What Frames Need Work, And How Prioritized They Should Be.

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

Based on my experience with several frames, most of them simply lack the utility in their powers, something straight dps increase doesn't address and has lead to the spam 4 to win. I have all of these frames, maxed and potato'd

 

Nekros,

He needs a complete re work, not just a buff. But an overhaul. At the moment he's a mess. There's a very long and good thread on here which goes into great detail about his failings. I won't repeat it here, but the major contributors have put some very good ideas forward.

 

Oberon,

Reckoning, is actually okay, it deals a lot of damage. Dealing radiation damage and impact it's actually very effective against both Grineer and Corpus, just not so much against infested, but why no radiation proc chance? Smite, suffers from what many 1 powers suffer from, complete lack of utility. The bouncing balls? Why? Just switch it to a grenade style AoE which causes ragdoll, slash proc or something. Also why no radiation proc? Renewal, urgh. Why is the HP regen capped at 200? Take it off, there's no point to using Renewal now, also allowing it to revive downed players would make it really worth it, although they can still be subsequently staggered and downed again. So as not to take away from Trinity. HG, needs CC a slow mechanic and a fan shape of 90 degrees in front of Oberon, not a weird rectangle. Also, again why no radiation proc chance?

 

Maybe an buff to armour, but his power's lack of utility is his major flaw. 

 

Rhino,

Powerful, but okay. The Vanguard helm should never have given a 25% speed boost and he should not be attainable on Venus. The frame itself, is reasonable. 

 

Mag, 

The pull, targeting needs to be looser. It's very fiddly to target. I think she's in a reasonable position at the moment. 

 

Nova, 

MP is too all encompassing. The speed debuff of 50% needs to go, it makes chain explosions way too powerful and grants CC to a nuker. AMD, damage multiplier is on the high side, but other than that fine. Null Star, fine. Wormhole please fix the issue where you get moved outside the tile.

 

Volt,

Shock is great, this is how all first powers should be balanced, it has incredible utility. Electric shield should allow shock to be super charged by the 50% electric damage when fired through it, but other than that it's fine, speed is okay at the moment. Overload, in addition to the electric pulse, add 2/3/4 lightning arcs emanating from Volt, which can be blocked by terrain and functions in the same manner as shock with a proc chance of 100% with a 50% damage reduction for targets hit by the AoE. At the moment it's too dependant on the environment and suffers diminishing returns after one use. It currently has the lowest damage of 900 of any Ult power. For a direct damage frame that needs to be addressed, as his powers actually augment gun play, they're not even remotely an alternative.

 

Vauban,

Vortex is a touch on the powerful side but generally he's fine. Infested need greater variety, not Vauban being nerfed. 

 

Valkyr,

Hysteria has issues. Invincibility is cheap, it should give a significant damage reduction, the damage taken should then be mitigated by armour and the hp regen by attacks increased in accordance. Get rid of the claws and let me use my weapons, if they want to keep the claws, then get rid of that god awful floaty stunted attack animation, it's irritating and a pain to target, making Hysteria a chore to use. Currently it's very simple and easy to use as a power. Have you seen what a Rage mod teamed with Hysteria does? It effectively allows one to take damage to increase energy, tap Hysteria, then regen HP and repeat the process. Very boring and little risk to a very powerful combination.

 

Nyx,

She's in a good position at the moment, Psychic bolts could do with ignoring terrain and the targeting being loosened a bit. Absorb, needs a cancel button with the appropriate decrease in damage for the reduced time spent in absorb. 

 

Trinity,

I've recently acquired, but initially thoughts. Change blessing, it's broken and far too formidable. The key issue is also that her powers other than blessing are mediocre at best, with the possible exception of energy vampire, hence everyone uses blessing. Currently blessing is too all encompassing. Hell, it can keep the invincibility, but it should be hard capped not duration based, while HP regen is fine, also no map covering distances please. Well of life could simply be shifted to allow Trinity to revive downed players from a distance and regen hp on a single target based on duration, or allow a team DR, something, it's just currently in limbo at the moment as Blessing is easier and way more effective. 

 

Edit:

 

Oh and Frost. Eurgh. Freeze, is okay, but the targeting needs to be looser, I don't see why it can't be used on a single target, then if the single target subsequently they take an additional damage % for each hit, until the power runs out or they shatter. Ice wave. Okay for now. SG, I'll reserve judgment until the latest SG changes come through on the PS4. Avalanche, I'm not a fan of the look really. I don't like the snowballs, it would be preferable to base it on Ember's fire blast, although not duration based, just the visual being similar for the activation period of 1 sec while it procs and freezes everything in the area, hence I'd prefer it termed blizzard, damage wise is fine as it stands and freezes everything within the vicinity for up to 5 seconds, although it's not immediate and they are required to be within the vicinity for 1/2 seconds although they are subject to the 100% cold proc, Frozen targets receive 100%( or whatever %) additional damage from attacks while they are frozen.

