The Perfect Way To Nerf Nova

[QuiteCrazy]

I got a better perfect way to nerf Nova.

Buff the rest of the frames.

but there's 18 frames or so to buff that way instead of nerrfing one :D

 

I would say that removing slow effect and duration to 30 sec is a good way to nerf it without affecting Ulti itself, It still kill everything. and until mobs get to lvl 50 it's so annoying that they r slowly walking to the pod(IMHO) :D

[StuffedTurkey007]

You people are just jealous because your favorite frames are not as strong as Nova in term of damage dealing. Nova is fragile in exchange for powerful abilities. Yeah, the slow and x2 damage seems nice but a rocket from Bombard at the feet of a Rhino could kill Nova while leaving Rhino almost unharmed. Everything has its cost, a Rhino can't have massive damage like Nova, a Nova can't have massive defense like Rhino, an Ember can't have healing, a Trinity can't have lots of damage, etc etc. You just mad because at the end, your killing score is less than a Nova. Let me tell you this, your objective is to, well, complete whatever sh*t Lotus tell you to do, not to get the highest score. I can complete a sabotage or spy mission without killing anything. Even if Nova is killing more than you do, he/she is on your team, it's like you are asking to nerf Lina or Lion so they can only have as mush kill as Dazzle and Treant (DotA players will understand). "Hey let's nerf Nova because they are stealing our kills", stupid child, who gonna save you when level 80 Napalm come? Maybe we should nerf Trinity Blessing too, or nerf Rhino Iron skin, oh hey let's nerf Chaos and Absorb, oh I see Invisibility and Smoke screen op, let's nerf them too. Don't whine about other frames being powerful, whine about your lack of skill. 

 

I'm not jealous at all, Nova is the only frame I've potatoed. She's the only damage frame you need to potato - she's just way more OP than the other caster frames. I'm not upset at all when I have the highest damage; and if I play Rhino, I'm not upset when Nova has the highest damage.

 

What bothers me is that Ember and Banshee usually aren't even worth playing when you can play Nova instead. Even if Ember and Banshee were brought in line to be as powerful as most of the frames, they would still be not as strong as Nova. Nova may be squishy, but her ult's 3 effects combined are ridiculous and more than make up for it. She is so strong that I would never consider not using her in any group of 4 for a difficult mission with lots of enemies.

[tantananan]

They already nerfed MPrime a few updates in update 11. The explosions do not seem to chain properly and there are a few enemies untouched by damage even if someone just blew up beside them. This makes the overall damage of MPrime significantly lower.

 

Someone made tests on this and posted some pictures but I cant find the thread as of now.
Thread here: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/160383-novas-m-prime-damage/

Edited January 28, 2014 by tantananan

[LukeAura]

 

The point is not: "I don't find it ruin with having her power weaken", the point is "why having her power weaken in the first place when it being use to execute nicely for high lvl missions"?

No that was pretty much exactly the point. And it was a question. Not an argument. You can not say the point is wrong when there isn't intended to be a counterpoint. 

I was specifically asking where Nova could be reduced and you, or any one else, would still find her functioning the same. And you can't really say her powers as they are are the minimum of their usefulness as they are because even if she isn't OP, she is clearly very strong. 

 

 

what will Nova do vs lvl 30+ mobs without her slow debuff. Since people already know that her chain explode no longer working the same point when Rhino's iron skin no longer working as well. 

Again, I said straight number nerfs, not removals. At what percentage down from 50, does the slow become not slow enough? 

 

what will Nova do vs lvl 30+ mobs without her slow debuff. Since people already know that her chain explode no longer working the same point when Rhino's iron skin no longer working as well. 

Gun is always preferred over abilities, did you know that once gun is nerf, that's the same as nerfing m-prime as well? Since m-prime required using gun to kill mobs in order to activate the damage. 

Worm hole doesn't worth the slot since it cost very high energy, and only useful for straight direction map, I only ever see Nova use it when she go to extraction, or travel in long distance, not as an ability to help escape. Rip line or super jump is more favorable in my opinion, and I'm willing to trade worm hole for it. 

Not many people use AMD mainly for the fact that, it's slow, it doesn't have exact target indication, required you to stay in certain position, required you to aim at it. It's like a sniper but 10x slower. 

M-prime had the same range as Rhino stomp, mag's shield polarize, Nyx's chaos etc, as I already explain Nova is not the exception to having that range. 

I never said a thing about nerfing guns. Guns are overall pretty well balanced, with some that may stick out more than others but nothing glaringly overpowered. 

