The Orokin, The Grineer, The Corpus - Their Place In Orokin Era Of Human Society

[Agent_of_Change]

I think that we are reading way to much into scraps of information and then looking for other scraps to confirm what we as individuals already believe to be the case.

 

I mean in general what i accept at this point is thath the Orikin existed, the tenno were is some way created by/from them, the Orokin had crazy advanced tech, the orokin went to war with "the sentients", The orokin empire is responsible for unleashing the technocyte plague (and therefore the infested) during that war, the orokin empire collapsed, the tenno played some role (apparently active?) in the fall of Orokin society.

 

BREAK

 

An undetermined amount of time (apparently a looooong time) The grineer and Corpus have risen and created warring empires each striving to own the solar system.  They both are largely ignorant of the Tenno's origins and Orokin technology.  One treats it almost mystically, the other hit's it with wrenches until it works or blows up.  (I can't help but be reminded of WH40k's Ordos Mechanicum and Orks respectively in some striking respects) Neither are particularly fond of the Tenno.  The grineer have some cause for continous cloning from degrading source material that is yet to be fully explained.

 

Basically my take away from that is that the only real direct thread from the "then" to the "now" is the Tenno themselves.  What I draw from the sketch of a narrative above is that while the Grineer and Corpus may well be descended from the remnants of the peoples of the Orokin Empire so much time past from the fall to the their rising dominance that they have forgotten more than they know now as cultures.  Think of the fall of the Orokin empire as beginning a solar system wide dark age of in determinant length from which the grineer and corpus empires only arose from various survivor groups because they managed to wrangle enough power to do so.

[GamingEntity]

Interesting point of view. We will never know for certain, but at least this provides food for thought.

 

Theory crafting is meant to be "wrong" or "weakly supported".  Not every hypothesis is perfect off the bat; over time it can be supported with more observations and facts. As of now we are not certain of anything the OP is presenting to us, however we can not say that OP is entirely wrong; there might be a few things that could be plausible yet it requires more evidence and observations.  Given the current state of lore presented to us it would make sense that each and everyone of us can come to conclusions like this; which means that we have enough info, presented to us, to craft ideas and to fill in the blanks.  In my mind this is what we are suppose to be doing.

 

Overall this sounds like a good base line to work off of.  This, as well as other crafted works, could be coupled together to created an even sturdier backing to the history of Warframe.

[NevanChambers]

Very few things we can know for certain.

However, with the Corpus, as you say, it is the most likely scenario.

The Grineer... the game makes it pretty clear right off the bat that they are lusting for Orokin Tech just as much as the Corpus (it is the reason why Captain Vor and Sargas Ruk exist after all). While we can't say for certain, I think it is pretty safe to assume that at least their weaponry is based on Orokin technology - the existence of Braton, Latron and Burston Prime tells us that the Orokin did use both ballistic weaponry and energy-based weaponry.

Aren't all of those ballistic? Though they definately made laser traps so that supports your theory.

OT I dunno I think that enough time has passed since the fall that it's unlikely you could trace any kind of direct line to what they once were based on what they are now.

Edited March 21, 2014 by NevanChambers

[Silvershadow66]

Pretty much all technology (Grineer and Corpus alike) is reverse-engineered from ancient Orokin technology. This most likely includes Grineer cloning technology (and is why the clones are getting worse and worse each generation; the Grineer don't fully understand how it works in order to repair the problem).

 

I  agree that this is a far more likely explanation. My thoughts are:

 

The Grineer were originally soldiers for the Orokin in the war against the Sentients (but were not up to the task).

The Corpus were originally the technicians and engineers who worked for the Orokin in the more mundane areas.

 

Neither group knew much about the science behind Orokin tech other than how to use it on a day to day basis. After the Collapse both groups started trying to understand how to make the technology they had been using, but without the Orokin it would be a long and difficult process. Taking many centuries to advance to the point where they are now does not seem unreasonable and it would also explain why the Grineer seem to be more recent players in the Solar System domination game, if they were relying on using Orokin cloning tech without being able to build new facilities it would have limited their numbers until they got past that tech barrier.

Edited March 21, 2014 by Silvershadow66

[Silvershadow66]

Without knowing ANYTHING ELSE. Yes, I can. It's a logical assumption, just as I can assume future trees will grow the same way in the future as they do today.

 

No, you can't and its not. Considering that science has only just reached the point where we can now make DNA from scratch and insert it into a cell to make a brand new species it is obvious that there could be a lot more advances in cloning technology to come.

 

If DNA can be manufactured from scratch then degradation would not be an issue. The degradation seems to come from the Grineer trying to improve the cloning process without fully understanding the science behind it.