Edited March 19, 2014 by (PS4)billy-d-squid

[Genoscythe]

 

Volt has speed which is amazing, shock is a good stun. He isn't bad at all.

I dunno what trinity needs.

I like desecrate actually. It makes sense and all in my opinion, and can help to offset RNG in surivval

Player involvement should be made with clever reworks.

Volts speed doesnt make him strong in combat, the main element of this game.

 

I didnt say desecrate is bad or weak, its just nothing for nekros, he is in utter need of skills that match his theme, because he is not a death frame at all. Thats why I said move the skill, not remove it completely.

[Monolake]

 make sure to let DE know.

 

 

 

Do you really think DE doesnt know? they dont want to do it for w/e reason.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

I think I agree with everything in the OP...

[cd33]

For Excalibur, All the Radial Javelin needs is Armour ignore dmg much like Ash's Blade Storm. It stays on the theme of offensive balance by not having an awesome damage boost or extremely negative damage reduction against any faction. And of course the limited number Javelins will still exist. Slash Dash needs some way to change its damage type or have it take the element or damage type from your weapon. That way you can mod for it. Slash damage is not versatile enough to warrant "Balanced offense". Radial Blind is Awesome and should not be touched. Super jump is a puzzle to me. I suggest turning it in to an either a offensive melee dmg buff call it "Sharpen" maybe or keep it because it does have its rare moments of usefulness. Maybe let us use it in air or something. Any way those are my Ideas for an awesome Excalibur! 

[Scar.Heart]

Vauban- Completely trivializes an entire faction, it would be more suitable for infested to have something to counter him rather than just nerfing the abilities.

 

Just because CC abilities/elements make Infested a laughable threat doesn't give a good reason (imo) to nerf a CC-oriented frame.

 

If we're making an enemy specifically designed to take Vauban out, I expect every frame to start fearing something designed for the sole purpose of killing them.

Hell, it might encourage staying together with your teammates.

[Thirsty_Pickle]

 

Warframes that need to be nerfed*

Nova

 

 

Ah, no.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Just because CC abilities/elements make Infested a laughable threat doesn't give a good reason (imo) to nerf a CC-oriented frame.

 

If we're making an enemy specifically designed to take Vauban out, I expect every frame to start fearing something designed for the sole purpose of killing them.

Hell, it might encourage staying together with your teammates.

That would actually be really cool...

[Thirsty_Pickle]

That would actually be really cool...

 

Until people start complaining about that specific mob hunting them down over and over and killing them instantly.

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Until people start complaining about that specific mob hunting them down over and over and killing them instantly.

My starter frame was Volt back when chargers were terrifying and Ancients ignored him completely.  They'll live.  And it doesn't have to be a RPC-level counter...

Edited March 18, 2014 by Volt_Cruelerz

[LukeAura]

I think Nova needs a buff to Null Star, and maybe some mod effect adjustment/changes to her entire kit. 
While M prime could use a little toning down, she needs a more rounded out kit in general.

[Thirsty_Pickle]

I think Nova needs a buff to Null Star, and maybe some mod effect adjustment/changes to her entire kit. 

While M prime could use a little toning down, she needs a more rounded out kit in general.

 

Nothing about Nova needs to be nerfed, she's OP because she's frail.

 

[bUT MAXED SHIELDS BLAH BLAH]

 

Unless she's got another frame backing her up, she goes down easily.

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

I think Nova needs a buff to Null Star, and maybe some mod effect adjustment/changes to her entire kit. 

While M prime could use a little toning down, she needs a more rounded out kit in general.

 

It can cause critical hits and they auto target enemies in the vicinity, you want it buffed? It's one of the better 1 powers in the game as it stands. 

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Nothing about Nova needs to be nerfed, she's OP because she's frail.

 

[bUT MAXED SHIELDS BLAH BLAH]

 

Unless she's got another frame backing her up, she goes down easily.

When I play her, I very rarely have difficulty staying alive..  It's hard to die when you killed everything else first...

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

Nothing about Nova needs to be nerfed, she's OP because she's frail.

 

[bUT MAXED SHIELDS BLAH BLAH]

 

Unless she's got another frame backing her up, she goes down easily.

 

Yeah, I wonder what every other frame like Volt, Nyx, Vauban, Nekros etc. who have armour or shields made of tissues and orphan's tears manage, oh that's right, just like Nova, they die when the enemy looks at them.

