Jade Eximus may have finally pushed me away from warframe.

[hellodownthere]

5 minutes ago, dwqrf said:

That's what ramping up damage on afk target means. It kills you in a few seconds.

And it can be completely negated by reapplying Ironskin.

[dwqrf]

il y a 6 minutes, hellodownthere a dit :

And it can be completely negated by reapplying Ironskin.

If you reapply ironskin, then you are not afk.

[hellodownthere]

11 minutes ago, dwqrf said:

If you reapply ironskin, then you are not afk.

If you're shooting your gun you're not AFK, if you're doing anything you're not AFK, if you're going to AFK pause the game if you're solo and if you're in a group why are you AFK.

You die when you're afk and don't do anything, what a shocking revelation.

Edited September 16 by hellodownthere

[dwqrf]

il y a 14 minutes, hellodownthere a dit :

You die when you're afk and don't do anything, what a shocking revelation.

Well no, some people don't die even when afk. Hence the needing addition of jade eximus into the game and ramping beam damage.

[CoffeeElemental]

В 19.08.2024 в 06:27, Binket_ сказал:

old Energy Leech Eximus

oh no

no no no nononono

[CoffeeElemental]

В 19.08.2024 в 21:55, TenTonneSkeleton сказал:

Also why does every faction have to have them? For lore reasons it seems like maybe just the corpus should have them.

Grineer could steal or buy it from Parvos, and Infested - well... it's not difficult to deduce.

[hellodownthere]

1 hour ago, dwqrf said:

Well no, some people don't die even when afk. Hence the needing addition of jade eximus into the game and ramping beam damage.

Okay, doing another survival and this time I have a 2,183,743 Ironskin. I sat completly in a jade beam and it left me on ~200k so if I were to guess it does ~2 million damage. Than I stomped and it went back up to 2.18 mill. 

Total AFK should be removed from the game much like 1 button kill all mobs abilties of old such as the Mesa's original Regulator Pistols and Ash's Bladestorm.

Have a 3 million Ironskin, stayed in a jade beam and got taken down to 1,194,146 so yeah 2 million damage on is most likely right, at least for a 176 SP corrupted.

Edited September 16 by hellodownthere
beam damage

[Traumtulpe]

So, if you're shield gating then you don't care about these.

If you're invisible you don't care.

If you're using Iron Skin you love them.

If you're Revenant you don't care about anything.

The only way these could possibly be a bother, is if you have an AFK playstyle a'la Inaros + Adaptation and are completely braindead holding down the melee key. No movement, no going into operator, no shooting at the green beam, no nothing. Just afk holding down a button.

Looks like Warframe really needed Jade Eximus.

[Thorham]

People are still complaining about Jade Eximus 🤣

[quxier]

7 hours ago, Traumtulpe said:

The only way these could possibly be a bother, is if you have an AFK playstyle a'la Inaros + Adaptation and are completely braindead holding down the melee key.

I wonder if that's even possible.

Based on my testing most (if not all) melee standing (so just holding melee) moves you. Given high attack speed & slow Jade's beam movement I think frames would just move faster in most cases.

[Rexis12]

My only issue is the whole Transferring out of Warframe thing that Jade Beams can just #*!% you up without any real indication. 

It'll stop more 'involved' Operator moments like Zariman Game Modes. 

It was already an issue even before Zariman came out, which limited the whole Operator suplimental gameplay they wanted, made much worse when they make Transference Static Debuff much stronger (Seriously what was their idea lmao), but Jade beams kinda makes it unnecessarily punishing for something you can't control like how Buffa are duration based and you your self can't turn it off. 

[Tiltskillet]

1 hour ago, quxier said:

I wonder if that's even possible.

Based on my testing most (if not all) melee standing (so just holding melee) moves you. Given high attack speed & slow Jade's beam movement I think frames would just move faster in most cases.

There are definitely combos that would be slower than walking, especially with low attack speed.   And some combos that stick you in place for a few moments, which could be worse even if the overall distance the combo moves on average is pretty good.  And Jade Light beam speed does scale noticeably with level, so walking  speed itself is probably not quite fast enough at high levels.  Even before cold procs and the like.