So Wormhole doesn't even matter to you? Well, I guess someone who values it more will need to give me their opinion on it. 

Okay, but what about its ability to boost damage? And its range? If you find its too slow as is that means it shouldn't have its travel speed reduced. There's a start. 

It doesn't matter what else has the range of M-prime. It only matters at what range M-prime stops being useful to Nova players. 

I know its hard for you to say anything but Nova is perfectly fine, don't touch her. And I'm not asking if she should or shouldn't be. But let's face it, DE doesn't exactly have the best track record of appropriate nerfs or nerfing in slow stages. It will drop hard and fast on Nova, and they've said several times Nova will be looked at, the potential is there for her to be completely ruined because only the people vying for a nerf have been suggesting how to nerf her. You love Nova, you like her as she is, you therefore have the best sensibility to suggest the absolute minimum of weakness her ability effects can be and still not be trash. It'd be better to give your opinion on how weak she can be without being ruined than saying nothing about it at all, because that will ruin her.  

 

[-CM-Syein]

No that was pretty much exactly the point. And it was a question. Not an argument. You can not say the point is wrong when there isn't intended to be a counterpoint. 

I was specifically asking where Nova could be reduced and you, or any one else, would still find her functioning the same. And you can't really say her powers as they are are the minimum of their usefulness as they are because even if she isn't OP, she is clearly very strong. 

 

-She is clearly strong in damage, as I said a number of time, damage is not everything in the game, you only concentrated on damage and ignored other mechanic of the game or her survival abilities. You are nerfing the numbers, that's the same as lower her effectiveness, how is that functioning the same. 

 

 

Again, I said straight number nerfs, not removals. At what percentage down from 50, does the slow become not slow enough?

The current slow debuff still doesnt help her escape dead, so what's the point of reducing it more?

 

I never said a thing about nerfing guns. Guns are overall pretty well balanced, with some that may stick out more than others but nothing glaringly overpowered. 

So Wormhole doesn't even matter to you? Well, I guess someone who values it more will need to give me their opinion on it. 

Okay, but what about its ability to boost damage? And its range? If you find its too slow as is that means it shouldn't have its travel speed reduced. There's a start. 

It doesn't matter what else has the range of M-prime. It only matters at what range M-prime stops being useful to Nova players. 

 

reasons why I mentioned gun is because you said: "AMD now only gives a 250% percent multiplier instead of 400%. would you still use it as an AoE damage amp or just go back to using your guns? " gun will always better than abilities, especially Nova's abilities are activate by gun. So yes, gun is always being preferred over. 

Reason why I said worm hole is not an effective method for Nova's survival is because it's energy cost is 75, Nova's m-prime is 100. So if you haven't max every possible efficiency, you rather use m-prime instead of worm hole for survival. 

Problem with worm hole: It's distance is long, sure, but it's not a good method to escape from close space places (grineer ship or infest ship for example)

Worm hole doesn't give you specific location for travel, you only know it travel in straight line. (exp: loki's switch teleport give exact location since his decoy is in that location place) Sometimes worm hole can travel you to whatever dimension and immediately kill you. Hence, mostly you see Nova only use worm hole in big open space or extraction point. I couldn't careless if they took out worm hole as Nova's skill. 

 

I know its hard for you to say anything but Nova is perfectly fine, don't touch her. And I'm not asking if she should or shouldn't be. But let's face it, DE doesn't exactly have the best track record of appropriate nerfs or nerfing in slow stages. It will drop hard and fast on Nova, and they've said several times Nova will be looked at, the potential is there for her to be completely ruined because only the people vying for a nerf have been suggesting how to nerf her. You love Nova, you like her as she is, you therefore have the best sensibility to suggest the absolute minimum of weakness her ability effects can be and still not be trash. It'd be better to give your opinion on how weak she can be without being ruined than saying nothing about it at all, because that will ruin her.  

 

The reason why I said Nova should not be nerf is because I played many frames, and able to compared her in various situation. I myself would have said: "yes, her damage is strong" but hey, I rather use other frames in other certain situations. 

Rhino's damage is not as much as Nova, but reason why I choose Rhino mostly for high level run is because, I rather be the one staying alive and still can do decent damage and CC at high level, instead of doing huge damage but request help from teammates multiple times. 

In a game, damage is the one thing that stand out the most. 

And don't worry, in internet, there are times when I know that's I'm wrong as well as apologize, but regarding for frame's nerf, I don't think I'm wrong. There are people that will never admit they are wrong in the internet, even though they feel it is wrong. I am sure I don't have such problem since I never feel I am wrong in this topic. 

