Problem With Shotgun Damage Mods!

[Brimir]

Serration/Hornet Strike > Point Blank

 

Shotguns have all their raw Damage spread out on far too many mods. The biggest problem I have when modding a Shotgun is not having enough Capacity, but rather I just can't cram everything in there because you need so many different mods.

 

Another problem with this is that Blaze has Fire Damage; this will mess up your elemental combos. I'd rather see Point Blank "absorb" the damage portion of Blaze and it being given another bonus in addition to the Fire Damage.

[SquirmyBurrito]

IMO, Blaze should be changed into a fire+status mod.

Edited March 24, 2014 by SquirmyBurrito

[Velvetscream]

Shotguns in general have a much higher Damage than most rifles and pistols though.

Excluding the obvious OP or High damage, low ROF guns.

 

 

IMO, Blaze should be changed into a fire+status mod.

Then Shotguns will have ridiculous amounts of Status chance.

a Boar Prime with Cicero / Tethra, already has 92.5%

Edited March 24, 2014 by Velvetscream

[liavalenth]

Shotguns in general have a much higher Damage than most rifles and pistols though.

Excluding the obvious OP or High damage, low ROF guns.

Which is great but they have smaller percentage increases from mods which averages out to about the same damage per shot and worse ROF, thus modding them makes them have much less DPS.

 

Thats just how I see it though. I do not have the math to prove it, but if shotguns do come out stronger I will be very surprised.

Edited March 24, 2014 by liavalenth

[(PSN)natek_morzy]

IMO, Blaze should be changed into a fire+status mod.

noooo. I want my extra damage and we already have plenty of element+status mods. :x 

 

As for the OP.. I wish shotgun had better mods, too. I need to sacrifice  spread and tolerate fire damage to get what I want. :s

[SquirmyBurrito]

Shotguns in general have a much higher Damage than most rifles and pistols though.

Excluding the obvious OP or High damage, low ROF guns.

 

Then Shotguns will have ridiculous amounts of Status chance.

a Boar Prime with Cicero / Tethra, already has 92.5%

 

I wasn't aware of that lol I'm going to start kicking myself for selling the shotgun cicero mod. I'll buy it back later.

 

noooo. I want my extra damage and we already have plenty of element+status mods. :x 

 

As for the OP.. I wish shotgun had better mods, too. I need to sacrifice  spread and tolerate fire damage to get what I want. :s

 

 

That suggestion was supposed to be in addition to OPs absorption suggestion.

Edited March 24, 2014 by SquirmyBurrito

[Velvetscream]

Which is great but they have smaller percentage increases from mods which averages out to about the same damage per shot and worse ROF, thus modding them makes them have much less DPS.

 

Thats just how I see it though. I do not have the math to prove it, but if shotguns do come out stronger I will be very surprised.

Shotguns are kinda like Sniper rifles, on opposite ends of the spectrum.

They're both Burst Damage weapons, they lose out in the DPS race against Rifles.

[VKhaun]

+1

 

I like the solution of stealing Blaze's damage. Reload speed IMO.

 

Whatever reason there was for this disparity back in Damage 1.0 is long dead due to power creep and Damage 2.0.

 

I'm hoping the only reason they're not fixing shotgun mods is because they plan to do something drastic, like just let them use rifle mods or redo all the mods with +damage and get rid of the mandatory ones like Serration / Hornet Strike / Point Blank entirely. 

[liavalenth]

I'm hoping the only reason they're not fixing shotgun mods is because they plan to do something drastic, like just let them use rifle mods or redo all the mods with +damage and get rid of the mandatory ones like Serration / Hornet Strike / Point Blank entirely. 

They will never get rid of Serration / Hornet Strike / Point Blank. They have said this before.

 

However, I do hope they completely rework the mods because ever since Damage 2.0 they have had a huge problem with 3 different mods for physical damage.

[Velvetscream]

+1

 

I like the solution of stealing Blaze's damage. Reload speed IMO.

 

Whatever reason there was for this disparity back in Damage 1.0 is long dead due to power creep and Damage 2.0.

 

I'm hoping the only reason they're not fixing shotgun mods is because they plan to do something drastic, like just let them use rifle mods or redo all the mods with +damage and get rid of the mandatory ones like Serration / Hornet Strike / Point Blank entirely. 

Would be cool, but they'd have to rebalance everything.

Mobs health, weapon damage, status, crit.

 

If you just buff the weapon damage, then low level gameplay is ridiculously easy.

If you just lower mob health, then high level gameplay gets boring.

Unless they just ramp up the mob health apbruptly after a certain level.

[SquirmyBurrito]

Would be cool, but they'd have to rebalance everything.

Mobs health, weapon damage, status, crit.

 

If you just buff the weapon damage, then low level gameplay is ridiculously easy.

If you just lower mob health, then high level gameplay gets boring.

Unless they just ramp up the mob health apbruptly after a certain level.

 

They could always just regress a bit and bring back a (changed/more balanced) version of those old level up trees and use those in place of 'necessary' mods. I'm not saying they should retire mods as a whole, I'm suggesting they go with both.

