Tatsu Prime [STANCE] rework desperately needed!

[Scar.brother.help.me]

 For the love of VOID, please do something about 2H Nikanas' [stance], it is terrible!! Ever since the last melee rework!
It wasn't great before, but tolerable, but this one messes up the legs so badly, that it takes away control from the player and feels really slow and cluncky.

Those legs movement override in general is not a good idea, it's not a slow-paced Souls-like game, let us choose in options to "set our legs free" from the melee combo, even if the animation isn't great. I don't want to lose momentum, slowdown/stop or jump around, do "moonwalks" and JoJo posing while ignoring WSAD whenever I press melee attack (except some very old polearm/dual dagger combos).

[Scar.brother.help.me]

Btw, I'd like to hear some changes for melee which are the most wanted from the community (as shorl as you can, please :3 ).

How about sharing part of glaves mechanic to all melee - hold to wind up a heavy attack + press heavy attack in time to do more massive damage/slash/status proc in range (some cool explosion or a cone/beam)

Hold melee button while slamming for Heavy Slam

Both to make heavy attack/slam ready to use with 1 HOLD of a button (just like a glaive throw) and a well-timed follow-up heavy attack press (like glaives explosion) for extra damage-status effect (maybe even ability like a buff or grouping or even utility like [greedy pull])

Would be cool to build your own combo moves from different stances and have different heavy attacks.

[Mazifet]

Melee is pretty much good for me, the only change I'd like is some forced slash procs on brutal tide, the sparring weapon stance.

[Numerounius]

Assault saw class also needs a new stance or butcher's revelry needs its animation speed upped by a lot.

[V2lkyr]

Just now, XHADgaming said:

Assault saw class also needs a new stance or butcher's revelry needs its animation speed upped by a lot.

Assault Saws need a non-meme tier weapon first.

[rinzzlr]

I'd like to bump this topic up more, but not only because Tatsu Prime is coming along with Revenant Prime, but I am also calling for DE to actually take one more look over the stances of melee weapons. Seriously, give them a buff. Worst-offender for me is Wise Razor with its atrocious animations and requiring like two attack speed mods to even be usable, even then, (I cannot confirm but) I have heard that using Tenet Livia, Tatsu's sister weapon of the same archetype does better dps without Wise Razor than with the stance. I don't know man but upon hearing that, that's concerning. I don't even need to delve into the numbers of these stances on a lot of weapon archetypes. Butcher's Revelry, Hammer/Axe Stances, Sword Stances, and ESPECIALLY Two-Handed Nikana stance. Please give them a buff. What is weapon diversity in this game when the other options are just as bad? 

[Traumtulpe]

9 hours ago, Scar.brother.help.me said:

For the love of VOID, please do something about 2H Nikanas' [stance], it is terrible!! Ever since the last melee rework!

While that stance is particularly egregious, really they ruined ALL the melee stances, and on purpose too. Spending precious dev time on making the game worse...

[Traumtulpe]

9 hours ago, Scar.brother.help.me said:

How about sharing part of glaves mechanic to all melee - hold to wind up a heavy attack

We had that in the game for a couple months - it was horribly bugged and made combo builds literally unplayable, so instead of fixing it DE just deleted the feature.

[Drex83]

I'd also like to add to this I hope DE will consider updating Wise Razor before Tatsu Prime hits. To be honest I actually used to love that weapon until the big melee update. It's a damn shame since that update was supposed to fix, clean up, and update many old and broke ass things, and it was a great update! but a few things slipped through the cracks which is to be expected but they really should have fixed this before now. I can understand how some weapons may still have a flaky stance but this is the ONLY stance for this type and it's awful.

That being said a new stance would be fine, but I'd be totally happy with this one just being fixed. I used to love it before the melee update but it just does not feel good now at all, and the vertical spin attack which is strong and also looks hella cool is waaaaay too far into it's combo to be useful, that used to be part of what was really good on the old version

[OniDax]

Try to hire the guy who did the animations for Ghost of Tsushima, DE. That guy would improve melee animations a lot.

[Scar.brother.help.me]

3 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

We had that in the game for a couple months - it was horribly bugged and made combo builds literally unplayable, so instead of fixing it DE just deleted the feature.

I would be glad to have it as an option until they find a way to fix

 

[Scar.brother.help.me]

3 hours ago, Drex83 said:

I'd also like to add to this I hope DE will consider updating Wise Razor before Tatsu Prime hits. To be honest I actually used to love that weapon until the big melee update. It's a damn shame since that update was supposed to fix, clean up, and update many old and broke ass things, and it was a great update! but a few things slipped through the cracks which is to be expected but they really should have fixed this before now. I can understand how some weapons may still have a flaky stance but this is the ONLY stance for this type and it's awful.

