Orokin Derelict Survival Oxygen

[AcquisCommunitaire]

The oxygen drop-rate is absolutely horrendous. Unless you happen to spawn in a good map, mobs not only hardly appear, but they drop so few oxygen packs that playing T3 survival is a joke.

 

Survival is meant to be a game where you are overwhelmed by mobs. In the void, this is done correctly. Players run to extraction because they are too overwhelmed with enemies or the enemies are too strong to get an adequate amount of oxygen drops. In ODS, it's a different story. You can kill hundreds of enemies but still, because of this horrible oxygen drop rate, you'll run out of air at 10 minutes - not because you don't kill enough enemies, but because the enemies just don't spawn.

 

As a result of this, hardly anyone plays ODS.

[Casardis]

The Infested have always had a bad oxygen droprate ever since the Survival Event, which is a LONG time ago. I'm still very much wondering why DE hasn't address this because you're definitely not the first pointing this out. I think it's just because most people are preoccupied with other things right now and less of us notice it *coughbrokenlightscough*.

 

The only logic I can think of behind it is that DE might think the Infested spawns much faster and swarms much more since they all run towards you. The cold truth is that it's not true at all; the ratio between spawn and drop rate is still horrible. In fact, I get MORE SPAWNS and MORE OXY DROPS in Grineer survival on the Galleon (which btw is great, and one of my favorite survival faction).

Edited March 19, 2014 by Casardis

[7grims]

Not entirely true.

Its not a a problem in ODS, its a problem in several surv maps.

You can see those in some survs in mars and pluto (corpus maps), and you can see those in T3 surv, but for some reason not in T2 surv.

 

Its like the mechanisms gets broken in some maps and not in others, who knows why.

[HellEnforcer]

 As far as I know, the higher the enemy level, the more rarely they drop oxygen.

 

 To me the real problem is that the infested are restricted to the Derelicts, where they are about level 35 and such. If you want a 'good' oxygen spawn, you would need to get them on a low level invasion.

[yarash2110]

besides the fact that ODS maps just sucks in general with tons of re spawn falling areas and really small paths that are a nightmare for even the slightest fps drop 

[[DE]Rebecca]

Hm, seems like a few feedback topics here on (avoiding) ODS:

 

1) Spawnrates/Survivability

2) Level Design/Performance

 

Would be nice to get more voices here talking to these points if anyone has experiences to share. 

[kebra]

It often happens, particulary in Orokin Derelict that the last supply of oxygen arrives 3 or 4 seconds after the last oxygen remainging... around 17 minutes, even when I'm very careful with the "supplies" and timing... Doing it in a organized group as solo changed almost nothing.

 

Sorry for my half-****d english... ^^

[Bronte]

True there does seem to be good and bad runs with ODS, more often bad or barely survivable, it gets rather difficult to survive past the 15 minute mark in most cases due to lack of air drops.

 

In other cases it's been due to lack of enemy spawning fast enough and there have even been extended periods where nothing is around to kill for a good 30 seconds.

[Auxeus]

Same issue happen to couple random guys i met and including me. Unless the squad have a Nekros we will just having hard time surviving long enough for 15 minutes. Tileset layout is quite important for the infested spawn rate in our experience.

 

But having to kill 10-15 bunch to get 1 oxygen drop (sometimes non) is ridiculous. And i recall there was a similar thread back in 3-4 months but wasn't getting any attention.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Auxeus

[Virtus_Dei_Est]

For me the real question is why the survival mode in Warframe need to rely AGAIN on RNG.

 

why DE thinks is a great idea to depend on air drops generated by RNG, when a survival mode should depend on skill, and not in bad or good luck.

 

remove air drops as a lotery, just add a little % to the air when you kill an enemy, just like in nightmare mode adds life when you kill enemies.

Edited March 19, 2014 by omega_phoenix

[Cr4p]

Hm, seems like a few feedback topics here on (avoiding) ODS:

 

1) Spawnrates/Survivability

2) Level Design/Performance

 

Would be nice to get more voices here talking to these points if anyone has experiences to share. 

 

 

For the level design/performance, I can't stand the derelict survivals. There are too many places for oxygens, drops and players to fall or be knocked off the map, sometimes respawning (although usually far away) and sometimes not, and the paths between the big oxygen tanks tend to be really convoluted (like the big room with all the nanospore trees where it likes to spawn 3 tanks, one on each side and one in the middle, but the vertical patching along the trees makes it take much longer to get between them than it should and then there's the wonderful get punched off and respawn somewhere of have the narrow path so clogged with enemies you can't get through and can't kill them all quick enough at high levels).

