Nullifiers Should be tweaked(IMO)

[Aesyaan]

Just tuning into the forums for the first time. I've wanted to provide feedback on this for a while and I understand that many may disagree with me, but hear me out here. I think that Nullifers should "drain" or temporarily deactivate certain abilities instead of just completely removing them, my case in point: Gara or Chroma. It is incredibly frustrating when I'll have built up high damage with Gara's 2 or high buffs with Vex armor then some Nullifier will just walk out from a corner or appear from a fissure and remove all of that immediately, it is my opinion that instead of just erasing those kinds of abilities entirely, it should drain them, temporarily deactivate them, or something of the sort so they are preserved once the nullifier effect is gone. These are just my thoughts and recommendations on nullifiers that I think would provide a better and less 'annoying' gameplay experience. Thanks for giving this a read and I wish you a lovely day.

Edited February 6 by Aesyaan

[chaotea]

No one disagrees with you, its just that these points have been made for almost a century to no avail. Think most people are resigned to nullifier issues now XD

[Tiltskillet]

20 minutes ago, Aesyaan said:

my case in point: Gara or Chroma. It is incredibly frustrating when I'll have built up high damage with Gara's 2 or high buffs with Vex armor then some Nullifier will just walk out from a corner or appear from a fissure and remove all of that immediately, it is my opinion that instead of just erasing those kinds of abilities entirely, it should drain them, temporarily deactivate them, or something of the sort so they are preserved once the nullifier effect is gone.

FWIW, Nullifier dispels are already dealt with differently in a few cases.  It's just very few.

[Circle_of_Psi]

Nope, not gonna happen, pop their bubbles, kill the guy.

 

Simple as that

[Aesyaan]

@Circle_of_Psi But what about fissures, or when they walk from around a corner? It's not so simple as "shoot at something I can't see behind a wall". I'll have you know I dislike my 1 mil splinter storm being erased because a guy just spawned on top of me.

Edited February 6 by Aesyaan

[BiancaRoughfin]

1 hour ago, chaotea said:

No one disagrees with you

I do, not only do i disagree, i also think DE should make Nullies for a period of time like they originally were back when first released just so players can be grateful of their current state.

I wouldnt say this is a matter of "Git Gud" its a matter of being alert and aware of your surroundings to avoid being caught by the Nullies.

6 minutes ago, Aesyaan said:

But what about fissures, or when they walk from around a corner? It's not so simple as "shoot at something I can't see behind a wall".

Nullifiers emit a very specific sound when their shield deploys and starts growing, be aware of it and you wont run into one around the corners.

8 minutes ago, Aesyaan said:

I'll have you know I dislike my 1 mil splinter storm being erased because a guy just spawned on top of me.

Why do you even bother stacking it up to so much when most enemies would instantly die from 1/5 of that?

[(PSN)Sentiel]

So many enemies ignore our abilities that nullies seem like the least of the evil we have to deal with.

[Aesyaan]

@BiancaRoughfin

11 minutes ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

I wouldnt say this is a matter of "Git Gud" its a matter of being alert and aware of your surroundings to avoid being caught by the Nullies.

Nullifiers emit a very specific sound when their shield deploys and starts growing, be aware of it and you wont run into one around the corners.

Counterpoint: Fissures, no matter how aware of your surroundings you are, you can't prevent a nullifiers from spawning on top of you. Also it can be nearly impossible to hear that sound over all the other chaos that is constantly happening with abilities and gunshots. That's simply unreasonable given how quiet that sound is compared to other sounds

11 minutes ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Why do you even bother stacking it up to so much when most enemies would instantly die from 1/5 of that?

When you get to a certain level, almost all enemies will NOT die from only 200K damage, not to mention Grineer armor at higher levels reducing the damage even further.

Edited February 6 by Aesyaan

[Tiltskillet]

21 minutes ago, Aesyaan said:

But what about fissures, or when they walk from around a corner?

The fissure thing, well, there are still lots of complaints about it, so I'd feel silly  saying it's a myth.  But if it's  happened to me in the last couple of years, it's been extremely rare.   Corrupted Nullifiers don't often drop right on top of me, and there's a delay before their bubbles are active and expand.  Maybe it happens with lag, I don't know.

As far as around corners goes, I know players largely aren't in the habit of playing this way in Warframe, but occasionally it helps to be a little tactical and not blunder blindly around corners.  :P  Especially if one is playing Death Ball Gara.

Don't get me wrong, I have sympathy with wanting to change Nullifiers.  I'd like the effect to be less binary on more powers, I wish so many of them couldn't spawn at the same time at high levels, and I'd love it if the drone was a little easier to hit.  But I also think we shouldn't pretend we're  helpless.

[Aesyaan]

@Tiltskillet I agree with this, sums up how I feel perfectly.

[Venefik]

10 minutes ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

I do, not only do i disagree, i also think DE should make Nullies for a period of time like they originally were back when first released just so players can be grateful of their current state.

I wouldnt say this is a matter of "Git Gud" its a matter of being alert and aware of your surroundings to avoid being caught by the Nullies.

Nullifiers emit a very specific sound when their shield deploys and starts growing, be aware of it and you wont run into one around the corners.

Why do you even bother stacking it up to so much when most enemies would instantly die from 1/5 of that?

 Nullifiers aren't balanced though. The impact a Nullifier has over Tempest Barrage is inverted: not only Barrage is not dispelled, it will actually damage and reduce their bubbles to the point 3 casts will almost immediately break their bubbles as soon as they regenerate, basically nullifying the nullies inside a pretty large radius. Mallet does the same.

