On New Players, Power Gap, Events, And Exclusives

[PoorCensored]

I'm placing the following feedback here, as I'm assuming this is the best venue for it.

New Player Experience

When I started playing a little over a month ago, I found it extremely hard to get started. I was in starting gear until Earth, and found Earth to be extremely hard with the beginning equipment. When I switched to the regular Braton, I was able to handle myself much better, but there was no good way (in game) to know that switching from the MK-1 would be a better choice. (When I initially looked at the stats, the MK-1 actually looked like a better choice than the regular Braton, given the higher accuracy.)

Additionally, new players get all sorts of items they won't be able to build for a long, long time... Barring getting lucky Orokin cell drops from a boss, a new player won't be able to build Seer until they get to Saturn, and they won't be able to build Rhino or Oberron until they make it to Europa or the Void. Veteran players don't seem to fully understand just how rare resources are for new players (particularly nanospores, plastids, and control modules - which veteran players have in droves). I think early-area resource distribution, part drops, or formula costs might need to be tweeked to help new players be able to have/build somewhat better equipment.

Power Gap

The difference between a new player with an unmodded MK-1 and veteran player with a potato'ed, 6 forma, fully modded Soma is just way to great. The power imbalance has veteran players clamoring for harder content, because they have to play 90 minutes of Tower III survival to get a challenge; while new players are struggling to make it through Earth.

I'm not quite sure what needs to be done to help resolve this issue, but, for the game to have long term longevity and any sense of meaningful balance in challenge, I think this gap has to be narrowed.

Cronus

In the first week I played, I believe I ran Vor about three dozen times, and I've run him at least once a day since (for about a month and a half now). I've yet to see Cronus drop. I know if I'm just extremely unlucky, or if the drop is just that rare. If its the later, I'd appreciate it if you could re-evaluate the drop rate.

The Grustrag Three

I first encountered the Grustrag Three on the night of their introduction (four times out of twelve invasion misions!), before the hot fix. It. was. AMAZING. I don't think I've had so much fun with anything else in game before or since. I was lucky enough to get all the parts of the Braak in those four encounters. (I still haven't build it.)

However, I'm a bit disheartened that I haven't encountered them since - they were a lot of fun to fight. Even worse, I've spoken with a number of other players who haven't seen them at all - and certainly didn't have the fun that I did.

Retired Items:

While I have been told that the Boar and Dual Ether Daggers may eventually make a return, I'm hoping they return in their normal forms, not as Wraith/Vandal versions (see Exclusive Items). I know the Snipertron was retired for Lore reasons (and I'm fine with never having one for that reason), but I'd like to have a stock version of the Boar and Dual Ether Daggers (made available to everyone).

I don't know why they were removed, but I'd personally appreciate it if they could be made available again; perhaps added to the log in rewards like the Gorgon and Wraith?

(I don't know of any items other than the Boar, Dual Ether Daggers, and Snipertron that have been retired.)

Exclusive Items

Let me start by saying I disagree with the concept of exclusive items. I think exclusive items cause deep divisions in any community they are released in to, especially if they have any real game impact. However, I do believe I understand the difficult place DE is in having promised exclusive items to the people it has already awarded them to.

I don't know that there is a good solution for DE. I think whatever action (or inaction) DE takes, some set of people are going to be unhappy. I've lived through some similar experiences with Team Fortress 2.

I'm not a Founder. I missed the closed beta and the the events that awarded Wraiths. I've only been playing since shortly before Valentines Day.

In the most recent event, I earned Wraith Gorgon. Since it was my first and only Wraith, I contacted support to ask if the old Wraiths would be re-released and, if not, if I could have my Wraith Gorgon replaced with a normal Gorgon - or at least be notified that old Wraiths would not be re-released so I could sell it. Support informed me that the old Wraiths would not be re-released, and I sold my Wraith Gorgon for 7,500 credits.

Edit - Quoted from the ticket:

"In regards to Wraith weapons and other Event exclusive items, at the time we have no plans to bring back old events nor the items back." 

Personally, this leads me to a bit of a problem: if I don't have the ability to collect a full set of something, I don't really want to have any of them. While I have tons of Prime parts sitting in my inventory, they are likely to just sit there unused unless Prime versions of Excalibur, Lato, and Skana become available. (I would probably build or maybe buy a full set of Prime warframes if that were possible, but it was not a possibility for weapons.)

