More Penalty On Death / Bleedout ?

[Paxolotl]

*** No, its not a "this game is to easy" whine thread ***

 

I feel there should be more punishment if you die or fail a mission - since the current system allows players to get revived unlimited and with no penalty. There is no downside of dying at a mission - you will even get the rewards / resources you collected -> theres no meaning of death in warframe whatsoever :(

 

How about making death more punishing for us ?

The first thing that comes to my mind is some kind of a Repair system:

 

- Frames get damaged on death / bleedout and need repairs

Repairs are time / parts / resource related. DE could add everything from a passive timer, which prevents you from using that frame immedeatly again, over a debuff that will stack, to a penalty that parts of your frame get damaged on death / bleedout, and you need resources or parts to repair it.

Note: not the actual part blueprints -> noone would play Vauban anymore :S

Overall, just anything that makes dying annoying / want to be avoided.

 

- Forma and repair penalties

Players forma their most beloved weapons and frames. By making a forma´d frame more resistant to the penalties above, they will enjoy to play their favourite frames even more + their effort and time spend on that frame will have an actual impact on this system.

 

- Lotus is watching you

Players with conditions like MR lower than 6 or only one frame will not have to deal with damaged frames/parts.

This is, of course, to protect new players game experience and their frames.

 

 

However this is just one example for making death / bleedout more meaningful in Warframe.

Please share your opinion / ideas on how to improve the current death mechanic - or why you like the current state of it.

 

/discuss

[BrotherIcarus]

Were I am not against the idea of penalties in dyeing I would not like to see the ideas you suggested implemented.

[kaboomonme]

inb4 comparisons to KanColle

Cool ideas, but might be a pain for all the glitch-induced deaths.
 

Edited March 24, 2014 by kaboomonme

[Scar.Heart]

The first thing that comes to my mind is some kind of a Repair system:

 

[se05239]

So losing everything you gathered so far is not enough as a penalty?

Making the game even more frustrating when you die from cheap shots (Slash Procs, for example) or environmental hazards (Arc Traps).. it does not seem like something DE would draw any benefit from. They need players playing, not players leaving.

[Paxolotl]

So losing everything you gathered so far is not enough as a penalty?

Making the game even more frustrating when you die from cheap shots (Slash Procs, for example) or environmental hazards (Arc Traps).. it does not seem like something DE would draw any benefit from. They need players playing, not players leaving.

 

IMO, no its not enough + you dont loose everything you gathered if you are playing with others that complete the mission for you.

I agree on the Slash Procs, not on the Arc traps thou. - I see more issues with the things "kaboomonme" mentioned - falling throu map, glitching etc.

DEs benefit ? The additional timesink. Players benefit ? More excitement due to fear of death / penalties.

 

E: typos

Edited March 24, 2014 by Sunfox069

[ZephyrAM]

Except there's nothing wrong with dieing in a fast paced, run and gun like Warframe. 

 

There doesn't need to be extra punishment for a regular part of gameplay.

[SpilockT_T]

No,

 

I don't want this game to be a Dark Soul-ish game...

[anavn]

I do not agree with it as for new players this could be futrating and for high lv players would all use Trinity or rino

[Tsukinoki]

Why does there need to be a penalty attached to dying beyond what is already there.

And what about the free players with 2 slots. They die twice and are out of usable warframes. All that does is tell them "Don't play this game, play a different one!" which is NOT a good strategy for a game to do.

And this would just make the cheapshots in the game even more annoying.

You go down because of a few stacking bleeds caused by Eviscerators and now have a debuff when you get up(whether you use a revive or an ally picks you up) which makes you more likely to die in the same mission which means more debuffs which means you're more likely to die....see the problem here?

And its a never ending compounding issue until the mission ends.

And what would be the point?

You already lose a revive/rewards/credits(if you dont revive and others finish the mission). Why does there need to be a bigger penalty?

All this does is make Rhino even more attractive as his IS would laugh off nearly any penalty the game could stack on him and he can get through missions without nearly as big of a chance of getting downed.

If I wanted to play a game with dark souls/demons souls death penalties I would play one of those game.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Tsukinoki

[Paxolotl]

wow.

 

the last 3 posters might wanna actually read my original post further than "Repair system".

[DietEbolaCola]

Due to the amount of times I have failed missions or died due to lag or connection issues I'm gonna have to say no to this.