That being said a new stance would be fine, but I'd be totally happy with this one just being fixed. I used to love it before the melee update but it just does not feel good now at all, and the vertical spin attack which is strong and also looks hella cool is waaaaay too far into it's combo to be useful, that used to be part of what was really good on the old version

I would love to see a combo rework some day in a way:
combo 1 are all quick frontal attacks or spins [spam E in place]
combo 2 - quick forward attacks [E + forward (if attacks alligned to camera) or ANY direction (if free camera)]
combo 3 - slow but powerful spins [E + aim/block]
combo 4 - frontal attacks with dashing forward [E + aim/block + forward/any direction]

of course with exceptions like gunblades

[Marvelous_A]

2H nikanas need new stances and so do the sword and whip weapons

[Genitive]

A new stance for 2h nikanas is more probable, I don't see them reworking the current stances again.

 

51 minutes ago, Marvelous_A said:

and so do the sword and whip weapons

Spoiler

How dare you...

 

[Azamagon]

Yes please, lemme move (with ALL stances) when I use the forward combo.

Also, revising all the damagetypes + armor is really in order - for example; if heavy attacks have no innate slash-procs (or the weapon has no/low slash-damage weighting), they are often pretty garbage on higher levels vs armor. This kind of stuff automatically makes clear weapon-metas, completely unnecessarily.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

a new stance for 2HNs would certainly be nice. one more focused on fast and simple movements rather than acrobatic flips that take a long time to pull off, a bit like Decisive Judgement, but for a bigger Nikana lol.

[(XBOX)Lord ChibiVR]

7 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

We had that in the game for a couple months - it was horribly bugged and made combo builds literally unplayable, so instead of fixing it DE just deleted the feature.

Wait they removed that? I hated that holding down the xoris attack for more than half a second made me throw it. Literally ruined the weapon for me.

[Scar.brother.help.me]

I'd like to have an option to choose between Weapon Alt-fire or Melee Heavy attack when I press this button while not in a full melee mode. (It is actually possible to bind these actions on different buttons on PC but nothing happens on Heavy Attack button before you draw out your melee by making at least one normal swing, which is even worse when you are aim-gliding)
And if your gun has NO alt fire - Heavy Attack should be there by default.

[Traumtulpe]

52 minutes ago, (XBOX)Upl0rdYT said:

Wait they removed that? I hated that holding down the xoris attack for more than half a second made me throw it. Literally ruined the weapon for me.

The Xoris is a glaive - glaives still do that. It was implemented for all melee weapons (except sword+shield for some reason, was probably just double bugged).

[Traumtulpe]

19 minutes ago, Scar.brother.help.me said:

nothing happens on Heavy Attack button before you draw out your melee by making at least one normal swing

Yeah, I hate that. It's godawful on slow weapons like the Karyst Prime.

[0_The_F00l]

I do feel that some stances are indeed in need of a touch up , 

But it's difficult to quantify fluidity and movement , and if i can't exactly say what I need beyond calling it "clunky" it is difficult to fix.

I would like all stances to have some semblance between them.

Like 

1) Standing combo should not move you much , but do slightly more damage on things in front 

2) standing defense combo should not move you much but hit around you ideally adding some minor cc effects like knockdown or lift ,

3) forward movement combo should let you keep chaining ahead with minimal impact to mobility (it should absolutely not have animations that lock you in place)

4) forward block combo should be gap closers and can hold you just long enough to deliver multiple blows on the gap closed target (there should be some magnetism) so i can do hit and runs between enemies.

5) Heavy attacks could work similarly but would sacrifice some movement in all above scenes.

 

I would also like the ability to mix stances , this would of course need some combination of mastery , resources and knowledge to work.

And it can't be outlandish , like can't have heavy melee weapons use glaive combos or daggers start going around doing slam attacks like hammers.

I would consider something similar to helminth for stances , you would need to master 3 weapons that uses that stance , then you could break it down and apply their combo in a custom stance (might even add value for the stance forma)

1h weapons cannot use 2h stance, bastard weapons (2h nikana) could use both , akimbo weapons can only apply to other akimbo weapons , exotic weapons can only interchange combos within themselves.

This might be a bit more than DE could chew , but i am talking what I want not what is most probable.

[vanaukas]

I wish they do a new one, I like the current one

[Helljack84]

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

I wish they do a new one, I like the current one

Yep, was quite refreshing after the spin-/slam-spam of the heavy blade stances. If people prefer the heavy blade stances why don't they just pick a heavy blade?

Quite easy hitting flying targets and lands headshots on humanoid enemies. Charge and/or slide attacks can take care of grouped up enemies.

[Dunkelheit]

signed!

[ReddyDisco]

WIse razor is like a dumpsterfire that was then dropped in a volcano, it's so horrid. two handed nikanas need a new stance or hvy attack pennant will remain king