Beyond my personal collection issues; Prime, Vandal, and Wraith items all seem to be superior to their normal counter parts, and I've seen certain groups of players ask players with a non-exclusive version of an time to switch to the exclusive version and/or ask the non-exclusive using player to leave. (For context, I've normally only seen this happen on Void runs, Events, and Nightmare levels; however, exclusive game play items have the potential to create a permanent, insurmountable power rifts between players.)

I'm not advocating DE take any particular action on existing exclusive items; but would greatly appreciate them not making any new exclusive ones - or at least none with game play differences.

Edited March 22, 2014 by PoorCensored

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

WHY WOULD YOU GET RID OF YOUR GORGON WRAITH?

[PoorCensored]

WHY WOULD YOU GET RID OF YOUR GORGON WRAITH?

It's in my post... If I can't have them all, I don't want any. I would have been happy with a plain Gorgon.

(And, honestly, the event itself was awesome without any rewards. I had a lot of fun with it. Probably my second favorite experience so far. I hope DE releases the mods soon for everyone to enjoy, maybe as nightmare rewards.)

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

"If I can't have them all..."

[ajwalker65]

While I agree there is a big gap in new player vs. veteran player that DE needs to address, your not having a Wraith or Vandal weapon, therefore not wanting any sounds like a personal OCD issue. 

 

I wasn't around for closed beta, or many of the earlier events in game, but I was very pleased to be around for the event that gave me a Gorgon Wraith and a couple badges and a couple mods that I couldn't get otherwise.

 

But yes, DE does need to address the ability for new players to get to the mods and resources sooner as they progress through the early parts of the game or make the actual weapons scale along with it's level instead of having to use mods.

[Arkadyc]

i agree with op that being said, if you want everything you will get nothing guess you already chose.

[Teasing]

As a completionist, I understand. I also started a week or 2 before Valentine's Day. As a beginner, there were some issues I ran into but then again, I was brought to this game by my friends who were already playing. I hope we could trade weapons later in the future so I could collect the items I don't have.

[PoorCensored]

While I agree there is a big gap in new player vs. veteran player that DE needs to address, your not having a Wraith or Vandal weapon, therefore not wanting any sounds like a personal OCD issue. 

 

I wasn't around for closed beta, or many of the earlier events in game, but I was very pleased to be around for the event that gave me a Gorgon Wraith and a couple badges and a couple mods that I couldn't get otherwise.

 

But yes, DE does need to address the ability for new players to get to the mods and resources sooner as they progress through the early parts of the game or make the actual weapons scale along with it's level instead of having to use mods.

 

I apologize if I wasn't clear: the collection issue is a personal concern. I've updated my post slightly to reflect that. Collecting things in game is something I enjoy doing in games - and is a large reason I play games, particularly in loot-games.

 

However, there is still the issue of exclusive weapons being *better* than the regular versions... and that's not really fair to people who, say, like the Gorgon, but missed the event. It would be one thing if the items would become available again, but, as it stands now, better versions of equipment are locked away from players forever... which is not good. If I didn't make that clear, I apologize. Let me know, and I can update my original post.

 

Regarding mods, it is my understanding that, in the past, event mods have been made available again as nightmare mode rewards after a period of time. I have no reason to not expect that they will do that again. If DE doesn't plan on making them available again, then I'd have a serious problem with event mods. The only mod that is 'exclusive' is Primed Chamber, and I got the impression they might bring it back periodically, but keep it relatively rare - which is ok with me, so long as it will resurface again in some capacity.

Edited March 21, 2014 by PoorCensored

[Cpl_Facehugger]

It would be one thing if the items would become available again, but, as it stands now, better versions of equipment are locked away from players forever... which is not good. If I didn't make that clear, I apologize. Let me know, and I can update my original post.

DE said the exclusives (except the founders exclusives, which are generally only good for bling purposes since their stats are barely better than normal excal/skana/lato - those are never coming back) are going back into the Disney DE vault to potentially return in the future. I think this was livestream 24 or 23 where they mentioned this?

Edit:

Devstream 22.

Edited March 22, 2014 by Cpl_Facehugger

[PoorCensored]

DE said the exclusives (except the founders exclusives, which are generally only good for bling purposes since their stats are barely better than normal excal/skana/lato - those are never coming back) are going back into the Disney DE vault to potentially return in the future. I think this was livestream 24 or 23 where they mentioned this?