 

That is punishment enough.

Edited March 24, 2014 by DietEbolaCola

[Tsukinoki]

@Sunfox069

I read it all and it doesn't change my response in any way.

A free player has only 2 warframe slots.

If both of them get damaged then they might as well just not play the game anymore until either the passive timer is finished or they can find a friend that they can leech a few missions off of to get the materials needed to repair their frame.

A game should not tell you "Oh you died? Better just not play for a while...."

And even having forma factor into system just means that the penalty system punishes the casual players (as in the majority of the players in the game) far more than it would punish a hardcore player.

And what would be the point?

An annoyance that would range from game breaking to something you can completely ignore depending on how long you've played the game and whether you've spent money to buy frame slots or not?

I dont see it as a good addition.

[Paxolotl]

@Tsukinoki

 

- Lotus is watching you

Players with conditions like MR lower than 6 or only one frame will not have to deal with damaged frames/parts.

This is, of course, to protect new players game experience and their frames.

 

 

It was just an example - and i added a new-player-protection with random numbers to prevent this kind of conversation.

For you again: The system takes affect after a certain playtime/experience level/mastery rank/number of frames/etc etc.... *sigh*

 

 

However this is just one example for making death / bleedout more meaningful in Warframe.

Please share your opinion / ideas on how to improve the current death mechanic - or why you like the current state of it.

 

please focus on this. Thank you.

[Tsukinoki]

@Sunfox069

And that still doesn't address the concern that it will either be a gamebreaking debuff (for the players who cant afford a lot of warframe slots) or will be something completely irrelevant because they have 18 frames to switch between and a debuff or a cant use timer on one wouldn't even affect them in the least bit.

And it still doesn't prevent a player with only a few slots from either losing access to all of their frames for a short while or having to leech off of others to get enough mats to repair them.

And if there was a lower limit on frames before the penalty kicked in what would that number start at? 2? 3? 4?

And I have already said I much prefer the state of it.

You need a more detailed reason?

In a game like this character death/bleedout is expected and not something that should be punished too heavily.

Otherwise you remove desire to see how far you can push the game in ED/S missions. Why try getting to 45+ minutes on a pluto survival if the frame I'm using will be hit by a large debuff if I go into bleedout/have to use a revive.

Isn't using a revive or losing everything I gathered and got as rewards for getting that far enough? Why should I have an extra penalty on top of that?

It just seems overly punishing and doesn't seem like it would add anything to game.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Tsukinoki

[Babellon]

*** No, its not a "this game is to easy" whine thread ***

 

I feel there should be more punishment if you die or fail a mission - since the current system allows players to get revived unlimited and with no penalty. There is no downside of dying at a mission - you will even get the rewards / resources you collected -> theres no meaning of death in warframe whatsoever :(

 

How about making death more punishing for us ?

The first thing that comes to my mind is some kind of a Repair system:

 

- Frames get damaged on death / bleedout and need repairs

Repairs are time / parts / resource related. DE could add everything from a passive timer, which prevents you from using that frame immedeatly again, over a debuff that will stack, to a penalty that parts of your frame get damaged on death / bleedout, and you need resources or parts to repair it.

Note: not the actual part blueprints -> noone would play Vauban anymore :S

Overall, just anything that makes dying annoying / want to be avoided.

 

- Forma and repair penalties

Players forma their most beloved weapons and frames. By making a forma´d frame more resistant to the penalties above, they will enjoy to play their favourite frames even more + their effort and time spend on that frame will have an actual impact on this system.

 

- Lotus is watching you

Players with conditions like MR lower than 6 or only one frame will not have to deal with damaged frames/parts.

This is, of course, to protect new players game experience and their frames.

 

 

However this is just one example for making death / bleedout more meaningful in Warframe.

Please share your opinion / ideas on how to improve the current death mechanic - or why you like the current state of it.

 

/discuss

no...just...no. 

Why do you need to be punished for death in a video game? you die, you get up, you move on. hopefuly you learn from the mistake and dont die again. Beyond that, its a game, 

[Paxolotl]

 

Why do you need to be punished for death in a video game?

 

excitement?

 

Beyond that, its a game, 

 

didnt know thx.