Not that I'm suggesting Jade Light is difficult to deal with normally.  For the hypothetical "Basically AFK with melee key taped down" player you're talking about though,  it could be rough going.   Especially when they get stuck against a barrier and don't notice right away. :P

[_Anise_]

On 2024-09-16 at 12:14 PM, quxier said:

Wait, so you are telling me that you have problems with "hooking"

On 2024-09-16 at 12:14 PM, quxier said:

You know that any very common action like rolls or bullet jump "turns off" hooks?

In steal path without bringing jade light into it AT ALL, yes I have been double hooked more than once and instantly died, to avoid it by rolling you would have to roll before you get hooked and hooks can come from range outside of your peripheral vision! there is also no diminishing return mechanic to prevent a second hook landing while you are hooked and if it happens back to back and kill you in seconds before you can go operator, I had this happen multiple times...

also operator does NOT make your warframe immune to damage, if you happen to be channeling. high enough level a hook into a jade light can still potentially kill a frame.

tldr Yes I have had issues with the "mortal kombat scorpion" like hooking in steelpath while running "mortal" frames, no I have not yet been hooked into a jade light yet, I just acknowledge the possibility.

On 2024-09-16 at 8:31 AM, dwqrf said:

That's healthy for the game.

if it forces just a small percentage of players into playing stealth frames because they don't get targeted at all or forces them into rev because immortal, then in my opinion, no! it's not healthy for the game, it does not do "what it says on the tin" people can AFK they just use different frames or methods to do it? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

On 2024-09-16 at 8:31 AM, dwqrf said:

It's not a ridiculous skill, it's just that you don't play around it in the right way.

I agree a little, it can be mitigated "some" and its in a better state then when it was first added, I remember being on spy dropping stealth at a console mid hacking and immediately having a jade light touch down on me from the next room over!! they fixed that so its not completely ridiculous but its also still not a fun mechanic in my opinion.

I think would be more bearable if they could fix a lot of issues with it, again .. hitting you while in CC, top clipping low ceilings, Jades glory pistol being unable to hit the jade light at all for some reason? CC effecting the jade eximus unit should also be slowing the jade light etc, issues where it hits a player while activating life support (before you yell operator! deep archimedia has a no operator modifier!)  but I guess in general we aren't allowed to activate life support without stealth or operator now? o.O

again this ability having so many launch issues, the unit being mega present during the jade event, sets up some bias towards it being a bad ability which is amplified by current situations where you have multiple jades firing off beams while trying to play a cc focused frame or even any frame where a majority of the game ends up being dodging beams #not-fun

On 2024-09-16 at 7:18 AM, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

elden ring

that's the only one I played on the list and I did so to completion, beat Malenia, I never did the dlc though, I don't think elden ring remotely compares to warframe

 

On 2024-09-16 at 7:18 AM, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

use the operator

similar to what I told Quixer, death can sometimes happen in the blink of and eye and operator does not make your warframe immune while you are channeling, I think you take 90% reduced damage and jade light will kill a 3 million health Rhino, so .. that?

On 2024-09-16 at 7:18 AM, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

I've said it so many times that I've lost count, fun is SUBJECTIVE, just because you don't find something fun doesn't apply to everyone.

I totally get that fun is subjective. Whenever I mention 'fun,' I'm just sharing my opinion. Just because fun is subjective doesn't mean my views or anyone else's aren't valid. also 'Bunch' is a vague term, and I wasn't trying to imply a majority or minority—just that there are definitely players who feel the same way.

I use the "boss" mechanic example because there was this boss in wow where he had an effect similar to jade light that would almost kill you if it touched you, it allowed enough time for players to move but every single time this mechanic killed the entire raid because people kept getting hit and the healers couldn't keep up.

Every attempt and there were many! most players except me and the tank died, we had the boss down to 10% tank died, I hit cooldowns and evasion tanked for a few percent until I died too, I don't think it was a bad mechanic it was actually fun for me despite everyone else being inept at dodging.