Edit:

Devstream 22.

I know. However, in my recent support ticket, I was told DE had no plans to bring back the previous event weapons. Which is why I brought up the bit about my Wraith Gorgon.

Edit - Quoted from the ticket:

"In regards to Wraith weapons and other Event exclusive items, at the time we have no plans to bring back old events nor the items back."

Edited March 22, 2014 by PoorCensored

[Scryed]

DA FUQ?

[PoorCensored]

DA FUQ?

Out of curiousity, what is this aimed at?

[Pazgabear]

So, because you can't have 3 exclusive primes, you don't want to craft any of the one you got ?

Same for Wraith/Vandal, because you can't have the ones that you missed, you don't want the ones that you can get ?

 

I fail to understand your logic here ; exclusive items are trophies, not portable nukes, so i don't get why they would create a gap between new players and vet' too

Edited March 22, 2014 by Pazgabear

[PoorCensored]

So, because you can't have 3 exclusive primes, you don't want to craft any of the one you got ?

Same for Wraith/Vandal, because you can't have the ones that you missed, you don't want the ones that you can get ?

 

I fail to understand your logic here ; exclusive items are trophies, not portable nukes, so i don't get why they would create a gap between new players and vet' too

I'm on my phone, so this reply will be lacking in numeric analysis, but I'll post a follow up with that info when I can.

On my collection issues, it's like going to a restaurant and find out they are giving away a set of commemorative cups, and you missed the first one. Even if they were awesome cups, I'd most likely pass.

On statistical issues, compare a fully molded Wraith Dual Viper to a fully molded Dual Viper. Because of how mods work, the end effect of tiny statistical differences can be significant.

[LunarWind]

I'm on my phone, so this reply will be lacking in numeric analysis, but I'll post a follow up with that info when I can.

On my collection issues, it's like going to a restaurant and find out they are giving away a set of commemorative cups, and you missed the first one. Even if they were awesome cups, I'd most likely pass.

On statistical issues, compare a fully molded Wraith Dual Viper to a fully molded Dual Viper. Because of how mods work, the end effect of tiny statistical differences can be significant.

 

Now, here is why most people are confused.

You clearly understand that 'exclusive' event reward items are better than their normal counterparts.

And you also state that you do not want them, and would prefer the normal counterparts, if you cannot have the full matching "set" of exclusives.

 

Here's what you need to know:

Wraith items are not a set "set", they are simply the upgrade of Grineer tech. You could easily have a full 'set' of wraith weapons if you started collecting now, because a full 'set' would be one melee, one secondary, and one primary.

Assuming you play the game to have fun (It sounds like you do) and not to be powerful, the Wraith versions are STILL a better choice.

Faster reload speed on the Gorgon Wraith and having a free Catalyst installed = more fun.

Less reloading (boring) and less hoping/grinding for a Catalyst (assuming you didn't buy one).

 

This is like going to a restaurant which is giving away commemorative cups.

However, when compared with normal cups, the commemorative ones hold more liquid, break less, look better, and are FREE and come pre-filled with FREE beverage.

All you have to do is eat at the restaurant (complete the event) to receive one of these limited time cups.

Most people look at that as a freakin' amazing deal, especially if they were going to eat at said restaurant anyways, or were looking for somewhere to eat. (Playing event for fun or already in-game and looking for something to do)

 

So, that should sum up why people are (very) confused at your choice to destroy (sell for measly sum) your Gorgon Wraith.

Even if you can't have the "Full Set" you can have a matching trio, which is the most you can equip, and they are flat out better than the regular ones.

 

 

Oh.

On topic, I agree with you about new player experience.

Excellent analysis there.

[Pazgabear]

On statistical issues, compare a fully molded Wraith Dual Viper to a fully molded Dual Viper. Because of how mods work, the end effect of tiny statistical differences can be significant.

 

So ? WTV and Strun Wraith are IMO the only wraith weapon that could be called "mini-nukes", but even then, there are other weapons which completely destroy them when it comes to damage output

[Cpl_Facehugger]

I know. However, in my recent support ticket, I was told DE had no plans to bring back the previous event weapons. Which is why I brought up the bit about my Wraith Gorgon.

Edit - Quoted from the ticket:

"In regards to Wraith weapons and other Event exclusive items, at the time we have no plans to bring back old events nor the items back."

I'd assume that means they don't have any idea when it'll happen, but Steve and the other dev leads said it would happen, so I personally am going with them.