 

Nova is no more delicate than any of the lighter frames, so please try harder.

[Cwierz]

Just because CC abilities/elements make Infested a laughable threat doesn't give a good reason (imo) to nerf a CC-oriented frame.

 

If we're making an enemy specifically designed to take Vauban out, I expect every frame to start fearing something designed for the sole purpose of killing them.

Hell, it might encourage staying together with your teammates.

I think that would be cool, but it is obvious you don't know/want to acknowledge/dont think highly of how well vauban does against infested. Do an ODD with a vauban in your party. Its insane.

 

I think I agree with everything in the OP...

Well, its great to see you are thinking about agreeing with me.

I guess I will think about thanking you.

:3

 

Do you really think DE doesnt know? they dont want to do it for w/e reason.

I think they do know to an extent, but it isn't their focus or they are afraid to do so.

 

Volts speed doesnt make him strong in combat, the main element of this game.

 

I didnt say desecrate is bad or weak, its just nothing for nekros, he is in utter need of skills that match his theme, because he is not a death frame at all. Thats why I said move the skill, not remove it completely.

Volt speed gives him a niche in every mission besides defense and survival. Whether you want to acknowledge that or not, it is still very prevalent.

 

In my opinion, nekros needs to have a more synergetic kit yes. But I would love to see descrate stay on him. 

 

avalanche no longer has any form of cc at all

/slaps self for not keeping up with the changes

 

Don't get why trinity needs a nerf, she doesn't have any crowd control abilities, nor direct damage powers.

 

Don't talk bad of excalibur, he is great, yet even though superjump is an utility, it could have a different way of use, more like what was done to zephyr, she navigates true the map fast and greatly.

 

Vauban, you are totally disregarding grineer and corpus existence.

 

I dont think anybody noticed when I said that vauban should have an infested enemy that can help against him. 

Despite what you might say, excalibur's only above average skill is radial blind. Everything else is super meh. He is the posterboy and a starting warframe. He is the most likely frame to be played by any player, he needs to leave a lasting impression.

 

Trinity = infinite godmode. If you don't see the problem with that, I doubt me telling you why it is an issue will change your point of view on the matter.

 

Banshee needs to be way higher in priority. You have her below Rhino? And Frost who was just reworked? And Nova who is at least fully functional? and Vauban who is perfect?

 

lol

 

LOL, I SAY!

The priority isn't perfect, its my opinion. Even if you buff banshee, it wont do anything. You wont see anybody using banshee.

Everybody will continue to use the really good/to good at everything rhino, or the map clearing nuker who outpreforms every other nukers except in rare scenarios and eclipses them.

 

 

the buffs are warrented 

the nerfs arent needed 

fix psychic bolts 

I do think the nerfs are warranted. Really, they basically take the content of the game, close line it, then take a massive dump over its mouth.

No joke.

 

Unlimited godmode? obviously cool.

Ability to wipe out hordes larger then the massive hordes of people protesting the cancellation of twinkies in the midwest US? On demand! Its gud.

 

Seriously, they are pretty insane. That isn't to say you just take them and say F*** you lolol, I removed ur powers and made you less useful then a snail with a tooth pick. You have to be intelligent with how you nerf things.

 

 

Nothing about Nova needs to be nerfed, she's OP because she's frail.

 

[bUT MAXED SHIELDS BLAH BLAH]

 

Unless she's got another frame backing her up, she goes down easily.

M Primes slowing, her speed, and her immense killing power easily offset that a bit to much. If you want what you say is true to actually be the case, start by removing her CC. 

 

Also, volt, ember, nekros, and many other frames have that issue as well (except it actually exists!)

[Scar.Heart]

I think that would be cool, but it is obvious you don't know/want to acknowledge/dont think highly of how well vauban does against infested. Do an ODD with a vauban in your party. Its insane.

My good man, I use him for ODD's.

I know he makes the Infested easy work. BUT, so does everything with a Blast proc or any real form of CC.

 

You nerf Vauban, the Tenno will bring in...

- Rhino Stomp spam

- Radial Blind spam

- Molecular Prime spam

- Sound Quake spam (Plus Sonar, woot!)

- Snow globe (slow ability + max stretch/overextended does the job well. You can add the Impendence Aura for a bigger ailment)

- Crush spam

- Chaos

- Reckoning spam

- so on

 

If an ability has a guaranteed stun/knockdown, it'll be spammed in the Infested mission. And will conclude with the Infested becoming a laughable threat.

You can take Vauban off his throne, but there are so many others to replace him. (Damn near everybody)

Unless the Infested are given immunities to CC similar to that of Stalker, you'll never win this particular battle. Not until every CC is worthless, and every Blast proc erased.

