Release Excalibur, Lato, Skana Prime To Public, Give Founders Something Else.

[CY13ERPUNK]

i kinda view this like the abortion issue (the irony of a bunch of men debating on women's rights to their own bodies)

OP is obviously GM however, so i think its a valid discussion

DE could simply send out an email poll to all Hunter/Masters/GM's and gauge public opinion on the subject

if a majority of the Hunter/Master/GM's founders agreed to "unlock" Excal/Skana/Lato prime in some way, then so be it, DE could always design another exclusive cosmetic for them: helmet, skin, syandana, etc

myself personally, im glad i bought the founder pack i did, sure i would like to have gotten DC/skana/lato but i couldnt tolerate the steep price, but i was glad to support DE with $50

but it also wouldn't break my heart if DE opened up excal prime to others through another means (ie prime access, etc, etc) as long as they let me vote and gave me some other swag as well

Edited February 26, 2014 by CY13ERPUNK

[ZeroPhobic]

In a few months people are going to be on these boards saying "I didn't get the prime access cape when it was out, I know it is exclusive to that pack, but I want it now and am willing to farm or whatever. Can we give the prime access people something else, so I can have the cape now?"

The next paid exclusive is set to roll out soon too, I'm sure. Without fail a few months after that closes the same thing and on and on. If you missed it you missed it. We all miss items now and again, but they are only digital shiny things, there will be hundreds more, forget the founders exclusives, they are gone!

[xZARAx]

As much as I would like a Skana Prime. LIMITED EDITION, is Limited. You didn't get it when it was available, unfortunate, maybe in a year or 2 they will give you a little deal

[fatpig84]

If DE release Founder Prime Gear, this is going to set a very bad precedent.

Even the haloed Lato and Braton Vandal aren't safe.

 

So I am not even sure what DE can do to appease a lot of the Masters / Grand Masters.

 

Re-usable potato bps ?
Why do I need it when I got like 8 to 10 potatoes already built (both Catalyst and reactors each) and sitting unused ?

 

Give us that Prime access scarf or prime access extractor ?

I can imagine the rage of Prime access users.

 

Or another special snowflakes item ?

Again more rage and people whining for it.

Edited February 26, 2014 by fatpig84

[Tsukinoki]

@fatpig84

Giving us the Prime Access scarf and extractor isn't really an option, what would they do for the founders that bought the prime access pack?

But you do have it right: no matter what DE gives us people will throw a fit and whinge about it. Especially considering how impressive the cosmetics would have to be in order to be worth the 250$ the GMs put into the game.

I mean, people threw fits that a scarf was only available to the highest level prime access pack as an exclusive item there. If they gave us enough cosmetics to be worth the money us founders have put in I wouldn't want to be on the forums at all for the long time it would take for all of the rage threads by all the non-founders to die down.

And I agree with you that it would set a horrible precedent.

Currently DE is doing very well sticking to their word and being trustworthy in regards to the founders stuff, I I believe that they would lose a lot of respect from the people who pay in the most money into this game if they renege on the deal they gave us.

[Llyssa]

I personally don't mind non-founders adding input one way or the other. 

 

I gotta say though, if your cause here is trying to get prime release, you are not helping your cause.  You'd require a considerable level of support from the founders for this to even dream of happening.  Such blatant self interest with no concern for the people who'd be losing out is likely to sway support against the re-issue, just cause it comes across as almost insulting.

Well, personally, it bothers me because it makes it hard to piece through. I mean, there's pages with 1 founder post(the OP) on it, and tons and tons of non-founders clamoring about it.

 

I'd much prefer to be able to read "people who actually own the things being discussed" with ease. Every post that isn't in that subset is unneeded spam.

 

It's a 14 page thread that should be honestly closer to 2. You can't readily barometer ~300 posts for consensus when 80% of them are people who don't actually get a say on the subject. It's far too much work for something that is currently settled as "an official 'hell no' has already been given by the dev team".

 

If it was just the founders affected posting, that'd make it easier to see/sort through.

 

Basically, it boils down to "at least some founders affected agree with the dev team". Gleaning anything beyond that is far too much hassle.

 

Amusingly enough, if it *was* only the founders affected posting, it would be easier to discern what level of support it has, but, potentially, prove that there's enough support to try and change it. So all of the non-founders posting are really shooting themselves in the foot here.

 

So, it will stay as-is.

[OniDax]

Problem with this is that the Founders already have something else. That's the exclusive Founders Prime items compared to the rest of the standard items that the non-Founders have. You give the Founders exclusives to the public, and give something else to the Founders, and you'll repeat this whole cycle of "It's not fair. You have something I don't have". The bigger issue isn't that people want Excalibur Prime. It's that Founders have something they don't have and cannot obtain. That doesn't change if you give Founders something else. The Founders would still have something that no one else can get. So this isn't a solution. Although I do think that, given that DE gets money outside of the Prime Access, when you've paid the equivalent amount of money to buy platinum as you need to get each level of Prime Access, you should automatically get the items. Then it becomes a reward for putting money into the game (because the money of people who paid into the game just to get platinum is worth no less than that of those who buy the Prime Access).