 

replied in quote ^

Edited January 28, 2014 by SElZE

[Ekaterinanl]

All you yelling "nerf Nova" have nothing but words to throw at people who love Nova the way she is. "Nerf this, nerf that, nerf this in particular". SEIZE already offered you a chance to go on a field test and all you do is dodge. When her ult can fire nukes that were thrown at Hiroshima faster than America's democracy delivering rate then I believe she need a nerf.

[DaveC]

All you yelling "nerf Nova" have nothing but words to throw at people who love Nova the way she is. "Nerf this, nerf that, nerf this in particular". SEIZE already offered you a chance to go on a field test and all you do is dodge. When her ult can fire nukes that were thrown at Hiroshima faster than America's democracy delivering rate then I believe she need a nerf.

I earlier I said this as part of a longer post that was totally ignored by the Nova players

Usually how all these threads end, is the Nova players start making yes no insult comments, this starts a back and forth that gets the thread locked...which is what they want to happen. Nova is the elephant in the room that they want us all to ignore

Here is the first one, where cogent discussion is not possible and all facts and discussion are conveniently ignored. We are also being told that we're all nerf this, Nerf that etc.. Whan in fact our discussion is specifically about Nova and molecular prime in particular. they are not just "words to throw at people", it is how we feel, it is factual and it is not fun for other players.

The triple whammy of massive slow, huge debuff and chained explosions (all active for a huge 60s), with one of the biggest AOEs in the game, ability to cast while previous one is still active and a very fast casting time that can be done in all situations including midair! On a frame whose abilities are almost all unaffected by corrupted mods. This isn't discussed.

Edited January 28, 2014 by DaveC

[LukeAura]

replied in quote ^

effectiveness=/= function. Function, what it does. Effectiveness, how good it is at doing so. Where does effectiveness start to impede function?Where does the effect become so bad it can not be used as intended? 

Say there is some kind of theoretical numerical test that determines the level of power of each ability. Nova's M prime scored an 85%(Entirely hypothetical, it starts wherever you want it to.). Good, but not 101%(Screw you curve ruiners), at what values of range/slow/damage boost/explosion damage/explosion range does that 85% become a 51%? 

[Xana_Skullsunder]

I earlier I said this as part of a longer post that was totally ignored by the Nova players

Usually how all these threads end, is the Nova players start making yes no insult comments, this starts a back and forth that gets the thread locked...which is what they want to happen. Nova is the elephant in the room that they want us all to ignore

Here is the first one, where cogent discussion is not possible and all facts and discussion are conveniently ignored. We are also being told that we're all nerf this, Nerf that etc.. Whan in fact our discussion is specifically about Nova and molecular prime in particular. they are not just "words to throw at people", it is how we feel, it is factual and it is not fun for other players.

The triple whammy of massive slow, huge debuff and chained explosions (all active for a huge 60s), with one of the biggest AOEs in the game, ability to cast while previous one is still active and a very fast casting time that can be done in all situations including midair! On a frame whose abilities are almost all unaffected by corrupted mods. This isn't discussed.

 

Nova threads in a nutshell. I'm hoping, with this pointed out that there can actually be some discussion, rather than everything boiling down to "you're wrong, and a meanie."

[-CM-Syein]

I earlier I said this as part of a longer post that was totally ignored by the Nova players

Usually how all these threads end, is the Nova players start making yes no insult comments, this starts a back and forth that gets the thread locked...which is what they want to happen. Nova is the elephant in the room that they want us all to ignore

Here is the first one, where cogent discussion is not possible and all facts and discussion are conveniently ignored. We are also being told that we're all nerf this, Nerf that etc.. Whan in fact our discussion is specifically about Nova and molecular prime in particular. they are not just "words to throw at people", it is how we feel, it is factual and it is not fun for other players.

The triple whammy of massive slow, huge debuff and chained explosions (all active for a huge 60s), with one of the biggest AOEs in the game, ability to cast while previous one is still active and a very fast casting time that can be done in all situations including midair! On a frame whose abilities are almost all unaffected by corrupted mods. This isn't discussed.

if you talking abut last Nova topic, someone already pointed out to you that you ignored most of my valid points. Any one who read the full topic would know what I mean. 

 

And you also ignored it when I said: "let go test it out" 

Hey, I did offer a chance here, TO TEST OUT NOVA. Seriously no one actually take on that offer. Now, who's the one making yes no insult comments. 

