Give new players energy nexus as a reward for Vor's Prize

[OgreEye]

Putting it in the right place this time. Energy economy in the early game is unbelievably restrictive, as unless vets are in and blasting enemies with a much higher kill rate than you can normally achieve, energy orbs are very scarce. When I was a new player, for the longest time I remember getting a number of ability casts I could count on one hand in a mission. Having a consistent source of energy that isn't an absolute snail's pace like dreamer's bond would dramatically improve the early game, and in fact has been such a game changer for me even in the ultra-late game a part of me wants to say it should be basekit instead of a mod, but that's another conversation. Letting people actually play warframe instead of call of duty but you can jump really far would probably go a long way in getting them interested from the start.

[dwqrf]

il y a 6 minutes, OgreEye a dit :

early game is unbelievably restrictive
[...]
as unless vets are in and blasting enemies with a much higher kill rate than you can normally achieve

Early game is supposed to be restricting, so you learn the ropes and get stronger and feel proud of the way accomplished. You struggle, you learn, you get new tools, you combine them, and you succeed faster and with less effort.

The problem you have is that you got your experience completely biased by "vets" carrying you around, or streams and youtube videos telling you "how to play" in the endgame. But you weren't there yet.

You forgot to play the early game at your rythm, with the tools given, to have fun, to discover, and to enjoy it plainly.

[OgreEye]

6 minutes ago, dwqrf said:

Early game is supposed to be restricting, so you learn the ropes and get stronger and feel proud of the way accomplished. You struggle, you learn, you get new tools, you combine them, and you succeed faster and with less effort.

The problem you have is that you got your experience completely biased by "vets" carrying you around, or streams and youtube videos telling you "how to play" in the endgame. But you weren't there yet.

You forgot to play the early game at your rythm, with the tools given, to have fun, to discover, and to enjoy it plainly.

I have literally never once watched a YouTube video on Warframe or really any media for it at all, and I played probably 2/3 of my missions solo because I got in the game late enough that most everyone was steel path at the time. The early game is supposed to have you feeling weak, not like your Warframe is a cosmetic. On a friend's recommendation I built nezha relatively quickly and found that because I didn't have the ability to mod his 2 to make it actually go energy positive with the relatively low enemy density, I only ever had the energy for his 3, if even, and often found myself not being able to cast it.

Edited September 19 by OgreEye
Elaboration

[dwqrf]

il y a 1 minute, OgreEye a dit :

Warframe is a cosmetic

From Earth to Venus, you can get mods like Flow, Streamline, Energy Siphon, Synth Deconstruct, and Equilibrium. Those mods give you a really good energy economy if you combine a few of them.

[OgreEye]

2 minutes ago, dwqrf said:

From Earth to Venus, you can get mods like Flow, Streamline, Energy Siphon, Synth Deconstruct, and Equilibrium. Those mods give you a really good energy economy if you combine a few of them.

Right, which both of us know, but some newbie won't, and there's not even an indication to look for these things, leaving them feeling like S#&$. Having a single mod solution that's directly given to you smooths things over tremendously.

[dwqrf]

il y a 1 minute, OgreEye a dit :

Having a single mod solution that's directly given to you smooths things over tremendously.

And that's doen't give the player any reason to play any longer if he gets the best tools right away. He won't look for better option, he won't even consider energy to be a valuable ressource to mod for, he won't be able to feel a gap in power and in casting consistency.

One time, few years ago, I was helping a player struggling a lot. He was dying a bit too much to my taste, and that only around Jupiter ; so much in fact that he struggled to enjoy the game. So I gave him [Adaptation]. The game went from really difficult to totally dull and boring. He left and never came back.

Looking for alternatives and new tools to solves problems is part of the game. New players have to struggle, to look at their mods page and wonder what they can do with it, to enhance they gameplay experience. It will never be easy, nor optimal, until they get a greater perception of what the game is about, and what tools they have access to, which are better and why ; for them. Some players might prefer starting energy, some players might prefer energy gain, some other might prefer energy cost reduction.

And until you try it out youself, facing the game limitations and using the tools obtained proudly with your own sweat, you can't know, that's for sure, and that's not a bad thing. The early game shouldn't cut down the thought and experimenting process with overpowered mods just "because".

Some people might drown in informations trying to move too quick in the star chart without mastering the basics or solving one issue at a time, and that's not the game fault.

[Firefrye]

I have made this suggestion in the past, but I'll add it on here as it directly relates. I agree that the new player energy economy is horrible and leaves many players feeling like they're playing with cosmetic frames, but I don't think simply handing them energy nexus would be the best solution as it would STILL not be very good until they upgrade it with the relatively limited endo/credits an actually new and un-aided player will have.

So here's what I suggest. Do you remember the opening sequence of the game? When you pick your starter frame and Lotus speaks up to say "Wake up"? She goes on to say she's "Surging your warframe's power" and gives you unlimited casts of your 1st ability for the first few moments of the quest until you can leave and pick your first weapon. What if DE implemented THAT SAME DIALOGUE as a long-cooldown 5th ability in missions? Call it something like "Transference Surge", give it a 5 or 10 minute cooldown, and make it refill 100% of your energy + health (but not give free-casts).