___

On the other hand...

I would love to see specialized enemies to take out individual frames, rather than just nerfing a frame.

It would encourage team work and diversity amongst a cell.

If Tenno whine and $#*(@ about it, DE can step in and tell them, "That's how it's supposed to work. Stick with your team and you'll be fine."

 

But, if we're not going for Spec-Op enemies, I say nay.

[Axterix13]

Banshee needs to be way higher in priority. You have her below Rhino? And Frost who was just reworked? And Nova who is at least fully functional? and Vauban who is perfect?

 

lol

 

LOL, I SAY!

Yeah, she'd be my #1.  Three of her four powers need work.  Yes, that includes Sonar, which typically isn't very useful.  New players, who can't drop stuff in the blink of an eye, don't have her, while others can drop mobs like that, barring endless modes, which don't really bother with enough for Sonar to really matter.  And of course it totally doesn't mesh with the invincible except in spot X at time Y boss mechanics.  There's reasons why you rarely see her.

 

Though personally I'd pair off the early ones.  Combine the ones that need upgrades the most with ones that need to be brought down a bit.  Spoonful of sugar and all that.

 

 

Volt has speed which is amazing, shock is a good stun. He isn't bad at all.

Shock isn't really a good stun.  Lasts too short for that.  But combined with the damage it does, I'd go with it being a good power that happens to briefly stun.  His idea that Volt is bad though is laughable.  Volt is overall one of the best balanced frames.  Other frames should use him as the benchmark.  He's got 4 useful powers (with shield being the weakest), a #1 he uses more than his #4, and a good team buff.

 

*shrug*

 

He's probably one those "balance around endless mode" types.  That idea is silly, since if things were actually balanced, it wouldn't take 20+ minutes to get to the point the players are "balanced" for.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Axterix13

[OptimumBow0]

Again, Blessing isn't broken, and it's one of the few ultimates in the game that can actually scale, but here's a thought - increase the cast time. Really, I've died in the current 1.2 seconds it takes to activate Blessing, which completely defeated the point of casting it in the first place.

 

I don't think there would be any kind of huge fallout over implementing something like that either, but for Pete's sake, the "infinite god-mode" is Narrow Minded's fault!

[Cwierz]

Again, Blessing isn't broken, and it's one of the few ultimates in the game that can actually scale, but here's a thought - increase the cast time. Really, I've died in the current 1.2 seconds it takes to activate Blessing, which completely defeated the point of casting it in the first place.

 

I don't think there would be any kind of huge fallout over implementing something like that either, but for Pete's sake, the "infinite god-mode" is Narrow Minded's fault!

It might be the case.

But wouldn't nerfing or changing narrow minded be nerfing blessing?

 

I never specified how these nerfs should be done, except for suggestions in the form of nova and vauban.

I imagine there are a multitude of ways to tackle the issue, but infinite godmode needs to go regardless.

[7grims]

 

Despite what you might say, excalibur's only above average skill is radial blind. Everything else is super meh. He is the posterboy and a starting warframe. He is the most likely frame to be played by any player, he needs to leave a lasting impression.

 

He is nowadays my go to frame, I had to play all other frames until I got to him again; I do long survivals with him, and he doesn't let me down.

But like you said, it's all in the radial blind, and his ultimate just like most frames doesn't kill anything at high levels.

 

About trin, yah I've been reading all other replies in here, she is kinda godmode, even though I still manage to dye with her xD

Still I cant see how to fix a frame, whos only good thing is actually its invincibility, you change or nerf her, and you might end up with an unplayable and useless frame.

Edited March 19, 2014 by 7grims

[Cwierz]

He is nowadays my go to frame, I had to play all other frames until I got to him again; I do long survivals with him, and he doesn't let me down.

But like you said, it's all in the radial blind, and his ultimate just like most frames doesn't kill anything at high levels.

Slash dash used to be the best 1 in the game, but it needs some new toys/mechanics with melee 2.0 desperatley.

Super jump is a bit boring

 

I hate radial javelin, it can miss, doesn't do much damage comparatively, and has that long &#! animation.

 

I personally thinking that Radial Javelin should be changed to a buff to melee 2.0's stance.

Super jump should be changed to jump jets that are free to use similar to titanfalls jump jets.

 

 

That, and parkour needs some work as well. Titanfall's pilot combat honestly feels like a better warframe without powers

[Nox-Lamina]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/189034-azamagons-warframe-rebalancing-ash/

 

Shameless plug for a thread with ideas I like. Also I find the ideas of letting smokescreen turn teammates invisible and calling that utility to be silly compared to making it a literal smokescreen that messes with your enemies' vision and confuses them and can be cast while invisible.