A boss skill similar to jade light can be fun to me and add an interesting unique mechanic, but if I had to do that in wow for every 10 - 30 enemy it would get really old really fast and to do in in warframe where multiple jade can come along and have you having to spend 10 in every 15 seconds trying to avoid these beams can be really off putting.

 

 

[Tiltskillet]

8 minutes ago, _Anise_ said:

In steal path without bringing jade light into it AT ALL, yes I have been double hooked more than once and instantly died, to avoid it by rolling you would have to roll before you get hooked

There is a delay between being hooked and getting pulled/knocked down.  If you roll in that interval you'll down the enemy instead, even an eximus or other unit that's normally immune to knockdown.  (Can be really amusing on the Acolyte Mania, who will often just curl up into a ball and give up if you do this.)  You can also bullet jump or melee in the direction of the attack to break the chain or tentacle.

[_Anise_]

  

1 hour ago, Tiltskillet said:

There is a delay between being hooked and getting pulled/knocked down

brief delay

On 2024-09-16 at 6:52 AM, _Anise_ said:

like I said in busy situations

if you notice it hit you in the back then sure,  I guess.

[Tiltskillet]

10 minutes ago, _Anise_ said:

  

brief delay

if you notice it hit you in the back then sure,  I guess.

I largely rely on the sound.  I would find it more difficult with sound off.

The window might be 2s?  I'm not sure, but it's long enough I don't find it too restrictive.   It's anytime between when the hook hits and you're knocked down at the end--you can still do it while getting pulled.  So even if you don't notice getting hooked from the back there's still an opportunity.

YMMV, but to me it's one of the best engineered CC-counterplay examples in this game. 

[quxier]

30 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

The window might be 2s? 

I feel like it's more than 1 second but I've just found update 31.6:

Quote

Enemy Grappling Hook Rework:

Scorpions, Ancients, and Tusk Predators have had their grappling hook mechanic reworked! An age-old enemy mechanic from the early beginnings of Warframe, they’ve been grappling Tenno left and right for years - it’s time to break free! Since its introduction, the grappling hook attack has consistently knocked players down or dragged them around, providing no opening for combative counterplay.

NOW Scorpion, Ancient, and Tusk Predator grappling hooks will tether to you, followed by a slight delay (1 second) before they attempt to slowly pull you in. Tenno who are agile enough can now Melee attack in the direction of the rope to destroy it and stagger the enemy. Additionally, Bullet Jumping or dodging during the pulling animation can cause a stagger to the enemy.

• Isolator Bursas have not received the cut mechanic since the mechanic works a bit differently for these enemies.

 

3 hours ago, _Anise_ said:

On 2024-09-16 at 1:14 PM, quxier said:

You know that any very common action like rolls or bullet jump "turns off" hooks?

In steal path without bringing jade light into it AT ALL, yes I have been double hooked more than once and instantly died, to avoid it by rolling you would have to roll before you get hooked and hooks can come from range outside of your peripheral vision! there is also no diminishing return mechanic to prevent a second hook landing while you are hooked and if it happens back to back and kill you in seconds before you can go operator, I had this happen multiple times...

First, 2 or more hooks are "destroyed" when you roll. Not sure if that's the case for you but I wanted to note it.

So taking above aside, you are telling me that you get hooked while you roll or just after? I find it highly unlikely. First rolls will prevent hooks. And just after rolls you won't be hooked. I mean "short time". I don't know if they nerfed it or I set something wrong in Simulacrum but hooks used to be auto aimed and more dangerous.

In general constant moving prevents hooking. I sometimes forget that hooks exist anymore, unless I'm noobing (e.g. typing, or just doing weird thing). If you want to stand, prepare yourself.

3 hours ago, _Anise_ said:

also operator does NOT make your warframe immune to damage, if you happen to be channeling. high enough level a hook into a jade light can still potentially kill a frame.

But that's imho problem of frame <> operator stuff, not Jade light or Hooks.

