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Suggestion for controllers: More options for rebinding; in particular, an option to hold R1/RB and tap R2/RT to throw glaives


SpyroManiac1
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Note: I do not have a Switch, so for those that are familiar please put your recommendations below.

Also some big spoilers are mentioned regarding The Second Dream, The War Within, and The New War.

A big problem with the current method of throwing glaives is that you have to hold the Circle/B button to throw, and then quickly move your thumb over to the right stick to click it to detonate the glaive. This is awkward movement to do often, and leaves you unable to move your camera while charging the glaive throw. This means that you always have to line up your shots (which is fine) and then remove all ability to control your camera while charging and your thumb's travel time (not so fine). Compounding this is that a glaive build that is modded for detonations will have the glaive come back to you very quickly, leading to a sort of almost whack-a-mole movement with your thumb, which becomes straining after a while.

 

This all got me thinking on alternative ways to go about doing this, and I took a look at the controls to see if there was a way to not develop a repetitive stress injury. I quickly saw that there were many unused binds that could be useful for players for multiple uses, but very few rebind options. And after some tinkering in the Simulacrum and some thinking, I thought of creating a thread discussing it.

 

My proposal is to add more rebind options to the Ability Menu, one of which is a "Throw Melee" option, or some equivalent. I don't own or use all of the weapons in the game, so the terminology could probably be adjusted to fit all the weapon types that could use such a feature where appropriate.

 

Currently, the Ability Menu looks like this by default:

SNHAiei.jpeg

And the options for rebinding on this menu are just three:

JXWNswo.png

(On a side note, the rebind menu clearly does not read the "Controller Icon Set" setting. You can see it displays Playstation icons normally in the first image but is displaying Xbox icons on the rebind menu in the second image. This is true for all controller rebind menus in the game currently.)

 

There are six additional binds here that could be seeing use for additional inputs, hotkeys, gear items, emotes, etc. Left/Right Stick movement and the Start/Select buttons* are not rebindable for obvious reasons. I believe adding more options for the player to rebind would provide a net benefit, allow less interruptions in gameplay, and have a closer parity to mouse and keyboard users who have all the rebind options in the world for them to use already. An input method should never come between you and the game. For immersive purposes, we would ideally not have any abstraction layer at all, but that's a separate conversation. For now, input methods should be as intuitive, useful, and comfortable as possible so that you're focused on the game, not the controls.

 

*I refuse to call these buttons anything else.

 

I think the additional rebind options should be an obvious shoe-in to put into the game and really shouldn't see any contention, but I'd like to go into more detail about the proposed "Throw Melee" option specifically as it currently doesn't exist as a possible rebind and I would like to expound upon why I think it should.

 

The good:

  • Can still function alongside the current hold button system, if DE so wished.
  • Making this an option for a dedicated input would allow for the player to charge the throw while still allowing for movement and camera control since both thumbs would maintain their positions on the analog sticks, which is crucial for accuracy.
  • Less strain than the current method if you use the throw option often.
  • This option could be used for mouse and keyboard as well, and players could bind it to a key or an extra button on their mouse.

 

The bad:

  • Digital Extremes appears to be reserving the Ability Menu almost exclusively for Operator/Drifter functions and abilities. This is neat thematically, but is also very limiting in my opinion, as controllers are already starved for more inputs as it is. Additionally, this menu does not even exist for mouse and keyboard users; there is no key and no bindable option for them to bring it up. Someone who has played on mouse and keyboard the whole time and has never played or seen somebody play the game with a controller has no idea this menu even exists. So the thematic reason doesn't really hold water in my opinion. Also, there's a binding for the Omni and Tactical Menu/Dojo Legend already anyway, which is not Operator/Drifter related.
  • Given the point above, the Abilities Menu would likely need to be renamed to something more appropriate. A small concession. After all, we used to get Prime parts from Void Keys instead of Void Relics. Changing the name of a menu that functionally only exists for a portion of the user base doesn't seem too crazy of a change.
  • The six buttons that are available for rebinding may be planned for future content such as Operator/Drifter related quests, like the Duviri Paradox. I find this an unlikely scenario, as controller users still have space for two more Operator/Drifter abilities if DE decides to add them (R1 + Triangle/Circle & RB + Y/B). If this was to be an issue, I think it would more likely be for more expansive content like Railjack that can benefit from rebinds that are unique to that content. But DE would know better than me about that kind of stuff, obviously.
  • Does technically require more inputs. However, the extra input is the simple hold of a button (which players were already doing) and then tapping another button when they've lined up their shot. Crucially, you would only have to time the tap instead of the hold. I believe the benefits of being able to aim while charging outweigh the negative here, and it's just an option. You wouldn't be forced to use it.