 

You said that I keep quoting people. Well, let me tell you, the reason why I quote people is because they are actual facts and evidences that this points had been addressed.

Also, I'm too lazy to type out the same thing over and over again, so quoting is the fastest way to do it. 

[-CM-Syein]

effectiveness=/= function. Function, what it does. Effectiveness, how good it is at doing so. Where does effectiveness start to impede function?Where does the effect become so bad it can not be used as intended? 

Say there is some kind of theoretical numerical test that determines the level of power of each ability. Nova's M prime scored an 85%(Entirely hypothetical, it starts wherever you want it to.). Good, but not 101%(Screw you curve ruiners), at what values of range/slow/damage boost/explosion damage/explosion range does that 85% become a 51%? 

So what are you trying to address here? 

The fact that Nova weak in certain situation does not change, likewise, the fact that she's a team player does not change/ 

As I said before, if no other frames beside Nova exist, this won't turn into a "nerf" table. 

 

Regarding range, different frames use different range, as I already explain:

-Range is not an argument, here's why: Range contributed differently to different frames. 

Nyx's chaos, Rhino's stomp, shield polarize etc all had the same range as molecular prime (25)

Range can be a disadvantage. Can you imagine a frost having 25m range for snowglobe? How can he protect himself with that ridiculous range while his power is solely for def? 

Vauban's range affect his power strength to hang mobs, so having range doesn't mean it will give him absolute advantage. 

Some abilities doesn't required range, trinity's blessing, renewal, rhino's roar etc, such power had no need for range, it immediately effective no matter where you are. Basically, infinite range. 

Given m-prime with such dps, she still die a lot in some situation where some frames are totally at ease. Loki's invisibility and ash's smoke screen are such example. 

Why is she not a top pick for nightmare mission? Answer is quite obvious

Why is she not a top pick for solo? Obvious answer. 

[-CM-Syein]

but there's 18 frames or so to buff that way instead of nerrfing one :D

 

I would say that removing slow effect and duration to 30 sec is a good way to nerf it without affecting Ulti itself, It still kill everything. and until mobs get to lvl 50 it's so annoying that they r slowly walking to the pod(IMHO) :D

Just because something is easy, doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. 

 

Also, there are less than 18 frames to buff  

I can list tons of reason how mag, nova, vauban, rhino, and trinity are on par with each other. 

The only problem with mag is that she a specialized of only one faction. Put mag vs corpus and she will be better than Nova in that regard. 

[Killerdude8]

2x Damage Dealt to enemies, Check.

Halved speed, and at the same time, Halved DPS, Check.

Chain reaction that can clear small nations in a matter of miliseconds, Check.

Can be cast for 25 energy at NO negative costs, Check.

Can be recast while still active, Check.

Has the Largest AoE of any other Ult, Check.

 

All the while Completely out doing EVERY damage frame in the game.

 

"But she is TOTALLY balanced."

 

 

 

 

[-CM-Syein]

 

 

 

 

 

-everything is an issue if you look at things at low level range. So basically anything, any aoe, any ults. Now, not only frames, even weapons can do it. Penta, Ogris, ignis, etc 

Did anyone notice that Frames that not on par with Nova are often those having their power NOT scale?

Why is Nova, Rhino, Nyx, Loki, Trinity etc, are considered useful for end game? Because their power scale. Yes, Nova dps is above all, but she is a damage frame.

So what? You wanted all frames to have the same damage power? If that is the case then we don't need any combination of frames being group together.

So basically 4 lokis, 4 trinities, 4 novas, 4 rhinos etc can just finish the missions for a long period of time without even need any other frames.

This is a game where one frame good in this area and the another good in other.

Trinity is best for support/ heal, Frost/Vauban/ Nyx for def, Rhino for tank, and Nova is damage.  That's their role.

 I really love the ignorance of people who only concentrated on damage, damage, and damage, without considered other areas of the game.

If damage is everything, we wouldn't need missions such as defense and survival.

In my experiences, power that doesn't scale doesn't last long in survival and def. Eventually it'll become completely useless. Volt, Saryn, and Ember are such frames.

 Just because a frames is considered no fun at low lvl, doesnt mean that frame should be nerf. And this is something people need to keep in mind. I could spam ember WoF in low lvl mission and kill every mobs in my way faster than Nova. Because Nova power is stationary/ no duration, while ember's power is mobility/ effect by duration, so talk about low level- mid lvl, anyone could spam.

 -Range is not an argument, here's why: Range contributed differently to different frames.