45 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

1 hour ago, _Anise_ said:

  

brief delay

if you notice it hit you in the back then sure,  I guess.

I largely rely on the sound.  I would find it more difficult with sound off.

YMMV, but to me it's one of the best engineered CC-counterplay examples in this game. 

Sound, slowing down frame, "line". There are many stuff.

[quxier]

30 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

The window might be 2s? 

I feel like it's more than 1 second but I've just found update 31.6:

Quote

Enemy Grappling Hook Rework:

Scorpions, Ancients, and Tusk Predators have had their grappling hook mechanic reworked! An age-old enemy mechanic from the early beginnings of Warframe, they’ve been grappling Tenno left and right for years - it’s time to break free! Since its introduction, the grappling hook attack has consistently knocked players down or dragged them around, providing no opening for combative counterplay.

NOW Scorpion, Ancient, and Tusk Predator grappling hooks will tether to you, followed by a slight delay (1 second) before they attempt to slowly pull you in. Tenno who are agile enough can now Melee attack in the direction of the rope to destroy it and stagger the enemy. Additionally, Bullet Jumping or dodging during the pulling animation can cause a stagger to the enemy.

• Isolator Bursas have not received the cut mechanic since the mechanic works a bit differently for these enemies.

 

3 hours ago, _Anise_ said:

On 2024-09-16 at 1:14 PM, quxier said:

You know that any very common action like rolls or bullet jump "turns off" hooks?

In steal path without bringing jade light into it AT ALL, yes I have been double hooked more than once and instantly died, to avoid it by rolling you would have to roll before you get hooked and hooks can come from range outside of your peripheral vision! there is also no diminishing return mechanic to prevent a second hook landing while you are hooked and if it happens back to back and kill you in seconds before you can go operator, I had this happen multiple times...

First, 2 or more hooks are "destroyed" when you roll. Not sure if that's the case for you but I wanted to note it.

So taking above aside, you are telling me that you get hooked while you roll or just after? I find it highly unlikely. First rolls will prevent hooks. And just after rolls you won't be hooked. I mean "short time". I don't know if they nerfed it or I set something wrong in Simulacrum but hooks used to be auto aimed and more dangerous.

In general constant moving prevents hooking. I sometimes forget that hooks exist anymore, unless I'm noobing (e.g. typing, or just doing weird thing). If you want to stand, prepare yourself.

3 hours ago, _Anise_ said:

also operator does NOT make your warframe immune to damage, if you happen to be channeling. high enough level a hook into a jade light can still potentially kill a frame.

But that's imho problem of frame <> operator stuff, not Jade light or Hooks.

45 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

1 hour ago, _Anise_ said:

  

brief delay

if you notice it hit you in the back then sure,  I guess.

I largely rely on the sound.  I would find it more difficult with sound off.

YMMV, but to me it's one of the best engineered CC-counterplay examples in this game. 

Sound, slowing down frame, "line". There are many stuff.

[--Leyenda-yight6]

hace 3 horas, _Anise_ dijo:

similar to what I told Quixer, death can sometimes happen in the blink of and eye and operator does not make your warframe immune while you are channeling, I think you take 90% reduced damage and jade light will kill a 3 million health Rhino, so .. that?

Once you are in operator mode, the jade eximus will no longer use its light against the warframe, although you can always drag your warframe to the operator's location. The rhino will die if it stays still under the light for more than 5 seconds, is that what you are doing? not move?

hace 3 horas, _Anise_ dijo:

Just because fun is subjective doesn't mean my views or anyone else's aren't valid.

Your opinion is valid, but it is still just that, an opinion, since it is simply based on taste, just as anyone who has a contrary opinion is equally valid.

[hellodownthere]

5 hours ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

The rhino will die if it stays still under the light for more than 5 seconds, is that what you are doing? not move?

Your opinion is valid, but it is still just that, an opinion, since it is simply based on taste, just as anyone who has a contrary opinion is equally valid.

