what's wrong with Sentinel damage

[supernils]

so I read there were some buffs

I still do 5-10 times as much damage with Obex with Pressure Point and Fury and nothing else than with my fully kitted Artax (including Riven) on Taxon. I also do not understand why I get 90% cold procs when there's only viral and heat on the weapon.

Fired Up does nothing too, not a single heat proc (unequipped mods on Artax to test).

And to top it off he seems to have a reload time of like 10 seconds (or Assault mode cooldown?).

I wouldn't call that degree of damage useful. And this is single target only too.

[VibingCat]

Switch to Verglas, you'll be surprised.

Assault Mode has a cooldown because it's a precept mod. Additionally, your sentinel will stop attacking if you idle.

 

[supernils]

seems to be that Artax though, basically all other weapons are much better. Guess I'll save me that Riven slot for something else.

[Pakaku]

Some are good at damage output, like the Helstrum and Verglas, which are also a bit further down the progression line than the standard sentinel weapons.

The Artax is pretty decent when paired with the Nautilus' pull ability, or enemy grouping abilities in general. So less for its damage, more for its support.

Just now, supernils said:

seems to be that Artax though, basically all other weapons are much better. Guess I'll save me that Riven slot for something else.

Given that it's the default weapon for the starter sentinel, it's somewhat understandable

[TeaHands]

I've been using Artax with Shivering Contagion since it turns cold procs into AoEs and it grinds small crowds to a halt. It also does the same to Archons. Then I use Duplex Bond Mod and the clones are just freezing everyone. Artax is way better for debuffing then dealing damage.

Edited April 19 by TeaHands
Better words and name for the mod.

[UnstarPrime]

Sentinels are so strong now that you can rely on them for all your damage-dealing needs if you build them right.  For example, see this video here:

This video was before Contagious Bond's spread was capped, but it still works great.

Edited April 16 by UnstarPrime

[RobWasHere]

40 minutes ago, supernils said:

I also do not understand why I get 90% cold procs when there's only viral and heat on the weapon.

Artax's unique trait is that it forces cold procs each tick regardless of mods on the weapon. Cold is on top of other mods' status procs, its just Artax has like 3% status chance at base.

Along with Taxon, its designed as introductory sentinel for new players. Artax does minuscule damage by itself but its fine for starter planets, slows down single enemy and Taxon restores shields.

Get Verglas for top-notch sentinel weapon or if you can't, buy and build either Cryotra or Helstrum from one of Fortuna's vendors.

[Tiltskillet]

45 minutes ago, supernils said:

I still do 5-10 times as much damage with Obex with Pressure Point and Fury and nothing else than with my fully kitted Artax (including Riven) on Taxon.

I should hope so.   Artax only does 5 damage per shot, and only fires once per second at base according to the wiki.  (It actually seems to me it shoots a little faster than that, but not much.  In any case, a typical beam weapon it is not.)

47 minutes ago, supernils said:

I also do not understand why I get 90% cold procs when there's only viral and heat on the weapon.

The weapon has forced cold, with only 3% base status chance for natural procs.  

 

48 minutes ago, supernils said:

so I read there were some buffs

Not directly to companion weapons or attacks.  Hopefully some of this is coming with part 2, supposedly sometime this year.

[ShogunGunshow]

We're supposedly getting a second part of the companion rework at some point that contains a balance pass on sentinel weapons to bring the weaker ones into usefulness but... Well. This is DE. So who knows how many years that will take.

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

7 hours ago, TeaHands said:

I've been using Artax with Shivering Comtagion since it turns cold procs into AoEs and it grinds small crowds to a halt. It also does the same to Archons. Then add I use Duplex Bond Mode and the clones are just freezing everyone. Artax is way better for debuffing then dealing damage.

And they said CC was dead? 🤣🤣🤣

[Hayrack]

14 hours ago, supernils said:

<...> damage <...>

 <...> Artax <...>

AHAHAHAHAHA GOOD ONE

Elementals, status chance, status duration, fire rate and mag size is the best modding directions for Artax. If you use builds with "damage per status type", you can slap on electricity for VIP targets + Gas for AoE priming + 60/60 Radiation mods, that drop from Murmur, because why not?? (that's additional 3 statuses + innate cold), if you use IPS/Heat/Viral on your main weapons + element-casting warframe.

If you have spare space, put some Vigilante mods for stat-sticking.

As far as rivens go, CD/CC are considered "god roll stats" (you can keep them as is in case sentinel weapons get a good buff), but if you ever have multiple Artax rivens, roll one for status chance/duration.

Edited April 17 by Hayrack

[helioth137]

11 hours ago, UnstarPrime said:

Sentinels are so strong now that you can rely on them for all your damage-dealing needs if you build them right.  For example, see this video here:

This video was before Contagious Bond's spread was capped, but it still works great.

great guide ! :) mvp post by far

shivering contagion is also great with sentinels + weapons, it's a pocket gloom

Edited April 17 by helioth137

[TARINunit9]

12 hours ago, supernils said:

I still do 5-10 times as much damage with Obex with Pressure Point and Fury and nothing else than with my fully kitted Artax (including Riven) on Taxon.

Artax deliberately has the lowest of all damage values in the game. They did that on purpose for... some reason I forget, but it's on purpose 

12 hours ago, supernils said:

I also do not understand why I get 90% cold procs when there's only viral and heat on the weapon.

Artax deals forced cold procs regardless of mods and elements

Edited April 17 by TARINunit9

[-ShadowRadiance-]

*Looks while his Verglas helios prime with duplex bond clones SHREDS through steel path on their own*

 

"ok"

 

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

6 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:

Artax deliberately has the lowest of all damage values in the game. They did that on purpose for... some reason I forget, but it's on purpose

Maybe I'm wrong but I remember the explanation as being a way for players to learn the benefits of using CC and stat procs instead of just raw power. Personally, I think DE knew how much of a powerful tool Artax is to vets too. Now with Shivering Contagion available, Artax is downright scary.