[PoorCensored]

Now, here is why most people are confused.

You clearly understand that 'exclusive' event reward items are better than their normal counterparts.

And you also state that you do not want them, and would prefer the normal counterparts, if you cannot have the full matching "set" of exclusives.

Here's what you need to know:

Wraith items are not a set "set", they are simply the upgrade of Grineer tech. You could easily have a full 'set' of wraith weapons if you started collecting now, because a full 'set' would be one melee, one secondary, and one primary.

Assuming you play the game to have fun (It sounds like you do) and not to be powerful, the Wraith versions are STILL a better choice.

Faster reload speed on the Gorgon Wraith and having a free Catalyst installed = more fun.

Less reloading (boring) and less hoping/grinding for a Catalyst (assuming you didn't buy one).

This is like going to a restaurant which is giving away commemorative cups.

However, when compared with normal cups, the commemorative ones hold more liquid, break less, look better, and are FREE and come pre-filled with FREE beverage.

All you have to do is eat at the restaurant (complete the event) to receive one of these limited time cups.

Most people look at that as a freakin' amazing deal, especially if they were going to eat at said restaurant anyways, or were looking for somewhere to eat. (Playing event for fun or already in-game and looking for something to do)

So, that should sum up why people are (very) confused at your choice to destroy (sell for measly sum) your Gorgon Wraith.

Even if you can't have the "Full Set" you can have a matching trio, which is the most you can equip, and they are flat out better than the regular ones.

Oh.

On topic, I agree with you about new player experience.

Excellent analysis there.

In the case of the cup as you presented it, I would probably drink my drink at the restaurant and then give the cup way to someone else who wanted it. I had no option to give the Wraith Gorgon away. I suppose I could have used it for mastery, but I didn't.

I do play to have fun - but collecting is part of that fun. Knowing that I have a Wraith Gorgon, but don't have, and can never get, the Wraith Twin Vipers, Wraith Strum, and Wraith Machete will grate at me and make the entire game less fun - or even unfun. Which is why I haven't build any Primes. I haven't even built Dread or Despair, as I don't have plans for Hate yet; or the Seeker, as I haven't had Cronus drop.

If it weren't for the information that the regular Boar and Dual Ether Daggers were going to be re-released, I'd probably have stopped playing for the most part (due to not being able to obtain a full set of 'stock' weapons). While I do really enjoy the game, a large portion of the game is collecting materials and building stuff, if you can't collect a full set of stuff, why are you collecting stuff at all?

 

I do hope DE does work on the new player experience.

 

So ? WTV and Strun Wraith are IMO the only wraith weapon that could be called "mini-nukes", but even then, there are other weapons which completely destroy them when it comes to damage output

1) I have issues with the game's power-gap in general (see above).

2) I have seen people been asked to switch their equipment and/or leave a party due to using the non-wraith version of Wraith weapons. Not common, but I have seen it happen and its a concern to me. Its not a "OMGWTFBBQQ!?!" level concern, but it is a concern, for me.

3) They may disincentivize better balancing of the non-Wraith versions. People normally compare the Wraith Twin Vipers and Twin Gremlins, not the Twin Vipers and Twin Gremlins. I don't know of anyone who currently advocates using the non-Wraith Strun.

 

I'd assume that means they don't have any idea when it'll happen, but Steve and the other dev leads said it would happen, so I personally am going with them.

Well, I asked, and was answered. That's all I can do. If they decide to re-release any of them down the line, they should re-release the Wraith Gorgon as well; and I can start collecting them all at that point. As long as I'm not told I can't get a complete set of basic equipment, I'll still be here.

Edited March 23, 2014 by PoorCensored

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

You're purposely ruining the game for yourself based on your outright refusal to accept what you get just because it isn't to your standards.



Just saying.

[Pazgabear]

1) I have issues with the game's power-gap in general (see above).

2) I have seen people been asked to switch their equipment and/or leave a party due to using the non-wraith version of Wraith weapons. Not common, but I have seen it happen and its a concern to me. Its not a "OMGWTFBBQQ!?!" level concern, but it is a concern, for me.

3) They may disincentivize better balancing of the non-Wraith versions. People normally compare the Wraith Twin Vipers and Twin Gremlins, not the Twin Vipers and Twin Gremlins. I don't know of anyone who currently advocates using the non-Wraith Strun.