So long as the Rhino has an Ironskin that's over 2 million they'll be fine standing in it for the full duration but no one would willingly stand in the beam for that long unless you're either AFK, your keyboard/controller is broken or you're testing how much damage a beam does.

[--Leyenda-yight6]

hace 2 horas, hellodownthere dijo:

So long as the Rhino has an Ironskin that's over 2 million they'll be fine standing in it for the full duration but no one would willingly stand in the beam for that long unless you're either AFK, your keyboard/controller is broken or you're testing how much damage a beam does.

That's why I'm surprised that he says he dies using rhino, even if he doesn't reach those levels of iron skin, 5 seconds is enough time to react and move away from the laser. By the way, 5 seconds is how long I survive using the rhino build I made 2 years ago, when I didn't have much experience in the game.

Edited September 18 by --Leyenda-yight6

[_Anise_]

On 2024-09-17 at 7:17 PM, quxier said:

So taking above aside, you are telling me that you get hooked while you roll or just after?

this just happened to me in a sortie, I was doing spy as ivara solo, I never craft energy pizza I was just charging my energy up from zenurick while moving between spy targets unstealthed (because you don't accumulate energy over time in stealth) I was parkour/dodging and out of nowhere I hear *pshw clink* then Ivara keeled over dead before I could do ANYTHING, I didn't get to react, I did take a screenshot, I wish I had recorded video tbh.

tldr the hooks kill you, if they couldn't they don't belong in warframe at all, which doesn't change they are annoying and can lead to situations like above but this is entely focusing too much off topic.

On 2024-09-17 at 7:49 PM, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

Once you are in operator mode, the jade eximus will no longer use its light against the warframe

if the jadelight has already been activated and you go operator it will continue to pound your warframe until the duration of jade light ends, I have seen this happen often enough unless there was a recent change I am unaware of?

 

[dwqrf]

Il y a 9 heures, _Anise_ a dit :

this just happened to me in a sortie, I was doing spy as ivara solo, [...] and out of nowhere I hear *pshw clink* then Ivara keeled over dead before I could do ANYTHING, I didn't get to react, I did take a screenshot, I wish I had recorded video tbh.

Was it a Sortie against Infested ?

Because infested Toxic Ancient Eximus can hook with Toxic damage ! (Effectively bypassing your shield and one shooting you more than hooking you, given the right level).

[_Anise_]

7 hours ago, dwqrf said:

Because infested Toxic Ancient Eximus can hook with Toxic damage ! (Effectively bypassing your shield and one shooting you more than hooking you, given the right level).

I think it was infested! which emphasizes my point, under the right circumstances things can insta-kill you which people were making out to be a simple "just dodge", IMO we need less situations where things can "just kill you" catching you in a cc or with a shields generally pants down situation. so my point being that Jade light just adds another one of these "I guess I just die" situations in the right circumstances.

now to counter it, I think this ability might be more "fun" if dread mirror could look up? also it were considered a projectile, then vazarin can absorbe it with guardian shell, xaku and other sources of evasion suddenly become useful against it, (I also think most forms of CC should also work against the beam)

but no the only things you are allowed todo are...

• move out of it's way
• shoot it if it isn't line of sighting you (which should not be possible IMO)
• or play one of the Warframes that completely and passively negates it.

Edited September 19 by _Anise_

[--Leyenda-yight6]

hace 1 hora, _Anise_ dijo:

I think it was infested! which emphasizes my point, under the right circumstances things can insta-kill you which people were making out to be a simple "just dodge", IMO we need less situations where things can "just kill you" catching you in a cc or with a shields generally pants down situation. so my point being that Jade light just adds another one of these "I guess I just die" situations in the right circumstances.

Under the right circumstances, anything can kill you. Did you expect that in this game you wouldn't die even once? Nobody said that you just have to dodge, in this thread they have already talked about various means to confront them.

hace 1 hora, _Anise_ dijo:

but no the only things you are allowed todo are...

• move out of it's way
• shoot it if it isn't line of sighting you (which should not be possible IMO)
• or play one of the Warframes that completely and passively negates it.

As I said: people tend to exaggerate what they don't like.