[Firetempest]

*** No, its not a "this game is to easy" whine thread ***

 

I feel there should be more punishment if you die or fail a mission - since the current system allows players to get revived unlimited and with no penalty. There is no downside of dying at a mission - you will even get the rewards / resources you collected -> theres no meaning of death in warframe whatsoever :(

Then... don't let people get the rewards / resources when dead and teammates finish mission?

Don't need to add 3 more degrees of failure to the act to "make up" for the lack of punishment.

[Paxolotl]

Then... don't let people get the rewards / resources when dead and teammates finish mission?

Don't need to add 3 more degrees of failure to the act to "make up" for the lack of punishment.

 

Yea, that would add some death-consequences, but keep em at a limit. I`d be fine with that.

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

There's just something not kosher about asking to be punished...  I believe it's a serious psychological condition.  XD

Edited March 24, 2014 by sushidubya

[Killist]

Interesting idea.

I like that timer on the frame that just went down.

This will force people to play some of the rarely used frames.

[achromos]

no...just...no. 

Why do you need to be punished for death in a video game? you die, you get up, you move on. hopefuly you learn from the mistake and dont die again. Beyond that, its a game, 

 

You don't 'need' to, but it really does make things more intense and I agree that it would be interesting, MAYBE something more along the lines of this.  You know how you have four revives a day? What if there was a system that tied into it, maybe change it from just 4 revives a day.  Maybe you can get your revives back every 6 hours.

 

While at: 4/4 revives:

10% More Credits at Mission End

 

 

While at: 3/4 revives

After 6 hours (or 15k Credits or plat) you will return to 4/4 Revives

Max Health: -5%

Max Shields: -5%

Max Armor: -5%

Max Energy: -10%

Max Stamina: -10%

Run Speed: -10%

 

While at: 2/4 revives

After 6 Hours (or 20k Credits or plat) you will return to 3/4 Revives

Max Health: -7%

Max Shields: -7%

Max Armor: -7%

Max Energy: -15%

Max Stamina: -20%

Run Speed: -20%

 

While at: 1/4 revives

After 6 Hours (or 30k Credits or plat) you will return to 2/4 Revives

Max Health: -15%

Max Shields: -15%

Max Armor: -15%

Max Energy: -30%

Max Stamina: -33%

Run Speed: -33%

 

While at: 0/4 revives

After 6 Hours (or 35k Credits or plat) you will return to 1/4 Revives, or if you manage to kill a boss you can cut that time in half, 3 hours to return to 1/4.

Max Health: -50%

Max Shields: -50%

Max Armor: -50%

Max Energy: -75%

Max Stamina: -66%

Run Speed: -66%

 

There should also be a max bleedout amount per mission.  I'd say 3 then you either toss a revive or sit on the sidelines.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Sibarian

[Sapphirya]

>system where your frame breaks and you need resources and parts to repair it<

 

 

I've completely abandoned games that I previously liked when they added BS like this. Let's not.

[achromos]

>system where your frame breaks and you need resources and parts to repair it<

 

 

I've completely abandoned games that I previously liked when they added BS like this. Let's not.

 

Yea, getting resources to repair your warframe is a bit much though being honest if it were one of the things you had 1,000k+ it wouldn't be 'that' bad.  I like my idea better though, and maybe a mix.  Like you can reduce the penalty on your frame with each forma already on it.  So lets take the 0/4 revive status:

revive 0/4 with no forma

Max Health: -50%

Max Shields: -50%

Max Armor: -50%

Max Energy: -75%

Max Stamina: -66%

Run Speed: -66%

 

revive 0/4 with 1 forma

Max Health: -45%

Max Shields: -45%

Max Armor: -45%

Max Energy: -50%

Max Stamina: -55%

Run Speed: -55%

 

revive 0/4 with 2 forma

Max Health: -40%

Max Shields: -40%

Max Armor: -40%

Max Energy: -45%

Max Stamina: -50%

Run Speed: -50%

 

Ect, although there has to be a cap, like you could only benefit 'so much' from what forma will give you in terms of the revive penalty while at 0/4 revives.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Sibarian

[(PSN)friedricetheman]

What about each time you bleed out, you will need to pay 10p to revive. Otherwise, teammates cannot revive you.

If your bleed out timer runs out before your teammates can get to you, you either pay 50p to self revive or get booted out of the mission with no rewards.

Good?