof, just fantheory and assumptions.

And you want DE to throw the lore even more under the bus so you can have you favorite weapon primed even if that makes ZERO sense in the lore...

No.

What proof you want? Because I find hard to believe that Revenant went to Earth to fight a building sized Eidolon unarmed. And his signature weapons have the same energy pattern and have the same looks but for some reason you don't think they went to the same hole he was and suffered the same eidolon energy change he did...

[--F--NerevarCM]

1 hour ago, (PSN)robotwars7 said:

thoguh by this logic we could expect infested weapons like Lesion to also be primed, which I'd still be OK with

Isn't Lesion a infested Tipedo?

[--F--NerevarCM]

50 minutes ago, EternalDarkness666 said:

i would have loved Nidus Prime to have gotten weapons related to him, its not like they couldn't have used the same excuse they used for priming nidus himself, primal strain of infested weapons.

Because there's no strain made for weapons. The infestation before the Mutalist strain wasn't able to change non organic materials fast.

Old Infested Weapons are pretty much ripped off bones, organs and toxins. Then we have the Mutalist ones that comes after Patitent Zero/Breeding Grounds. So post Orokin Era.

The only way the Orokin weaponized the Infested was infecting someone and throwing at the Sentients. Thats it.

 

Now if you guys want some "Prime" version of a infested weapon. That's another story and I fully endorse it. The only thing lacking right now for faction weapons is a "Vandal/Wraith" version for infested weapons. Something akin to a Prime in stats.

50 minutes ago, EternalDarkness666 said:

however wasnt revenants weapons technically tenno weapons before becoming corrupted by eidolon? or is Phantasma, like made from sentients?

Yep. Both Tenno weapons. The Phantasma use Sentient cores but is not a Sentient weapon and its not made from Sentient materials.

[xcrimsonlegendx]

27 minutes ago, --F--NerevarCM said:

He is an Eidolon themed Warframe. Doesn't mean he is Sentient.

Last time I checked Eidolons are Sentients, no?
You're taking my words to literally. I didn't imply that Reveneant is literally a Sentient.
He's obviously Sentient themed, with Sentient (Eidolon) themed weaponry.

21 minutes ago, --F--NerevarCM said:

Yeah, he was unarmed when he was fighting the Sentient. That's why he was "SLASHING" him.... /s

All is said though there is no evidence to prove your case. Just fan theory and speculation. I'm not saying you're wrong but that's not any kind of evidence to back up your point of view. Sure, they could have been corrupted along with him or they could have been created afterwards, we don't know.

21 minutes ago, --F--NerevarCM said:

You want DE to throw the lore even more under the bus so you can have you favorite weapon primed even if that makes ZERO sense in the lore...

No.

DE makes the lore, they can literally do whatever they want. As far as Hema being primed making no sense in the lore, sure it does. For all we know Hema was created at the same time Nidus was, specifically for him we simply don't know how it was created and there's no lore either way to prove or disprove it. People used to say that Nidus could never be primed because of the lore and guess what, they did it anyway. There's nothing in the lore that exists now that could possibly say that Hema couldn't have been primed. If Hema is a life form not a weapon then it can still be primed, they primed cats and dogs, they can prime anything they want.

I'm not trying to be argumentative. But throwing quotes from the wiki at the wall and hoping something sticks isn't going to prove anything when there's zero context to the debate at hand.

[EdinaMonsoon]

4 minutes ago, xcrimsonlegendx said:

Last time I checked Eidolons are Sentients, no?

they're broken undead sentients, made up of broken parts and pieces, simple minded and aimlessly trying to restore itself. that's what makes it an "Eidolon" rather than a classic sentient and see the term Eidolon used again in TNW when a certain character is being restored

they're like what zombies are to human. people don't see zombies as real humans because they're already dead