 

I find it harder than t3 void survivals not because of the enemy difficultly (infested are by far my favorite faction to fight regardless of mission type) but because I often find myself running low on air much earlier than any other survivals because of the low oxygen drop rates and poor suitability of the maps for a game mode in which success depends on access to dropped items and quickly traveling from one oxygen supply spot to another.

 

The map LOOKS brilliant, it just doesn't play very well.

[Liminal]

Yes. I agree. Oxygen drops in the derelicts have been terrible for me as well. I can rarely get to 25 unless I'm running Nekros (but then again, Nekros has other issues in this map). 

 

 

remove air drops as a lotery, just add a little % to the air when you kill an enemy, just like in nightmare mode adds life when you kill enemies.

^That would be glorious.

Edited March 19, 2014 by The_Doc

[Valiant]

Yes the oxygen drops have been peculiar for a while now but I thought it was just intended and accepted. Maybe now it'll be appropriately adjusted.

[Issun135]

I'd like to play a Direlect survival and be absolutely swarmed by mobs at the 15 min mark, because the infested barely have ranged attacks, so they must make up for that in numbers. Also it should be funny/scary when 15-20 ancients go after a single person.

more enemies = more oxygen drops, with or with out a Nekros.

[LordAsmolicious]

In the ODS. the length between the Air pods is too long. in the way of getting there. the spawn time for the pods in the ODS is ungodly long aswell. considering the travel times. never got past 15 minutes due to lack of oxygen

 

 

Often the mini map markers direct you from one end of the room and then back to where you came to point you to a whole other direction instead.

[LxLawliet]

I avoid doing Orokin Derelict Survival for three reasons:

 

1) Performance. The tilesets may look "beautiful", the performance isn't. Having 10 FPS in survival is not fun at all.

2) Oxygen. Infested drop less capsules than the other factions, making it difficult to maintain a stable supply of oxygen.

3) Map Layout. I do not like the way DE handled survival after its introduction via an event - in the event, it was just you, your squad, your abilities and the enemies. Now, it's you, your squad, your abiltiies, the enemies and dozens of same-looking rooms.

 

Optimize the tileset, increase the drop rate for capsules, and reinstate the "one room survival" from the event, and you'll make a lot of players happy.

[Laecerelius]

Golden rule for a good Survival map:  Keep it simple.  It helps the player get around to oxygen drops and it helps the AI swarm into the rooms where the players are.  I've never had problems with the Grineer galleon and Orokin Void tilesets.  They seem to be pretty much perfectly suited for Survival.  The Corpus ship tileset is also really good as long as you keep out that tile where there's three levels and you have to wall run/take a slow &#! elevator between each level.  I haven't played Corpus survival in a long time and the last time I did was in the Jupiter tile set.  That was is very...  Meh.  It was fine for spawns, but it seemed to sometimes take forever to get to a room with air supplies in them.  Maybe cut down the number of potential non-air supply tiles between air supply tiles.  Also on the Earth tile set please get rid of the water slide room as a potential Survival tile.  It's cool for normal missions but it's a bit busy for Survival.  I've also noticed that Corpus don't seem to drop oxygen as often as Grineer.  Maybe this is completely anecdotal and I just have bad luck with Corpus but I tend to struggle a bit more with oxygen against Corpus than I do against Grineer.

[AcquisCommunitaire]

Other than the issues mentioned above, it would do players much good if the map is brighter. I understand that having a dark map is a concept that was wanted for the derelicts, but it is excessively dark. Some players don't have perfect 20/20 vision and some have different eye conditions that makes the person less able to identify objects in a dark environment.

[Thundervision]

I avoid doing Orokin Derelict Survival for three reasons:

 

1) Performance. The tilesets may look "beautiful", the performance isn't. Having 10 FPS in survival is not fun at all.

2) Oxygen. Infested drop less capsules than the other factions, making it difficult to maintain a stable supply of oxygen.

3) Map Layout. I do not like the way DE handled survival after its introduction via an event - in the event, it was just you, your squad, your abilities and the enemies. Now, it's you, your squad, your abiltiies, the enemies and dozens of same-looking rooms.