 

To better explain, everyone should be paying into Prime Access when they purchase platinum. If I pay $50 to purchase platinum (or a number of payments that equal $50), I should be rewarded with the two prime weapons. When I've paid $30 more ($80 total), I should be rewarded with the Prime Warframe, avatars, and the miscellaneous equipment item (for the first iteration, that was the Titan Extractor Prime). When I've paid $60 more, for $140 total, I should be rewarded with the boosters and syandana (or whatever will replace it, hopefully a sentinel).

 

If you pay within a certain Prime Access rotation, you get the reward for that rotation (for the first one, Ember Prime and that). If you start paying and get some of the rewards, and then it crosses over into the new cycle, then you'd only get the new items you would've gotten if you'd just been paying in the new cycle. So if Tuesday (yesterday) you'd paid $50 to get the 1050 platinum, Sicarus Prime and Glaive Prime, and today you pay $30, then you would only receive the 1050 platinum, the new Prime Warframe, avatars, and the equipment item. You wouldn't receive the new Prime weapons. You would pay $60 to get to the highest level of the current Prime Access, and then you'd have to pay $50 again during that current cycle to get the new Prime weapons and the 1050 platinum. If you pay the highest level for a current cycle within that cycle, then when you pay more that would qualify for the next. If you pay the equivalent of two or more cycles, then the rewards would carry over into other cycles. DE might lose money at first, because you might have some who might spend $140 on platinum, and then $140 on Prime Access, but that'd level out. Also, if you in essence "pre-pay" the Prime Access, you wouldn't have to wait until a new cycle to get the platinum for that cycle. You'd get that immediately when you pay. Not only that, but given you're paying for platinum and getting extra rewards, I'd say that the platinum price would be slightly lower, say 900 or 950 instead of the 1000 for just the platinum or the 1050 that comes with the Prime Access.

 

In that way you don't slight those who've put money into the game, even if they haven't purchased the Prime Access. Also, in that way, you don't have the issue of not having the money to pay for Prime Access and missing out on stuff because you never have enough when needed. You'd be guaranteed to get an exclusive item if you put your hard-earned cash into the game. You support the devs and you get a reward for doing so.

Edited February 26, 2014 by AntoineFlemming

[ObviousLee]

snip*

i can kinda agree with what you got going here, although in terms of founder exclusives i would still have to say they need to pay what you and i, and every other GM paid. and buying platinum for prime access? i disagree with because if you want prime access, thats what you have to pay for. iirc you get platinum along with the prime access, but im not certain on that. point is, you get what you pay for, and you pay for what you get.

 

im open to people paying what we paid for, but buying platinum and getting prime gear out of it just doesn't seem like a good idea to me, but i could very well be wrong.

[DreadScourge]

so you're willing to spend 250 dollars i take it?

I would assume that people who bought the package were doing so for the ability to vote on features to be implemented in the game and to have their name on the star map, not a primed pistol.

 

I just want the pistol.

[Phatose]

I'm pretty sure you don't get to assume in things like this.

[ObviousLee]

I would assume that people who bought the package were doing so for the ability to vote on features to be implemented in the game and to have their name on the star map, not a primed pistol.

 

I just want the pistol.

and the pistol came with the package. package deal. you want the pistol, had to buy the WHOLE PACKAGE.

[Tsukinoki]

@DreadScourge
You would be surprised.
My brother only bought the highest level because of the exclusive pistol.  If it wasn't for the exclusive primed pistol he would have passed it up.

I bought it to support the game and for the pistol.  The voting is nice, but that is no longer exclusive to founders, and as I mentioned before the solar landmarks are pretty much un-noticed by the vast majority of players who honestly couldn't care less about a small ticker-tape of names.

I would even hazard the guess that the reason that a lot of the Ms and GMs bought the package was first and foremost the exclusive gear, the other stuff was just small nice additions to it, icing on the cake really.

Further the pistol was part of a packaged deal.  You cant just single out part of the package that you want, you would have to pay the full price of 250$.

Also dont assume.
You know what they say right?
When you assume you make an &#! of you and me.
Though in this case you would have to leave out the 'and me' section....

Edited February 27, 2014 by Tsukinoki

[Zinthir]

It's not often to see a Grandmaster Founder advocating the release of Founder exclusive gear to the non-Founders.

It's just because he wants something useful. If the founder's items were good, I'd like to see what this guy's stance on the matter would be.

[OniDax]

i can kinda agree with what you got going here, although in terms of founder exclusives i would still have to say they need to pay what you and i, and every other GM paid. and buying platinum for prime access? i disagree with because if you want prime access, thats what you have to pay for. iirc you get platinum along with the prime access, but im not certain on that. point is, you get what you pay for, and you pay for what you get.

 

im open to people paying what we paid for, but buying platinum and getting prime gear out of it just doesn't seem like a good idea to me, but i could very well be wrong.