 

1) So ? The power gap is a good thing, what's the point of crafting better gear if you're just a bit more powerful than the newcomers ?

You're saying high level players need to get to 90 min survival to get a challenge ? Of course if you use the best gear in the game you'll come to a point where everything is just meat waiting to pass in your grinder

 

The problem here isn't the power gap in itself, it's how the new players should proceed to get beyond that gap

 

2) Well, here we've got a problem, i don't see why people should be excluded because they don't have access to an event exclusive weapon, still, i haven't seen that happening in my region channel

 

3) First, I didn't see anyone comparing WTV with Twin Gremlins, i don't get why they would do that either

Second, nobody uses the Strun simply because it's complete garbage, i've tested it BEFORE damage 2.0, and it was already garbage (I didn't have any Shotgun mods at that time, so that maybe explain why)

Third, i don't get why people would be saying "chose the non-wraith version over the wraith one" when Wraith are supposed to be an UPGRADE of the base version, if people have access to a Wraith/Vandal/Prime over the classic, why would they chose the classic if the W/V/P ones are better ?

[ThePresident777]

I'm placing the following feedback here, as I'm assuming this is the best venue for it.

New Player Experience

When I started playing a little over a month ago, I found it extremely hard to get started. I was in starting gear until Earth, and found Earth to be extremely hard with the beginning equipment. When I switched to the regular Braton, I was able to handle myself much better, but there was no good way (in game) to know that switching from the MK-1 would be a better choice. (When I initially looked at the stats, the MK-1 actually looked like a better choice than the regular Braton, given the higher accuracy.)

Additionally, new players get all sorts of items they won't be able to build for a long, long time... Barring getting lucky Orokin cell drops from a boss, a new player won't be able to build Seer until they get to Saturn, and they won't be able to build Rhino or Oberron until they make it to Europa or the Void. Veteran players don't seem to fully understand just how rare resources are for new players (particularly nanospores, plastids, and control modules - which veteran players have in droves). I think early-area resource distribution, part drops, or formula costs might need to be tweeked to help new players be able to have/build somewhat better equipment.

Power Gap

The difference between a new player with an unmodded MK-1 and veteran player with a potato'ed, 6 forma, fully modded Soma is just way to great. The power imbalance has veteran players clamoring for harder content, because they have to play 90 minutes of Tower III survival to get a challenge; while new players are struggling to make it through Earth.

I'm not quite sure what needs to be done to help resolve this issue, but, for the game to have long term longevity and any sense of meaningful balance in challenge, I think this gap has to be narrowed.

Cronus

In the first week I played, I believe I ran Vor about three dozen times, and I've run him at least once a day since (for about a month and a half now). I've yet to see Cronus drop. I know if I'm just extremely unlucky, or if the drop is just that rare. If its the later, I'd appreciate it if you could re-evaluate the drop rate.

The Grustrag Three

I first encountered the Grustrag Three on the night of their introduction (four times out of twelve invasion misions!), before the hot fix. It. was. AMAZING. I don't think I've had so much fun with anything else in game before or since. I was lucky enough to get all the parts of the Braak in those four encounters. (I still haven't build it.)

However, I'm a bit disheartened that I haven't encountered them since - they were a lot of fun to fight. Even worse, I've spoken with a number of other players who haven't seen them at all - and certainly didn't have the fun that I did.

Retired Items:

While I have been told that the Boar and Dual Ether Daggers may eventually make a return, I'm hoping they return in their normal forms, not as Wraith/Vandal versions (see Exclusive Items). I know the Snipertron was retired for Lore reasons (and I'm fine with never having one for that reason), but I'd like to have a stock version of the Boar and Dual Ether Daggers (made available to everyone).

I don't know why they were removed, but I'd personally appreciate it if they could be made available again; perhaps added to the log in rewards like the Gorgon and Wraith?

(I don't know of any items other than the Boar, Dual Ether Daggers, and Snipertron that have been retired.)

Exclusive Items

Let me start by saying I disagree with the concept of exclusive items. I think exclusive items cause deep divisions in any community they are released in to, especially if they have any real game impact. However, I do believe I understand the difficult place DE is in having promised exclusive items to the people it has already awarded them to.

I don't know that there is a good solution for DE. I think whatever action (or inaction) DE takes, some set of people are going to be unhappy. I've lived through some similar experiences with Team Fortress 2.

