PC PC Dante Unbound: Hotfix 35.5.6

[PraetorGix]

Inb4 the whiners start crying about the 1 billion damage to Dante because it's too heavy a nerf -_-

In a more serious tone, thanks for the Arca Triton un-nerfs. 

Oh and please for the love of Natah, can we get back reload time in the stats UI without having to hover the mouse pointer over "magazine"???

Edited April 10 by PraetorGix

[Fenastreal]

Rhino with Parasitic Armor could gain OG from Iron Skin, with no shields, so if you allowed it for Rhino or even Frost with Icy Avalanche, but not Kullervo, you'd be in a situation where you could just play Rhino or Frost with PA and by virtue be just as adept at using a HA/OG build as Kullervo would have been.

[Daviodraan]

hace 6 minutos, Fenastreal dijo:

Elemental Excess is a flat add, so it checks out, as it is 20% added after all the other modifiers, so what it actually looks like is

That's not how literally any other Incarnon upgrade works. 

I'm getting 120+ Status chance on, say, the Incarnon Boltor Prime with just Galvanized Aptitude and 1 60-60 mod (52% base sc with the Evolution)

They add to your base value, that's what then gets multiplied by mods (and other buffs in-mission).

[Fenastreal]

Just now, Daviodraan said:

That's not how literally any other Incarnon upgrade works. 

I'm getting 120+ Status chance on, say, the Incarnon Boltor Prime with just Galvanized Aptitude and 1 60-60 mod (52% base sc with the Evolution)

They add to your base value, that's what then gets multiplied by mods (and other buffs in-mission).

Elemental Excess on Laetum, Phenmor and Onos are all flat adds, just checked the wiki to be sure.For the Genesis Adapter evolutions those are base changes, but for those 3 examples, they are indeed flat adds.

[_GoodLuck_]

These LoS changes gonna kill your game. Don't go wrong

[Daviodraan]

Justo ahora, Fenastreal dijo:

Elemental Excess on Laetum, Phenmor and Onos are all flat adds, just checked the wiki to be sure.For the Genesis Adapter evolutions those are base changes, but for those 3 examples, they are indeed flat adds.

Hm, some transparency on it would be appreciated then, it's not overly clear at first sight. 

Fair enough then.

[jdsworld]

Thanks for the swift changes! 1 billion damage cap is crazy. 

[Fenastreal]

1 minute ago, Daviodraan said:

Hm, some transparency on it would be appreciated then, it's not overly clear at first sight. 

Fair enough then.

Yeah, I agree, I was annoyed when I first found out as well xD

[Stomno]

Please fix this effect and sound bug with Mania

[Wiz3rd]

Just revert the LoS checks.

Not a single ability with a LoS check IN THE ENTIRE GAME is fun and fluid - ironically, the only frame that could use LoS checks is Vauban with his Vortex, and he's the one exception.

Line of Sight is a terrible balancing mechanic and feels awful every time. Don't do it.

[Raikh]

3 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

I don't know about Rhino, but Kullervo kind of had to be an exception by virtue of being able to generate Overguard and having no shields to throttle the energy gain from HA/Rage.  He'd be an exponentially better HA user than any of the traditional health tankers that it's tuned for.

I agree though, it's awkward as something people will have to look up on the wiki to find out. 

Question is if that one exception right now is worth the result of it being so unintuitive. They could also just reduce the effectiveness of Rage energy gen via Overguard since Overguard is not affected by most damage reductions and Armor. At full effectivness Nidus and Inaros now gain dramatically more energy via Rage when receiving Overguard externally since they usually run around with quite a bit of Armor, Adaptation or similar. So I think there is room to make it a general rule without breaking anything. And as long as its reasonable I don't see how having access to Rage on Kullervo would warrant such a roundabout way to implement the change. If one thing it would actually give some purpose to him being shieldless, which in the context of Overguard is just coming as a downside.

Although even then it wouldn't really change that anyone with shields is still being bricked by receiving Overguard externally if using Rage. Nowadays I don't do it much anymore, but there has been a time where I used Rage on any Frame that could reasonably take Health Damage and w/o Overguard getting rid of some minimal base shields is usually not a huge deal, so its not some super situational playstyle even if less popular nowadays due to shield gating.

[Champagne]

can u fix the color channels of the archimedean sumdali, its metallics are colored by the primary color rather than accents

[L115A3_XB1]

2 hours ago, Grimm said:

could you fix it not armor stripping acolytes and demolysts since the inline armor update multiple years ago please 
also banshees base 1/3 armour strip doesnt inline strip (strip more per cast) only works with the augment that makes it increase with power strength, ability also still does not have any wording about its base strip feature.