Nyx's chaos, Rhino's stomp, shield polarize etc all had the same range as molecular prime (25)

Range can be a disadvantage. Can you imagine a frost having 25m range for snowglobe? How can he protect himself with that ridiculous range while his power is solely for def?

Vauban's range affect his power strength to hang mobs, so having range doesn't mean it will give him absolute advantage.

Some abilities doesn't required range, trinity's blessing, renewal, rhino's roar etc, such power had no need for range, it immediately effective no matter where you are. Basically, infinite range.

Given m-prime with such dps, she still die a lot in some situation where some frames are totally at ease. Loki's invisibility and ash's smoke screen are such example.

Why is she not a top pick for nightmare mission? Answer is quite obvious

Why is she not a top pick for solo? Obvious answer.

 

And as I said before, when you compare something, you don't compare only damage. Did you read my post where I said: what if a rhino had the same dps as Nova? A tank, good in survival, low lvl and mid lvl can't get past iron skin (2nd skill), high damage buff, and now what if you add Nova's dps in Rhino? Now what about giving Nova's damage to Trinity? Ok that sound so ridiculous, but is it sound ridiculus on Nova? I don't think so.

 Yes, Nova's power is for end game.

However, her survival/solo/def abilities are not for end game. There are tons of other frames that could do survival/ solo/ def way better than Nova.

 Trinity's support ability/ survival is for end game | Likewise, Nova is for damage

Rhino's nuke mobs, and his dps buff is for end game| likewise Nova is for damage

Mag's power scale against corpus, she is better at dps and survival against corpus better than Nova, Mag is for corpus at end game| likewise Nova is for damage.

Frost/ Vauban is for infinite def until limited, so their def abilities are for end game| likewise Nova is for damage.

In a game, things that blinded people are damage.

If I ask majority of players regarding what char they would choose in game. They will likely ask something similar to this: "What char deal the most damage?" without any regards for the char's survival abilities.

If we take one thing to balance the other out, weaknesses made up for one strong point. It is balance.

Nova just happened to be that damage frame.

 

I try to summarize most of my point, it still end up so long

Beside, are we even reach end game yet? This is still in Beta isn't it? My...

 

and no one take on the experiment of going to survival run together to see who's better. Isn't it because deep down inside, Nova can't match other frames in that aspect.

 

If an arguments doesn't come at a conclusion, the only choice is to experience it ourselves. I'm available, I'm open, who'll go with me. 

[Cwierz]

I really do not get why you spam the same posts over and over again, even though they have been fully refuted.

 

I am literally at the point where I wish the game was never taken to open beta just because we have to many people who don't realize this is a beta for the purpose of feedback, or really shouldn't be beta testers because they don't cut it. Keep in mind I wasn't even in the closed beta either.

 

Luke, I feel sorry that you have to reply to that post, and killer, I feel even more sorry.

[LukeAura]

 

So what are you trying to address here? 

 

Nothing, and at the same time, everything. It's just an idea of mine of determining how strong a frame is by seeing how much it would take to make a player consider it weak, without fundamentally changing anything about the abilities, just the numbers. And since most people think most other frames aren't that strong to begin with, and no one is really making threads about nerfing Rhino, I'm hijacking this thread, and saddling it up as my majestic guinea pig steed. 

It's a simple question, how much can you strip from her abilities before they stop functioning. As I stated before this wasn't about whether or not if Nova needed a nerf. I don't really care. There is nothing to say on the topic that Nova does or does not need a nerf here or Nova does or does not need a nerf there, because that isn't the topic I'm talking about.

I'm asking about the theoretical situation in which she does get nerfed, where would the point be in which it hits her too hard. 

Hurm. Essentially do to Nova's powers what DE did to Overheat. 

From 70%->40%->health only buff(Effectively half, for the sake simplicity)20%(Or less, likely less, just doing some quick calcs and the difference).

Overheat was still kind of usable when it was a 40% buff, and became completely useless when it only applied to health. What would it take to do that to Nova's abilities? 

[Xana_Skullsunder]

-snip-

 

First off, this not an argument. This is a bloody /wall/. You're not encouraging discussion with this, you're just bludgeoning your opponent with words until he goes away. Because that's what you want. That's why Nova discussions all get locked. You don't want discussion.

[Cwierz]

you're just bludgeoning your opponent with words until he goes away.

Beautiful, I shed a tear whilst reading this.

 

But in on topicness towards Luke.