Edited March 24, 2014 by SquirmyBurrito

[VKhaun]

They will never get rid of Serration / Hornet Strike / Point Blank. They have said this before.

 

They said they weren't retiring Serration at the time in one of the Livestreams, but I've never heard of any Dev comitting to never getting rid of damage-only mods. In fact they tried to do exactly that with Melee 2.0 and only didn't because it created too much complexity with how they were going to do it, not because they wanted to keep damage-only mods.

Edited March 24, 2014 by VKhaun

[LazyKnight]

I wouldn't mind if pointblank ate blaze's damage percentage. There should only be two damage mods, point blank and vicious spread, because it would at least standardize the damage system a little more.

 

It wouldn't change that much DPS wise, as it would only be one more mod slot. The DPS increase would be about the same as a rifle going from 7-> 8 slots.

Edited March 24, 2014 by LazyKnight

[Brimir]

Shotguns in general have a much higher Damage than most rifles and pistols though.

 

They also have these two ridiculous things called fall-off(this one in particular) and spread.

 

There is no need to "punish" them further, if that is what you're implying.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Brimir

[ObviousLee]

yes, buff shotgun damage mods, make my phage grow.............

[Brimir]

yes, buff shotgun damage mods, make my phage grow.............

 

It is not a buff, but rather shuffling the stats around the already existing mods to make Shotgun mods more akin Rifle/Pistol mods.

[ObviousLee]

It is not a buff, but rather shuffling the stats around the already existing mods to make Shotgun mods more akin Rifle/Pistol mods.

which i am in complete agreement. however how likely would a shotgun-wide nerf be? i mean some shotties (my phage, sweet jesus the damage) might go from insanely strong to just stupidly OP. how would some kind of middle ground be reached?

[Brimir]

which i am in complete agreement. however how likely would a shotgun-wide nerf be? i mean some shotties (my phage, sweet jesus the damage) might go from insanely strong to just stupidly OP. how would some kind of middle ground be reached?

 

Well, to be fair, the Phage is to Shotguns in general what the Synapse/Soma is to Rifles in general.

 

I'm sure DE are smart enough not to balance an entire class of weapons towards the most retarderdly overpowered example.

[LazyKnight]

 how would some kind of middle ground be reached?

The middle ground would be to spilt the 60% damage from blaze evenly into Vicious spread and Point blank. This requires the same sacrifice as other weapons (accuracy lost) and it would also keep Vicious spread useful.

Edited March 24, 2014 by LazyKnight

[ObviousLee]

Well, to be fair, the Phage is to Shotguns in general what the Synapse/Soma is to Rifles in general.

 

I'm sure DE are smart enough not to balance an entire class of weapons towards the most retarderdly overpowered example.

true, not even i can argue that the phage, especially with six forma in it, is capable of absolutely obscene damage, and the mods available for shotguns give immense versatility to the weapon, ex: Vicious spread to replace point blank in current build, giving massive spread that gives a 45 degree angle iirc with 15 beams that kill any midgame mob on contact. anything more..........too much.

 

my logic on this is that it still competes fantastically on level 100 mobs all factions. now i wont site any dps calculators, as they have yet to truly calculate status effect proc damage (according to dpsframe my build shouldn't be taking down level 100 heavies in 3-5 seconds for a group of them.)

 

 

 

 

 

edit: started drinking, words failing.

Edited March 24, 2014 by ObviousLee

[SquirmyBurrito]

true, not even i can argue that the phage, especially with six forma in it, is capable of absolutely obscene damage, and the mods available for shotguns give immense versatility to the weapon, ex: Vicious spread to replace point blank in current build, giving massive spread that gives a 45 degree angle iirc with 15 beams that kill any midgame mob on contact. anything more..........too much.

 

my logic on this is that it still competes fantastically on level 100 mobs all factions. now i wont site any dps calculators, as they have yet to truly calculate status effect proc damage (according to dpsframe my build shouldn't be taking down level 100 heavies in 3-5 seconds for a group of them.)

 

 

 

 

 

edit: started drinking, words failing.

 

I was looking at your builds on Warframe-builder, why did you forma your Phage 6 times? It looked like everything could be fit on nicely with just 4.

[ObviousLee]

I was looking at your builds on Warframe-builder, why did you forma your Phage 6 times? It looked like everything could be fit on nicely with just 4.

because i screwed up really bad before the tethra mods came out, and had to redo a - polarity i put in to a v slot to make my builds work.

Edited March 24, 2014 by ObviousLee

[Brimir]

Plus all those extra stars on the loadout screen.

 

AmIrite?

[ObviousLee]

Plus all those extra stars on the loadout screen.

 

AmIrite?

not really one for caring how many stars it has, as opposed to i made a whoopsie and needed to adjust to make what i wanted to happen happen.

[SquirmyBurrito]

because i screwed up really bad before the tethra mods came out, and had to redo a - polarity i put in to a v slot to make my builds work.

 

So are your builds on that site up to date? I have a ~level 6 phage and I'm trying to figure out whether or not I want to multi-forma it or not. Carrier kinda makes me second guess using any shotguns.