Edited March 21, 2014 by Silvershadow66

[Morec0]

No, you can't and its not. Considering that science has only just reached the point where we can now make DNA from scratch and insert it into a cell to make a brand new species it is obvious that there could be a lot more advances in cloning technology to come.

 

If DNA can be manufactured from scratch then degradation would not be an issue. The degradation seems to come from the Grineer trying to improve the cloning process without fully understanding the science behind it.

 

*raises eyebrow skeptically*

 

Source?

 

But if this is true: GO SCIENCE! And, as I said: I'll have been proven wrong and retract my statements and apologize to you, Bri.

[Silvershadow66]

*raises eyebrow skeptically*

 

Source?

 

But if this is true: GO SCIENCE! And, as I said: I'll have been proven wrong and retract my statements and apologize to you, Bri.

 

Venter and his team used the genome of an existing bacteria as a template but the genome was built from scratch rather than cloned. So cloning from a template is basically what they did and a new species is now technically possible as well.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/science/2010/may/20/craig-venter-synthetic-life-form

Edited March 21, 2014 by Silvershadow66

[Morec0]

Venter and his team used the genome of an existing bacteria as a template but the genome was built from scratch rather than cloned. So cloning from a template is basically what they did and a new species is now technically possible as well.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/science/2010/may/20/craig-venter-synthetic-life-form

 

 

 

I win.

 

Brimir's post taken from a different thread because I feel it applies here.

 

I apologize, Bri, for my ignorance and arrogance... Looking back and everything, I've been wobbling between a few different ideas myself seemingly JUST for the case of argument... Now I feel like an A******, and I apologize for being an A******. I think there is still a possibility that the genetic material has been damaged as time progressed for one reason or another, but malfunctioning technology is very much a root cause of it.

[Morec0]

Just heard this on the Rhegor assassination: Lotus says that the genetic degeneration is due to excessive cloning. Not 100% sure what that means, but sounds like they HAVE been overusing their base material somehow - rather than it being due to lack of understanding about technology.

Edited March 27, 2014 by Morec0

[Silvershadow66]

 

 

Brimir's post taken from a different thread because I feel it applies here.

 

I apologize, Bri, for my ignorance and arrogance... Looking back and everything, I've been wobbling between a few different ideas myself seemingly JUST for the case of argument... Now I feel like an A******, and I apologize for being an A******. I think there is still a possibility that the genetic material has been damaged as time progressed for one reason or another, but malfunctioning technology is very much a root cause of it.

 

 

No worries. And kudos for apologising.

 

In science news today its just been announced that the first truly artificial chromosome has been inserted into yeast cells, a technique that could allow bio-engineering of yeast to produce a variety of new substances such as medicines.

[arch111]

Note the Grineer came out of nowhere, a flood of clones of clones, swallowing colonies whole.

They guarded Terminus, the place of the Massacre. The hope was to prevent the deadly Tenno to ever come back.

They failed. Vor has a clue, he found a Key and went into the Void.

he tries to learn the secrets of old.

Vor may be very old.

The queens hate the Tenno like the plague.

Corpus knew about Orokin, Tenno and the Rails. I think they are doing what they did for the Empire, service and maintenance.

The Orokin were cold and cruel, thought themselves Gods maby.

They lived surrounded by machines and servants, engineering the world at a whim.

They finally met an enemy that could use their technology, they lost the upper hand.

In response they engineered an army of clones, launching them at the aware and very emotional enemy.

A enemy we call the Infested. Of course, they were not monsters then, that came later.

They took children of the enemy, exposing them to the void. In time they became Tenno.

Mindcontrol and mothering by Lotus kept them on a leach.

In the end, the children of the enemy ended the cold rule of Tyrants.

The remnants fought and then the Tenno hid.

Explains why no trace exist of Sentients, they became the Infested.

Sorry for thery madness :p

[OniDax]

The infested are not clones. The Lotus is against the Orokin. She told the Tenno to eliminate the Orokin to maintain balance. This is from leaked datamined in-game text.

[Morec0]

The infested are not clones. The Lotus is against the Orokin. She told the Tenno to eliminate the Orokin to maintain balance. This is from leaked datamined in-game text.

 

That so? Can you link that again? I missed that bit... or has it been taken down by now.

 

 

But I'm going to take a moment to add and addendum to that (because this is how I feel): even though the Lotus SAID we need to do it for balance (apparently) that doesn't MEAN WE ALL did it for balance. It could be that many Tenno used that as an excuse for revenge, or stood back and decided not to help or hinder their fellow Tenno in the act (if for whatever reason you're UPSET we killed the Orokin, weirdo), but that would be up to the player to decide what they did or did not do.

 

I just say this for RP/personal story purposes. Carry on everyone else.