 

I believe that M Prime will loose its function if the damage multiplier or base is manipulated. However, base function is not affected by the removal of the slowdown, so if a nerf was to be placed I vote on removing slowdown completely (uneeded and unfair), and reducing the duration, to however long chaos lasts at base.

[shut]

Beautiful, I shed a tear whilst reading this.

 

But in on topicness towards Luke.

 

I believe that M Prime will loose its function if the damage multiplier or base is manipulated. However, base function is not affected by the removal of the slowdown, so if a nerf was to be placed I vote on removing slowdown completely (uneeded and unfair), and reducing the duration, to however long chaos lasts at base.

Well, frankly, if we removed the 2x damage debuff entirely and just doubled the damage of each explosion, that would keep the explosions the same while removing the unnecessary Bishop-level support skill.

Edited January 29, 2014 by SortaRandom

[Ohmlink]

Why not just buff other Warframes and make their abilities useful and scale well? Nerfing Nova does not fix nor improve anything in the long run. 

This ^ more than anything, even Nova's damage dies off at some point.

 

ALL Offensive abilities need to scale with enemies. Only a part of the damage calculation has to be percentage based. A skill that does 300 damage as well as 15% would do 450 damage against a target with 1000 hp. As levels get higher the skill would scale with enemies, but not become either OP or useless at lowerlevels due to the fixed value.

 

This would get the game so much closer to actually sort of balancing out offensive powers to CC powers.

[-CM-Syein]

I really do not get why you spam the same posts over and over again, even though they have been fully refuted.

 

I am literally at the point where I wish the game was never taken to open beta just because we have to many people who don't realize this is a beta for the purpose of feedback, or really shouldn't be beta testers because they don't cut it. Keep in mind I wasn't even in the closed beta either.

 

Luke, I feel sorry that you have to reply to that post, and killer, I feel even more sorry.

this is feedback and what I'm saying is also feedback. If you don't like it then don't read it, the reason why I re-quote is because I don't want to reply the same thing over and over again. 

 

If you think you have the right to post feedback, so am I. I don't get your frustration when what I did and what you did is no differences. 

[SolarDwagon]

Well, frankly, if we removed the 2x damage debuff entirely and just doubled the damage of each explosion, that would keep the explosions the same while removing the unnecessary Bishop-level support skill.

How about no, no and no.

Abilities with nothing but damage are terrible, and are the main reason various frames are regarded as "not end-game" material.

 

As stated in my previous post, although not in the same way, any nerf to Molecular Prime should not take away the usefulness at high levels-which is the damage multiplier and the speed debuff. At level 50+ (unless you use BR in which case it's far FAR less spammable), the explosions are insignificant on even light units-although a max range build can catch units in overlapping blasts, which can maintain chain damage for longer than base damage.

 

Another thing to consider-Yes, corrupted mods are part of the game... but what about those who have bad RNG luck with it? What about those who are too new to have access to the Derelicts, which are considerably higher difficulty and level than even when corrupted mods were first released? How will THEIR experience of Nova be without these mods?

Most of the discussion in here is using MPrime as a 25 energy skill to justify their points-there are situations, like the above, where this is impossible for a player.

[-CM-Syein]

First off, this not an argument. This is a bloody /wall/. You're not encouraging discussion with this, you're just bludgeoning your opponent with words until he goes away. Because that's what you want. That's why Nova discussions all get locked. You don't want discussion.

I find it amusing that what you did and those other might as well be the same as what I did. 

 

If you look at my post, may I ask one question, where is it that I post that doesn't include any reason why Nova shouldn't be nerf, excepted post that reply to post such as yours. 

 

So are you saying that posting a bloody wall is wrong? Why? This is an argument, it doesn't matter how long the paragraph is, as long as it have my points. 

 

Reason why Nova discussion is block before someone said, you're right, you're wrong, back and forth without any explaination nor true feedback. 

If you look at my posts again, I list every reasons, facts, things that Nova will be at disadvantage and advantage depend on situations compared with other frames. By no mean I said things such as :"You're wrong, I am right etc etc" 

 

"you're just bludgeoning your opponent with words until he goes away." Speak for yourself and other people who replied to my post before you blaming me, hypocrite.

 

 

I'm done with this topic. 

The one who get to make the decisions is DE. This is their game, they must have already test Nova, test other frames, and made the decisions of release her frame.

If you or I feel that the game is not fair by developers decisions, leaving the game is one of the option. The other is giving feedbacks. That just how it is. There's no point in ridicules someone by them not having the same opinions as yours. Like what you did to me.