 

I'll make my Frost suggestions short

 

Freeze-> Frost shatter. Freezes enemies dealing cold damage in a cone front of frost, casting it again shatters enemies causing damage and a slowdown effect.. It should also be able to heal snow globe

 

Ice wave = See that Orokin Freeze trap? We're taking it! Ice wave needs widening, and then it should leave a lingering AoE like that and boost warframe's speed significantly when sliding across it

 

Avalanche -> Blizzard.  2 part ultimate, first part is wave of ice damage + pushback. Then the next part is the large MOBILE slowdown AoE around frost that lasts for a bit.  (all damage figures can stay where they are/be increased)

Edited March 19, 2014 by Nox-Lamina

[Volt_Cruelerz]

Well, its great to see you are thinking about agreeing with me.

I guess I will think about thanking you.

Let me put it this way, I agree with everything I picked up on in the OP.  That may or may not have been everything because the SQL database I have to build from the ground up for my databases class is kind of eating the mental resources that would normally be allocated to things like making sure I read a post thoroughly and consider all the implications of those things.

[fatpig84]

1) Trinity.

Blessing. 15m range.
Tada. Fixed.

 

 

2) Loki

If people are going to nerf invisibility, better nerf it's power cost too.

Then increase RD base range to 30m.

 

 

3) Vauban.

He is fine.

Introduce flying infested mobs which go right through Bastille and he is balanced really.

 

 

4) Excal.

Being a melee frame, having his attack skills get X% damage from his main weapon is fine.

But that means everyone just use weapons like Jet Kitty. Oh well.

 

Super jump = Allow Excal to super jump in the air.

RJ = Innate pierce of 5m.

RB = Slow down blinded by 50%.

 

 

4) Nyx.

Psy bolts need more damage and innate pierce to ignore obstacles.

Be at least comparable to Shuriken....

 

 

5) Nova.

MP blast damage = 400.

Increase MP slow to 60%.

Increase MP damage buff to 300%

Allow anti-matter drop AOE range be affected by range mods.

 

 

6) Ash

Shuriken = needs innate punch through

 

Teleport = Becomes teleport strike.

On reaching target Ash hits the target with a minor AOE knock down.

 

Bladestorm = Ash deploys 4 shadows of himself. (1 per rank)

Each Shadow does 4 attacks each.

Each attacks does 1.5k damage and the Clone will teleport to target. (Power str increases damage)

Attacks anything within 30m of Ash.  (Power range extends engagement range.)

Shadow are invulnerable but only last 15 seconds. (Power duration increases duration)

If there is only 1 target, the Clones can all attack the sole target.

 

Ash is free to do anything he wants and can cast any skill.

 

 

7) Nekros

Terrify = Remove target limit.

Reduces affected movement speed by 50%.

Reduce affected armor and shields by 80%.

Base duration = 15 seconds.

Not affected by power strength.

Affected by power duration and range.

 

This alone will make Shadows of the Dead a lot more powerful, since reduced armor and shields meant that Shadows can easily kill stuff.

 

 

8) Mag

Pull needs to rag doll again.

Bullet attractor needs to work like Absorb and Mprime :3

 

 

9) Oberon

Renewal. Effects continue to pulse even after targets are at max health.

Hallowed Ground. Has a 15% chance to proc Radiation.

Reckoning. Innate 100% chance to stun targets for 3 seconds after their landing.

 

 

10) Rhino

Tone down Vanguard to 20%

Rhino P = match Nova (1.2)  in speed.

Regular Rhino = slightly slower than Nekros (1.1)

 

 

11) Saryn

Buff Hemlok to 20%

Molt removes debuffs.

Contagion = Becomes a team buff.

 

 

12) Banshee

Sonic boom = needs more rag doll.

Increase range to 20m.

 

Silence = Silences team's weapons.

Effect goes from 25%/50%/75%/100%

 

Sound Quake = remove that bug and it is good.

Adds a 100% knock down proc before it ends.

 

 

13) Frost.

Snowglobe.

It should get resistance from armor.

A Frost with 75% mitigation will allow globe to mitigate 75% of incoming damage before deducting them off it's hit points. 

1000/2000/3000/4000 hp.

 

Avalanche

Frozen state affected by duration.

 

Freeze.

Small freezing AOE on impact of target.

So it can freeze / chill enemies around the target.

 

 

14) Zephyr.

Don't let the loot get stuck on ceilings due to Tornado.

That's all.

 

 

15) Valkyr

Awaiting melee 2.0

Edited March 19, 2014 by fatpig84