It was a bug , it was fixed in one of the hotfixes or the main update for Dante cant remember exactly off top of my head but its in notes

 

[MrBeat2827]

Please DE, Pablo and anyone else who works on game mechanics, DELETE LOS ON DANTE!!!!!! I don’t know how long I’ll need to scream that until it becomes a reality but I will. I loved pre NERF Dante and even with these “fixes” it’s still a bad beat all around. Until Dante is “unbound” I’m about done playing Warframe. Mirage is boring to me and that was my most used frame. Everyone else is boring too because preferences. Dante felt FUN and EXHILARATING making the game fun for me but now…this is dumb. #revertthenerf!!!!!!

[Fenastreal]

10 minutes ago, Raikh said:

Question is if that one exception right now is worth the result of it being so unintuitive. They could also just reduce the effectiveness of Rage energy gen via Overguard since Overguard is not affected by most damage reductions and Armor. At full effectivness Nidus and Inaros now gain dramatically more energy via Rage when receiving Overguard externally since they usually run around with quite a bit of Armor, Adaptation or similar. So I think there is room to make it a general rule without breaking anything. And as long as its reasonable I don't see how having access to Rage on Kullervo would warrant such a roundabout way to implement the change. If one thing it would actually give some purpose to him being shieldless, which in the context of Overguard is just coming as a downside.

Although even then it wouldn't really change that anyone with shields is still being bricked by receiving Overguard externally if using Rage. Nowadays I don't do it much anymore, but there has been a time where I used Rage on any Frame that could reasonably take Health Damage and w/o Overguard getting rid of some minimal base shields is usually not a huge deal, so its not some super situational playstyle even if less popular nowadays due to shield gating.

That's why I feel it it should have just been in general, if you have OG, and you get hit with no shields, then you get energy. OG is not affected by DR, and on top of that, if going the route of oh well then you can just OG on Kullervo and grofit,  then it would have to not affect any frame that could put on PA(all of them) as the archgun deployer gives 2000 OG, steadfast dismount in open worlds gives OG, and there are 6 frames who can all generate OG:

1) Intrepid Stand+Styanax

2) Kullervo

3) Rhino

4) Rumbled+Atlas

5) Dante

6) Icy Avalanche+Frost

That said, I don't feel the power would be that drastic, just gives a way to have energy gen as they have to actively give up shield gate and rely on overgate alone to benefit from the rage interaction.

That said, that's why I also proposed, should they make that change or not, a corrupted mod for rage, Constant Rage, to allow you to make a health tank build if you want and if you get OG(or make OG if they do make the change) you're not locked out because of shieldsa as you won't have any. Likewise, this change still didn't address Kinetic Plating on Gauss, and I can tell ya, that puts in work in my Gauss build but can't if I get OG, as this change only affected Rage/HA and only specific, niche cases.

[TheTundraTerror]

Brilliant. This is literally the first thing I tested. Stand at the bottom of the steps and cast Dark Verse/Tragedy to test LoS. Somehow able to hit three mobs despite not being able to see them in any way. 🫠

Spoiler

Full Orokin Battlegroup, by the way.

Edited April 10 by TheTundraTerror

[Hexerin]

30 minutes ago, Daviodraan said:

Hm, some transparency on it would be appreciated then, it's not overly clear at first sight. 

Fair enough then.

28 minutes ago, Fenastreal said:

Yeah, I agree, I was annoyed when I first found out as well xD

It's technically transparent, if you look at it from a lore perspective. The "OG" incarnons (those crafted from the old tech) are all flat add. Whereas the "Genesis" adapters (which were created by a mixture of Duviri influence) are base value changers.

Does this feel good from a gameplay perspective? Not even remotely. However, it does make sense if you consider it from the lore perspective.

Also, it would make the OG incarnons even more overtuned than they already are, if they were updated to use the Genesis system. Onos doesn't have access to Devastating Attrition, however, so buffing it would probably not unbalance things.

Edited April 10 by Hexerin

[Cortes02]

1 hour ago, Phoenician said:

DE will definitely need LOS checks on future purchases (especially Protea which will be launching soon enough) because they're going to see a decrease in revenue for sure, hopefully enough to show them we're not happy with LOS, the bait and switch and general tone deaf approach they're taking.

You didn't use him before the LOS check was introduced to his 4?