 On the other hand, 'dome' class of skills and some other objects and zones placed on the field become almost unusable since a nullie spawning anywhere nearby will insta dispell it just for existing. Why must Tempest Barrage and Mallet (25 energy, powerful DPS and debuffing/cc tools) be almost non-dispellable while Cataclysm (100 energy, ultimate) simply vanishes when a nullie touches it??

 Saying Nullies ruin the game would indeed be exaggerating. I have an amp that allows me to pop nullie bubbles with ease, and some of my warframe choices like Titania make nullies look cute when you can vaporize their protection.
 But saying "they aren't problematic and need no fixes" is a huge lie. There are warframes that I simply do not bring into corpus missions even when I want to play them simply because of Nullifiers and how uneven their effect on the roster is.

[Aesyaan]

@Venefik yes this exactly! Not game ruining, but still problematic and annoying at times.

[JimothyStevens]

Let's be real, nullifiers should just be removed from the game. Total nullifier death.

[BiancaRoughfin]

53 minutes ago, Aesyaan said:

Counterpoint: Fissures, no matter how aware of your surroundings you are, you can't prevent a nullifiers from spawning on top of you.

Oddly i dont have that issue, also i dont play with frames that depend on sacking damage buffs so much to be reliable as my weapon easily deals those 1 Mil+ damage on its own.

23 minutes ago, Venefik said:

 Nullifiers aren't balanced though.

Guy, compared to how they used to be when introduced, you`re practically smacking a pudding now days. Not only did they have many times more shield energy, there was no drone to hit or augment to instant pop the bubbles, also they used to reflect damage so if you shot them you would down 99% of the time, you were literally forced to Melee their bubbles down or ground slam into the bubbles to kill them.

6 minutes ago, JimothyStevens said:

Let's be real, nullifiers should just be removed from the game. Total nullifier death.

Not happening.

[JimothyStevens]

Hey, never say never.

[NeDesitVirtus]

Nullifiers don't need to be nerfed it just requires understanding the DPS mechanics to delete the bubble faster. 

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Nullifier_Crewman

Use higher DPS primary/secondary to delete the shields more quickly. 

For the sake of additional challenge, I'd suggest we add nullifier types to regular grineer missions, i.e. modified demolysts outside of disruption which pulse and deactivate abilities but have a slightly higher chance of dropping rare mods, endo, etc. 

Begin adding these at the end of the regular star chart, albeit watered down as a training tool of what to expect in Steel Path or lvl 100+ enemies in Lua Circulus, and beyond. 

Instead of easy mode. Let's try for incrementally more difficult and challenging. 

In the end, the AI for enemies is so underwhelming and basic, the weapon fire accuracy and group coordination by the enemy so non-existent, that they all serve as cannon fodder to fuel the power fantasy of the average Warframe player. 

[Aesyaan]

1 minute ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Guy, compared to how they used to be when introduced, you`re practically smacking a pudding now days. Not only did they have many times more shield energy, there was no drone to hit or augment to instant pop the bubbles, also they used to reflect damage so if you shot them you would down 99% of the time, you were literally forced to Melee their bubbles down or ground slam into the bubbles to kill them.

Alright now lets take this into account with your suggestion on your first comment in this thread: how the heck would making them worse, like they used to be, make things any better than they are now?

[Aesyaan]

7 minutes ago, NeDesitVirtus said:

Nullifiers don't need to be nerfed it just requires understanding the DPS mechanics to delete the bubble faster. 

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Nullifier_Crewman

Use higher DPS primary/secondary to delete the shields more quickly. 

For the sake of additional challenge, I'd suggest we add nullifier types to regular grineer missions, i.e. modified demolysts outside of disruption which pulse and deactivate abilities but have a slightly higher chance of dropping rare mods, endo, etc. 

The problem, or at least the one I have isn't destroying the bubbles, but it's when they appear so fast that you can't. A good example is void fissures, I know many people may not have this problem but almost every fissure mission I go into a fissure will spawn a nullifier right next to me- there's nothing I can do to stop that. Also nullifiers coming from around corners while I'm passing, it is a rare occurrence but it's difficult to avoid when zooming around and it does happen.

Edited February 6 by Aesyaan

[JimothyStevens]

1 hour ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

I do, not only do i disagree, i also think DE should make Nullies for a period of time like they originally were back when first released just so players can be grateful of their current state.

Why would you want to make the game even worse lol. "You think this particular mechanic sucks now but it was even worse before! So quit complaining!" This logic confuses me. I don't like it as it exists and would like an improvement. It's the equivalent of a, "Back in my day!" argument.

Edited February 6 by JimothyStevens

[Famecans]

The mobile platform is coming, the mobile platform will naturally reveal problems in terms of progression and gameplay, there are many old school mechanics that will be nerfed.

For me nullifiers are horrible visually and mechanically, the nullifier zone should work as an enemy enhancer and make them immune to skill damage / AoE damage / elemental damage / physical damage / skill... maybe this zone turns them into eximus without aura/overguard. I don't know but the DE should rework nullifiers, the nullifier zone must not turn off skills, it must not prevent the skill recast.

[__Kanade__]

I honestly never even knew they made a sound to let you know they're coming.

So much is already going on with death screams, abilities, melee, gun shots, BGM, etc.

 

I mean, sometimes I can't even hear the black clouds during Siphon missions and they;re pretty loud to begin with.