 

Optimize the tileset, increase the drop rate for capsules, and reinstate the "one room survival" from the event, and you'll make a lot of players happy.

Yeah, agree with you.

FPS drops, perfomance and level design - It needs some improvement.

 

upd:

About level design... What about old Corpus Cargo Ship (Defence/Survival Event) tileset and another one with Cargo Bay (The Hunt For Alad V) as Survival?

Edited March 19, 2014 by Spectre-Agent

[Lunaticked]

Spawn rates in ODS are just bizarre, but that may be due to how many 'doors' are blocked off. Most rooms only have one way in, one way out, as opposed to Tower Survival where rooms usually have several places that mobs can come in from.

[Gio21]

Have seen it too

there are times when we are like lower than 5% still left and trying to find mobs till next life support spawns

i played a 3man t3s and we had to extract at 39:55 cuz no mob drops (+we had necro also)

[liavalenth]

Having a core mechanic of any game mode be directly connected to RNG is a bad idea IMO. In Survival how long you last, the entire point of the game mode, is reliant on random oxygen drops. Just seems like a bad idea.

[Splatter_Puppet]

Oxygen drops in ODS are indeed horrible. I've seen Novas clear out whole rooms of enemies and there was 1 (if that) green canister that dropped from them. The trees are also a nightmare, especially when I'm trying to quickly (in the dark might I add) go up a little tree branch to get to some point above me, to then go through 3 more rooms of tree-branch paths, to get to the next oxygen capsule which I will then need to pull since I spent almost two minutes getting there.

 

Survival is buggy all across the board though IMO. I've been with teams where we just sat around waiting and waiting for just 1 enemy to spawn (the whole time oxygen is ticking away mind you). Other times you'll think you're doing fine and then the next blue canister will drop literally on the opposite side of the map and you just can't get there fast enough (this happens a lot on corpus outposts and on the new earth tile sets).

 

I would personally love to see defense maps return to survival, even if they just get mixed in with current maps. I've never had more fun than when my team and I were on that one corpus outpost map during the survival event just blowing 1,000s of lvl 100 enemies to pieces. There was no worry about getting to the next room or if green canisters were dropping enough, just pure chaos. It was great.

[(PSN)natek_morzy]

Hm, seems like a few feedback topics here on (avoiding) ODS:

 

1) Spawnrates/Survivability

2) Level Design/Performance

 

Would be nice to get more voices here talking to these points if anyone has experiences to share. 

My dear DE emplyee, the design of the ODS tile set is so funky with the Infested faction I sometimes use it against them as an advantage!

 

note: My best team for ODS is Nekros, Vauban, Trinity and Nova.

 

You see, in the largest room, which I call the Tree Room, there is a path the Infested take that eventually leads to them running off the edge and respawning(like I would if I jumped off) on a platform where I kill them as all of this happens endlessly. Some can call it exploiting but I call it strategy because it's not my fault the Infested can't jump across a simple gap.

 

I do not believe the drop rate for capsules is too low. Having Nekros for Survival is always a good idea and an obvious choice since he CAN desecrate life support. I find it understandable that Infested have a lower chance to drop the life support since they come in larger numbers than the other two factions.

 

If you made survival easier I would literally be able to solo ODS for ~40 minutes by hiding behind my Vortex with Vauban. That would be too easy.

 

However i'm always open for a smarter, meaner infested faction and more level design/revamps. :)

 

 

 

 

Cheers

Morzy

Edited March 19, 2014 by (PS4)natek_morzy

[bigfoot1812]

I avoid doing Orokin Derelict Survival for three reasons:

 

1) Performance. The tilesets may look "beautiful", the performance isn't. Having 10 FPS in survival is not fun at all.

2) Oxygen. Infested drop less capsules than the other factions, making it difficult to maintain a stable supply of oxygen.

3) Map Layout. I do not like the way DE handled survival after its introduction via an event - in the event, it was just you, your squad, your abilities and the enemies. Now, it's you, your squad, your abiltiies, the enemies and dozens of same-looking rooms.

 

Optimize the tileset, increase the drop rate for capsules, and reinstate the "one room survival" from the event, and you'll make a lot of players happy.

I would like to have the open room from the event that made it hard yet easy. 

Hard due to the mass amount of mobs you had gunning for you in one open area. (but that was the fun part as well)

Easy due to the travel time from one point to the next and if you had the right squad and weapons you could last for an hour easy just on drops. but again you had to know what you were doing to last that long.