 

And the particular:

  • I would insist that the default function of pressing the L2/RT button be a tap instead of a hold. The reason for this is that it will cause less strain and reduce accidental inputs. Regardless, even if players had to hold L1/LB and then hold L2/LT to charge, it would still be more functional than what we have now.
  • You could argue that the Ability Menu should keep it's default bindings as is, so that new players aren't as confused when figuring out how to play the game. I would include the "Throw Melee" binding personally, but leave the other options open for custom bindings for gear and such.
  • For players that have not done the Second Dream and War Within quests, the currently occupied bindings for Operator/Drifter abilities and Transference will simply be unable to be rebound or 'reserved'. Alternatively, you could just overwrite any bindings that conflict with the Operator/Drifter abilities, but I feel this would cause confusion and therefore I would recommend the former option.
  • Could also put the "Throw Melee" binding on the Right Stick click, which would fix most of this. The problem is that if you are using a Primary or Secondary weapon with a secondary fire, you will activate that instead of the melee. This isn't an issue when you have held down the Switch Weapon binding to switch to your melee weapon. However, you lose the ability to switch instantly from your Primary to your Melee by just pressing either the Fire or Melee button. This is how it used to work back in the day, where you had to hold the Switch Weapon binding to get to your melee, and tap it to switch from Primary and Secondary. Considering how DE has talked about players should be switching weapons more often with the ammo rework, I wouldn't see this change reverting being an impossibility. No free lunch either way.

I probably forgot to mention some other things, but kinda sums up my thoughts on the matter. Would appreciate feedback and thank you for coming to my TED talk.

 

inb4 glaives get nerfed again

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I would really appreciate Things like Kahl having their own seperate control scheme so I don't have to rebind my general controls every time I do a Kahl mission. My current customized setup makes it impossible to exit cameras during Kahl missions.

I'd also really appreciate if Necramechs had a 5th ability slots on the bottom right for Transference like normal gameplay. Because of the way I have my controls customized I have to map transference to a button or I can't exit my Necramech.

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On 2022-12-05 at 2:32 AM, SpyroManiac1 said:

JXWNswo.png

(On a side note, the rebind menu clearly does not read the "Controller Icon Set" setting. You can see it displays Playstation icons normally in the first image but is displaying Xbox icons on the rebind menu in the second image. This is true for all controller rebind menus in the game currently.)

No idea how you think those are Xbox icons. Playstation also has a d-pad and a left bumper button.

And no to the suggestion, nobody wants to use awkward button combinations. This isn't the N64 days here.

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On 2022-12-06 at 1:15 PM, (XBOX)Rez090 said:

No idea how you think those are Xbox icons. Playstation also has a d-pad and a left bumper button.

SH9wlCr.png

Those are most definitely Xbox icons. Even going back to the first image in my first post for example, Playstation doesn't call their bumpers LB/RB. It's L1/R1.

 

On 2022-12-06 at 1:15 PM, (XBOX)Rez090 said:

And no to the suggestion, nobody wants to use awkward button combinations.

My suggestion would create less awkwardness, actually. Since you wouldn't have to move your fingers and thumbs as much. But even if you disagree with this notion, it would still be just an option for players to use. More options, especially for controls, are objectively better for a game no matter how you see it.

 

On 2022-12-06 at 1:15 PM, (XBOX)Rez090 said:

This isn't the N64 days here.

Have you played any modern game recently? Controls for games are already far more complex than anything in those days. Also, kind of a strawman by equating my suggestion to an awkward looking controller that hasn't been used in over two decades. Perhaps provide more critical feedback instead?

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