I'm not a Founder. I missed the closed beta and the the events that awarded Wraiths. I've only been playing since shortly before Valentines Day.

In the most recent event, I earned Wraith Gorgon. Since it was my first and only Wraith, I contacted support to ask if the old Wraiths would be re-released and, if not, if I could have my Wraith Gorgon replaced with a normal Gorgon - or at least be notified that old Wraiths would not be re-released so I could sell it. Support informed me that the old Wraiths would not be re-released, and I sold my Wraith Gorgon for 7,500 credits.

Edit - Quoted from the ticket:

"In regards to Wraith weapons and other Event exclusive items, at the time we have no plans to bring back old events nor the items back." 

Personally, this leads me to a bit of a problem: if I don't have the ability to collect a full set of something, I don't really want to have any of them. While I have tons of Prime parts sitting in my inventory, they are likely to just sit there unused unless Prime versions of Excalibur, Lato, and Skana become available. (I would probably build or maybe buy a full set of Prime warframes if that were possible, but it was not a possibility for weapons.)

Beyond my personal collection issues; Prime, Vandal, and Wraith items all seem to be superior to their normal counter parts, and I've seen certain groups of players ask players with a non-exclusive version of an time to switch to the exclusive version and/or ask the non-exclusive using player to leave. (For context, I've normally only seen this happen on Void runs, Events, and Nightmare levels; however, exclusive game play items have the potential to create a permanent, insurmountable power rifts between players.)

I'm not advocating DE take any particular action on existing exclusive items; but would greatly appreciate them not making any new exclusive ones - or at least none with game play differences.

 

I pretty much agree.  I would not get rid of items because I do not have the entire set.  But, exclusive items are getting on my nerves.  It's turning into exclusive game mechanics.  The have nots are perpetually nerfed relative to the haves.

 

As for the power gap, I know what to do.  Make higher level missions available immediately instead of after 40 minutes of survival.

[Bluetick]

As for the game being very hard on noobs I tend to agree with that  I think the lower planets need to be kept easy for the noobs with more mods available earlier on to help get them into the game. Most the people I hear complaining in game about how easy it is are the same ones I see doing Apolodorus with max characters. Go to Puto and Ceres and it is really hard to find people doing anything on those levels. With all the high level people it would seem to me there would be a lot of activity there. And a lot of the people that think they are the Greatest are the same ones I keep picking up in game or get half way thru and die and leave me to have to solo a mission that is NOT intended for me to be able to solo. I am not maxed out on all the greated mods and equipment but have enjoyed the game a lot.... but found myself all to often going it alone. I like challeges but not everyone is or ever will the the invincible ace that some claim to be so from that stand point there should always be a place for eveyone at every skill level. And maybe rather than make all the levels of the game harder just pull some of the SUPER mods out of the game to relieve someone of the burden of being invicible and then they can have a challege just like me.

[PoorCensored]

1) So ? The power gap is a good thing, what's the point of crafting better gear if you're just a bit more powerful than the newcomers ?

You're saying high level players need to get to 90 min survival to get a challenge ? Of course if you use the best gear in the game you'll come to a point where everything is just meat waiting to pass in your grinder

 

The problem here isn't the power gap in itself, it's how the new players should proceed to get beyond that gap

 

2) Well, here we've got a problem, i don't see why people should be excluded because they don't have access to an event exclusive weapon, still, i haven't seen that happening in my region channel

 

3) First, I didn't see anyone comparing WTV with Twin Gremlins, i don't get why they would do that either

Second, nobody uses the Strun simply because it's complete garbage, i've tested it BEFORE damage 2.0, and it was already garbage (I didn't have any Shotgun mods at that time, so that maybe explain why)

Third, i don't get why people would be saying "chose the non-wraith version over the wraith one" when Wraith are supposed to be an UPGRADE of the base version, if people have access to a Wraith/Vandal/Prime over the classic, why would they chose the classic if the W/V/P ones are better ?

 

1) Ideally, I'd want to build different gear because it gives me different capabilities. With the different weapon types they have coupled with the damage types and vulnerabilities that are currently in the game, you could make selecting the right weapon for the right encounter extremely important; instead of having certain weapons just be better than others.

 

That said, I don't think that's quite going to happen - but I do think the gap between a catalyzed, 6 forma, max-level modded Soma and the stock issue MK-1 Braton should be smaller than it is now.

 

Also, if a game is built and balanced well, there should never be a point where everything is the "meat in the grinder".