I wasn't playing when the update dropped and they nerfed him right after I started building him

[Peekoh]

3 hours ago, Galexivity said:

I believe I speak for the majority when the main issue with Dante when it comes to Tragedy is the LoS. While we appreciate the fixes that you are doing, you need to see that the best fix for Dante's tragedy is to revert the LoS changes on it and make it a circle again. Reduce the range of it if that's the problem. Don't make it one-shot level 26 enemies if that's the problem. But once again, you're missing the mark just by a tad. Please just get rid of LoS for Dante's Tragedy. There are so many reasons and possible solutions that members have asked for who play your game for hours on end. We love you DE, but we really want you to listen. ;n;

LoS is fine.  It helps reign in his power.  Dark Verse and Tragedy line up anyways, the radial effect previously wasn't needed.  You'll still be hitting the ones marked by Dark Verse,

[Joezone619]

3 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Rage and Hunter Adrenaline 

Previously, Overguard granted by allies could prevent you from gaining Energy from these Mods (since it blocked damage dealt to Health). So, in an effort to create a more co-op friendly experience between the two, we’ve made the following change:  

Now, Rage and Hunter Adrenaline can convert the Damage on Overguard granted by allies to Energy while Shields are inactive. 

More specifically, they will trigger when the last source of Overguard originates from an ally (includes Warframe Specters with Overguard abilities spawned by allies.) This allows shield-less Warframes, such as Inaros and Nidus, to be able to regenerate Energy via these Mods when they would have previously been blocked by Overguard granted by allies. 

Here are the exact stat details:

• Rage: +40% (same effectiveness as the base functionality) of Damage on Overguard granted by allies to Energy while Shields are inactive. 
• Hunter Adrenaline: +45% (same effectiveness as the base functionality) of Damage on Overguard granted by allies to Energy while Shields are inactive.  

NOTE: Warframes that grant themselves Overguard, like Kullervo or Rhino, will not be able to trigger Rage and Hunter Adrenaline from their own Overguard. Only Overguard granted by allies is eligible because this is the only interaction that is potentially disruptive to your build (i.e your ally puts Overguard onto your Rage-Build Nidus). 

This does absolutely nothing for every single warframe that uses rage barring nidus and inaros.

Edited April 10 by Joezone619

[Cortes02]

1 hour ago, Nero.DMC said:

Try the same in enclosed spaces and high level you wont delete S#&$, you need to mark enemies first and then if you are in a small space (that is fairly common on older content) you are going to hit 3 enemies, being happy eating crap does not make it any less crap.

Man what a problem, really makes him unplayable. Oh wait, you can just play in other maps.

If you like to play in tighter tilesets, it's honestly a you problem. He doesn't work well there, doesn't mean he doesn't work in general

1 hour ago, Gandalf_White said:

Next time try playing on a tileset that isn't called "Lua" or "Void" or "Zariman"

What if I told you that I played him on corpus spaceships, kuva fortress and laboratories instead of those?

[sitri_01]

2 hours ago, Numerounius said:

Archon intensify still triggers if you heal at full health so that means that the ability to proc archon intensify should still work does it not?

Just tested in Simulacrum with Grendel and no it doesnt work at full hp.

[OnestarMike]

50 minutes ago, PraetorGix said:

Inb4 the whiners start crying about the 1 billion damage to Dante because it's too heavy a nerf -_-

In a more serious tone, thanks for the Arca Triton un-nerfs. 

Oh and please for the love of Natah, can we get back reload time in the stats UI without having to hover the mouse pointer over "magazine"???

Mate you are so far gone not even gauss can catch up with you.

literally nobody cared about this. Dante’s 4 feels terrible to use. It could one shot everything in the game and it would still suck to use because most of the time that damage doesn’t actually happen. And no amount of LoS fixes will change that. 

[Mewvg2]

Revert the Dante and Nezha changes entirely.

There is no other acceptable option.

 

There is no way you have enough data in 8 days to make sweeping nerfs. All you are doing is making sure the community has no reason to get excited for future content on release in the future. It follows the pattern of Styanax post release nerfs and Voruna / Dagath / Qorvex pre-release nerfs and lack of fixes for months. There is no reason to get excited for new content anymore, it'll either come out in a worthless state or be nerfed to oblivion within the first month.

 

I don't care about the new game mode, my best friend that I wanted to play the new game mode with was so excited for Dante and enjoys playing him so much I can't just ruin his entire reason for playing at the moment by breaking the news about the nerfs to him. Thanks for ruining what was a golden update with bull$%#@.

[Darkbring]

Remove LoS from Tragedy, especially now that you added it properly to Dark Verse. Nerf range of Tragedy to anything from 20 to 25 meters if it's such a big deal (30m range really isn't a problem at all, but whatever). Either that, or refund.