[Tiltskillet]

29 minutes ago, (PSN)GEN-Son_17 said:

Maybe I'm wrong but I remember the explanation as being a way for players to learn the benefits of using CC and stat procs instead of just raw power. Personally, I think DE knew how much of a powerful tool Artax is to vets too. Now with Shivering Contagion available, Artax is downright scary.

In comparison to what? :P

On the face of it, I'd much rather use radiation-cold Verglas or Helstrum for CC.  I'd lose out on viral or heat, but Artax is such a mediocre  primer for anything but cold, it's hard for me to see it as a big loss.   Better not to outsource those at all if I'm relying on them. 

If there's more to it, I'd love to understand it better.

[Ace-Bounty-Hunter]

Verglas is the only viable option if you want your Sentinel to do any meaningful damage. Helstrum instead if you'd prefer it to be a primer.

All the other weapons need some serious buffs.

[Pragmatic_2015]

20 hours ago, TeaHands said:

I've been using Artax with Shivering Comtagion since it turns cold procs into AoEs and it grinds small crowds to a halt. It also does the same to Archons. Then I use Duplex Bond Mod and the clones are just freezing everyone. Artax is way better for debuffing then dealing damage.

I love the way you think. So when are we getting Artax Prime ????

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

40 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

In comparison to what? :P

On the face of it, I'd much rather use radiation-cold Verglas or Helstrum for CC.  I'd lose out on viral or heat, but Artax is such a mediocre  primer for anything but cold, it's hard for me to see it as a big loss.   Better not to outsource those at all if I'm relying on them. 

If there's more to it, I'd love to understand it better.

It was the intro sentinel weapon so bI think it can't really compare to anything else, in regards to power. However, is utility holds up to most weapons. If a weapon can't kill enemies effectively, then it needs to be able to help keep me alive. A guaranteed, highly stacked, cold proc means I get hit less and can manage my shields better. 

[Slayer-.]

20 minutes ago, Pragmatic_2015 said:

^{_{I love the way you think.}} So when are we getting Artax Prime ????

Yes please, you always remember your first.

[supernils]

On 2024-04-16 at 11:18 PM, UnstarPrime said:

Sentinels are so strong now that you can rely on them for all your damage-dealing needs if you build them right.  For example, see this video here:

This video was before Contagious Bond's spread was capped, but it still works great.

those type of rare cheese builds are NOT an example of how "sentinels are strong" generally. It's more like the opposite: "oh look, seems DE hasn't thought of this combination". Sentinels are generally strong when they are strong with an average build of an average player.

Edited April 21 by supernils

[UnstarPrime]

4 hours ago, supernils said:

those type of rare cheese builds are NOT an example of how "sentinels are strong" generally. It's more like the opposite: "oh look, seems DE hasn't thought of this combination". Sentinels are generally strong when they are strong with an average build of an average player.

This is certainly a high-end example of the output you can get from a Sentinel, but you don't need a complex build like this to have your Sentinel be an effective killer.  It doesn't matter what gear you're using, just slap a well-modded Verglas on any Sentinel and your companion will effectively kill enemies.

Broadly speaking, there are two kinds of sentinel weapons: weapons that are good at apply status, and weapons that are good at dealing damage.  Choose the right tool for the job and you'll get better results.

Overall I've taken to using my Helstrum — which is great at dealing status to groups — instead of my Verglas specifically because I was getting tired of the frequency with which it felt like my Sentinel was stealing my kills in Steel Path.  But if you want your Sentinel to be a damage-dealer, you can; you just have to pick the right tool for the job.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb supernils:

those type of rare cheese builds are NOT an example of how "sentinels are strong" generally. It's more like the opposite: "oh look, seems DE hasn't thought of this combination". Sentinels are generally strong when they are strong with an average build of an average player.

That's a good thing.
Because only beginners need this sentinel damage. Because they have maxed 1 Sentinel weapon and that will help them. Almost all players are constantly leveling something on the side. And most of the weapons are garbage even with the best mods and primed mutation and lvl 5 arcane.

and with sensible weapons I kill 5-6 or even a lot more enemies than pimped verglas with the best mods. therefore it fits.

[Tiltskillet]

5 hours ago, supernils said:

Sentinels are generally strong when they are strong with an average build of an average player.

What's an average build?

[Hexerin]

On 2024-04-17 at 10:36 AM, Ace-Bounty-Hunter said:

Verglas is the only viable option if you want your Sentinel to do any meaningful damage. Helstrum instead if you'd prefer it to be a primer.

All the other weapons need some serious buffs.

Helstrum actually deals a surprisingly high amount of damage, if you mod it well. I'd actually argue that Helstrum isn't that great at priming, due to the projectiles having such a slow flight speed. Enemies are usually dead long before those clusters of rockets find their targets, unless firing at things I'm not actively rushing down (such as things to the flanks or behind me).

Ultimately though, priming is one of those things that only matters if you're fresh/new to Steel Path and don't have a basic SP kit built yet. Once you start putting together your proper kit, priming very quickly becomes a waste of time.

The only reason I still use Helstrum is because I haven't felt the mood take me to go grab something else yet, and Helstrum is still useful for its passive CC application (enemies on fire flail around instead of attacking me, etc). I've actually been thinking about remodding it to cold, to give me a source of passive cold procs for slowing spazzy enemies (like Rogue Voidrig/Bonewidow).

Edited April 22 by Hexerin