This does a few things.

1. It helps reinforce the role the Lotus plays in helping and supporting the Tenno early on in the story outside of simple dialogue.

2. It gives them a reliable "emergency" button for when they are overwhelmed or running low on energy.

3. It introduces them to the term "transference", but in a way that does not spoil what we learn about it later.

4. It helps "hide" the discussion of the "real" 5th ability they will unlock later in the Second Dream. When they hear vets talk about their 5th ability or the different "schools", the vets can simply tell them that the story will eventually let them customize their 5th ability and give it more options beyond just energy/health.

5. Once they DO finish the Second Dream, they're already conditioned to look to their 5th ability for energy utility and will already know (or at least have a CHANCE to know) to look to the different schools for varying forms of utility.

6. Thematically it also helps players feel like "waking up" is even more of a natural story progression. No longer is Lotus the one surging their transference signal to boost their energy and support them, but they are doing it themselves directly showing their growing independence and personal improvement.

[matt11mz]

12 hours ago, Firefrye said:

I have made this suggestion in the past, but I'll add it on here as it directly relates. I agree that the new player energy economy is horrible and leaves many players feeling like they're playing with cosmetic frames, but I don't think simply handing them energy nexus would be the best solution as it would STILL not be very good until they upgrade it with the relatively limited endo/credits an actually new and un-aided player will have.

So here's what I suggest. Do you remember the opening sequence of the game? When you pick your starter frame and Lotus speaks up to say "Wake up"? She goes on to say she's "Surging your warframe's power" and gives you unlimited casts of your 1st ability for the first few moments of the quest until you can leave and pick your first weapon. What if DE implemented THAT SAME DIALOGUE as a long-cooldown 5th ability in missions? Call it something like "Transference Surge", give it a 5 or 10 minute cooldown, and make it refill 100% of your energy + health (but not give free-casts).

This does a few things.

1. It helps reinforce the role the Lotus plays in helping and supporting the Tenno early on in the story outside of simple dialogue.

2. It gives them a reliable "emergency" button for when they are overwhelmed or running low on energy.

3. It introduces them to the term "transference", but in a way that does not spoil what we learn about it later.

4. It helps "hide" the discussion of the "real" 5th ability they will unlock later in the Second Dream. When they hear vets talk about their 5th ability or the different "schools", the vets can simply tell them that the story will eventually let them customize their 5th ability and give it more options beyond just energy/health.

5. Once they DO finish the Second Dream, they're already conditioned to look to their 5th ability for energy utility and will already know (or at least have a CHANCE to know) to look to the different schools for varying forms of utility.

6. Thematically it also helps players feel like "waking up" is even more of a natural story progression. No longer is Lotus the one surging their transference signal to boost their energy and support them, but they are doing it themselves directly showing their growing independence and personal improvement.

I really like this idea. "Transference Surge" is already used as a weak, proto transference for Drifter, so I think it could work as another aspect of the ability. Could even retroactively connect the two better.

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

Newb frames get abilities at what?  Level 3/6/10 ?  If they stick to the 1st couple of quests what level could they reach, what would they have to spam??  The focus should be on weapons, with abilities as backup/augments to your weapons.  

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Solo energy drops are depressing even for a veteran player though lol.  Sometimes go to level something and I starve to death =/.  

As a solution to this newb specific problem,   Maybe they could just up the energy orb drop rate in those 1st two quests.   After that its time to start learning Warframe.  

[Twilight053]

On 2024-09-26 at 9:02 PM, (PSN)AbBaNdOn_ said:

Newb frames get abilities at what?  Level 3/6/10 ?  If they stick to the 1st couple of quests what level could they reach, what would they have to spam??  The focus should be on weapons, with abilities as backup/augments to your weapons.  

=======

Solo energy drops are depressing even for a veteran player though lol.  Sometimes go to level something and I starve to death =/.  

As a solution to this newb specific problem,   Maybe they could just up the energy orb drop rate in those 1st two quests.   After that its time to start learning Warframe.  

The missions in Vor's Prize is are pre-bundled with 90k affinity across six missions. By the end of tutorial, they'll be at level 9-10.

Edited September 27 by Twilight053

[x-cessive]

Am 20.9.2024 um 05:18 schrieb Firefrye:

So here's what I suggest. Do you remember the opening sequence of the game? When you pick your starter frame and Lotus speaks up to say "Wake up"? She goes on to say she's "Surging your warframe's power" and gives you unlimited casts of your 1st ability for the first few moments of the quest until you can leave and pick your first weapon. What if DE implemented THAT SAME DIALOGUE as a long-cooldown 5th ability in missions? Call it something like "Transference Surge", give it a 5 or 10 minute cooldown, and make it refill 100% of your energy + health (but not give free-casts).

 

Very well rounded idea 👍