 

2) I've never seen it happen in region chat - but I've seen it happen in the squad chat when getting ready for a mission - particularly T3 and Nightmare runs.

 

3.1) Are you a newer player? and did you research your weapons before looking into what you'd invest in first? When I did searches for machine pistol comparisons, I ended up with threads focused on Wraith Twin Vipers.

3.2) That speaks to a larger balance issue.

3.3) I prefer side grades over upgrades. I like to have a lot of tools in my tool box, each useful for something specific, instead of one omni-tool to rule them all. However, if people never have a reason to pick the non-limited version, that shows an issue either with balance or exclusive weapons; as you lock newer players out of better content.

 

As for the game being very hard on noobs I tend to agree with that  I think the lower planets need to be kept easy for the noobs with more mods available earlier on to help get them into the game. Most the people I hear complaining in game about how easy it is are the same ones I see doing Apolodorus with max characters. Go to Puto and Ceres and it is really hard to find people doing anything on those levels. With all the high level people it would seem to me there would be a lot of activity there. And a lot of the people that think they are the Greatest are the same ones I keep picking up in game or get half way thru and die and leave me to have to solo a mission that is NOT intended for me to be able to solo. I am not maxed out on all the greated mods and equipment but have enjoyed the game a lot.... but found myself all to often going it alone. I like challeges but not everyone is or ever will the the invincible ace that some claim to be so from that stand point there should always be a place for eveyone at every skill level. And maybe rather than make all the levels of the game harder just pull some of the SUPER mods out of the game to relieve someone of the burden of being invicible and then they can have a challege just like me.

 

I picked Mag to start out with and I noticed that, around Neptune, it became really, really hard to find PUGs. I just figured they were all in Pluto, since, if you are at the high end, you'd be at the high end. But, I guess not. (I still haven't made it to Pluto... and I want to eventually build Excalibur.)

Edited March 24, 2014 by PoorCensored

[Pazgabear]

1) The gap between a potato'ed Soma with 6 formas with a MK1-Braton is fine as it is now

The MK1 was never meant to be a weapon you would keep in your inventory, and with the recents buffs some weapons got, some of them are better than or at least equal in a way to the Soma while being easier to craft (e.g. : Bows, Latron Prime, Phage)

 

3.1) I asked some friends what weapons i should craft back when i started the game, and nobody answered "Get a Strun Wraith", it's just stupid to answer that to someone who didn't got them

 

3.2) Weapons are based on a tier system, some are meant to be bad, some are meant to be good.

The Strun belongs to the lowest tier, so why should it be a good weapon to begin with ? It does its job in lower level mission (where low level weaponry are an option) and sucks in higher levels, i don't see any problems here

 

3.3) Tier system means that there are going to be upgrades and downgrades to a weapon

Primes, being at least a tier higher than their classic counterparts should be better than them, the same goes for the Wraith/Vandal versions, being upgrades to their respective counterparts

Primes/Wraith and Vandals shouldn't be sidegrades, being harder to acquire

 

Still, i agree with the fact that we need sidegrades to some weapons, like the Magnus and the Vasto, or the Paris and the Cernos

[Rakosta_Kai]

New player experience

The new player experience is something that the veterans have expressed concerns about and we know DE has seen our feedback on it. I'm sure something will be done to fix it. I just wish those fixes would come sooner as opposed to later.

 

 

Balance rift between New Players and Veterans

That rift is supposed to exist from the standpoint of available player DPS. Funnily enough, DMG 1.0 did a better job of balancing the gameplay difficulty between the two, in my opinion.

What really needs to happen now is that the enemies need to be changed. They need to be smarter, do more damage, and have more defensive measures as their level goes up.

 

Exclusive Items

What's funny is that this didn't become an issue until the Codex was implemented (genuinely wishing it hadn't been...). I'm amazed that there aren't people who are so completion oriented that they stop playing the game altogether due to the fact that they won't be able to complete it fully.

If items are retired or no longer available they need to be removed from the Codex.

My personal outlook on the Founders Pack Primes is that they need to release a Version 2 of all three to resolve the squabbling. They would all need to look entirely different from the Version 1 Prime items.

 

 

Lastly, to the poster that said the Strun sucks... I took it on T3 solo runs and into OD:E last night and it still works fine (don't try that with the extinguished key)... It's just not as EZ-mode as some of the weapons that have been released in recent.