 

Well you do get platinum with it. You get a little bit more platinum than you would just paying for platinum. What I suggested would work. But right now it kind of slights those who pay for platinum yet don't get the packs. I think they're deserving of something as well.

[--MANA--]

I'm against this simply because this is what was promised in the package and also Warframe could get sued for false advertising, there are thousands of Grand masters out there and the only way for this to work is probably to have all of them agree to this.

[Nitresco]

Would've gladly handed DE an additional 100 back then IF I didn't need it for food, bills, etc. Financial situations aren't always friendly towards what you want.

 

Exclusives should stay exclusives, though I won't object to people who've already bought founders getting a second chance to upgrade ranks. I would shell out that extra 100 now in a heartbeat, personally.

[--MANA--]

Problem with this is that the Founders already have something else. That's the exclusive Founders Prime items compared to the rest of the standard items that the non-Founders have. You give the Founders exclusives to the public, and give something else to the Founders, and you'll repeat this whole cycle of "It's not fair. 

 

-snippy snappy-

This is actually true and I can see this happening if this ever happens to founders package. it's a violent cycle that will be hard to stop once it begins.

[Lumireaver]

You give the Founders exclusives to the public, and give something else to the Founders, and you'll repeat this whole cycle of "It's not fair. You have something I don't have". The bigger issue isn't that people want Excalibur Prime. It's that Founders have something they don't have and cannot obtain. That doesn't change if you give Founders something else.

 

Missing the point. Founders have exclusive Primes, part of a series which non-Founders can't complete.

 

If they as much as renamed Exal Prime into Excal Origin then released a new, different Excal Prime, everything would be sweet for everyone.

[Jaysus41]

I honestly don't care if non-founders get Excalibur, Skana, and Lato prime, and i wouldn't mind if they gave us some cosmetic in exchange for their exclusiveness taken away, like a syandana for our sentinel or something.

 

I'm happy enough with my Grand Master badge personally.

[OniDax]

Missing the point. Founders have exclusive Primes, part of a series which non-Founders can't complete.

 

If they as much as renamed Exal Prime into Excal Origin then released a new, different Excal Prime, everything would be sweet for everyone.

 

No, it wouldn't. Because you still end up with something not everyone else has. You still end up with an exclusive item which everyone else can't get. That's not sweet for everyone.

[Lumireaver]

No, it wouldn't. Because you still end up with something not everyone else has. You still end up with an exclusive item which everyone else can't get. That's not sweet for everyone.

 

As long as the exclusive Founders things weren't part of an ongoing series it wouldn't be as imperative. You're framing this as a jealousy thing (IE: "You have things I want.") when it's, for the most part, a completion thing. (IE: "The last 4% of my collection is retired and I can never complete it.")

 

Give Founders something that's actually exclusive (IE: Not a part of a set which is 96% available to everyone) and many of the complaints will be addressed. 

[Tsukinoki]

@Lumireaver

Except people aren't complaining that they cant complete the set of primes for the most part. They are just complaining that there is a frame that they are unable to get and it shows up in their codex.

So no, the fact that they cant complete the prime set of frames and weapons is not the majority of complaints. Its the fact that it shows up in the codex and they can see it but can never get it.

No matter what they rename the founders items to people will always throw a fit because they can see it but they can never get it.

And before they go down any route with changing names or something they first need to change how excal prime looks. I mean its the plainest prime in the game and really needs a graphical overhaul.

[OniDax]

As long as the exclusive Founders things weren't part of an ongoing series it wouldn't be as imperative. You're framing this as a jealousy thing (IE: "You have things I want.") when it's, for the most part, a completion thing. (IE: "The last 4% of my collection is retired and I can never complete it.")

 

Give Founders something that's actually exclusive (IE: Not a part of a set which is 96% available to everyone) and many of the complaints will be addressed. 

 

The Founders items are actually exclusive. They aren't a part of a set that's 96% available to everyone. That's exclusivity.

[Yezzik]

How's this for a tradeoff? Founders get their Codices (that's the plural, I think) filled automatically, past, present and future.

They get all new cosmetic options for free, faster crafting, and unique cosmetic stuff. Their Extractors never lose health, and they can fill the starmap with them.

They have an infinite-duration booster of all types.

Would that be a good enough deal to make everything that gives Mastery available to all players?

[Phatose]

Missing the point. Founders have exclusive Primes, part of a series which non-Founders can't complete.

 

If they as much as renamed Exal Prime into Excal Origin then released a new, different Excal Prime, everything would be sweet for everyone.

 

No, not for everyone.  Things would be sweet solely for a very particular group - collectors who care about having all Primes, but who don't care about having everything.  And founders who care not only about exclusives they paid for, but exclusive Primes they paid for, are out in the cold.

 

The more I think about this whole proposal, the more I see it as an attempt to please a few members of a very specific group at the expensive of a few members of another very specific group.  I don't think I can really back this.